CFB51 College Football Fan Community
The Power Five => Big Ten => Topic started by: Cincydawg on November 27, 2018, 09:46:20 AM
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Having high expectations dashed makes for a bad year that can be exacerbated by losing to one's main rival and having frustrating coaching decisions. I'd argue that having a rash of injuries a la Wisconsin is different, that is a legit excuse, and "we'll be back".
Some candidates for this award:
Auburn - top ten initial ranking and lost to LSU and Bama and UGA and Tenn. Not a good year.
Michigan - a pretty good year by normal standards, but after the loss in week one looked really good on defense until ....
Wazzu - kind of the same story in a way, a great year turned south by the late loss to rival
Miami - high expectations again and now frustration with the HC and a mediocre outcome in a weak conference
Alabama - well, just because they allowed some points to be scored, their fan base is only happy for about five minutes a year
Kentucky - another story of having a very nice year spoiled late
UCF? - undefeated season, again, and no CFP sniff, plus injury to QB
Contingent bad years:
ND - IFF they get torched in a playoff game
Clemson - ditto
Florida - if they lose to UCF
Tennessee - if they lose their bowl game, oh wait.
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WE VOLUNTEER AS TRIBUTE!
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out of that list I'd say Miami... if they had fans. Next up would be Auburn. Lots of rumors flying around that they program and donors want to head in another direction.
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<<<raises hand>>>
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<<<raises hand>>>
I think the injury excuse is valid.
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Penn State?
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I think the injury excuse is valid.
Maybe. Injuries are part of the game though. Next man in, and all that.
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You can't put Michigan on the list.
They beat one of their rivals, which doesn't happen very often.
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You can't put Michigan on the list.
They beat one of their rivals, which doesn't happen very often.
Ha, good one.
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Another piece of this is expectations.
This Badger fan was frustrated at the beginning of the season when the team just didn't look like what it was projected as (and the injury bug had already hit the defense). As the season wore on, it was increasingly obvious, even in the wins, that this team just wasn't that good.
But the Badgers have also been on a high of late, and were sure to come down at some point. Our program isn't Ohio State, Michigan, etc. Down years are part of the Wisconsin cycle. I can manage it--especially it 7-5 is a down year.
Not that I'm happy about it (particularly with the performance against Minnesota), but ok...now it's basketball season.
Now, if next season goes like this, too, then I'll start to be anxious.
When USC fans want ND to blow them out so that their coach is canned? That's a bad season for fans.
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Another piece of this is expectations.
This Badger fan was frustrated at the beginning of the season when the team just didn't look like what it was projected as (and the injury bug had already hit the defense). As the season wore on, it was increasingly obvious, even in the wins, that this team just wasn't that good.
But the Badgers have also been on a high of late, and were sure to come down at some point. Our program isn't Ohio State, Michigan, etc. Down years are part of the Wisconsin cycle. I can manage it--especially it 7-5 is a down year.
Not that I'm happy about it (particularly with the performance against Minnesota), but ok...now it's basketball season.
Now, if next season goes like this, too, then I'll start to be anxious.
When USC fans want ND to blow them out so that their coach is canned? That's a bad season for fans.
Good post.
At the beginning of this season, there was a thread on "expectations for your team", or some such. I wrote in that thread that a NYD6 bowl game was the minimum I expected.
Given that, I'm disappointed. The poor record combined with losing the AXE for the first time since I was in my mid-30's makes it really shitty. Especially that last part. I can't even imagine how the seniors feel, knowing that they crapped it out last weekend.
Winning the bowl game will help, a little, for them, and us fans.
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Maryland.
This was supposed to be a breakout year with the talent at skill positions, the motivation of the players behind Durkin, and the thought of Piggy starting again after injury.
The win at Texas gave us great hope, although confusion at the QB choice, but the outside noise destroyed it all.
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at the lower levels...
Youngstown state fans seem to be ready to move on.. at least the vocal ones.
Montana fans seem frustrated as well.
Idaho dropped down to play FCS football and finished 4-7.... they went 4-8 last year in FBS.
