UTk Logo

College Football Fan Site, CFB51 for TENNESSEE VOL FANS!!! Best FREE Tennessee Vol College Football Forum on the Internet!!!

One community smart about Tennessee College football with Civil discussion, game analytics, in depth player and coaching discussions, topics surrounding the game, and reading of both original and aggregated news and commentary in our Publisher. You can even have your own free board, all you have to do is ask!!!

Anyone is welcomed and encouraged to join our FREE Tennessee Fan Site and to take part in our Tennessee Vol community- a community with you- the user, the fan, and the person- will be protected from intrusive actions and with a clean and clear place to interact.


Author

Topic: Deep breath... politics aside... football

 (Read 1359 times)

Drew4UTk

  • Administrator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 10165
  • Liked:
Deep breath... politics aside... football
« on: July 18, 2023, 08:54:57 PM »
This can be moved to the football board and be fine with me... it'll be seen here, better.... 

I just watched, posted on FB, the five second miracle ending between the hedges where UT takes the win after allowing a 40yd td pass with 10sec remaining for the UGA lead.  

Good times.  Heckuva game.  

Under butch.... prior to Pruitt.  Dobbs.. kamara.. jennings.. a handful more... on a team we've recently learned had not a soul benching more than 400#, and in an era where 90% of the team can do that... hell, I was benching 315 sets of three in my prime... its unfathomable the lack of physical conditioning there from Dooley to just when Coach Heup arrived.  

That said.  

UT drew players based on tradition alone.  An AD seemed intent to rape the coffers and destroy "what was".  Fulmer sought revenge is all I can figure.  Pruitt didn't learn those tricks by himself- he's too dumb- he learned them at untouchable bama at the feet of the master Sat(b)an... 

When we hired the AD of USF I was not impressed... then HE hires Heupel- and I figured "it figures"... I was wrong.  Hugely.  Happily. 

But that is just a run down... the man child kitten took the teams better components with him to USCw,  and Dooley was a fool extraordinare... incapable of recruiting except for the brand name... and even then- and that is what this thread is about. 

And even then UT flashed.  They played bama far better than they ought to have but would collapse in the late third and fourth.  They played and beat UGA when they shouldn't have.  Yeah, they lost to Vandy for the first time I could recall and UK in horrid embarrassment..  but they still played the game and flashed. Dobbs even beat UF.  

Point being- the giants of this conference aren't all that.  UF is without rudder... Bama relies on the ploys of superior athletes and the NIL+transfer portal has taken much umph from their machine.  UGA is the new bama, but they show weakness from time to time toying about with their food... theyre the only team in the east that SHOULD beat UT.  But who wants to bet on that game either way? 

LSU was flat out outcoached by UT last season... say all you want about the preseason love for them, but they will be beat again if UT gets the chance.  Bama... at home... nobody beats bama at home unless they actually beat them down- and that is something that CAN happen, but I wouldn't bet on it.  

UT isn't that far out from others.  Not anymore. They should be able to go toe to toe with anyone. 

I never thought I'd say that again.  I really didn't. 

Thoughts? 

jgvol

  • All Star
  • ******
  • Posts: 4846
  • Liked:
Re: Deep breath... politics aside... football
« Reply #1 on: July 18, 2023, 09:03:04 PM »
Good synopsis, and being in the conversation again feels good.  I, too, wasn’t enthralled with Heupel, but grateful to be wrong for once.  

I must say however, that our defense, and our defense coordinator, don’t inspire much confidence from me.  And we still aren’t nearly fast enough, or strong enough on that side of the ball.  But, hopefully progressed a bit in the off-season.  Recruiting will be key here going forward, moreso than on the offensive side of the ball.  

And then there’s Joe.  I am hopeful that we don’t see what we saw in 2021, but I haven’t forgotten like some have.  Fingers crossed.  

Drew4UTk

  • Administrator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 10165
  • Liked:
Re: Deep breath... politics aside... football
« Reply #2 on: July 18, 2023, 09:15:35 PM »
I'm hoping I'm right about this, but that's all it is- hope... 

