CFB51 College Football Fan Community
The Power Five => Big Ten => Topic started by: Mdot21 on January 04, 2022, 12:39:26 PM
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figured we might as well have one as the draft is in just a few months.
Michigan Rush LB/DE David Ojabo declares for the NFL draft.
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PFF latest mock draft.
https://www.pff.com/news/draft-2022-nfl-mock-draft-jacksonville-jaguars-michigan-edge-aidan-hutchinson-no-1-overall-pick-denver-broncos-quarterback-matt-corral-ole-miss
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(https://scontent.ffar1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/p526x296/271283770_4807667612603943_2820021818564831578_n.jpg?_nc_cat=1&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=sAeuTF2Sn7QAX_qFq7f&_nc_ht=scontent.ffar1-2.fna&oh=00_AT9eRCZCjRzG-7OXi5eBwO5Kk-eLmpbOHNY2_4AKiOg4-g&oe=61DAA115)
3 O-linemen in the top 5?????
redickerus
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(https://scontent.ffar1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/p526x296/271283770_4807667612603943_2820021818564831578_n.jpg?_nc_cat=1&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=sAeuTF2Sn7QAX_qFq7f&_nc_ht=scontent.ffar1-2.fna&oh=00_AT9eRCZCjRzG-7OXi5eBwO5Kk-eLmpbOHNY2_4AKiOg4-g&oe=61DAA115)
3 O-linemen in the top 5?????
redickerus
This draft might be one of the worst in recent memory for QB's. I wouldn't take any of those QB's in the 1st rd let alone with a top 5 pick.
Should always build team with these positions I think in this order; QB, DE, OT, CB. QB is awful this draft and CB is OK, not great. Meanwhile it's a really good DE and OT draft.
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I don't know whether I'd pick Thibidoix or Hutchinson. I just know I don't the Lions to pick the correct one. So I hope Jacksonville takes one of them to take the decision out of their hands
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I don't know whether I'd pick Thibidoix or Hutchinson. I just know I don't the Lions to pick the correct one. So I hope Jacksonville takes one of them to take the decision out of their hands
It's the Lions. They ruin whoever they pick. It's the franchise, not the player. I pray for Hutchinson's sake the Lions don't get him.
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This draft might be one of the worst in recent memory for QB's. I wouldn't take any of those QB's in the 1st rd let alone with a top 5 pick.
I mostly agree. My top 3 would be Pickett (Pitt), Howell (NC), and Strong (Nevada). All these QBs seem to have what it takes at the next level, but none of them are a sure thing (like Joe Burrow).
Ridder (Cincy), Corral (Ole Miss), and Willis (Liberty) are the other options. All 3 of these QBs have issues though. I wouldn't touch Willis. Corral is highly rated, but he has accuracy issues.
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For the Buckeyes, known entries are:
- Chris Olave
- Garrett Wilson
- Nicholas Petite-Frere
- Tyreke Smith
- Master Teague
- Jeremy Ruckert
- Thayer Munford
- Haskell Garrett
- Antjuan Jackson
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Olave just ran a 4.26
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shoot
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Olave just ran a 4.26
For a guy who is a precision route runner and exquisite deep ball tracker- that’s smoking.
looks like Garret Wilson ran 4.37
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yeah so OSU was loaded af at WR lol...
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Olave just ran a 4.26
And made a few extra millions.
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For a guy who is a precision route runner and exquisite deep ball tracker- that’s smoking.
looks like Garret Wilson ran 4.37
Yeah, you'll see this from time to time where a guy will pop out of nowhere and go from 6th round to 3rd round. Rarely does the best WR in the draft do it
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Isn't it more interesting how fast they are in pads?
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Kenneth Walker probably cemented being the first RB taken
https://twitter.com/NFLDraft/status/1499939572184195094?t=GX5ZfDVJ-qMbIuhcbfZ-6Q&s=19
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KWIII jeebis that's 1st rd
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Olave might have made himself a Raider with that time, lol.
