CFB 51 Cookbook, equipment discussion, techniques

[Drew4UTk]

i made three queso's more last night for dinner around 10:30p... my eve's have been consumed by construction and renovation since the storm so dinner's are late if at all... the absolute best part of it is they take literally three or four minutes to construct and cook on the griddle, and clean up takes less than five minutes, too.  this consumed the last of the smoked sirloin, unfortunately... that part takes about three to four hours.... 

i'd love to tell you those things were carefully calculated, but they started in effort to kill off the fridge in the barn of produce and odds-n-ends... and i had the ends off a rib-eye roast i'd smoked a few days prior.  i think i served maybe ten people with that- but the very next smoked rib-eye i did was ALL dedicated to quesadillas.... they are really really good and SO simple.  

cost alone, and because it impacts little, I swapped over to sirloin- but i've done them with brisket ends, and tri-tips.  i've settled on sirloin, though, as the best and maybe better than ribeye in that application. 

[FearlessF]

Sirloin is the most unappreciated cut of meat

[betarhoalphadelta]

Didn’t read through this whole thread but I need some ideas for cooking chicken on the grill.  Specifically chicken breasts.  Mine always turn out “meh.”  I usually just put lemon pepper and salt on them or store bought bbq sauce.

I admit I’m not a super griller.  Cooking and/or recipe ideas appreciated.

Also, got a smoker for Father’s Day and have just used it once.  Cooked wings in them from a recipe I found online.  They turned out great.  Would welcome any feedback on what else to cook in it and how to do it.

John Henry's "Texas Chicken Tickler" rub is really nice on chicken.
Question 1: Do you cook skinless, or do you cook with skin on? Skin on creates a lot of different considerations because getting the skin appropriately crispy is it's own job. 
So, assuming you're just grilling skinless chicken breasts, part of the problem is that they're often just "meh" to begin with. Especially if they're wimpy and thin, which doesn't make it easy to cook them through and keep them juicy. 
I recommend the Kirkland frozen chicken breasts, actually. They're individually vacuum-sealed, so you can pull them and defrost on demand. They're good sized, so you can actually cook them through without ending up dry and tasteless.
Then, the next step is browning. Since you're doing this on the grill, you want something on the outside to at least contribute some browning. Some olive oil or grapeseed oil helps the rub to adhere and helps promote browning. 
This is one of those cooks that I'd promote 2-zone cooking. On a gas grill, get the burners on one side as hot as you can and keep the burners on the other side turned off. On a weber kettle, move your charcoal all over to one side and get it roaring hot but leave the other side free of charcoal. 
The goal is to sear first, and then more gently bake the rest of the chicken breast. So you get them over the really hot burners/coals for 60-90 seconds to get the outside to brown, flip them to get the other side for 60-90 seconds, then move them over to the cool side of the grill. 
After that, it's cook to temp. I disagree with @Drew4UTk that I think poking with a good meat thermometer only lets out a miniscule amount of juices, and I recommend doing so. Get the inside to 145-150 degrees and get them off the grill. I know everyone says 160+, but that will leave you with dry, stringy, tasteless chicken. The key is that after you get them off the grill at 150, let them rest several minutes. This is good practice with every meat to allow the juices to reabsorb into the meat, but 2.8 minutes at 150 degrees IT will pasteurize your chicken. Plus, carryover cooking will take the internal temp up a few more degrees anyway. 
-----------------
One more suggestion. Skip chicken breast entirely and get some thighs. They're MUCH more delicious, and the dark meat stays succulent and juicy up to higher temps, so you generally cook them up to about 175 degrees internal, and they'll remain moist.

[FearlessF]

agreed, skin on the chicken helps a lot with keeping in the juices - breast or thigh

[utee94]

The boneless skinless all-white meat thing is from the olden days when the nutritionists were telling us that all fat and any fat was bad for us.

Turns out that, like everything else, moderation is the key.  A little bit of fat is fine, and adds a ton of flavor and moisture.

All that to say, yeah, bone-in skin-on thighs are awesome on the grill, in the fryer, etc.

