CFB51 College Football Fan Community
The Power Five => Big Ten => Topic started by: bayareabadger on October 02, 2022, 07:34:36 PM
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Well that's a degree of shocking.
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Overreaction Sunday?
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Scott Frost is available.
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Scott Frost is available.
How dare you.
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That’s actually pretty shocking. Hear Brian Ferentz may be available.
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An interesting stat I stole from another site.
UW's downturn started in 2018. From then to the start of the weekend, UW has the fourth-best record in the conference. They're behind OSU, Iowa, Michigan.
Just wild stuff.
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Coming off that rather disappointing game they played against Ohio State was bad. But it could’ve easily been back on track with a win over Bielema. But losing big to him in your home stadium was the gas on the fire.
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Wow.
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An interesting stat I stole from another site.
UW's downturn started in 2018. From then to the start of the weekend, UW has the fourth-best record in the conference. They're behind OSU, Iowa, Michigan.
Just wild stuff.
They’re ahead of Penn State? And everyone thinks Franklin is some amazing coach….
I get being behind OSU and MICH- being behind Iowa is unacceptable. Wisconsin should always be ahead of Iowa imo.
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They’re ahead of Penn State? And everyone thinks Franklin is some amazing coach….
You must not remember what he did pre-Penn State.
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can’t help but feel Chryst got himself in trouble putting all his QB eggs in the Graham Mertz basket. Mertz blows.
At least Wisconsin didn’t give him a $95 million contract after one season like Sparty gave Mel….
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can’t help but feel Chryst got himself in trouble putting all his QB eggs in the Graham Mertz basket. Mertz blows.
At least Wisconsin didn’t give him a $95 million contract after one season like Sparty gave Mel….
$16.4M buyout. I’m telling you, it wounded Barry Alvarez deeply to lose to who he lost to this weekend and by such a wide margin
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You must not remember what he did pre-Penn State.
he made Vanderbilt mediocre in a weak ass SEC East? Quick, back up the brinks truck!
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$16.4M buyout. I’m telling you, it wounded Barry Alvarez deeply to lose to who he lost to this weekend and by such a wide margin
that could just be what happened. Seems like an emotional overreaction after a couple bad losses. Mertz gifted the Illini like an easy 14 pts with his turnovers.
Or maybe Barry is clearing the decks to try and bring Bert back?
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They’re ahead of Penn State? And everyone thinks Franklin is some amazing coach….
I get being behind OSU and MICH- being behind Iowa is unacceptable. Wisconsin should always be ahead of Iowa imo.
A half game better.
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Wisconsin got any good OL croots everyone in the conference is going to start trying to poach?
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Apparently Wisconsin is run by message board losers
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can’t help but feel Chryst got himself in trouble putting all his QB eggs in the Graham Mertz basket. Mertz blows.
At least Wisconsin didn’t give him a $95 million contract after one season like Sparty gave Mel….
Nobody was trying to poach him. The last time MSU didn't pay up for a coach who hadn't won shit was Nick Saban
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Apparently Wisconsin is run by message board losers
isn’t it run by Barry A ?
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Nobody was trying to poach him. The last time MSU didn't pay up for a coach who hadn't won shit was Nick Saban
Yeah, I was kinda just getting a jab in there. MSU was in a rock and a hard place. Risk letting him go somewhere else or pay him.
Tuck can recruit his ass off. MSU never recruited this well nationally. That’ll pay off in 2-3 yrs but he needs to fix the DC and defense though or he won’t be around for long.
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Yeah, I was kinda just getting a jab in there. MSU was in a rock and a hard place. Risk letting him go somewhere else or pay him.
Tuck can recruit his ass off. MSU never recruited this well nationally. That’ll pay off in 2-3 yrs but he needs to fix the DC and defense though or he won’t be around for long.
The problem, as I said when he was hired, is even if he recruits his ass off, he still won't out recruit OSU, UM or PSU. So if you have the 4th most talent in your division, you better surround yourself with elite coaches. Seems like that is not the case at all.