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David Bell dropping down based on measurables, so he's gonna be a steal for some team.
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(https://i.imgur.com/W6U9Fud.png)
I wonder if NFL scouts put as much emphasis on hundreths of a second here as many of the public.
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I assume they have a sort of cut-off: below this time, we want you, above it....no thanks.
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I know from his time at Tennessee, Ty Chandler is a master at 2 things:
1 - getting tripped up by a random hand on his foot, especially when there's daylight
and
2 - he'll hit a 65-yard run....but only rush for 20 yards the rest of the game
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Cincy, maybe you could correct me, but I find it odd that the banger RB Cook ran only 0.02 slower than the long-striding, toss-sweep guy in White. I'm not talking about what they could or might do, but more how they were used at UGA.
Is that off?
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They were not dissimilar backs in the UGA offense, in my view, Cook was used a bit more often catching passes. Cook initially was viewed as a kind of scat back, but he could carry between the tackles as well, and White was about the same. I think White had more impact and better balance after contact. Cook was still a bit more agile.
Speed in pads is more important I think. I think White would be the better choice in the NFL.
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(https://i.imgur.com/W6U9Fud.png)
I wonder if NFL scouts put as much emphasis on hundreths of a second here as many of the public.
6 guys under 4.4 seems like a lot
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If I was an NFL GM, I'd pay lots of money for real, midseason 40 times for these guys.
These times are a bit silly, as these players have been doing nothing but training for this since the end of the season. It would be useful for a potential track career, not football.
I worked with the girlfriend of an eventual 4th round RB and he'd swing by every day after training. He knew exactly how many strides his 40 should have, working on his start a lot, etc. That's not football, lol.
It's like studying for the SATs. What are we doing here?
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I wonder if NFL scouts put as much emphasis on hundreths of a second here as many of the public.
Like Jimmy Johnson use to tell scouts "Ya but can he play" and he'd repeat that mantra no matter how many measurables were placed in front of him.
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I only look at the 40 times as mostly meaningless, and only a plus if the guy has proven he can already play- like KWIII. But even if he didn't run that sort of time- and he was in the 4.5's - he'd still be the best back in the draft imo.
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David Bell dropping down based on measurables, so he's gonna be a steal for some team.
Packers should snag him in the 2nd rd and pair him up with Adams. Good luck trying to stop that.
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I suspect the times are confirmation of what is already thought to be the case.
I think someone once noted that Barry Sanders ran like a 4.5 or higher.
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But can he play
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I suspect the times are confirmation of what is already thought to be the case.
I think someone once noted that Barry Sanders ran like a 4.5 or higher.
Sanders ran a 4.37.
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Top 10 All-Time Leading Rushers in NFL history
1. Smith - 4.55
2. Payton - 4.4
3. Gore - 4.58
4. Sanders - 4.37
5. Peterson - 4.4
6. Martin - 4.4
7. Tomlinson - 4.46
8. Bettis - 4.7
9. Dickerson - can't find it, but he was fast
10. Dorsett - 4.3
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To have a guy rush for 10,000+ career yards, straight-line speed isn't a top requirement.
1 - Vision
2 - Injury-avoidance
3 - Durability/High volume
4 - Moves/Agility
5 - Speed
I'd rank the attributes like that........vision is #1 - both vision to find the hole/cut back/progress through the quagmire AND vision to avoid big hits/surprise hits/etc - because those can cause fumbles and injury.
#2 and 3 on the list do not align, which makes it so hard to be a 10,000 yard rusher. You need lots of carries, BUT - you need them by earning them (being productive) and you need them while not sitting out from injury due to them.....AND not getting too many of them in a given season. RBs tend to have bad years following a career-high carries load. I looked this one up - Emmitt has the most carries ever, but ZERO seasons in the top 20 all-time. That matters.
