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Author Topic: ~Soccer Thread~  (Read 7659 times)

Online ELA

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~Soccer Thread~
« on: September 05, 2017, 06:15:33 PM »
Not sure there's enough interest to make it more specific.

All of those good vibes coming off the Gold Cup and the last games of qualifying seem to be evaporating quickly.



Offline rook119

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #1 on: September 10, 2017, 08:27:13 PM »
US should still qualify. If you break down the squad there just isn't much talent in this generation. The USMNT of 2009 would just blow this side apart in a match.  

Pulisic has the potential to someday be a top 30 player in the world. However keep the emphasis on someday. People need keep the all time best US player ever talk a rest for the time being. He still needs to adjust to playing 60+ matches season and being a marked man. And when you are the focal point, coaches, some of which know what they are doing will find every single deficiency in your game and make your life miserable. 

Gonzales admittedly is very good on his club sides but has largely been a disaster in defense for the national side.  

Bradley has regressed a bit playing in Toronto, Also his game suffers because we don't have a Stu Holden type next to him (the lack of which is our biggest hole) who can distrubute. That being said despite the regression it doesn't look like there is anyone coming up in the next 5 years who could challenge him.

Tim Howard is still the best keeper we got and he's past it. We can't produce a decent keeper anymore?

Dempsey could be a decent sub/starter in the next WC but that's it for him.

Right now with Zusi and undead Demarcus Beasley at LB/RB its been a tire fire.

Yedlin, Wood and maybe Johnson could be solid pros but that's pretty much their ceiling. Brooks and Cameron are OK.

Not buying this Nagbe thing. People like him because occasionally he does soccer like things sort of like what those continential players do. However he's terrible at the international level. Dribbles way too much, constantly turns the ball over, is a traffic cone in defense and doesn't really score goals. You can get away with that in MLS but its just not going to work at a higher level. 

Its slim pickings, and its going to be this way for a while. At least the US can look forward to the everyone qualifies 2022 tourney.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2017, 08:32:02 PM by rook119 »

Offline rolltidefan

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #2 on: October 10, 2017, 10:05:46 AM »
day of judgement. have a good chance, but conditions aren't ideal. pulisic might be hampered a bit as well. still, all things considered, we're in as good a spot as we could ask after the start (and last month) to this cycle.

Online ELA

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #3 on: October 10, 2017, 10:44:32 AM »
I think I used to get beIN, but not in HD, but last time I tried to watch it, it had been moved to a different tier.  Surprised it's so tough to watch this match here.

Offline rolltidefan

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #4 on: October 10, 2017, 12:18:59 PM »
home team gets to pick broadcast. get the go90 app. it's free (and for verizon it doesn't count against data) and has all bein games.

home teams getting to pick broadcast is fine, but if the away team wants to dual cast they should be allowed, imo. or let fox/espn/whoever pay a fee to bein to pick up game in us.

Offline PSUinNC

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #5 on: October 10, 2017, 12:32:03 PM »
So, not sure what Rook meant by the last statement "everyone qualifies 2022 tournament"....

Offline rolltidefan

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #6 on: October 10, 2017, 12:36:36 PM »
normally just 32 teams qualify for world cup. but in 2026 they are expanding to 48, so almost everyone with a pulse gets in

edit: seems he likely missed the year, as did i. it's 2026 not 2022 that it expands.
« Last Edit: October 10, 2017, 12:39:11 PM by rolltidefan »

Online ELA

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #7 on: October 10, 2017, 12:47:41 PM »
Right, the guess is that CONCACAF will go from 3.5 to 6.7, meaning all 6 teams still playing would have already qualified, and a nation that didn't even make it to the hex would still be getting a play in game.