[Drew4UTk]

i bought an 11 pound spiraled ham and carried it to the smoke pit.  i'd found a recipe? on the interwebz and decided to give it a shot for a party we tossed last friday.

gents.... this is amazingly good... it was gone in an hour.  

rinse ham and dry with towel.  if it's not cross cut during the spiraling, cross cut it but not terribly deep.  

lather it in processed mustard- good ol' french's or it's like.  roll it in a good rub that really doesn't matter so long as you like it- i used a salt, black pepper, red pepper chips, cayenne, brown sugar, cinnamon ect.... just a 'rub'... mix yourself some orange juice with chicken broth, more rub, even more cayenne, and inject it liberally. 

overnight it in the fridge in a tinfoil tray.

get a mixing bowl and mix dark brown sugar, more mustard, raw honey, more cayenne, more rub, a dash of minced ginger and a dash of minced clove- and a couple shots of bourbon- bring to heat enough to mix it all very well- you want the consistency of commercially available bbq sauce (thick kind)... rest it in the fridge, too.  

next day, allowing for six hours time, fire the smoker with hickory lumps and maple chips.. add a tray below with orange juice, chicken broth, and mustard... full smoke absolutely no hotter than 230*... this is important as you want it to glaze with a caramelized crust and not have a hint of burn.   at hour two mop it down with glaze, and every hour to hour and a half afterward... 

when you reach 110~115*, pull that baby out and break a cardinal rule: slice it.  thin.  baste it once more.  no more than half an hour after this in the smoker still with full smoke.  

i can't tell you how good this is.  

here is a pic, though: 


 

[FearlessF]

pic is worth 1000 words

[847badgerfan]

I'd put that in my mouth.

[FearlessF]

one slice at a time

[Drew4UTk]

I learned a lesson... the kind that only comes with experience and dabbling instead of academic... I'll share it with y'all, but I don't expect it to be accepted until you've experienced it for yourselves. 

so... smoked a whole sirloin last weekend.  It turned out better than anything I've ever smoked.  The bark was perfection and the ring was apparent and uniform and to a depth of perhaps an eighth of an inch.  The wood used was an oak/maple mix of my own blend.  The sirloin was rubbed well with coarse salt and black pepper, and some of that montreal steak seasoning.  nothing special.  i took the 11# cut up to 112* internal, and then wrapped it in foil, then a towel, and then a cooler for another hour.  The smoker rendered a medium rare masterpiece of 'sweet' smoked heaven.  not a bit bitter. it's the first time i've ever successfully smoked without a hint of 'bitter'... here is the lesson learned.  

BLUF (bottom line up front) : It's ALL about the fuel.  Without getting into the chemistry specifics which i have little grasp of understanding, wood is chock full of naturally occurring chemicals.  These impart the bitter taste, and they often cause wafts of thick white to light gray smoke.  This is bad.  Many counter this by smoking 'full smoke' only partial cook time, and attempt to bypass the smoke during later phases. Many 'soak' wood chips to smoke.  This is wrong.  The way to dispense with the bitter flavors is simple: only burn natural wood fires that have been rendered to charcoal.  there is little smoke, there is zero need to 'soak' chips, and the chemicals that impart the bitterness are long gone before you even drop the match at cook time. 

my set up is a wood fired ecoque gen2 smoker/pizza oven.  It's made everything from brisket to applewood smoked bacon, to breads and homemade pizzas.  it works great and i am happy with the purchase.  there is no gas involved, and there is no 'briquettes' to be used.... you only want to use clean and natural fuels, and always as dried out (seasoned) as possible fuel... and that's what i've been doing.  no matter how seasoned, though, the smoke stack never lies- the smoke coming out of that thing can be described, at times, as clouds- white, pillow like, thick and consistent.  this is a bad thing.  

I was reading a study offered up by aTm (if you can believe it) about how 'types of woods aren't as important as origin of woods'... i found this interesting to say the least.  the basic premise is "Oak from one location geographically may be better suited than Hickory from another or vice versa, and it may be better than apple or any of the fruit woods depending on it's geographic origin."... they went as far as to say "hickory from some places properly seasoned imparts a sweeter flavor than, say, cherry from another"... here is the key though, and it was strongly stressed: "It really doesn't matter what wood- so long as it is a hardwood- as people talk a lot about the subject the truth of the matter is they can't truly distinguish one way or the other what wood was used, but they can absolutely tell if that wood wasn't properly prepared prior to being used in the smoker".   