RBs rarely run in a straight line. They're almost always shifting and hopping, cutting, and stutter-stepping. Not just juking defenders, but setting up blocks, being patient, and navigating that mass of humanity in front of them. Getting 3 yards instead of 2 by being shifty and falling forward is incredibly underrated.
I view speed as being needed and the most useful when you're deficient in the first 4. Speed can make some of it up. And I'd go so far as to say if you have the first 4 AND great speed, you're screwed, because you'll get the ball so much that #2 becomes impossible.
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Who are the top three current RBs in the NFL? What were their times?
Necessary but not sufficient, which is no doubt why the fastest guy in the NFL is not an RB (I bet).
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To have a guy rush for 10,000+ career yards, straight-line speed isn't a top requirement.
1 - Vision
2 - Injury-avoidance
3 - Durability/High volume
4 - Moves/Agility
5 - Speed
I'd rank the attributes like that........vision is #1 - both vision to find the hole/cut back/progress through the quagmire AND vision to avoid big hits/surprise hits/etc - because those can cause fumbles and injury.
#2 and 3 on the list do not align, which makes it so hard to be a 10,000 yard rusher. You need lots of carries, BUT - you need them by earning them (being productive) and you need them while not sitting out from injury due to them.....AND not getting too many of them in a given season. RBs tend to have bad years following a career-high carries load. I looked this one up - Emmitt has the most carries ever, but ZERO seasons in the top 20 all-time. That matters.
RBs rarely run in a straight line. They're almost always shifting and hopping, cutting, and stutter-stepping. Not just juking defenders, but setting up blocks, being patient, and navigating that mass of humanity in front of them. Getting 3 yards instead of 2 by being shifty and falling forward is incredibly underrated.
I view speed as being needed and the most useful when you're deficient in the first 4. Speed can make some of it up. And I'd go so far as to say if you have the first 4 AND great speed, you're screwed, because you'll get the ball so much that #2 becomes impossible.
If say having a good OL is pretty important too :96:
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Four-time U.S. Olympic gold medalist Michael Johnson advised Kansas City Chiefs wide receiver Tyreek Hill to, literally, stay in his lane.
Johnson was asked Thursday whether he thought Hill could make the U.S. Olympic team as a sprinter, and he succinctly replied "no" to Drew Davison of the Fort Worth Star-Telegram.
"He knows what his sport is," Johnson said. "That sort of thing picks up steam from other people saying, 'Oh, he can be in the Olympics.'"
Johnson continued:
"Honestly the sport is much more complex than people think. These guys are all fast and they're struggling to pick up the concept of a simple start position. Simple to me. Not simple for them. Just like if I went in and tried to be a running back. It looks simple, just take the ball and avoid the defense. It looks simple. It's not simple."
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The few who play multiple sports are amazing to me. I got to know one of them a bit through baseball, he's a really nice fellow.
(Brian Jordan).
Guess who he said gave him the hardest hit he ever had in the NFL? I think I mentioned this before.
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If say having a good OL is pretty important too :96:
Is that a personal attribute for a RB?
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Who are the top three current RBs in the NFL? What were their times?
Necessary but not sufficient, which is no doubt why the fastest guy in the NFL is not an RB (I bet).
Good luck getting a consensus on that, lol.
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Well, let's take the top four based on yards alone last year.
2021 NFL rushing stats - Players | NFL.com (https://www.nfl.com/stats/player-stats/category/rushing/2021/post/all/rushingyards/desc)
Taylor Chubb Mixon Harris.
Chubb ran a 4.52 combine.
Taylor 4.39 fast
Mixon 4.45
Harris 4.45
0.13 seconds from slowest to fastest.
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(https://i.imgur.com/tw8BGjc.png)
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so, it's not about speed, it's about the O-line!