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The problem, as I said when he was hired, is even if he recruits his ass off, he still won't out recruit OSU, UM or PSU. So if you have the 4th most talent in your division, you better surround yourself with elite coaches. Seems like that is not the case at all.
well he's out-recruiting Michigan right now bc Michigan's recruiting in 2023 and 2024 has been dog sh*t. Still lot of time til 2023 NSD and plenty of time for 2024 to change that though. But I agree with your general sentiment, Tucker needs elite coaches to develop the talent he's pulling- Dantonio was pretty damn good at doing that even if he mailed in the recruiting his last few seasons.
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wonder if this whole thing was done to try and keep Jim Leohnard. Maybe they were afraid someone was going to poach him this off-season and figured they might as well give him the try out and if he shows anything at all rest of this season they'll make it permanent.
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Well it's either that or get a head start on Leipold
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Wisconsin got any good OL croots everyone in the conference is going to start trying to poach?
I mean, they have a mess of good OL recruits on the roster.
Do not have a good O-line.
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Well it's either that or get a head start on Leipold
I would hope, from their standpoint, it's this
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according to CBS Sports Chryst finishes 67-26 (.720) overall at Wisconsin, though the team went 52-16 (.765) across his first five seasons and just 15-10 (.600) since the start of the COVID-19 pandemic-shortened 2020 campaign.If Chryst was fired without cause, Wisconsin could pay north of $16 million for his buyout.
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he made Vanderbilt mediocre in a weak ass SEC East? Quick, back up the brinks truck!
You can word it that way, sure. But no matter how you word it, it's something that no one else has ever done.
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https://twitter.com/dirkchatelain/status/1576714626426773504?t=_zvgP31JCeZCIUg_okw4Rg&s=19
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wonder if this whole thing was done to try and keep Jim Leohnard. Maybe they were afraid someone was going to poach him this off-season and figured they might as well give him the try out and if he shows anything at all rest of this season they'll make it permanent.
People keep floating this, but I honestly think they're too smart for that.
Like, what jobs would Leohnard not leave for UW? I'm not saying that in a conceited way. But he'd basically have to be given one of the 12-14 really good jobs and be pretty successful. Like, if he is good at Nebraska, and UW calls, he's probably coming. Like, unless he replaced Franklin, Harbaugh or Day, is there a Big Ten job you think he could jump start and wouldn't leave for Madison. I'm looking at other conferences. Maybe a couple ACC jobs, neither of which are opening, same for the Big 12, same for the Pac-12. I could see a few SEC jobs at that level. But honestly, unless you hand hi a blue blood, I think he's leaving anywhere for UW.
The guy is maybe the most UW man alive. He's the greatest walk-on in program history. He comes from a town the size of a fingernail. He got hired with basically no experience at the school and thrived.
So if he left, big whoop. He'd come back when the time came. Chryst almost did, but for some recommendations Barry made, and two years later, it happened anyway.
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Wisconsin AD Chris McIntosh said he fired Paul Chryst because it is “what is in the long-term best interest of our football program”
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People keep floating this, but I honestly think they're too smart for that.
Like, what jobs would Leohnard not leave for UW? I'm not saying that in a conceited way. But he'd basically have to be given one of the 12-14 really good jobs and be pretty successful. Like, if he is good at Nebraska, and UW calls, he's probably coming. Like, unless he replaced Franklin, Harbaugh or Day, is there a Big Ten job you think he could jump start and wouldn't leave for Madison. I'm looking at other conferences. Maybe a couple ACC jobs, neither of which are opening, same for the Big 12, same for the Pac-12. I could see a few SEC jobs at that level. But honestly, unless you hand hi a blue blood, I think he's leaving anywhere for UW.
The guy is maybe the most UW man alive. He's the greatest walk-on in program history. He comes from a town the size of a fingernail. He got hired with basically no experience at the school and thrived.
So if he left, big whoop. He'd come back when the time came. Chryst almost did, but for some recommendations Barry made, and two years later, it happened anyway.