for this evolution planned for the Sirloin described above, the plan was to use solely charcoaled lump with only spits of 'fresh' silver maple the size of pencils or so, and to NOT add any more 'fresh' wood after the start.  the smoke was not apparent at all throughout the cooking process- it could be smelled, but even ten feet away from the stack it was barely visible.  Opening the chamber a few times during cooking usually results in vision clouding breath holding efforts to 'wait it out' before you can inspect progress- but not this time.  there was certainly trapped smoke, but it was there and gone as soon as the chamber was accessed.  ... I had my doubts about this based on what i was seeing, but i figured it prudent to not change gears mid race. 

as mentioned, the results are perhaps the best smoked red meat i've ever had from any location at any time... I'm not trying to brag, as all i really do is observe the process anyway, i'm just saying straight up that patience and using the right material makes all the difference in the world.  not a little difference.  a massive huge gigantic difference.  one that makes you think it's time to hang that 'smoke master' sign above your pit.  that, of course, won't happen- but there was much fanfare over that sirloin and people not only familiar with smoked meats but my efforts in the arena that were as stunned as i was over how good it turned out.  Lump charcoal only. next time, I even think i'm going to abandon the sprigs of silver maple, to be honest.   

the irreplaceable keys to all of this: 

Don't trust store purchased lump charcoal.  Don't expect to find something near as natural and prepared as what you can do for yourself. 

Starting with a metal barrel, preferably a metal trash can no bigger than 20 gallons or so (you can use a drum, but where has that drum been and what was it used to store?) remove the lid and cut six or so 3" holes around the perimeter- revolver style.  Place a couple fire bricks under either side of the barrel in the fire pit  (not the smoke pit- a bonfire type pit) to keep it a foot or so off the ground, and build a stack of limbs of whatever sort, split wood, whatever all around and under the barrel/can.  fill the can with your smoking wood cut in no longer/thicker than 6" chunks, and fill the can 3/4 full.  secure lid.  ignite the fire pit.  keep it fed and burning strong.  at around 700* the wood in that can will start to off gas flammable gas- and this is fun: ignite it- it will burn like a torch until it's gone long gone.  Let the fire roar with the torch looking fire burning atop the can until it dies completely- which is at least 24 hours...
after the fire is absolutely dead, pull your can out and dump the contents into a bin for storage.  you now have absolutely clean and prepared all natural charcoal lump to cook with.  
it's easy to ignite in the smoke pit's cooker (you'd think it infused like a briquette it's so easy to light) and it burns exceptionally clean.  It will burn hotter and not for as long- but since it's natural and free of any type of chemical, but you can always add more to the fire as it will burn without any ill impacts... 
it doesn't matter so much the type of wood you use- oak, hickory, maple, apple, cherry, mesquite- as we've been told for years and years.  what matters is the origin of the wood (if you subscribe to aTm's study) and CERTAINLY the 'state' (condition) it's in when you fire it.   for the love of all that's holy, you've gotta try this. 
note on wood chips popularly sold in bags: the common thought is to soak these.  this is wrong.  you don't want anything to do with what's in that smoke when it comes to food... it is a certain way to get that bitter flavor.  you also don't want to burn them dry- because it is rarely seasoned to the proper expectation.  it will burn with clouds of white smoke.  you don't want to set them on indirect heat with intent to 'cook' the flavors out of them... that's another way to get those chemicals on your food that render bitter.  you can either stay completely away from them, or run a mini-kiln out of them making them charcoal just like described above.  otherwise, these are basically a waste of money and/or effort. 

I'll never smoke another way, and I can't wait to use this method on a massive brisket i've got staged right now, and on a piggy i'm getting as soon as the farmer down the road harvest them (should be a few weeks) as I'm looking forward to that sweet smoky flavor recently discovered on a pork belly turned into bacon goodness. 
i hope this is at least tried by someone here, so you can experience it for yourselves.  it is the only way to do it, i'm thinking.  i'm also thinking after you've done it you'll agree... 

[utee94]

That's a lot of words, but I certainly agree with the concept, you don't want bad white smoke.  But there's no need to use strictly charcoal to get there.

