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Topic: Georgia vs. Texas 2: Electric Boogaloo

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Cincydawg

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Re: Georgia vs. Texas 2: Electric Boogaloo
« Reply #70 on: December 09, 2024, 10:43:02 AM »
Eh, Kirby Smart is an incredible jackass and the SEC office is weak and insipid.  We learned plenty from that altercation.
Maybe "we" learned something, but it ended up being forgotten and irrelevant to anything at all.

And maybe refs are influenced by the "image" of certain groups, that seems possible to me.

utee94

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Re: Georgia vs. Texas 2: Electric Boogaloo
« Reply #71 on: December 09, 2024, 10:52:47 AM »
The problem with assuming that there's no referee bias because referees don't go into games intending to favor Team A over Team B is that it assumes intentionality is necessary for biased calls.  It isn't. 

Alabama vs. LSU were prime examples over the years.  Many LSU fans thought referees were in the bag for the Gumps, and eventually the issues were obvious enough to grab the attention of media who openly questioned calls.  (The same media who likely created the problem I'm about to describe.)  Personally, I don't think the referees ever tried to tank LSU's games against the Tide.  I think referees are people like the rest of us who are subject to the constant barrage of "information" on certain things, and like the rest of us, it can't help but color our opinion.  The studies of the effects of propaganda on people who know they're being inundated with propaganda are clear.  Even when we're aware of it, it affects us. 

So when Alabama's OL has a reputation for being amazing and they are amazing without having to commit holds, does a referee have to be in the bag to miss holding calls?  I don't think so.  But believing without realizing it that this OL does what it does without holding may lead to seeing something that makes you say "Was that holding.  Eh...it was questionable, I'll let it go." 

I've said this a number of times as an illustration, but also to show I'm attempting to not be biased, I think the same thing was true of LSU DBs for a long time.  For a decade, LSU was considered DBU, or one of the DBUs at least, and not without reason.  But I noticed that our DBs got away with more grabby behavior than other teams got away with, and earlier contact with WRs than other teams got away with.  There were many times our guys made a "good play" but I was convinced there was no flag because refs were used to not throwing flags on our DBs.  It didn't have to be "I'm rooting for LSU so I will not throw a flag."  Maybe it's more "These LSU DBs keep going high in the draft and becoming NFL stars and they're so well coached, look how they defend right to the edge of what's allowed."  When maybe sometimes it was just PI. 

Granted, Alabama seemed to have more instances of that working in their favor, but I'm just pointing out how narratives affect calls.  I doubt the officials were intentionally biased toward UGA, but I raise my eyebrows when calls start getting a certain amount lopsided.  UGA is the team now who loads the NFL with stars and has recently won two NCs and has all the narrative about it's great staff, coach, players, etc.  I think it's naive to believe that has no effect on the referee crews.  And the no-call on the late hit on Ewers was flat-out egregious, nobody but the homerest of homer UGA fans could say otherwise.  I don't recall if it made a difference.  But it was a horrible no-call on an obvious PF. 

I think this is all certainly part of it, at least.

Drew4UTk

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Re: Georgia vs. Texas 2: Electric Boogaloo
« Reply #72 on: December 09, 2024, 12:04:17 PM »
i reckon i watch things some don't, or read into things maybe i shouldn't.  one of these is one of those: 

Georgia is the 'anointed' heir to the saban affect... they're gong to get every break where officiating can make it happen.  it's that simple.  this doesn't make them invincible, but, it means you have to straight up beat them down. 

there is something going on with carson beck... maybe it has to do with fancy cars being delivered, or the NIL fanfare in general that causes a rift on any team, but, UGA- despite their dominance- has played lousy most the season... only to maybe 75% of their potential.  I hate that, but i believe it to be true, too.  the first half of this game was owned by texas: they owned the mojo, AND they owned the pistol used to shoot themselves in the foot... after the half and when Beck was ambulatory,  i thought Texas would roll... they didn't because an entirely different UGA came out and they had some pep in their step- slapping each other on the helmet and rallying... that has been missing all year... and they played hungry- and mean... and i'm not certain anyone can beat them in that state. it's my opinion when a roster as stacked as theirs (and as several other teams) are playing in their comfort zone and loose, where one player challenges another and they try to out-do each other happens- their opponent becomes themselves and ceases to be the wide eyed haggard looking bunch in different colors across the LoS.  

the proof will be if Beck returns- to my knowledge the extent of his booboo hasn't been released... if it was season ending, whatever team UGA sends out will be a completely different animal in play call and tendency than we've seen this season- if not season ending, and if they fall back into the 'laxisdasical' effort as under Beck- there are several teams that can beat them... including Texas.  

Cincydawg

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Re: Georgia vs. Texas 2: Electric Boogaloo
« Reply #73 on: December 09, 2024, 12:13:21 PM »
Beck has a UCL tear, he is out at least for the first round.  The good news is that Stockton will have plenty of time to prepare and he is talented, just inexperienced.


Drew4UTk

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Re: Georgia vs. Texas 2: Electric Boogaloo
« Reply #74 on: December 09, 2024, 12:18:19 PM »
The problem with assuming that there's no referee bias because referees don't go into games intending to favor Team A over Team B is that it assumes intentionality is necessary for biased calls.  It isn't. ........................... no-call on an obvious PF. 
here is the thing... there is no excuse within a conference, but there is a ton of room for excuse crossing conferences, imHo.  

the PAC, with their 'west coast O' some years back were the recipient of BOTH a lot of missed PI calls and over scrutinized PI calls that were made... they let the interior hold like mugs unless the player was set to sack.... then, they'd call it.  all that is well and good and it's adjusted for inside that conference.  the B1G would have a lot of holding calls in the same era, a lot of false starts, but very few 'false starts because the Olineman was 'tricked'' as we seen called nowadays... the receivers would be in the flats or five yards downfield beating the hell out of the CB's, or, vice versa.. nobody cared, as that wasn't where the action was.  SEC and it's playaction had it's drawbacks... and advantages... and nobody cared.  it's how the game was played. 

now, though, when the focus is all season long on national champions and conference doesn't hold the same weight anymore- and games which require refs from neutral conferences to officiate- you'll see what we'd call 'asinine' calls, or questionable call, or missed calls- because that isn't the way it's called in your 'home' conference.  

... i've not studied other conferences this season- just the SEC... and there is zero doubt in my mind that refs aren't entering a game with a hedge on one team or another... and that has big psych impact on players.  the UT players after the UGA game were blunt about it... we can see it plainly without their confirmation.  and it all comes back to: it's a business and it's about the money, period.  SCOTUS has even ruled that these leagues are such and can therefor do what they want to impact the outcome without penalty... folks forgot that, apparently... but it's so... and begs (at least presents) the question:  why even concern over a decision such as that if it weren't happening?

and is why i won't wager on games. especially meaningful games. 

MikeDeTiger

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Re: Georgia vs. Texas 2: Electric Boogaloo
« Reply #75 on: December 11, 2024, 10:09:51 AM »

... i've not studied other conferences this season- just the SEC... and there is zero doubt in my mind that refs aren't entering a game with a hedge on one team or another... and that has big psych impact on players.  the UT players after the UGA game were blunt about it... we can see it plainly without their confirmation.  and it all comes back to: it's a business and it's about the money, period.  SCOTUS has even ruled that these leagues are such and can therefor do what they want to impact the outcome without penalty... folks forgot that, apparently... but it's so... and begs (at least presents) the question:  why even concern over a decision such as that if it weren't happening?


Given the rest of what you wrote, did you mean zero doubt that refs are entering a game with a hedge on a team?  I'm not sure I followed your train of thought here.  

 

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