Offline rolltidefan

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #8 on: October 10, 2017, 01:50:51 PM »
concacaf goes from 3.5 to 6. but the us/canada/mex are likely to host and hasn't been determined how they will handle multi-nation hosts autobids.

bids for each confederation- new bids (old bids)
afc - 8 (4.5)
caf - 9 (5)
concacaf - 6 (3.5)
conmebol - 6 (4.5)
ofc - 1 (0.5)
uefa - 16 (13)
playoffs - 2 (0)

total bids 48 (31 plus host)

the old way gave the host nation an auto bid on top of allotment (why the math adds to only 31), but the new format pulls the auto bid from the allotment. except with multiple host teams it is still undetermined.

also, the playoff spots will be a 6 team playoff and will consist of 1 team from each confed (except uefa) plus 1 from host confed. the top 2 fifa ranked teams in this tournament will get a bye, and play winner of the other matches for one of the 2 spots.

Offline rolltidefan

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #9 on: October 10, 2017, 02:26:33 PM »
probably won't matter for us, but the socceroos (australia) just won their confed playoff spot to be in the november playoff with the concacaf playoff team (likely hon or pan, but could be us)

Online ELA

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #10 on: October 10, 2017, 08:18:08 PM »
Heh, I kind of hope we get eliminated on an own goal

Online ELA

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #11 on: October 10, 2017, 08:47:59 PM »
May yet back in courtesy of Mexico and Costa Roca

Online ELA

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #12 on: October 10, 2017, 09:05:36 PM »
Thank God Pulicic was cleared

Online ELA

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #13 on: October 10, 2017, 09:48:45 PM »
probably won't matter for us, but the socceroos (australia) just won their confed playoff spot to be in the november playoff with the concacaf playoff team (likely hon or pan, but could be us)
Well you're right that it isn't going to matter.

Offline rolltidefan

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #14 on: October 11, 2017, 12:05:19 AM »
Well you're right that it isn't going to matter.
Lol came here to post that. Sad. 
Also right about judgement day. I imagine head will roll after this. 

Online utee94

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #15 on: October 11, 2017, 10:25:59 AM »
Oh man, totally bummed about the USMNT.  It's so much more fun to watch WC when there's at least the slim shadow of a possibility of a chance for us.

Ah well, ManU is still at the top of the table, so there's that.

Offline PSUinNC

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #16 on: October 11, 2017, 10:42:18 AM »

I mean, was this thing even on TV?  On a relatively boring sports night in the middle of the week, this should have been a huge deal.  
I know it's been discussed ad nauseam, but soccer's just never going to be much in this country until it's made a priority with money and advertising.  As long as kids can dream to make big money in baseball, football and basketball, they'll migrate to those in the HS years over the pennies (relatively speaking) that US soccer players make.  
It'll take some imagination, but it can happen.  Then again, it's been said now the same way for the past 20 years and really nothing's changed at all other than some small gains by MLS.  
On a total side track, but interesting to me (and maybe other PSU fans) - the last time the USMNT didn't make the WC?  1982 and 1986:)

Offline boilerbanger

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #17 on: October 11, 2017, 10:58:09 AM »
I watched the last 15 minutes on NBC Universo last night (yes it was in Spanish).  Unbelievable we lost to them, I have no clue on soccer strategy but that team was 1-8 in pool play before that game I believe.  Whoever has the rights in the US to the World Cup can't be happy we didn't qualify, no one is going to watch now.

Online MarqHusker

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #18 on: October 11, 2017, 11:21:32 AM »
I think it was on some channel that I have called BeIN.   If I recall the TV rights for stuff like this, the distribution is controlled by the 'home' team, which is why it would not have been automatically beamed to espn/fox/nbcsn type outlets.   I don't know how or what determines T&T's broadcast rights decisions, but that's what I was told, as to why it was only available on BeIN.


I did notice certain other qualifying matches were on this network, along with a few others.

Online ELA

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #19 on: October 11, 2017, 01:04:12 PM »
Yeah the earlier games I watched on beIN, but Comcast dropped it.  It seemed like they had all of the USs road matches except for Mexico, who I believe has a deal with FOX. ESPN had the US home games.

I wound up watching in Spanish on Universo.

ESPN losing the bidding war with FOX may have saved their hides.  With as much trouble as they are already in, paying $400 million for the US rights to a tournament the US isn't in would have been a disaster.