Yeah, no doubt he'd crawl across broken glass for a non-blue blood that just fired a guy who won over 70% of his games.
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At 16 million left on his contract you would crawl too Brutus with out regard to winning %
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Yeah, no doubt he'd crawl across broken glass for a non-blue blood that just fired a guy who won over 70% of his games.
My friend, this is not in touch with the situation described. Unless a future coach is fired after winning 70 percent of his games, and if that happens, then we’ve got a whole different situation.
Also, probably would.
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My friend, this is not in touch with the situation described. Unless a future coach is fired after winning 70 percent of his games, and if that happens, then we’ve got a whole different situation.
Also, probably would.
Chryst had a .729 winning percentage.
It's worse than Nebraska firing Pelini for winning 9 games per year. A lot worse.
At least Nebraska is a blue blood, and Pelini had non-football related baggage.
It's going to take a guy who loves Wisconsin like a son, because no one else is going to a non blue blood that fires a serviceable HC mid season after a few dud games.
all of this jmho, obviously.
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So what look at Ohio State under Cooper with an embarrassment of riches dropped in his lap annually. While proven winners like Tressel waiting in the wings. With Leipold making immediate strides in football hell,worse case Leonhard or Aranda. Unfortunately PC caught a string negative mojo he couldn't shake he had what 7 yrs - he won't be missing any meals
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Wisconsin AD Chris McIntosh said he fired Paul Chryst because it is “what is in the long-term best interest of our football program”
so, is there something else going on with Chryst besides the record?
and is King Barry not influencing the AD???
What does Barry have to say about this?
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Personally, I've always really liked Chryst.
With zero knowledge of what's going on in Madison, I didn't think it was time yet, but...
- 2020 was excusable because of COVID, but that team wasn't very good;
- 2021 was excusable, but the Penn State loss was ugly, the collapse against ND was ridiculous, the blowout at home to Michigan was poor, and the loss to Minnesota was hard to stomach. That team had a decent record, but wasn't nearly as good as we expect Badger teams to be. So excusable, but that's a decent number of excuses adding up
- 2022: losing at home to Wazzu was a very bad sign. Getting curb-stomped at OSU was notable (losing at OSU is one thing, but it was much, much worse than merely losing). Losing to an improved Illinois is one thing; not being competitive is entirely another.
- It's not just the losses, it's the manner of the losses. When Wisconsin plays Wisconsin football--solid offensive line, clock control, discipline, and scrappy defense, but comes up short against 5- and 4-star players at Ohio State, that's ok (although Chryst was 0-5 against the Buckeyes, which starts to be a bit much). If the quarterback isn't playing well, but the team grinds out yards, controls the clock, and just wears out at the end, that's something we're used to. But this team isn't that. This team doesn't block well and isn't disciplined (e.g., nearly 70 penalty yards per game), and the team captains have identified players quitting as a problem. That all suggests a deeper problem.
- I know fans are almost never happy, but when former players are also starting to identify problems, that requires a little attention.
So from my perspective, while this seemed early, it isn't quite as reactionary as some people seem to think. And I've seen a lot of talk on this board and elsewhere about Ferentz and Iowa. I know that Wisconsin fans don't want to be Iowa. This decision is consistent with that.
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Don't have time to comment on this, but it had to be done, and yes, King Barry had a say.
And the buyout will not be $16MM.
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Yeah, I guess he has been pretty mediocre since 2020.
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the buyout might not be $16, but it will be substantial
unless there are other factors with the firing
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https://twitter.com/Matt_Fortuna/status/1577073315830587392?s=20&t=3p1PC_76h7VaqgJqjjmZyw
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Matt Fortuna-
Wisconsin and Paul Chryst have agreed to a reduced buyout of $11 million, to be paid before Feb. 1, 2023, per a school official.
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Sorry the guy got canned but don't say "poor Paul"
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just throwing this out there out loud.....Lane Kiffin?
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just throwing this out there out loud.....Lane Kiffin?
Definite culture fit....