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I think the injury excuse is valid.
Yeah, same with MSU. Didn't make the season any less painful. Particularly since MSU wasted a historically great defense (up to #2 nationally in S&P+) and Wisconsin wasted the best RB in the nation.
I think MSU has to be on that list, particularly how the offense totally fell off a cliff in November, from weakness to outright horrid. Made the games not even fun to watch. Ended on Senior Day in a half empty stadium against a garbage opponent nobody cared enough to change their Thanksgiving plans to attend, in a game that was as bad as feared.
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Louisville would qualify. Not only was it a terrible year on the field, but there was absolutely tons of drama regarding their coach, a complete loss of the team [to the point where something like 20 players requested transfer paperwork], and their recruiting is in a hole because of all the mess. They might call it a success if they manage to snag Brohm, but if not, I have to think there will be great wailing and gnashing of teeth in their fan base.
Ohio State is an interesting one that might be both the best year AND worst year. The results were good, going 11-1 and likely to win the CCG and get to the playoff. But the off-the-field stuff was nasty. This is the kind of year that winning MIGHT be enough to wash the stink off, but if they either lose the CCG or get utterly smoked in the CFP semifinal, the off-the-field stuff just adds to the disappointment.
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Yeah, same with MSU. Didn't make the season any less painful. Particularly since MSU wasted a historically great defense (up to #2 nationally in S&P+) and Wisconsin wasted the best RB in the nation.
I think MSU has to be on that list, particularly how the offense totally fell off a cliff in November, from weakness to outright horrid. Made the games not even fun to watch. Ended on Senior Day in a half empty stadium against a garbage opponent nobody cared enough to change their Thanksgiving plans to attend, in a game that was as bad as feared.
I'd have to assume that Sparty fans would be a lot more content with their season if they beat Michigan instead of Penn St.
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Meh, borderline Top 10 preseason team. I don't think anything less than 9-3, no matter where the wins came would make the fan base content this year. But 7-5 with a win over our top rival is better than 7-5 without one.
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Spartan fans are understandably raising their expectations.
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I think most are reasonable to know that the ceiling is the ceiling, not the expectation. So, in general 7-5 seasons are not necessarily disappointments, but 7-5 seasons coming off 10-3 ones, where you had (by S&P+) the most returning production in the nation, and a schedule where you had no ND, no UW, no Iowa, with UM, OSU and NW at home, is one where there is disappointment, particularly the way it ended with a sputtering 1-2 finish with absolutely zero offense.
I think if MSU can get healthy, and avoid early NFL departures (Williams, Willikes and Layne have all been thrown out as early entran possibilities) I think with changes on the offensive staff, expectations will be similarly high next year.
But expectations for 2020 will likely be way down, that's looking like a rebuilding year. Most Spartan fans know a rebuilding year looks like 6-6, 7-5, maybe 8-4 with some breaks. 7-5 in 2020 won't be a disappointment.
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Quit being reasonable.
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Louisville would qualify. Not only was it a terrible year on the field, but there was absolutely tons of drama regarding their coach, a complete loss of the team [to the point where something like 20 players requested transfer paperwork], and their recruiting is in a hole because of all the mess. They might call it a success if they manage to snag Brohm, but if not, I have to think there will be great wailing and gnashing of teeth in their fan base
I was going to post the same thing.
That fanbase watched the program disintegrate in the course of a season. The university is also having some financial issues, so throwing money at a quick fix might not be an option.
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I think Laville easily makes our top ten least happy fan bases.
If somehow their managed to hire Brohm, they'd perk up of course, but I don't expect that, and whoever else they hire likely will be viewed negatively by many fans.
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https://247sports.com/college/georgia/Article/Gus-Malzahn-close-to-accepting-changes-to-remain-at-Auburn-125449338/
I don't know if we mentioned Auburn fans, but this won't make them sing for joy. They also started out top ten and finished 7-5 with losses to their three main rivals, and Tennessee. I think I did mention them earlier. The Gus Bus may be misfiring.
