Perhaps the BEST B1G Forum anywhere, here at College Football Fan Site, CFB51!!!

I haven't seen any real evidence that anyone, anywhere thought the Taliban weren't going to take back the country. There is a reason why Trump negotiated directly with them. The military "experts" bounded all sorts of numbers around, usually in the range of a half a year. The actual number was less than a couple weeks. The fundamental miscalculation was that the Afghans wanted to fight in a civil war.

The bigger Another miscalculation was that they would fight in a civil war for 18 months after we made a deal with the enemy and left them to twist in the wind.

The bigger miscalculation was that we could depart with the job undone and all who helped us in danger of their lives with no cost to our own interests around the world.

As Churchill said in Parliament after the Munich sellout of 1938, "You were given the choice between war and dishonor.  You chose dishonor, and you will have war.”

You live in a pure fantasy world. 

With everyone else with an IQ over 30.

if your going to come in attacking, here again like you always do,  start by at least taking a credible position that isn’t laughable.  In lay  terms, get a clue. 

We killed Bin Laden with Obama in the WH.  We didn't leave.  Why?
It would be too messy.
The exact opposite of Obama was voted into the WH.  We didn't leave.  Why?
It would be too messy.
.
There are ZERO scenarios of us leaving that aren't messy.  If nothing else, at least Biden should be respected for having the balls to just get the hell out, knowing what his predecessors knew and still doing it AND standing behind it. 

The Biden administration looks incompetent right now.  Even many Democrats are saying this.
Trump should get the blame for making the deal to leave.  That was a fatal step.  It was at that point that at the lower echelons, elements of the Afghan army started making deals with the Taliban.
Biden should get the blame for not overriding Trump's policy and for the chaotic exit, leaving 90% of the Afghans who have put their lives on the line for us to await beheading by the Taliban, and leaving thousands of Americans still trying to find a way to get to the Kabul airport.
It was not killing us to stay there.  It was relatively cheap insurance.
We lost 66 service members over the last 7 years in Afghanistan.  We're losing more Americans than that in unnecessary deaths to Covid every day.  Right now.

Fro doesn't know whether to defend Biden or throw his support behind the Taliban. 

The Biden administration looks incompetent right now.  Even many Democrats are saying this.

The ________ administration would look bad as the one withdrawing.  "It's not killing us to stay" sounds like advocating for an indefinite occupation.  Not a good plan.
Ripping the band-aid off was the only solution.  Whoever ripped the band-aid was going to look bad...be the 'bad guy', etc.  

You guys are making this political, and it's not.  It's not about how good or bad Biden is. 
All I said was that Biden is doing the difficult thing that neither Obama nor Trump would.  And that's commendable. 

https://www.cnsnews.com/blog/craig-bannister/flashback-joe-biden-repeatedly-promised-take-responsibility-instead-blaming

commendable?   This didn’t age well.  

Also- go reread the last page or two of this thread. Pinpoint the place where it turned political versus a conversation about the current situation.   Then tell me who is “you guys”

The ________ administration would look bad as the one withdrawing.  "It's not killing us to stay" sounds like advocating for an indefinite occupation.  Not a good plan.
Ripping the band-aid off was the only solution.  Whoever ripped the band-aid was going to look bad...be the 'bad guy', etc. 

Why was indefinite occupation unacceptable?  It was relatively cheap.  In the same universe as what it costs us to maintain 10 times as many troops in South Korea.
To say that ripping the band-aid off was the only solution is an example of all-or-nothing thinking.  It's letting the perfect be the enemy of the just good enough.
It was just good enough to keep the Taliban at bay and keep Afghanistan from being a great haven and staging base for international terrorism that it was in September 2001.
A mature great power accepts that there are limits to its power, but it doesn't adopt the attitude that if it can't achieve total victory then it will do nothing.  After 100-plus years as a great power, we are still immature, and want to pick up our toys and go home when we can't get everything we want.