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Georgia’s mind-blowing NFL Combine performances take on national, historical significance (dawgnation.com) (https://www.dawgnation.com/football/georgia-football-jordan-davis-devonte-wyatt-travon-walker-zamir-white-james-cook-george-pickens/ASDMECFN5VBQXDDPA6ZWAQ2WIM/?fbclid=IwAR0kHLs6zUSZ-qEz2wTxPFG1etp-FqopzMpHRJsAimvT2sx70ANz8gbi4Ew)
The draft is quasi-interesting to me. I understand folks want their guys to do well, fine, but they can't contribute in college any more. Perhaps the pub helps recruiting, no doubt.
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OK, I'm just gonna say it....these guys just keep getting bigger, stronger, and faster.....gotta be the 'roids right? some of the testing #'s these guys are putting up today just seems unreal.
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Or people are just bigger, stronger, and faster overall.
I'd honestly point to the support systems for these elite athletes - keeping them in school and keeping them eligible. For every great success from the 80s and 90s, there seemed to be another never-was sob story. Fewer specimens are falling through the cracks.
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Or people are just bigger, stronger, and faster overall.
I'd honestly point to the support systems for these elite athletes - keeping them in school and keeping them eligible. For every great success from the 80s and 90s, there seemed to be another never-was sob story. Fewer specimens are falling through the cracks.
could be. or we could just have way better roids now. lol.
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I think the collegiate training table and conditioning today is quite advanced over even 2000. I agree seeing a 340 pound lineman running a sub five second 40 is pretty amazing. I think it also pretty obvious why that Dawg D was pretty good this past season.
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Is that a personal attribute for a RB?
Um, no... But it's damn helpful for getting to 10K career yards.
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I was listing things on their end, not totally out of their control.
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The few who play multiple sports are amazing to me. I got to know one of them a bit through baseball, he's a really nice fellow.
(Brian Jordan).
Guess who he said gave him the hardest hit he ever had in the NFL? I think I mentioned this before.
(https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fj.gifs.com%2Fv1ZzDG.gif&f=1&nofb=1) (https://j.gifs.com/v1ZzDG.gif)
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my memory is bad, but I think it was a WR
perhaps, Jerry Rice
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my memory is bad, but I think it was a WR
perhaps, Jerry Rice
Yup, he said Rice cleaned his clock, and he thought he'd been hit by some OL down field. He said Rice was the consumate player, didn't take plays off, played hard.
And Bryan is still a pretty large dude in good shape.
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If I had to make a living selecting which college football players will be solid in the NFL, I would be a poor man.
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Yeah, I find it interesting how tough it is and how many blown drafts teams have (Cincinnati). But sometimes you get a player like say David Pollack who likely would be very good and he busts due to injury.
I'd rather have a really elite OL and a midrange RB than the reverse of that.
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Or people are just bigger, stronger, and faster overall.
Shame we're not getting wiser
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Yeah, I find it interesting how tough it is and how many blown drafts teams have (Cincinnati).
Oh really, yet they've still played for 3 Lombardi Trophies - talk to Browns/Lions fans.Those two were the scurge before the 1960's now nary a blip
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I lived in Cincy and idly watched them draft Qb bust after bust, it was a bit amusing to me, some of them were obvious. They seem to have done better of late.
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Brady Quinn,Brandon Weeden & Johnny Manziel say hello.Amusing isn't exactly the adjectives BROWNS Fans used
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Shame we're not getting wiser
No needs....we're as confident in ourselves as ever.
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Yup, he said Rice cleaned his clock, and he thought he'd been hit by some OL down field. He said Rice was the consumate player, didn't take plays off, played hard.
And Bryan is still a pretty large dude in good shape.
Same here.....as a nobody who never even played in college, I played 7 years of tackle football and the biggest hit I ever took was by a guy who topped out at JV WR in a pickup game. When you get crack-backed blindly, it puts you on your ass.
He had a big, shit-eating grin and I said "good hit," and put my hand up for him to help me up.
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Lions are worst franchise in the nfl and maybe all of pro sports.