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In case it wasn't clear, put USC in with the contenders. They had 11 wins last year, and 10 the year before. They were pre-season #15, were out of the rankings by week 4, never to return (they were getting votes again in week 7, then lost to Utah and that was that). Finished 5-7 with three straight losses to doormat Cal, then their rivals UCLA and ND.
USC isn't MSU or Wisconsin. Their fans expect top 10 finishes. This is their fourth losing season in my lifetime (I turn 45 in the next few weeks).
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So I gotta ask, since I'm not up-to-snuff on Wisconsin's injuries - of their 4 OL on the preseason All-B10 team, how many actually warrant it now? I thought it was lazy to begin with.
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Gotta think Michigan. To have everything right there and then get crushed is, well, crushing.
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So I gotta ask, since I'm not up-to-snuff on Wisconsin's injuries - of their 4 OL on the preseason All-B10 team, how many actually warrant it now? I thought it was lazy to begin with.
Probably 3 of the 4 will make it, either 1st or 2nd. Probably not deserved either, to be honest. Line play (from what I saw) was down in the conference overall though, so we'll see.
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Purdue fans if Brohm pulls up stakes.And 847 is right bad year over all for O-Linemen in the BIG
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Gotta think Michigan. To have everything right there and then get crushed is, well, crushing.
Perhaps a big let down but over all they had a good year
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A team can have a pretty good year and the fans of said team can have a terrible year.
That usually comprises getting one's hopes up and having them dashed by a significant rival.
Dashed rather badly in this case.
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A team can have a pretty good year and the fans of said team can have a terrible year.
That usually comprises getting one's hopes up and having them dashed by a significant rival.
Dashed rather badly in this case.
But over all if you have read the M posters takes thru out - it was a good season.Sort of fun while it lasted,like tOSU in 2006
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Perhaps a big let down but over all they had a good year
Well MGoBlog is talking about living in actual hell this year so that's pretty bad.
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Logically, Michigan has had a good season.
How many fans, outside this place, are logical?
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I think the injury excuse is valid.
Allow me to disagree, and let me make the exhaustive case.
Assuming modest playing to expectations, UW is 9-3 minimum even with the injuries, maybe better. There's the obvious preseason top-5 to 7-5 thing, but its deeper than that.
UW coming into the season was this, good running game, secretly efficent passing game and a defense that had to reload, but we had faith a good staff would do it. Injuries derailed that last part from the start. The running game somehow got better, but then there's that passing game.
The Badgers returned Alex Hornibrook, an interception-prone passer without the strongest arm who had helped lead a really effective pass game last season. His top target was gone, and we perhaps underrated that tight end, but there were three receivers who had all showed promise (after a date rape case took out the best pass-catcher, which I guess we'll lump in with injuries), plus an awesome line coming back. There were whispers this could be one of the best UW Os in recent memory after they slung it all over Miami in the Orange Bowl.
That pass game sucked. It's around No. 100 in efficiency. Hornibrook regressed. None of the receivers have done a damn thing, and that line, that damn line, has let QBs get hit again and again. UW fell from an average pass pro team to No. 91, and some of the biggest mistakes came when someone tried to make a play under presser.
Let's run through the games. They drop a game to meh BYU where the pass game sputters and a veteran kicker biffs a 42-yarder to send to OT. They hang with Michigan for a while, as that pass game, which was supposed to be pretty good, does literally nothing.
Then comes the QB thing. You might say, Hronibrook got hurt, backup was bad, injuries. But Hornibrook had been so underwhelming, even the most rabid fans were begging for the promising backup. In UGA terms, it would be like Fromm underwhelming and Fields coming out and just sucking. Yes that's an injury, but in a lot of senses it's more. (UW still had a good division title path until that NW game, when UW was kinda game but for a mess of back-breaking turnovers)
And then came the goddamn hope. Coan finally looked OK late against Purdue. Taylor gave a superhuman effort. Danny Davis made two of the few damn plays he's made all year. All this drek could be made somewhat OK. Win against the Gophers AT HOME, salvage 8-4. I woulda been a little proud they stood tall through all that shit.
