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Topic: Worst Officiating Ever

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longhorn320

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #30 on: October 20, 2018, 12:35:50 PM »
Does any of our non-longhorn brethren find it rich that they are complaining about the refs?  

I’m surprised no Sooners have brought up that Ou Tech tilt from the mid to late 2000’s where OU was totally screwed (with replays to boot) at the end of the game.

My personal favorite is the late hit or out of bounds hit that gave Texas a fresh set of downs and win the final A&M/Texas game. Pictures later surfaced showing said ref in Longhorn garb. Personally I blame that game on Mike Sherman and Bill Byrne.
Why gigem whatever do you mean?

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« Last Edit: October 20, 2018, 12:37:52 PM by longhorn320 »
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FearlessF

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #31 on: October 21, 2018, 09:55:02 PM »
let's have a spelling contest
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

CharleyHorse46

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #32 on: October 22, 2018, 02:32:32 PM »
So I looked at that screenshot from Tombstone and wondered whatever happened JoAnna Pacula...

So I went to imbd to look at the full cast list...

Did you know Michael Rooker, Thomas Haden Church and Billy Bob Thornton were in it?  I didn't remember that.  They were all kind of lost in the wayside of Val Kilmer, Powers Booth and Michael Biehn chewing up the screen.

So I looked up clips.

Remembered Church.  Rooker was a youngster.  And Billy Bob Thornton was a chubby cheeked boy.  I didn't even recognize him.

FearlessF

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #33 on: October 22, 2018, 09:09:00 PM »
my favorite western of all-time
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

Kris60

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #34 on: October 28, 2018, 05:19:19 PM »
Can we add the botched job the refs pulled in the Ok St-Texas game on the attempted fake punt from the Pokes.  Half of the team moves and Texas is called for offsides.  That was a big play in that game.

FearlessF

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #35 on: October 28, 2018, 06:03:39 PM »
I understand that the Okies are moving around pre-snap, but the defense needs to hold their water and not cross the neutral zone

it was probably a bad call, but not the worst call ever
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

Entropy

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #36 on: October 30, 2018, 03:51:59 PM »
well... not one game... but...

Nebraska offensive opponents were called for zero holding calls on pass plays for 21 straight conference games (over 600 pass attempts).


The Generation X'er in me says the BIG has something against UNL.   The realist in me says UNL doesn't have a DL athletic enough to warrant a holding call.   Either way, it's an interesting stat.
« Last Edit: October 30, 2018, 03:53:54 PM by Entropy »

Mr Tulip

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #37 on: October 30, 2018, 04:08:46 PM »
Can we add the botched job the refs pulled in the Ok St-Texas game on the attempted fake punt from the Pokes.  Half of the team moves and Texas is called for offsides.  That was a big play in that game.
This comes down to a judgement call. Clearly, offenses set and reset all the time. Players motion out of the backfield.
The differentiator is supposed to be "simulating the start of a play". That is, a RB can go in motion in a clearly defined movement. Jumping forward really fast before doing so would not be allowed.
I agree with you that the refs botched this one. When the two inside protectors suddenly shot towards the Center, the defending rushers logically took that as the start of the play (they're looking at the players and not the ball). oSu should have been called for a false start.

BrownCounty

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #38 on: October 30, 2018, 04:09:13 PM »
Does any of our non-longhorn brethren find it rich that they are complaining about the refs?

Learning to complain about Longhorn favoritism is part of Aggie fish camp.  No one listens when Aggies cry out.

As far as Sooners, too many of their MNC's have an asterisk for me to worry about their virtue being violated.