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Lions are worst franchise in the nfl and maybe all of pro sports.
The Falcons and Hawks would probably make that list somewhere.
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The Falcons and Hawks would probably make that list somewhere.
Falcons at least had some great runs and made it to a couple Super Bowls in last 25-30 years. I remember the one vs the Broncos and of course the one vs the Pats.
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Rodgers reportedly offered $50+ million a year to stay in GB.
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Same here.....as a nobody who never even played in college, I played 7 years of tackle football and the biggest hit I ever took was by a guy who topped out at JV WR in a pickup game. When you get crack-backed blindly, it puts you on your ass.
Same-same played from grade school thru grade 12.Pick up games were the most vicious.....and fun. I had the boom lowered on me the very same way but it was a clean block. Many of the guys could have played varsity ball but weren't kissing the coaches hiney to do so. Back in the 70s/80s we had guys show up in baseball cleates,golf shoes and track spikes (all metal then) - Good Times
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don't think this is much of a surprise, but Dax Hill posts the best overall athleticism score of any safety prospect from NFL's NextGen Stats powered by Amazon - with a 96. It's like that Nike SPARQ type deal recruits get rated off- some kind of grading system/formula that looks at all the measurable testing time and creates a score.
Dax Hill checks in at 6' and 1/4", 192 pounds and runs an official 4.38 in the 40, 4.06 short shuttle, and 6.57 second three-cone drill. His 40 time was the fastest of any safety prospect and his short shuttle and three-cone times were also the best at safety.
Some updated mocks are putting him in the 1st round now.
https://twitter.com/NextGenStats/status/1500811956923609091?s=20&t=7ZgLn3bPO6_JD8O3dY2aSA
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LBU
(https://i.imgur.com/SiA0MXw.png)
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LBU
(https://i.imgur.com/SiA0MXw.png)
You always have good LBs. Guessing- a good combo of recruiting and development/coaching?
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Russell Wilson traded to the Broncos. Wow. Seahawks will get QB Drew Lock, TE Noah Fant, DL Shelby Harris, two 1st rd picks, two 2nd rd picks, and a 5th rd pick for Russell Wilson and a 4th rd pick. Yeah so Drew Luck sucks, Fant is decent but not exactly a Gronk in his prime or Kelcee type TE, and I've never even heard of Shelby Harris.
Broncos about to get good, really fast. Seems like QB was the one thing they were really missing.
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You always have good LBs. Guessing- a good combo of recruiting and development/coaching?
and a great D-line??? ;)
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Russell Wilson traded to the Broncos. Wow. Seahawks will get QB Drew Lock, TE Noah Fant, DL Shelby Harris, two 1st rd picks, two 2nd rd picks, and a 5th rd pick for Russell Wilson and a 4th rd pick. Yeah so Drew Luck sucks, Fant is decent but not exactly a Gronk in his prime or Kelcee type TE, and I've never even heard of Shelby Harris.
Broncos about to get good, really fast. Seems like QB was the one thing they were really missing.
Eh... Do the Broncos have a "win now" roster? If not, that's an issue... Was it really QB that was the only thing they were missing? They traded away Von Miller for picks suggesting that maybe it was time to rebuild--now they're trading away LOTS of picks for Wilson?
I've been a little sour on Wilson the last couple of seasons--seems his thought is to ALWAYS seek out the deep ball and mostly ignore underneath routes.
Agreed that Drew Lock isn't worth anything, and also have never heard of Shelby Harris. Fant is a good piece that will help, but he's not a gamebreaker IMHO.
I think this is Seattle saying "we're gonna rebuild like a mofo" this year, which makes ton of sense for them. What doesn't make sense is whether Denver is good enough to actually give Wilson something around him to win now, which you'd have to think if they're trading away that many picks.