Then UW turns it over four times, gives up a punt return TD, misses a 30-yard kick (from that same senior). They can't get a big run against a defense that gives them up, get sacked four times, get 5.7 yards per attempt not counting those sacks. UW basically craps all over the field as a 10-point favorite to lose a 15-year rivalry winning streak against a team it would still probably be favored against.
I don't know if that's the worst because Louisville, but if Kentucky and Michigan can feel bad about it, this mess is right up there.
(I thought No.4 was overrated in the preseason. But 9-3 was more than doable, maybe 10-2 without the NW alligator blood. For a program that had a high floor, this stepped down through that, all owing to a disaster on the front that is the head coach's specialty)
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So I gotta ask, since I'm not up-to-snuff on Wisconsin's injuries - of their 4 OL on the preseason All-B10 team, how many actually warrant it now? I thought it was lazy to begin with.
So here's the weird part, they were really, really effective vs. the run. There were moments where you saw some breakdowns, but the stats were REALLY good.
But they were bad in pass pro, with a quarterback that kinda needs at least competent pass pro. They were weirdly disappointing, but more for the schizophrenic part than anything.
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That was exhaustive, and exhausting!!! But also persuasive.
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That was exhaustive, and exhausting!!! But also persuasive.
You didn't have to live it my friend.
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You didn't have to live it my friend.
:iagree: That's what I was trying to tell you when we had the John Cooper exchange 2yrs back on the old board
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That was exhaustive, and exhausting!!! But also persuasive.
The man is good at this stuff.
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https://247sports.com/college/georgia/Article/Gus-Malzahn-close-to-accepting-changes-to-remain-at-Auburn-125449338/
I don't know if we mentioned Auburn fans, but this won't make them sing for joy. They also started out top ten and finished 7-5 with losses to their three main rivals, and Tennessee. I think I did mention them earlier. The Gus Bus may be misfiring.
doesn't help that their admin consistently keeps putting sugar in the tank by going behind the hc back to gauge interest in potential new hc's.
as for the changes to the contract that gus might accept, i can see 0 reasons why he should accept it. makes no sense.
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President needs to let the AD make the decisions provided he is competent
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Logically, Michigan has had a good season.
How many fans, outside this place, are logical?
10-2 is logically good.
10-2 that ends with another loss to OSU, and another year without even a trip to Indy is a little different. I think if UM had already been to at least Indy, let alone the CFP, or had been close to .500 against OSU the past decade or so, this season might feel different. But (and this is from a guy who watched UM-OSU with a full UM room in Ann Arbor), I think the universal take was that this was a wasted season, and that they still hadn't accomplished either of those things. My dad at one point just sort of sighed, and said if not now, when? OSU was seemingly down, MSU and UW were way down, Nebraska was way down when they played them, PSU was down from the past couple years. Michigan had what looked like the best defense in the nation, and it ended without a meaningful postseason game or a win over OSU.
I think 10 years from now, if Michigan has a couple Big Ten titles, and a CFP trip or two, 2018 will be remembered more fondly than it is right now. If even OSU had lost to Maryland, so UM had a chance to at least go to Indy, play for a Big Ten title, while the OSU loss would sting, it would feel like at least the team hung a banner. That's the standard at Michigan.
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They could have a "Co-Big Ten East Champion" banner. If they wanted.
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Allow me to disagree, and let me make the exhaustive case.
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That pass game sucked. It's around No. 100 in efficiency. Hornibrook regressed. None of the receivers have done a damn thing, and that line, that damn line, has let QBs get hit again and again. UW fell from an average pass pro team to No. 91, and some of the biggest mistakes came when someone tried to make a play under presser.
Pre-injury, Hornibrook was Hornibrook. The guy makes bad decisions (15 INTs last year, 11 this year, but 3 of those in the Minnesota game), but also looks great at times, particularly at key moments in close games (against Iowa, for instance). The bigger issue you identified in another post--the offensive line wasn't as good as advertised. They blocked for the run pretty well, but the pass protection was woeful pretty often, which makes any quarterback look bad, and makes the offense one dimensional, which makes defending it a lot easier.