FearlessF

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #39 on: October 30, 2018, 04:13:07 PM »
I preferred the good ol days when the offense had to be set for a full count and the defense could do whatever the heck they wanted to try to make them flinch
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utee94

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #40 on: October 30, 2018, 04:59:42 PM »
I understand that the Okies are moving around pre-snap, but the defense needs to hold their water and not cross the neutral zone

it was probably a bad call, but not the worst call ever
It was absolutely the wrong call, actually.  Definitely one of the worst calls ever, because they got it completely wrong, and it was extremely impactful.
There were 4 things going on there.  
1) Multiple olinemen shifting.  They are allowed to do this before they are down and before the ball is snapped. However, the rules dictate that this is NOT something that can draw the defense offsides. The only way the defense can be offsides in this case, is if the ball snaps. And if the linemen are shifting when the ball snaps, then it's an illegal procedure on the offense.
2) Two men shifting forward in the backfield toward the LOS.  Similar to above, this is allowed before the ball snaps, but by rule it's not something that can draw the defense offsides. The only way the defense can be called offsides here, is if the ball snaps, and if the ball snaps, then once again, that's an illegal procedure on the offense.  
3) A covered olineman shifting. Which is exactly what happened.  This one is an automatic illegal procedure and should have blown the play dead immediately with an illegal procedure on the offense.
4) Any motions/maneuvers that are designed to simulate the start of the play with the intent to draw the defense offsides unfairly, are also against the rules and an illegal procedure.  This play was CLEARLY designed to confuse both the defense, and the refs.  I give them credit, it worked, but the refs blew this one badly.  4 different ways it could have and should have been called illegal procedure on the offense, and yet it was incorrectly called against the defense.
And it was obviously VERY highly impactful.  Pretty much the worst call I've seen all season long due to the magnitude of its effect on the game as well as the total wrongness of the officials missing it 4 different ways.

utee94

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #41 on: October 30, 2018, 05:02:52 PM »
This comes down to a judgement call. Clearly, offenses set and reset all the time. Players motion out of the backfield.
The differentiator is supposed to be "simulating the start of a play". That is, a RB can go in motion in a clearly defined movement. Jumping forward really fast before doing so would not be allowed.
I agree with you that the refs botched this one. When the two inside protectors suddenly shot towards the Center, the defending rushers logically took that as the start of the play (they're looking at the players and not the ball). oSu should have been called for a false start.
Right. Like I outlined above, FOUR different ways this was an illegal procedure/false start on oSu, and not a single one of them was called.  Horrible, horrible call.


utee94

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #42 on: October 30, 2018, 05:04:23 PM »
I preferred the good ol days when the offense had to be set for a full count and the defense could do whatever the heck they wanted to try to make them flinch
I'll definitely agree with you there.  I mean... the offense KNOWS the snap count.  Not sure why they need any NEW protections other than that.  It worked for the first hundred years or so...

DevilFroggy

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #43 on: October 31, 2018, 01:24:39 AM »
ASU's game against Stanford last week was one of the worst ones in recent memory. 

We got jobbed at home vs LSU in 2005, that was NOT a touchdown catch by Early Doucet with 1:14 left in the game, dammit. 


I thought I settled my debts that night on the ride home
But I have still got hell to pay

DevilFroggy

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #44 on: October 31, 2018, 01:28:35 AM »
And while ASU did benefit from a ref blunder (nothing intentional, the refs were just dumb) at the end of their home game vs Wisconsin in 2013 I don't feel bad about it. Not only do I feel like ASU was the better team (if that game is played 10 times ASU wins 7-8 of them) but in the first half the refs missed an obvious hold by one of their olineman while their QB was in the endzone (should be a safety) but the refs missed another play where the badger QB's knee was down before he pitched the ball off to an RB for some positive yards when it should have been a sack. 
I thought I settled my debts that night on the ride home
But I have still got hell to pay

Kris60

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #45 on: October 31, 2018, 05:18:07 AM »
1992 vs. Syracuse.  WVU is up 17-13 with about 2 minutes left and SU has the ball.  QB Marvin Graves is belted out of bounds on a scramble.  He thinks it’s a dirty hit (it wasn’t) so he gets up and rifles the ball into the back of the head of DB Tommy Orr.  Orr turns around and pushes him and then is basically enveloped by the entire Orange sideline.

