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Topic: CFB Is Terrible At Crowning a Champion

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bayareabadger

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Re: CFB Is Terrible At Crowning a Champion
« Reply #238 on: January 12, 2018, 08:37:35 AM »
I agree about schools moving up. About 10 years ago I was talking to an Appalachian St fan/alum at a work function. He said he hoped App St never moved up.  He enjoyed playing FCS level and being relevant and playing for something meaningful every year.
I remember him saying it would suck to join the Sun Belt and even if you win it you play in some crap bowl no one cares about.  Of course, we know where App St is now...
If I recall correctly, GSU pushed it off for the longest time becuase they liked being good. They got up a level and actually we’re good, but then a BAD hire torpedoed them.

847badgerfan

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Re: CFB Is Terrible At Crowning a Champion
« Reply #239 on: January 12, 2018, 08:42:30 AM »
Utah won 28 games in three years, rising to No. 3 one year and No. 11 the next.
TCU won 11 games three times in four years and has three top-10 finishes.
It’s weird, these teams seem to do more than jack squat.
TCU's performance has been very impressive. It will be interesting to see how they maintain it over the next decade or so, especially if the two elephants in the state wake up and start performing to their respective ceilings, as opposed to their floors.

Utah has a bit of an advantage, being the only P5 school in their state. They have some good football players in their own back yard to try and keep home (and away from BYU too).
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TyphonInc

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Re: CFB Is Terrible At Crowning a Champion
« Reply #240 on: January 12, 2018, 09:31:45 AM »
Can we play the game so the G5 actually wins? (Gets the money and gets the trophy?)
Call me crazy (hey Cra-Cra!)

There are 5 Conferences in the Group of 5, what if they sent their top champ to a New years 6 Bowl? (Keeps the money coming in) and have the other 4 conference champs participate in a 4 team playoff, (that occurred say 3~ish hours before the CFP playoff.)

The winner of the playoff is crowned G5 champion, and if the top G5 team wins their New Years Day Bowl Game they are crowned co-champ. So what, there are 2 lower level champs. They get to keep the Big Money and have their own playoff.

The only negatives I see is a couple of minor Bowls get dropped due to 4 teams no longer participating, some mid tier bowls reshuffling who gets invited. And "controversy" over who the "real" G5 champ is. But I think the controversy will actually get them more press time, and draw more interests to their games.
There also could be some back lash from the top G5 team wanting to be in the playoff instead of the Bowl game, but I think we the fans would want to see it. I don't know, would you rather play 1 "elite" team or 2 really good teams to get a trophy?

ELA

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Re: CFB Is Terrible At Crowning a Champion
« Reply #241 on: January 12, 2018, 11:41:32 AM »
Can we play the game so the G5 actually wins? (Gets the money and gets the trophy?)
Call me crazy (hey Cra-Cra!)

There are 5 Conferences in the Group of 5, what if they sent their top champ to a New years 6 Bowl? (Keeps the money coming in) and have the other 4 conference champs participate in a 4 team playoff, (that occurred say 3~ish hours before the CFP playoff.)

The winner of the playoff is crowned G5 champion, and if the top G5 team wins their New Years Day Bowl Game they are crowned co-champ. So what, there are 2 lower level champs. They get to keep the Big Money and have their own playoff.

The only negatives I see is a couple of minor Bowls get dropped due to 4 teams no longer participating, some mid tier bowls reshuffling who gets invited. And "controversy" over who the "real" G5 champ is. But I think the controversy will actually get them more press time, and draw more interests to their games.
There also could be some back lash from the top G5 team wanting to be in the playoff instead of the Bowl game, but I think we the fans would want to see it. I don't know, would you rather play 1 "elite" team or 2 really good teams to get a trophy?
I kind of like the idea of the best 4 competing in a tournament.  Not sure I like sending UCF to the Peach, just to watch Toledo, Boise, FAU and Troy duke it out.

SFBadger96

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Re: CFB Is Terrible At Crowning a Champion
« Reply #242 on: January 12, 2018, 01:48:23 PM »
While everyone is spit balling, what about a six-team playoff where, just as in the NFL, the top two teams get byes. Conference champs from the Power 5, and the top-rated team from among everyone else (Notre Dame and the lower-tier conferences). Does that mean 2012 Wisconsin (8-5) gets destroyed in one of the first-round games? Probably, but it also means conference championships mean something. And it gives a real advantage to the teams that finish 1, 2, without excluding other conference champs who may or may not have played a tougher schedule (or so they argue). 

It excludes Alabama this year, but again, that makes a conference championship more meaningful. I kind of like returning to an era in which the conference championship is everyone's goal. Given that Alabama won in OT, would it have been a sin if Georgia wins the title this year? Is there any real evidence that Alabama was "more" deserving than Georgia?

I'm sure I'm missing something, but I kind of like it. And just like the NFL system, have the first round the week after conference championships, the second round the week after that, and the championship on New Years Day.

847badgerfan

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Re: CFB Is Terrible At Crowning a Champion
« Reply #243 on: January 12, 2018, 02:20:05 PM »
If a 6 team and bye concept were to occur, I would move the first round to before Christmas. The layoffs are long enough as they are.