I'll offer hooker was capable of adjusting for receivers... whereas Milton cant- requiring receivers to adjust to him... its more than that, though. It's, frankly, IQ. 

Hookers game IQ was fantastic.. every time I think of Milton, I think of the Ole miss game and the final seconds when hooker was hurt- and him going out of bounds after time expired instead of chunking it toward the end zone.  That was dumberndumb... nerves? Sure... but at that level it's unacceptable and shows he's a spaz or his game IQ just isn't there. 

Spaz can be coached.  Game IQ can too, but can only be improved just so much. 

'23 hinges on QB play. 

TREX

  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 15769
  • Liked:
Re: Deep breath... politics aside... football
« Reply #3 on: July 18, 2023, 09:32:32 PM »
We have so much depth at Receiver and running back that its criminal.


Our D will be better this year as well.   

Milton is a big kid. A big tough kid.  Glad we have him.

Snoop Dog needs to gain some weight for his own sake

awinatl

  • Starter
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 2067
  • Liked:
Re: Deep breath... politics aside... football
« Reply #4 on: July 18, 2023, 09:45:10 PM »
I think Milton will be fine as a whole but his default when being forced out of the pocket is to fling it 60 yds downfield so moving the chains on 3rd/4th and 4 will be key for him.

I’ll have to see it to believe it to have confidence in him in a close coming down to the wire 

roadvol

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 10174
  • Liked:
Re: Deep breath... politics aside... football
« Reply #5 on: July 18, 2023, 09:54:24 PM »
Living in Alabama after a year of beating the Tide in football, mens/ women's basketball and baseball it can't get any better but am hoping it does.
We have a favorable schedule and more depth but like any season we will need some luck, especially in avoiding major injuries.
Had some great leaders on the team last year and never know until the season  begins if they can be replaced 
One final note..read an article this week that the Vols will be wearing a black hat this season as almost everyone outside of UT thinks we got off light with the NCAA. Not really a bad thing...means we'll be playing with a chip on our shoulder this year.
GBO!!!

Volbrigade/oU

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 99158
  • Liked:
Re: Deep breath... politics aside... football
« Reply #6 on: July 18, 2023, 10:39:28 PM »
These are the good ol’ days for UT athletics.

Like Drew, I never thought I’d say that again.  It just goes to show ya… ya never know…

And what a bright, and welcome, compensation for these dark and dismal times.

We’ve been ranked #1, if only for a week or two, in football, baseball, and hoops recently (I’m a little hazy on hoops — maybe it’s been since Grant and Admiral.  But we got real high in the polls last year…).  And are at least competitive in girls’ hoops (which I don’t care about any more, sadly).

Some MASSIVE wins. 

I see your point about those pre-Heup teams, Drew.  Pruitt had some talent on both sides of the ball.  If he’d had a Hooker, instead of a you-know-who… we might still be doin’ the mashed tater.

Really, I’m just astounded at our change in fortune.  When Pruitt left, football was in the gutter.  Yea — another mediocre coach we get to fire after five more years of more or less .500 football.  Then lather, rinse, repeat.  Repaint the numbers on the bleacher seats.  Add about a foot for each one.  Make it a foot and a half.  Install stadium seats, so the bowl won’t look so empty with 60-70K in it.

Now?  Well, night and day doesn’t quite cover it.

Similar with hoops.  “Oh, great.  That washed up retread, Barnes.” 

If we’ve had better eras of Vol hoops, they’ve been few and far between. 

And baseball, from what I gather, was a dumpster fire (didn’t pay attention).  Seems to be rolling along now…

Girls hoops is better.

Coaching.  So important.

I really like Heup.  The excitement that he’s brought to this program — unbelievable.  And I think the feeling’s mutual.  I think he knows he’s pulling the levers of a one-of-a-kind tradition and culture.  I think he realizes that there are few places in the country that are better to be than those pleasant hills and dales around Knoxville. 