A mini brawl erupts and after a minute or so everyone is separated as the refs discuss what to do.  After all the discussion the ref gets on the mic and announces three WVU starters in the secondary have been ejected along with a 3rd string tackle from Syracuse.  The kid from SU was so obscure he wasn’t listed on the roster the WVU radio crew had received from the school.  Graves, the guy who started it all in the first place, gets nothing.

Graves takes advantage of a depleted secondary and leads the Orange on a 2 minute drive that culminates in a touchdown.  SU wins 20-17.  To this day Marvin Graves is despised in the state of WV.

Drew4UTk

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #46 on: October 31, 2018, 08:13:13 AM »
ECU @ Bama, somewhere in the mid nineties... Bama calls a t/o to stop the clock at the end of the game after their runner being tackled in bounds, and when ECU was ahead, and... the refs grant it... problem: they'd already used all three for the half.  solution: the refs gave them another anyway.  They split the uprights and won the game.  Steve Logan, then HC of ECU said after the game "I will NEVER allow a game scheduled in the SEC regular season again".   I've seen some blown calls before, and just remark that (prior to instant replay) refs are just human too- but this one was flat out nasty and literally stole a game from a team that had worked their asses off the entire game to earn that win.... 

FearlessF

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #47 on: October 31, 2018, 10:02:19 AM »
And while ASU did benefit from a ref blunder (nothing intentional, the refs were just dumb) at the end of their home game vs Wisconsin in 2013 I don't feel bad about it. 
hah, nobody ever feels bad about being on the "lucky" end of a blown call
hopefully, these equal out in the football universe over time
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Kris60

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #48 on: November 04, 2018, 08:53:22 PM »
I have a new nominee.  The crew of WVU-Texas authored a complete shit show yesterday.  One of the worst officiated games I’ve seen in quite a while.

utee94

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #49 on: November 04, 2018, 09:22:52 PM »
It was shocking bad, no doubt.

Congrats on the win Kris, despite the numerous Texas losses to your team and the awkward geography/timezone/distance stuff, I've been really happy with the addition of WVU to the B12.  Best of luck from here on out, and, with a little luck, perhaps Texas will get the chance at a rematch in the completely redundant and unnecessary B12 CCG. ;)


MikeDeTiger

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #50 on: November 05, 2018, 09:48:59 AM »
What's sad is how much us SEC guys complain about the officiating, and rightfully so.....yet they're still better than the Big 12 and PAC refs.  

Honestly, I'm not sure that overall the SEC crews aren't perhaps the best (definitely the fastest) refs.  

And that's really, really sad.  

Because they suck.  

CharleyHorse46

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #51 on: November 05, 2018, 12:31:36 PM »
You know... sometimes spots are even worse than calls.  A little fudge here or there can sure mess up a game.  And I'm not even talking about the Texas-wvu game.  I'm talking about all games in general.  

But the nice thing about the Texas-wvu game was that the officiating was thoroughly bad.  Misery loves company and when the refs are hosing you it always provides great solace to see them hosing your opponent too.

Texas and wvu both got screwed.  And even though Texas lost, the Horns had hunnert woulda coulda shouldas that might've changed everything.

Hard to complain in light of those factors.

CousinFreddie

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #52 on: November 05, 2018, 02:22:01 PM »
Honestly, I'm not sure that overall the SEC crews aren't perhaps the best (definitely the fastest) refs. 
Change the first s to a t, and they would become "definitely the fattest refs."
Seriously though, is there an objective measure for refs?  In this age of video replay, I think they're beginning to get a handle on which baseball umpires are more (and less) accurate at calling balls and strikes.  But in football, hmmm, seems harder to get an objective measure on whether the knee hit the turf before the ball crossed the plane, given that it would actually be a review of the review, nowadays, kind of like a refereeing infinite mirror, of sorts. 

How do we determine which conference has the best (and worst) refs?  We can give anecdotal examples of times when our team got ripped off in a OOC game (and for OU, definitely it was SWC and Pac refs that seemed the worst, but still the sample size is not large even if at times egregious).  But systematically, who has analyzed the refs?  And, who'll stop the rain?  And, who knows where the time goes?