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so, after he gets paid on Feb 1, Paul can take another coaching job and keep the $$$?
Heck, that's better than $16 mill with strings
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https://twitter.com/BraelonAllen/status/1576725257393930240?s=20&t=M2hI_dcfFMMNVgu9rZ8EJg
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Chryst had a .729 winning percentage.
It's worse than Nebraska firing Pelini for winning 9 games per year. A lot worse.
At least Nebraska is a blue blood, and Pelini had non-football related baggage.
It's going to take a guy who loves Wisconsin like a son, because no one else is going to a non blue blood that fires a serviceable HC mid season after a few dud games.
all of this jmho, obviously.
We're talking past each other, but I buy in part what you're saying.
I'd say that no one in position to be choosy "is going to a non blue blood that fires a serviceable HC mid season after a few dud games." But plenty of people ain't that choosy. Shoot, someone choosy might not look at Nebraska. Kentucky's coach didn't consider FSU only a few years back.
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Don't have time to comment on this, but it had to be done, and yes, King Barry had a say.
I was amused at anyone who doubted this.
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We're talking past each other, but I buy in part what you're saying.
I'd say that no one in position to be choosy "is going to a non blue blood that fires a serviceable HC mid season after a few dud games." But plenty of people ain't that choosy. Shoot, someone choosy might not look at Nebraska. Kentucky's coach didn't consider FSU only a few years back.
every situation is different
walking away from a job and walking into a new one
all the guys upcoming and mentioned can be choosy
if the leadership or culture at Nebraska or FSU or Wisconsin is questionable, choosy mothers gonna choose Jif
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It goes great with BACON on seeded rye bread - toasted of course
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It goes great with BACON on seeded rye bread - toasted of course
(https://i.redd.it/43vdeihuwzg91.jpg)
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Thought this was interesting. If you are thinking Kirk Ferentz is the next head coach that could be fired if Iowa loses to ILL, think again.
the buyout on Ferentz’s contract is at $6M per year remaining. After the year, Kirk still has seven more years left on his deal, meaning it would cost Iowa $42M to fire him after the season.
But then again, Iowa AD Gary Barta is officially the boss of OC Brian Ferentz. Barta could fire Brian Ferentz based on performance, which would probably force Kirk Ferentz to resign in protest, effectively firing Kirk Ferentz without financial penalty.
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Every time I hear murmurs about Ferentz, Iowa wins a few games and they dissipate.
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Yeah but Chryst went from minimum murmurs to out the door, all because he let OSU beat him twice.
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Yeah but Chryst went from minimum murmurs to out the door, all because he let OSU beat him twice.
When the defensive coordinator, and not the head coach, is giving the pep speeches after losing to OSU...
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Yeah but Chryst went from minimum murmurs to out the door, all because he let OSU beat him twice.
but the Hawks will settle for mediocrity
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Apparently, UW will not settle.
Sunday was the first time since 1989 (Don Morton) that UW has fired its head football coach (Paul Chryst).
The latter was far better (86-45) than the former (6-27).
Obviously, plucking a head coach from the lower levels isn't always the best thing. Don Morton is an example.
(https://i.imgur.com/QCyQp7m.png)
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It’s all relative….
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Ohio State didn't beat Wisconsin twice. Wisconsin isn't very good right now--and hasn't been as good as it is supposed to be since 2019. That's why Chryst was fired.
The Minnesota loss last year is instructive. The Badgers were good enough to be in contention for the Big Ten West, then Minnesota thoroughly outplayed them to keep them out of the CCG, showing that Wisconsin was merely an above-the-mean Big Ten West team. As noted above, it's not just losing, it's how you lose. Minnesota was clearly the better team. It's ok that this could happen in isolation, but it's not ok that it's a pattern. In the Alvarez Era, Wisconsin has become accustomed to being a contender, not merely above-the-mean. It's been too long, and this year showed things getting worse, not better.
This may have been a terrible move. We will see. Maybe this will make Badgers feel like Cornhuskers, wandering in the wilderness.