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Eh... Do the Broncos have a "win now" roster? If not, that's an issue... Was it really QB that was the only thing they were missing? They traded away Von Miller for picks suggesting that maybe it was time to rebuild--now they're trading away LOTS of picks for Wilson?
I've been a little sour on Wilson the last couple of seasons--seems his thought is to ALWAYS seek out the deep ball and mostly ignore underneath routes.
Agreed that Drew Lock isn't worth anything, and also have never heard of Shelby Harris. Fant is a good piece that will help, but he's not a gamebreaker IMHO.
I think this is Seattle saying "we're gonna rebuild like a mofo" this year, which makes ton of sense for them. What doesn't make sense is whether Denver is good enough to actually give Wilson something around him to win now, which you'd have to think if they're trading away that many picks.
Denver had the 3rd ranked defense in the NFL in 2021. Von was oft-injured and getting long in the tooth and had a fat contract they needed to unload. Bradley Chubb had a down 2021, missed half the year and dealt with a lot of injuries- but he's still a young in his prime talented pass rusher who has produced and made Pro Bowls. Justin Simmons is one of the best safeties in the entire NFL and Pat Surtain II is a phenomenal young CB. Denver will have another nasty defense in 2022, especially if Chubb rebounds to form.
On offense they'll have a pretty good 1-2 RB punch (if they re-sign Melvin Gordon III) and they do have some nice young talent at WR that have yet to blossom- but those dudes have also been playing with Drew Lock. Jerry Jeudy and KJ Hamler could both take massive leaps playing with a guy like Russell Wilson.
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Man the AFC West is a freakin gauntlet now
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One projection (are these of any real value?) has four Dawgs in the first round, all on defense, duh. I think some of their offensive players will offer good value, like George Pickens at WR, and Zamir White at RB, in rounds 2-3.
It'll be interesting to see how UGA reloads next year, their schedule is pretty favorable to get back to the SEC CG.
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Eh... Do the Broncos have a "win now" roster? If not, that's an issue... Was it really QB that was the only thing they were missing? They traded away Von Miller for picks suggesting that maybe it was time to rebuild--now they're trading away LOTS of picks for Wilson?
I've been a little sour on Wilson the last couple of seasons--seems his thought is to ALWAYS seek out the deep ball and mostly ignore underneath routes.
Stole my thunder,exactly,this is why I've said we have good player personell people right here. Moves like this have anyone with a greater than Biden understanding going WTF :017:. Unless they can land/reload in this draft makes no sense. The Rams forfitted the future but it's already paying off for them NOW
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You always have good LBs. Guessing- a good combo of recruiting and development/coaching?
Development has been huge. Nobody out side of Wisconsin, and very few within it, even knew who Leo (let alone John) Chenal was as a recruit.
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Development has been huge. Nobody out side of Wisconsin, and very few within it, even knew who Leo (let alone John) Chenal was as a recruit.
The scheme is very underrated as well. I'd argue Wisconsin has been underwhelming on the DL for years now, but scheme and LB talent has compensated that the front seven as a whole hasn't skipped a beat
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I have a notion the "3-4" isn't really a 3-4 in a sense, I usually see four guys with hands on the ground. I think it means your OLBs are rushers at times in 3 point, one or the other, it's just flexible as to which.
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true
a front 7 is a front 7
jersey numbers and hands in the dirt aren't important
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Yeah, that's is my general impression. I didn't like the "3-4" before I started to see it's not much different except in flexibility. It looks like a 4 front usually.
It's less predictable.
I still wonder what the QB is pointing to at times before the snap. Sometimes I can see, but others he's just pointing to some random LB who is where he usually lines up. Maybe it's to signal the RB who to chip or block?
I don't have much sense of the verbal communication that goes on presnap.
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Yeah, that's is my general impression. I didn't like the "3-4" before I started to see it's not much different except in flexibility. It looks like a 4 front usually.
It's less predictable.
