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Topic: In other news ...

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Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #2660 on: February 15, 2021, 07:36:38 PM »
I disagree obviously, and all your folderol is unconvincing and off point.

Charging rate will be double, it's inherent.

Two cars charge as double the rate as one car.  Three cars would triple the rate of recharge.  

longhorn320

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #2661 on: February 15, 2021, 07:47:25 PM »
I disagree obviously, and all your folderol is unconvincing and off point.

Charging rate will be double, it's inherent.

Two cars charge as double the rate as one car.  Three cars would triple the rate of recharge. 
how fast can EVs go
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Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #2662 on: February 15, 2021, 07:51:00 PM »
how fast can EVs go
It depends on the EV of course, but they go in excess of 100 mph in nearly every case.

The Chevy Bolt will do 140 mph and get 0-60 in 5.3 seconds.  They tend to be pretty quick, a lot of torque off the line.

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #2663 on: February 15, 2021, 08:04:15 PM »
I disagree obviously, and all your folderol is unconvincing and off point.

Charging rate will be double, it's inherent.

Two cars charge as double the rate as one car.  Three cars would triple the rate of recharge. 
Two 100 kWh cars will charge at double the rate of one 100 kWh car.

Two 50 kWh cars will charge at the same rate of one 100 kWh car.

What's so hard to understand? The charging rate is limited by the battery capacity. 

Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #2664 on: February 15, 2021, 08:06:59 PM »
I disagree entirely.  Charging rate is charging rate independent of battery capacity.

I don't understand all your posts, and didn't bother reading them.  I could be wrong, but it seems straightforward to me.

If I hook up a Volt, it charges at the same rate initially as a depleted Tesla with double or triple the battery capacity.




Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #2665 on: February 15, 2021, 08:08:27 PM »
If I have one 10 L bucket and one hose to fill it with water, it will fill at half the rate of two 5 L buckets and two hoses.

I get 10 L twice as fast with two hoses.

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #2666 on: February 15, 2021, 08:19:36 PM »
I disagree entirely.  Charging rate is charging rate independent of battery capacity.

I don't understand all your posts, and didn't bother reading them.  I could be wrong, but it seems straightforward to me.

If I hook up a Volt, it charges at the same rate initially as a depleted Tesla with double or triple the battery capacity.
A Tesla contains thousands of individual batteries. The individual batteries are rated to X amperes of maximum charging current. A battery pack is limited to X*N (N being the number of cells to create the pack) of maximum charging current. 

Splitting that battery "pack" in half means that you have two batteries each of N/2 size. So each pack can take X*N/2 maximum charging current, which means your total charging current for two packs is 2*X*N/2, or X*N. You've changed nothing by doubling the number of charging ports or chargers. 

If splitting the packs in half and doubling the number of charging ports would increase recharge rate, why would Elon Musk not have done it at this point? 

BTW if you hook up a Volt to a 250 kW Tesla v3 Supercharger, it won't fill at 250 kW, because the battery can't accept that much current. 

If I have one 10 L bucket and one hose to fill it with water, it will fill at half the rate of two 5 L buckets and two hoses.

I get 10 L twice as fast with two hoses.

The problem is that you're ONLY looking at this from the flow rate of the source. You're not looking at it from the rate at which the battery can accept charge, which is the limiting factor.

If the hose output is the same, then you'll fill one 10L bucket twice as fast with two hoses as you will with one. Along the same lines, if you have two 5L buckets, you'll fill them with 2 hoses AT THE SAME RATE as you will fill one 10L bucket with two hoses. It doesn't matter whether it's one 10L bucket or two 5L buckets if the hose flow rate is the key.

What I'm saying is that with batteries, it is NOT the hose flow rate that is the limiting factor--it is the battery cell maximum charging current. 

FearlessF

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #2667 on: February 15, 2021, 08:28:07 PM »
It depends on the EV of course, but they go in excess of 100 mph in nearly every case.

The Chevy Bolt will do 140 mph and get 0-60 in 5.3 seconds.  They tend to be pretty quick, a lot of torque off the line.

so, they should probably install little windmills to generate electricity to help charge the battery
and those fancy brakes that generate electricity
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Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #2668 on: February 15, 2021, 10:43:36 PM »
Which takes less time to recharge from empty?

A car with a 50 KwHr battery, or one with a 100?


Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #2669 on: February 15, 2021, 10:44:34 PM »
so, they should probably install little windmills to generate electricity to help charge the battery
and those fancy brakes that generate electricity
They do have regen brakes.  No windmills of course.

FearlessF

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #2670 on: February 15, 2021, 10:54:49 PM »
apparently the drag from the windmills isn't worth the added generation

I was thinking those few small spots where air is allowed to flow for cooling.  I understand the electric motor may produce much less heat, so no need for a radiator.  But, probably air cooled engine, keep batteries cool, brakes?
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Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #2671 on: February 15, 2021, 11:01:10 PM »
The batteries do have cooling systems. Regen braking does not get hot.

Cincydawg

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #2672 on: February 16, 2021, 07:02:01 AM »
apparently the drag from the windmills isn't worth the added generation
I thought you were kidding.  There is a real limit on windmill efficiency, under 50%.  So, you'd be producing drag and generating 40% of the energy lost to the drag.  Otherwise you'd have a perpetual motion machine.

Regen braking is a real thing and works.  You can set many EVs for driving without ever using your brake pedal, when you release the accelerator the regen brakes activate slightly and you slow down faster than you would normally.  It's a bit like gearing down except you recover energy.


Fast and Ultra-fast Chargers - Battery University

How Long Does It Take to Charge an Electric Car? | Pod Point (pod-point.com)

The time it takes to charge an electric car can be as little as 30 minutes or more than 12 hours. This depends on the size of the battery and the speed of the charging point.

  • A typical electric car (60kWh battery) takes just under 8 hours to charge from empty-to-full with a 7kW charging point.
  • Most drivers top up charge rather than waiting for their battery to recharge from empty-to-full.
  • For many electric cars, you can add up to 100 miles of range in ~35 minutes with a 50kW rapid charger.
  • The bigger your car’s battery and the slower the charging point, the longer it takes to charge from empty to full.

This last point is obvious.  A larger battery takes longer to recharge empty to full.The ratio is not linear of course.


OrangeAfroMan

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Re: In other news ...
« Reply #2673 on: February 16, 2021, 07:38:13 AM »
I'm still going with a trade-out station. 
Drive in, it's like an oil change setup, boom, they scan my car's sticker, it's one of the 3-6 common battery sizes every station has plenty of, and the machine underneath switches it out in a minute.  The weight doesn't matter, it's just the ID of the battery size/type and payment.
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