But what it shows is that the Wisconsin Athletic Department is not the Iowa Athletic Department, and doesn't want to be. And while I wouldn't have fired Chryst based on the limited information I have, I appreciate that the Athletic Director has no interest in sustained mediocrity.
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Ohio State didn't beat Wisconsin twice. Wisconsin isn't very good right now--and hasn't been as good as it is supposed to be since 2019. That's why Chryst was fired.
The Minnesota loss last year is instructive. The Badgers were good enough to be in contention for the Big Ten West, then Minnesota thoroughly outplayed them to keep them out of the CCG, showing that Wisconsin was merely an above-the-mean Big Ten West team. As noted above, it's not just losing, it's how you lose. Minnesota was clearly the better team. It's ok that this could happen in isolation, but it's not ok that it's a pattern. In the Alvarez Era, Wisconsin has become accustomed to being a contender, not merely above-the-mean. It's been too long, and this year showed things getting worse, not better.
This may have been a terrible move. We will see. Maybe this will make Badgers feel like Cornhuskers, wandering in the wilderness.
But what it shows is that the Wisconsin Athletic Department is not the Iowa Athletic Department, and doesn't want to be. And while I wouldn't have fired Chryst based on the limited information I have, I appreciate that the Athletic Director has no interest in sustained mediocrity.
Great post.
It will be interesting to see how they fare this weekend in the house of horrors on The Lake. That will be telling.
I'm thinking there will be a lot of transfers out. And decommitments.
Who on the staff stays?
Some smoke that Bobby Engram will not be calling plays this weekend. But was he really calling plays anyway? The only guy on the staff with play calling experience is Al Johnson. Maybe Bostad?
If Jimmy is indeed the next coach, and that is not guaranteed, I think he should retain Bob Bostad, Al Johnson and Alvis Whitted on offense. Johnson should coach the TE group - not the RB room. Bostad keeps OL. Whitted keeps the WR. Bring in a QB coach and RB coach. Haering is gone for sure - finally. Jury is out on Engram but that does not look good for him right now.
On defense, I think you retain everyone except D'Onofrio at ILB. They are not getting it done this year. Bobby April for DC/OLB.
Can Jimmy be head coach and still coach safeties? I'd rather not see that.
So many questions.
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It’s all relative….
dumb picture. Chryst has been able to feast on a pathetic West division and he's never won the B1G. That thing has been trending down. Jim plays in the East, which has been a TOUGH division to play in- and just beat Ohio State and won the B1G last year and made the playoff. And I'm no great fan of Jim.
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dumb picture. Chryst has been able to feast on a pathetic West division and he's never won the B1G. That thing has been trending down. Jim plays in the East, which has been a TOUGH division to play in- and just beat Ohio State and won the B1G last year and made the playoff. And I'm no great fan of Jim.
Exactly my point. It’s all relative. Trends. Etc
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Um, well, this seems pretty poor. When MSU hired away their recruiting director, he appears to have forgotten to hire a new one
https://twitter.com/slmandel/status/1578052766743769088?t=vpDvJn3YlILyPCu4qZzF9A&s=19
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Um, well, this seems pretty poor. When MSU hired away their recruiting director, he appears to have forgotten to hire a new one
https://twitter.com/slmandel/status/1578052766743769088?t=vpDvJn3YlILyPCu4qZzF9A&s=19
Actions like not talking to a prospective recruit will definately hurt your recruiting efforts. Does this fall on the coach or the Athletic Dept?
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I read that Athletic article, and yes, not having any recruiting department for that long was one of the things the AD considered in his decision. It was a disaster of his own doing.
There are now 8 people on the recruiting staff. Too little, too late.
In addition, he did not embrace the NIL stuff. Old school.
Caleb Williams really wanted to go to Wisconsin. Instead, he chose USC, and the money.
He had to go. I thought it would be after the season though.
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I read that Athletic article, and yes, not having any recruiting department for that long was one of the things the AD considered in his decision. It was a disaster of his own doing.
There are now 8 people on the recruiting staff. Too little, too late.