I still wonder what the QB is pointing to at times before the snap. Sometimes I can see, but others he's just pointing to some random LB who is where he usually lines up. Maybe it's to signal the RB who to chip or block?
I don't have much sense of the verbal communication that goes on presnap.
I do think in a lot of 4-3 alignments you are trying to have the DL occupy/split a gap to make tackles. In a 3-4 you want to have monster interior linemen who can control two gaps by taking a blocker head on and have the ability to shed him either side. The former is a "one gap" technique, the latter is a "two gap" technique.
Finding those interior monsters is hard though, so a lot of 3-4 alignments are actually getting 4 players aligned at the LOS using a hybrid speed rusher / LB on the edge to be versatile. Those guys are easier to find and recruit than someone you know can bulk up to 360# and keep their mobility and strength.
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I think people are initially wary of a 3-4 because they think the DEs are still going to be 240 lb guys. Once you see on Bama and UGA that they're 280+, you understand how the 3-4 stands up vs the run.
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I figured DEs would still be 280+, and the NT 320+, I didn't realize how large LBs were getting while retaining speed. As noted above, it's really the seven, not the 4-3 or 3-4. I like the flexibility of the 3-4 now that I start to understand it. It can turn into a 4-3 or 5-2 or even 6-1 in an instant.
The guys in the back end have to be able to hold up obviously. It's a fascinating game, and I wish I understood it better. Todd Blackledge helps some, but hardly anyone else does.
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I have a Spurrier playbook downloaded from the 90s and recently downloaded a recent Alabama one. Haven't looked at it very much yet.
You should do the same and share images of anything that confuses you or makes you ask 'why?'
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This doesn't deserve its own thread, but the USFL draft happened. Looking over the players, there are VERRRRY few names I recognize. And most of the big-name school guys were ones who got in trouble with the L-A-W.
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I have an Osborne playbook downloaded
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Is it 4 pages?
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I tried to download John Shoop's playbook, but there was a network overload and it took down Internet in 4 western states.
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Is it 4 pages?
94 pages
(https://i.imgur.com/iXhwq67.png)
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Easy to see how busted plays happen, and how less intelligent players may not be that good despite great physical talents.
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1977: There's a national champion on the team as Husker wide receiver Jeff Lee wins the 60-yard high hurdles in the NCAA men's indoor track and field championships. The 6-foot-2, 180-pounder from Racine, Wis., would finish his Nebraska football career with just one catch for six yards,
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I mostly agree. My top 3 would be Pickett (Pitt), Howell (NC), and Strong (Nevada). All these QBs seem to have what it takes at the next level, but none of them are a sure thing (like Joe Burrow).
Ridder (Cincy), Corral (Ole Miss), and Willis (Liberty) are the other options. All 3 of these QBs have issues though. I wouldn't touch Willis. Corral is highly rated, but he has accuracy issues.
Why aren’t analysts and GMs higher on Kenny Pickett?
At 6-foot-3 & 217lbs (with room to add weight), he’s the right size for colder weather franchises who more often draft for sturdier size passers, a la Josh Allen – 6-foot-4, 235lbs – or Carson Wentz – 6-foot-5, 235lbs. Pickett’s passing is NFL ready. Not sure how the Steelers, needing a QB, can overlook the guy right in their backyard if still available tp pick. Pickett has the physical stature, pocket footwork, passing accuracy, and plenty of college experience to develop into a franchise QB.
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Yes, his 2021 season was great. But that's 500 attempts of great vs his previous 1100 attempts of bleh.
If I'm a GM, I'm most concerned about a player's average, not his peak.
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Why aren’t analysts and GMs higher on Kenny Pickett?
small hands
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Smells of cabbage
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This doesn't deserve its own thread, but the USFL draft happened. Looking over the players, there are VERRRRY few names I recognize. And most of the big-name school guys were ones who got in trouble with the L-A-W.
At least the MSU guys who got drafted were the definition of fine. They were olid contributors, nothing more. A couple of HM All Conference at most.