The ending with Minnesota put Hornibrook's decision making front and center again, but I tend to agree with many who wonder why it wasn't Coan after Hornibrook's head injury had sidelined him so much. I'm normally the first to defend the coaches' personnel decisions, so on this one, I have to think that Chryst was confident Hornibrook was looking better. He didn't play it, and it doesn't take many bad decisions from the QB to really tank a game.
And while we're talking turnovers, Taylor has improved, but lost two key fumbles against Northwestern. Curiously, the only loss in which the Badgers didn't turn the ball over at least twice was BYU (though missing field goals is a lot like turnovers--or shanked punts). The Badgers were tied for 86th in turnover margin. Ouch. Only Minnesota, Illinois, and Rutgers were worse in the Big Ten. (Last year the Badgers were 30th.)
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They could have a "Co-Big Ten East Champion" banner. If they wanted.
That's what Harbaugh's dad wants.
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I know, I wish they'd do that.
The Bama players took their runner up trophy from 2016 and smashed it to pieces.
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I know, I wish they'd do that.
The Bama players took their runner up trophy from 2016 and smashed it to pieces.
To me, it depends on what the conference recognizes, and I don't know the answer.
In the pre-division days, all of the co-champs were equally Big Ten champs, the tiebreaker just determined who got to go to the Rose Bowl. The co-champs who didn't were no less champs than those who did. Their prize was just less.
Is that how the conference recognizes division champs? Is OSU the sole division champ? Or does the Big Ten recognize co-division champs, with OSU just winning the tiebreaker to go to the conference title game? If it's the later, I don't really have a problem with it I guess. If it's the former, then they are making something up, and that's a little weird.
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Yeah, if everyone plays everyone and it's 2 "co-champs," there's really one champ.
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Pre-injury, Hornibrook was Hornibrook. The guy makes bad decisions (15 INTs last year, 11 this year, but 3 of those in the Minnesota game), but also looks great at times, particularly at key moments in close games (against Iowa, for instance). The bigger issue you identified in another post--the offensive line wasn't as good as advertised. They blocked for the run pretty well, but the pass protection was woeful pretty often, which makes any quarterback look bad, and makes the offense one dimensional, which makes defending it a lot easier.
The ending with Minnesota put Hornibrook's decision making front and center again, but I tend to agree with many who wonder why it wasn't Coan after Hornibrook's head injury had sidelined him so much. I'm normally the first to defend the coaches' personnel decisions, so on this one, I have to think that Chryst was confident Hornibrook was looking better. He didn't play it, and it doesn't take many bad decisions from the QB to really tank a game.
And while we're talking turnovers, Taylor has improved, but lost two key fumbles against Northwestern. Curiously, the only loss in which the Badgers didn't turn the ball over at least twice was BYU (though missing field goals is a lot like turnovers--or shanked punts). The Badgers were tied for 86th in turnover margin. Ouch. Only Minnesota, Illinois, and Rutgers were worse in the Big Ten. (Last year the Badgers were 30th.)
I might dig in deeper at some point, but I’ll say this.
The pass game was highly efficient last year. This year, even before the injuries, it was not. I think AH got too much blame, but he deserves some, no doubt.
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What happened to Wiscy's defense?
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What happened to Wiscy's defense?
The injury bug bit early and often. Combine that with a ton of (yet-to-be-developed) youth and that's what you get.
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Now it's official. Louisville had the worst year.
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So I gotta ask, since I'm not up-to-snuff on Wisconsin's injuries - of their 4 OL on the preseason All-B10 team, how many actually warrant it now? I thought it was lazy to begin with.
According to the media vote yesterday?
4.
I am not seeing that.
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going into the off season, I'd say Auburn fans have to feel like their program is on pause at best. That Athletic Department has handcuffed their program.
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I know I'd be confused as heck were I one.
Disappointed and confused.