The only problem I see there would be final exams. I know for UW at least, finals are taken up to Christmas Eve (I had one on Christmas Eve actually) - not that UW will ever be in the playoff.
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rolltidefan

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Re: CFB Is Terrible At Crowning a Champion
« Reply #244 on: January 12, 2018, 02:28:17 PM »
Utah won 28 games in three years, rising to No. 3 one year and No. 11 the next.
TCU won 11 games three times in four years and has three top-10 finishes.
It’s weird, these teams seem to do more than jack squat.
those are bad examples. we should look at aTm, neb and mizz and how they've done after their move up to p5 conf. :)

rolltidefan

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Re: CFB Is Terrible At Crowning a Champion
« Reply #245 on: January 12, 2018, 02:38:41 PM »
While everyone is spit balling, what about a six-team playoff where, just as in the NFL, the top two teams get byes. Conference champs from the Power 5, and the top-rated team from among everyone else (Notre Dame and the lower-tier conferences). Does that mean 2012 Wisconsin (8-5) gets destroyed in one of the first-round games? Probably, but it also means conference championships mean something. And it gives a real advantage to the teams that finish 1, 2, without excluding other conference champs who may or may not have played a tougher schedule (or so they argue).

It excludes Alabama this year, but again, that makes a conference championship more meaningful. I kind of like returning to an era in which the conference championship is everyone's goal. Given that Alabama won in OT, would it have been a sin if Georgia wins the title this year? Is there any real evidence that Alabama was "more" deserving than Georgia?

I'm sure I'm missing something, but I kind of like it. And just like the NFL system, have the first round the week after conference championships, the second round the week after that, and the championship on New Years Day.
not sure why that excludes bama, they were the highest ranked 'everyone else', unless you limited it to 1/conf.
also, i don't like the hard set rule of conf champs in. i do not want to see 2012 gt (6-6 going into acccg), 2012 wisky (7-5), 2015 usc (8-4), 2011 ucla (6-6), and the many 3 loss teams that have played in all conf title games. all of those specific teams listed all lost, but eventually 1 will win and some 3 loss teams have won.
i'd be perfectly fine adding a "nd" type caveat, that if you're a p5 champ and in the top 8/10, you're guaranteed a spot.
but not a cut/dry line of conf champ. i value a 1 loss non champ over any 3+ loss team.

847badgerfan

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Re: CFB Is Terrible At Crowning a Champion
« Reply #246 on: January 12, 2018, 02:46:38 PM »
those are bad examples. we should look at aTm, neb and mizz and how they've done after their move up to p5 conf. :)
Mizzou and Nebraska won division titles (2, 1) when they moved. But now, well, now they are not too good.
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betarhoalphadelta

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Re: CFB Is Terrible At Crowning a Champion
« Reply #247 on: January 12, 2018, 02:48:49 PM »
If they have a playoff that lets conference champs of non-P5 conferences in, why wouldn't Arizona State move to the MWC and get into the playoffs every year?  Why wouldn't Illinois move to the MAC?  

The G5 or Other5 or whatever you want to call them are voluntarily participating in a system in which they cannot finish #1.  That's an odd choice, but it has been their choice.  Yes, they should move down.  And yet year after year, FCS teams keep jumping up instead, to join in with the ever-growing group of football teams that have no chance at #1.  Seems to me these ADs at Georgia State and App State and UTSA have some 'splainin' to do to the actual players themselves.

Seems odd.
Money. Purdue won't sniff a national championship. But we get millions and millions of dollars in the B1G, and would get none of that in the MAC. 
Also note that teams over time rise [or fall] to the level of their competition. Purdue out-recruits most MAC teams not because we're going to win the B1G and the national championship, but because we're *in* the B1G and recruits want to play on TV against the best competition they can. They get more exposure [and more likelihood of an NFL draft slot] playing for bigger schools. If Purdue dropped to the MAC, within a decade we'd be battling with MAC teams for recruits instead of battling with bottom-tier P5 schools, and that'd be a step down.
FCS teams move up because there's more money in FBS than in FCS, I assume. By moving up, they're playing higher-profile opponents, getting more televised games, getting a seat at a bigger table, etc. All of which results in a higher profile and higher revenue.
The national championship goes to 1 team a year. 60[ish] P5 teams reap the OTHER ($$$) benefits of P5 even if they aren't going to win the title. 

rolltidefan

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Re: CFB Is Terrible At Crowning a Champion
« Reply #248 on: January 12, 2018, 02:59:28 PM »
Mizzou and Nebraska won division titles (2, 1) when they moved. But now, well, now they are not too good.
i know, just a dig at the bigxii. it still baffles me how mizz played for sec title 2 times. they were decent teams, but not that good. east was just a clusterf.

Brutus Buckeye

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Re: CFB Is Terrible At Crowning a Champion
« Reply #249 on: January 12, 2018, 03:17:07 PM »
Luckily Nebraska helped the Big Ten dodge the Mizzou bullet. 
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847badgerfan

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Re: CFB Is Terrible At Crowning a Champion
« Reply #250 on: January 12, 2018, 03:19:01 PM »
Luckily Nebraska helped the Big Ten dodge the Mizzou bullet.
Mizzou was never a candidate, as much as they wanted to be (and probably still do). No bullet to dodge there.
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CousinFreddie

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Re: CFB Is Terrible At Crowning a Champion
« Reply #251 on: January 12, 2018, 03:25:44 PM »
i know, just a dig at the bigxii. it still baffles me how mizz played for sec title 2 times. they were decent teams, but not that good. east was just a clusterf.
Not much of a dig.  Mizzou never won the B12.  The last time NU and A&M won conference titles (and they only won 2 and 1 title respectively), was way back in the 90s.  They were all second tier when they left the conference.  Could not compete with either OU or Texas in the 00’s, and if they’d stuck around they would have had a lot of trouble with OkState, Baylor and TCU this decade.

 

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