So:  it’s all good.  How great it is to walk past the magazine section in the grocery, see the new Lindy’s and Athlons and Sporting News, and say “hey — let’s see what they’re saying about us.  Let’s see where they got us ranked…”.  Instead of knowing where we are — fourth or fifth in the East…

Milton:

here’s guy who’s talent has ridden him like a rented mule.  Or something.  What I mean is — it’s like he’s just been riding along on the tsunami wave of his incredible athletic prowess and measurables.  Just cruisin’ along.  Laid back as can be.  What, me worry?  “Ain’t nuthin’ there.  I’ll jest step out of bounds…”

“You IDIOT!!!” 

“Who — me??  What?  Oh…”

If he’s ready to ride that talent; to put a bit in its mouth, and take control of it — man.  Look out.  There ain’t no ceiling.  He’s older.  He’s been through it.  If Clemson comes to be seen as a STEP in his BECOMING…

It’s gonna be hard for the D to give up enough points for us to lose more than 2…

   

Drew4UTk

  • Administrator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 10165
  • Liked:
Re: Deep breath... politics aside... football
« Reply #7 on: July 18, 2023, 11:48:53 PM »
Micheal Bishop, played for KSU.... he had the strongest arm I've ever seen.  Close behind him is Heath Shuler.  I've heard several times he actually ruptured the threads on a football, once, throwing it at a sheet of plywood within 20 yards.  Truth? Who knows... good story all the same...

Milton may have that caliber of arm... the kind that shows up on the scene once every ten years or so.  Maybe.  It's strong, for certain.... but if he can't get it into hands of a receiver- it doesn't matter. 

Bishop's receivers complained- especially crossing routes in the center no more than 10yds deep- they said it actually hurt to catch the ball.  Shuler, well, as much as I love the guy he just isn't too smart.  Seriously.  The 'skins said he hardly got past the first page of the playbook...

Now Heup- his O is astounding.  It's the tempo, obviously, that draws the D into disregarding a single aspect... and when they do he lights it up.  Most SEC Ds can defend the run inside with the four down lineman and an LB in zone who can move up on the read- that goes back to Joe Lee Dunn and RC Slocum and that 46 and 44 D they ran... the lineman and singular LB can clog the middle... so... spread them ala Meyer- still nothing complicated... just an Option but buying the QB a second of read from the backfield and having the D stretched... adjustments made reduced it by the end of its tenure.  Saban broke him, in fact, with traditional smash mouth and threatening the QB every single play to the point his poor heart broke...... then comes Huep and what I call the Heuper O...

I've always been a D guy... reaction to threat but quick to turn that aggressive.  Chief had a set Fulmer would let him run from time to time, and it was nice- no down linemen... they just kinda roamed in a 10 foot or so box before the snap not allowing an O read until the snap.  It wasn't used as much as it should have been.  That is the type of D that worries me UT will see- not by a bama or uga- they have the ponies to not worry about things like that- but lessor staffed teams have to disguise as often as possible.  Heup doesn't do anything counter to fundamental- he just uses those wide out doubled or tripled up way outside, and the lone guy on the other side.  Sooner or later a DB os going to get tangled and drop that receiver- amd that receiver is going to react by streaking instead of hitch... and that's where the magic of his O happens. 

UGA didn't get lazy, and they didn't ever give up on the run last year.  They didn't sacrifice the center as many teams did.  And make no mistake, that strike O that could score from any place on the field scored- forcing other teams to play catchup... amd Satan himself got lulled in.. Smart didn't.  He just kept beating the receivers with DBs that wouldn't sleep and clogged the line- and the backup guys were just as good as the starters. 

If Joe can execute the O the only two teams that "should" beat is are obvious.  Hopefully USCe still hurts enough they've learned about sleepwalking. 


fuzzynavol

  • seeker of passage
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 17503
  • Liked:
Re: Deep breath... politics aside... football
« Reply #8 on: July 19, 2023, 08:43:35 AM »
I'm more than a little grateful that Roady has forgotten some of my prior remarks about UT football.



roadvol

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 10174
  • Liked:
Re: Deep breath... politics aside... football
« Reply #9 on: July 19, 2023, 09:40:26 AM »
I'm more than a little grateful that Roady has forgotten some of my prior remarks about UT football.