MikeDeTiger

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #53 on: November 05, 2018, 03:32:39 PM »
I was thinking more in terms of bad penalties called, or missing penalties that should've been called.  Not so much in terms of placing the ball correctly or where/when a guy's knee was down.  

The SEC has a long and storied history of flat out botches.  And they're still probably not worth complaining about as much as what I see sometimes in the PAC and the B12.  

Mr Tulip

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #54 on: November 07, 2018, 11:18:26 AM »
You know... sometimes spots are even worse than calls.  A little fudge here or there can sure mess up a game.  And I'm not even talking about the Texas-wvu game.  I'm talking about all games in general.  

But the nice thing about the Texas-wvu game was that the officiating was thoroughly bad.  Misery loves company and when the refs are hosing you it always provides great solace to see them hosing your opponent too.

Texas and wvu both got screwed.  And even though Texas lost, the Horns had hunnert woulda coulda shouldas that might've changed everything.

Hard to complain in light of those factors.
Yeah. The statistician in me knows that conspiracy theories are bunk, the mistakes in a sufficiently large sample even out, and the proximal mistake usually gets unfairly blamed.
A lot of what happened in the Texas/WVU game was appallingly bad. It had an effect on the game.
However, that doesn't mean you're obligated to overthrow wide open TEs. It doesn't force you to run a lengthy toss sweep on 2nd and goal from the 1/2 yard line. It shouldn't confuse your DE and have him repeatedly crash inside while leaving the ball carrier sprinting past him.
When you play perfectly and lose when the officiating hoses you, then you can complain.
Actually, I complain constantly anyway.

Drew4UTk

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #55 on: November 07, 2018, 11:36:12 AM »
in that spirit, @Mr Tulip , i feel much the same about OT games... if one team doesn't decisively defeat another they aren't that much better... and even then it's a toss up if the delta is because of one bad match up on the field (i.e. a specific receiver can't be covered w/o opening up other receivers, or a specific DL can't be contained by the OL w/o opening up threats elsewhere)... 

calls ought not be a factor in who wins or loses if one team is truly better than the other, pretty much period.... unless you're alabama and got an additional t/o at the end of regulation and inside field goal range. shizen like that, now... that is heartbreaking. 

CharleyHorse46

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #56 on: November 25, 2018, 10:49:42 AM »
Lots of folks seem to be talking about this one.  I didn’t see it.

https://www.sbnation.com/2018/11/25/18110745/texas-am-lsu-overtime-fbs-record

utee94

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #57 on: November 25, 2018, 11:05:35 AM »
Yeah, there was some weird and questionable stuff at the end of the game.  If I were an LSU fan, I'd probably be feeling pretty robbed right about now.

I think there are reasonable explanations for how the Aggies tied it up on that final drive in regulation, but the worst one was that I absolutely believe LSU recovered a fumble to end the Aggies' possession in the first OT, and thus won the game at that point.  To my eye it's not even questionable, it's a clear reception, fumble, and LSU recovery.

But the refs giveth, and the refs taketh away.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2018, 11:07:16 AM by utee94 »

FearlessF

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #58 on: November 25, 2018, 11:59:03 AM »
I agree on the reception and fumble, but I do think it's questionable enough to see the ref's point of view.  It was bang bang
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CharleyHorse46

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Re: Worst Officiating Ever
« Reply #59 on: November 25, 2018, 12:09:37 PM »
When bad calls happen, it’s tempting human nature to resent the benefactor but it’s doubtful they had any more control over the outcome than the injured party did.  It’s just the way it goes and you want to believe there was no agenda and that things will even out in the wash - if not within the course of a game than within the course of a season.

I think what bothers me most is I remember a time when football was a more obvious and less interpretive game.

Catches were catches.  Fumbles were fumbles.  Rules were simple and easy to follow.

The more they’ve tried to define things (and I believe this starts at the NFL level and all others follow suit), the more they have muddied the waters and made it about the refs instead of the teams.

 

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