I know I won't watch, for the same reason I can't watch EPL or Champions League, without a rooting interest I don't care enough.

Offline TresselownsUM

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #20 on: October 11, 2017, 02:55:23 PM »
the saddest part is a guy like Pulisic could have made millions by playing in the WC, now he won't. not to mention the kid is a phenom that the world could have seen on the biggest stage.

feel bad for guys like Tim Howard, Clint Dempsey they'll be too old for the next WC cycle.

but, the players got what they deserved, they slept through half of this qualifying round. and despite all that, all you had to do was get a tie vs the worst team in the region, and you couldn't get it done.

I almost feel like the backbone of US soccer, which was to try to outwork the opponent is gone, this team had a prima donna feel to it, taking things for granted. Arena will be gone, and I have no idea who the US will look to try and rebound. the only positive is we should see nothing but young players the next couple of years and get them experience, anyone over 30 should be ousted from any games for at least 2 years. there's no point in playing them, let the young kids develop together.

at least messi rose up for argentina, whether you like them or not, the WC is better because they are in

Offline LetsGoPeay

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #21 on: October 11, 2017, 05:11:08 PM »
There’s an app called Go90 that shows a huge number of matches from all over the world. It’s free, in HD, and can be mirrored to a TV via chromecast or Roku. I know, it’s not convenient but short of subscribing to BeIN Sports it’s the best option. 

Offline rolltidefan

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #22 on: October 11, 2017, 07:33:13 PM »
I mean, was this thing even on TV?  On a relatively boring sports night in the middle of the week, this should have been a huge deal.  
I know it's been discussed ad nauseam, but soccer's just never going to be much in this country until it's made a priority with money and advertising.  As long as kids can dream to make big money in baseball, football and basketball, they'll migrate to those in the HS years over the pennies (relatively speaking) that US soccer players make.  
It'll take some imagination, but it can happen.  Then again, it's been said now the same way for the past 20 years and really nothing's changed at all other than some small gains by MLS.  
On a total side track, but interesting to me (and maybe other PSU fans) - the last time the USMNT didn't make the WC?  1982 and 1986.  :)

one issue is the misconception that soccer players don't make anything.
6 of the top 10 highest paying leagues in the world are soccer leagues (from 2015 data). nba and mlb are both above the epl (as is the india cricket league, surprisingly) but not by much.
likewise, of the 2016 top 25 highest paid athletes, football and soccer lead the way with 6 and 5 respectively, while nba was at 3.
there's plenty of money to be made in soccer. and the euro leagues aren't averse to american players. the bundesliga (germany top league, 2nd best in world) seems to have made americans a priority even.
we need to stop pretending the mls can be one of the premier soccer leagues in the world. it isn't going to happen. it's not even top 3 in our hemisphere. we need to be getting our players into the europe leagues when we can, like they do for nba/mlb/etc.
and we're a large enough population that we can have top athletes in many different sports. we have dominant athletes in lower tier sports like swimming, boxing/mma, tennis (or have), gymnastics, track and field, etc. no reason we can also have a competitive national soccer team.

Online utee94

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #23 on: October 12, 2017, 08:59:26 AM »
Time Warner/Spectrum still has BeinTV on its base package so I was able to watch it (and other games that Bein carried).  But yeah, it would have been nice for ESPN or Fox to be able to work out some deal where they bought off the rights to show it in the US.

And I agree that we should be working to place Americans in the other world leagues, especially the Euro leagues.  But at the same time, marketing soccer to young American athletes would be a lot easier if the MLS were better, and better-known.  And I just don't know how to get the MLS where it needs to be.  It certainly won't ever rival EPL or the other Euro leagues, but it could be a lot better than it is.

Anyway, I'll still watch the World Cup because I love seeing international soccer played at its highest level.  Just like I watch the EPL and Bundesliga and La Liga, because I like watching professional soccer played at its highest level.  But I'd like it even more if the USA had made it.  That's just such a bummer.