I always start my fire with lump charcoal, and surround with split logs.  There will be zero charcoal left by the time I put the meat on 45 minutes later, only the logs burning to coals.  The next series of split logs that will be going in, sit on top of the firebox to warm up.  When I'm ready for more fuel, the splits from on top of the firebox go into the fire, and they ignite quickly and burn clean, so no bad white smoke.  Continue that rotation until the cook is done.  Pre-heating the splits is the key to clean fires.  Well, and obviously having properly seasoned/dried wood.

30+ years of doing it essentially this way, since I was a teen learning at my dad's BBQ restaurant, no white smoke, no bitter.  

One place I'll disagree is that the type of wood DOES matter-- most especially, mesquite.  It burns hotter and quicker than other woods, and tends to impart a much stronger flavor.  Consequently I typically only use if for grilling,  but I'll also occasionally use it to smoke something that is only going to spend a short amount of time on the cooker, like pork tenderloin or whole chickens.

Good info though,thanks drew!

[betarhoalphadelta]

@utee94 You're working with an offset smoker, right? 

@Drew4UTk I agree with utee. It's not *necessarily* the wood. The key is that wood contains ALL those volatile organic compounds [VOC] that generate the billowy white smoke, and you do NOT want those on your food. Charcoal has already burned off those VOCs, so charcoal can burn much more "cleanly". But it's not like hardwood can't burn cleanly, you just need to be running at much higher temperatures. 

Think back to when you make a campfire. When you first light it, you're throwing off HUGE amounts of that billowy white smoke. But once you get a good bed of coals, the fire is hot enough to combust all those VOCs, and the smoke is no longer white and billowy. And once the fire is hot enough, throwing another fresh log on the fire doesn't result in the billowy white smoke, because it's not a matter of the wood, it's a matter of the heat.

That's why utee is correct for his smoker, because IIRC, he's using an offset smoker. An offset smoker isn't strongly insulated (although most of the bigger ones is 1/4" steel, so they are somewhat efficient), but more importantly the firebox is offset to where the food is. With the firebox not being underneath the food, you can run a hot fire in your firebox [hot enough to burn off the VOCs] and still keep a cooking chamber at a much lower temp. And because the fire is hotter, when you're adding fuel, you can throw your splits in there without pre-burning them. Offset smokers tend to end up, then, with much more smoke flavor than insulated smokers, because they're able to use wood rather than charcoal as a heat source. But they don't have that nasty bitter flavor, because the VOCs are being combusted rather than desposited on the food.

On the other hand, I have a Kamado grill [similar to Big Green Egg]. With 200# of ceramic insulation, if I had a fire burning hot enough to burn off the VOCs, the cooking chamber would be running WAY too hot to actually smoke food. So I use lump charcoal to keep the fire small and clean. *HOWEVER*, that doesn't mean I don't use wood. When smoking, I will add in some hardwood chunks in the firebox. With the fire burning so small, those chunks smolder rather than ignite, which allows them to still burn cleanly enough to produce smoke flavor without big billowy white clouds of smoke. This does mean that the smoke flavor isn't typically as pronounced as a stick-burning offset smoker, but it can still be quite delicious. 

Very similar to the kamado IMHO are the insulated cabinet smokers like Stumps. These are insulated, so also run off charcoal as their primary heat source rather than hardwood, and for the same reason. 

I don't understand the way the Ecoque works, but I suspect it's a lot more similar to the insulated cabinet smoker than to an offset. As a result, it might be difficult to create a fire hot enough with wood to burn off VOCs and yet small enough to keep your cooking chamber from overheating. However, using charcoal as your primary heat source with a little bit of hardwood for flavoring would be an ideal way to smoke. 

[MarqHusker]

I generally support utee/bwiarny on the smoke/wood talk here.  I remember when I got my Egg, I was directed a certain video, and it was most helpful for showing me when the Egg is ready for the meat.  The (brief) takeaway was to simply look at the smoke coming out the top, as has been stated, you don't want the billowy white smoke, once that smoke has turned 'blue', you're ready for smoking.    Now that's anywhere between 20-45 minutes in my experiences.

I usually get my wood chunks from a local butcher shop (buy them as needed), and they rest in the egg with the Egg lump charcoal.

[betarhoalphadelta]

I generally support utee/bwarbiany on the smoke/wood talk here.  

Generally?!?! 
You mean with the exception of when you're wrong?