In addition, he did not embrace the NIL stuff. Old school.
Caleb Williams really wanted to go to Wisconsin. Instead, he chose USC, and the money.
He had to go. I thought it would be after the season though.
And that's why I disagreed with you (in part) about Tucker being a better coach than Dantonio. He's not, but Dantonio was woefully unprepared for this era of college football. Mel Tucker may not work out. He might not be able to coach. But Dantonio was not ready for the NIL/transfer portal era at all. So he was going to keep taking 4 win talent and winning 6-7 games a year in perpetuity. I'm not blind enough to know that's not always MSU, and didn't want to fire him over it. But I wasn't sad that he retired either.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hw7WCdIYg6I
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Interesting.
Chryst wasn’t naïve to his Badgers’ need to elevate their performance, particularly on the offensive side of the football.
But multiple sources this week told FootballScoop that Chryst’s firing had blindsided many even in the upper reaches of Wisconsin’s administration. Those same sources indicated an extremely heated conversation between Chryst and Wisconsin athletics director Chris McIntosh rested at the foundation of the stunning move.
Sources tell FootballScoop neither Chryst nor McIntosh headed to that meeting expecting the outcome that transpired.
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seems crazy
seems like something that Pelini would have pulled
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I read that Athletic article, and yes, not having any recruiting department for that long was one of the things the AD considered in his decision. It was a disaster of his own doing.
There are now 8 people on the recruiting staff. Too little, too late.
In addition, he did not embrace the NIL stuff. Old school.
Caleb Williams really wanted to go to Wisconsin. Instead, he chose USC, and the money.
He had to go. I thought it would be after the season though.
Well if PC got that slack/blase about recruiting then he had it coming.Specially at what they're paid.Perhaps the AD maybe saved the progrom for a spell.That and the QB position hadn't been up to snuff and he was brought aboard because supposedly of his whispering abilities.Me thinks it was a schrewd and insightful move.And as you pointed out PC didn't embrace the portal and some decent playmakers have been picked up thru the process And you could do a lot worse than Leonhard or Leipold as IMO it's down to them
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More from The Athletic.
Leonhard had experienced football success in every phase of his career, first as an in-state prep standout at Flambeau High, then as a walk-on who became a three-time All-America safety at Wisconsin, next as an undrafted player who went on to a 10-year NFL career and most recently in his first six-plus seasons as an assistant coach. He demonstrated during his coaching career that he had an excellent ability to connect with players, to help simplify concepts that may have seemed complicated.
Still, he recognized that this would be his most significant challenge yet. Drawing up game plans and schemes was one thing. Managing the emotions of college-aged players and helping to lift a program out of its shock was something else entirely.
Leonhard’s messaging focused on a few key areas, and he wanted to remain consistent in what he said. He told players they needed to get out of the building early in the week and process their feelings. He preached the value of compartmentalization and being able to focus on football during practices and meetings. He told them that he still had confidence in their abilities and that they could be the team they hoped to be if they held each other accountable and executed. Perhaps most important, he wanted to assure players that this was still Chryst’s team, and that wasn’t going to change even though there were going to be small tweaks.
What did Leonhard provide throughout the week?
“Juice,” Mertz said. “He was electric.”
Leonhard said he thought the team had turned a corner by the end of Tuesday and the start of Wednesday in prep work and practices. He noticed that the intensity, emotion and ability to focus all returned. By the time he walked off the bus to enter the stadium Saturday, he believed Wisconsin was ready.
“To me, there were a lot more nerves throughout the week than there were today,” Leonhard said. “Game day is game day. I’ve been a part of a lot of these. Obviously not in this role, but this is a reward. You put in the work, you put in the time and you should have confidence when you step off that bus that you have the right plan, you have the right guys. You’re going to put them in position to have success.”
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Don Morton should get another chance.
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Madison would implode.
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Don Morton should get another chance.
It’s wild that his bad tenure in Madison literally killed his coaching career. Never an assistant again.
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living on the buyout $$$???