[img width=204.963 height=360]https://abload.de/img/garo2qdasz.gif[/img]

Not forgotten but forgiven. Why spoil the moment on one of the very few topics we can all unite on.
« Last Edit: July 19, 2023, 04:54:44 PM by roadvol »

gymvol

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 13475
  • Liked:
Re: Deep breath... politics aside... football
« Reply #10 on: July 19, 2023, 04:36:31 PM »


With the SEC commissioner Greg Sanky living in Birmingham close to his buddy Nick Saban I don't think anyone would think referees would risk their careers by allowing TN to win in Tuscaloosa.

Face it BAMA gets the calls or no calls when it should go against them.  I think everyone knows it and knows why. It's all about the money getting SEC teams into the playoffs.

College football hasn't been amateur athletics played by student athletes since the BCS came about. Now that with the NIL it will only get worse and even more crooked if that's possible.

The day of the student athlete has long since passed. 

If everyone is thinking alike then somebody isn't thinking.

George S. Patton

Volbrigade/oU

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 99158
  • Liked:
Re: Deep breath... politics aside... football
« Reply #11 on: July 19, 2023, 04:44:43 PM »
Quote
Bishop's receivers complained- especially crossing routes in the center no more than 10yds deep- they said it actually hurt to catch the ball.  Shuler, well, as much as I love the guy he just isn't too smart.  Seriously.  The 'skins said he hardly got past the first page of the playbook...



Shuler's pro career was disappointing to the point of tragedy.

I really thought he was the next Elway or Aikman. 

He was held out of camp for a week or two.  Contract negotiations.  By the time he got there, (can't think of the guy's name, had it just five minutes ago -- Edit, just did -- Gus Freotte) a low-round, lowly paid guy, had developed the respect of the OL, who resented the high-dollar Golden Boy.  Heath got off on the wrong foot, and never could recover.  Apparently, he just wasn't that much better than -- dang, what is that guy's name?  And then he got hurt...

As far as the intelligence thing -- seems like an ordinary Joe to me.  I don't put much credence in the comments of some obscure football functionaries...

Heath, like Overthrow Joe (almost put "OJ".  Whoops.  That won't work.  OTJ?), had the God-given ability to effortless sling the ball great distances on a low trajectory, with exceptional velocity.  Or throw it high in the air, a real-estate-gobblng missle.  I can still see one of Heath's pinpoint bombs to Carl Pickens.  Louisville, '91?  '93?

In a game where that is a basic qualification for the QB position at the college and pro level --

to see someone who STANDS OUT at it is a rare and wonderful thing.

Happened to flip over to SECN for a second last night.  Good timing!  The panel interviewed Josh.  And then the former -- Vandy, maybe? -- QB analyzed OTJ's TD pass to Bruuuuu against Clemson.  And was raving over his reading the D, checking down his receivers, before making a throw that few humans can. 

Josh continues to impress.  Well-spoken.  Personable.  Not a good-looking fella.  Just exudes pure competence.  We absolutely lucked out.  Answered prayers?

He has invented a better mouse trap.  As he recruits to it, it is just going to get harder to stop.  Other teams with less than blue-chip talent will imitate it.  It evens the field.  D's will have to adapt. 

Josh will have to invent new wrinkles.  Stay a step ahead.

I'm optimistic he can do it.

D?  I think Banks' criticism is a little harsh.  Time and again, we made plays last year when we needed to.  Hopefully, we're addressing our secondary and pass rush issues.  I've never been impressed with Marinez, a much-travelled journeyman who was not liked (as DC, I think?) at UGA.

(EDIT -- I have no explanation for USC-e.  But something effed-up was going on.  And it had something to do with Banks.)

I was watching the end of the Bama game on SECN's "Tennessee Day" a few nights ago.  I still don't know how we won that game.  It was just time for the sun to shine on our arse.  That Bama RB holds onto the ball on their last series, and we need a TD to tie.  Instead of a FG to win.

Banks dialed up heat play after play.  Remember Chief's "prevents", that never prevented anything?  We couldn't get to -- dang, now I can't remember the Bama QB's name -- on the play he delivered the dropped TD. 

But -- we won.

I said it's great.  To be.  A Tennessee Vol. 

 

UT yeah!
Support the Site!
Purchase of every item listed here DIRECTLY supports the site.