Offline PSUinNC

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #24 on: October 12, 2017, 09:47:01 AM »
one issue is the misconception that soccer players don't make anything.
6 of the top 10 highest paying leagues in the world are soccer leagues (from 2015 data). nba and mlb are both above the epl (as is the india cricket league, surprisingly) but not by much.
likewise, of the 2016 top 25 highest paid athletes, football and soccer lead the way with 6 and 5 respectively, while nba was at 3.
there's plenty of money to be made in soccer. and the euro leagues aren't averse to american players. the bundesliga (germany top league, 2nd best in world) seems to have made americans a priority even.
we need to stop pretending the mls can be one of the premier soccer leagues in the world. it isn't going to happen. it's not even top 3 in our hemisphere. we need to be getting our players into the europe leagues when we can, like they do for nba/mlb/etc.
and we're a large enough population that we can have top athletes in many different sports. we have dominant athletes in lower tier sports like swimming, boxing/mma, tennis (or have), gymnastics, track and field, etc. no reason we can also have a competitive national soccer team.
But that's just it - they have to go overseas to do it.  If you're given a chance to be a big time baseball player and play your entire career here in the States, or be a big time soccer player and have to move to a foreign country, what are you going to do?  Heck, seems like even a lot of great soccer players try to transform that into a football kicking career.  
If the MLS is never going to be a Top 5 league in the world making comparative money to the major sports, soccer has no chance to be a top 4 league in this country.  

Offline rolltidefan

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #25 on: October 12, 2017, 01:53:59 PM »
soccer is NOT going to be a top 4 league in the us. it just isn't. europe isn't going to let go of their hold on the top players.

but it doesn't have to be a top 4 league to have a competitive national team. we have competitive athletes in golf, tennis, swimming, track, gymnastics, virtually every olympic sport, etc. so we have plethora of success in non-top 4 sports already. no reason soccer can't be among them.

if they're worried about money, there's 1 bball league that makes you top money, 1 football league, 1 baseball, and 1 hockey.
there are 6 soccer leagues. odds are favorable for soccer.
and if you don't make one of the top 6 soccer league, you have about 20 more leagues that you can make a good living ($100K plus), just not millionaire money. there are a few other decent bball and baseball league, but not like soccer.

and people have no issue coming to states for basketball and baseball, why should we have a problem going to europe for soccer?

Online ELA

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #26 on: January 08, 2018, 11:17:00 AM »

Offline rolltidefan

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #27 on: January 08, 2018, 11:27:30 AM »
wow, huge blow. complete blunder by ussf to let him get away. and can't blame him either. hope he does well.

Online Entropy

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #28 on: January 08, 2018, 11:33:56 AM »
my son is 7... every Saturday he wakes up early to watch Premier League soccer on NBCSN.   He's religious about it.  

At school, when I either attend for an event, volunteer or pick up my kids it is noticeable how many soccer jerseys/shirts I see compared to football, baseball or basketball.  yes, Chiefs day dominates.. and so does  a Royals Friday, but outside that it is soccer.  Sporting is very good and kids in KC have access to watch several European leagues.   It is much more popular today with kids compared to when I was growing up.  

It may never top Football, Baseball or Basketball, but it has gained ground and I believe will continue to gain ground.  
« Last Edit: January 10, 2018, 12:16:10 PM by Entropy »

Online SFBadger96

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Re: ~Soccer Thread~
« Reply #29 on: January 08, 2018, 03:12:14 PM »
my son is 7... every Saturday he wakes up early to watch Premier League soccer on NBCSN.   He's religious about it.  

At school, when I either attend for an event, volunteer or pick up my kids it is noticeable how many soccer jerseys/shirts I see compared to football, baseball or basketball.  yes, Chiefs day dominates.. and so does Royals Fridays, but outside that it is soccer.  Sporting is very good and kids in KC have access to watch several European leagues.   It is much more popular today with kids compared to when I was growing up.  

It may never top Football, Baseball or Basketball, but it has gained ground and I believe will continue to gain ground.  
Yep, it's gaining ground. TV access to the EPL and Bundesliga have sped it up. I don't pretend to live in a representative area, but I see as many international soccer jerseys at my kids public schools as I do NFL jerseys. 

 

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