Also, why do we need a new one of these seemingly every spring at this point? They all fail
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Yeah, I was talking to a friend about it. As long as there's big-time college football, a secondary pro league will not succeed.
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There are secondary semi-pro leagues in Europe. A really fun book about one is "Playing for Pizza", a great vacation read. The CFL of course is a secondary pro league that has been around for ages.
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Right, fooseball in other countries. Totes.
Zackly wut eye mint.
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(https://i.imgur.com/WfbkFCy.jpg)
At the top of this project, lineman, lineman, lineman, lineman ... two DB types, and two more linemen. The only "skill" guys are three WRs in the first round, not that this will happen, but it's an indication NFL teams are coming around to my way of thinking.
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NFL teams always typically build with the QB and OL/DL first.
And this happens to be an awful QB draft class and an incredible OL/DL draft class.
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(https://i.imgur.com/wyJXbFd.png)
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I presume LBs look a lot better if the DL is also very good and soaks blockers.
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[img width=259.091 height=498]https://i.imgur.com/WfbkFCy.jpg[/img]
At the top of this project, lineman, lineman, lineman, lineman ... two DB types, and two more linemen. The only "skill" guys are three WRs in the first round, not that this will happen, but it's an indication NFL teams are coming around to my way of thinking.
What happened to Karlaftis? He seems to have fallen down the board? I thought he was projected at the #3 DE behind only Hutchinson and Thibodeaux...
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George Karlaftis EDGE Purdue - Draft Player Profile | The Draft Network (https://thedraftnetwork.com/player/george-karlaftis)
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I presume LBs look a lot better if the DL is also very good and soaks blockers.
UW plays a 3-4, so two ends and a nose in the base defense. More often than not, they play with two down linemen and 5 DB's.
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I would hate that if I was a DL.
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The LB's are the stars in that defense. Have been since Dave Aranda installed it. Got a reigning NFL DPOY right now (TJ Watt) too.
Now, that said, UW will have at least one DL drafted this year, and a sure-fire pick after 2022. There is incentive to want to play DL at UW.
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We all know UW does a lot with "a little", in terms of recruiting stars. It's admirable I think. They are not a team you relish playing.
Of course, they are scared to come down south and play in September.
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Nakobe Dean at 18 seems like a steal to me. His instincts are unreal. That play he made vs Michigan where he came all the way across the field to make a tackle and diagnosed the play basically before it happened- unreal. That was some Ray Lewis clairvoyance type shit. His football IQ has to be super high.
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Dean is a bit small, or so the NFL thinks. He is a smart kid, he captained the defense. To go in the first day means you have almost no negative measurables, I think.
I'm still a bit surprised at how few "skill" players are listed in the first.
Of the Dawg players I think should do well in the NFL relative to their projected draft status, I'd pick Cine at safety and I like Zamir White at RB. The latter had two knee things, but he runs angry.
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This is horrible
https://twitter.com/BuckyBrooks/status/1505430465087377410?t=N2C3YTt8kpme16fdf4X_zA&s=19
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This is horrible
https://twitter.com/BuckyBrooks/status/1505430465087377410?t=N2C3YTt8kpme16fdf4X_zA&s=19
It is. Sickening. A sad reminder that the NFL is nothing more than a meat market
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A very expensive meat market.Seems like every couple of yrs a number one pick rips a knee in summer camp.I remember Winslow JR ripping his knee on the 1st play of the 1st preseason game Butch (Botch really) Davis had him on the Kick return team :017: the 6th over all player taken
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really sad. wonder why he was even working out at the pro day in the first place. he had an excellent combine and probably already cemented himself as a top 15-20 pick.
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really sad. wonder why he was even working out at the pro day in the first place. he had an excellent combine and probably already cemented himself as a top 15-20 pick.
Said the same thing last night on the text with my UM family. Those pro days should just be for the borderline guys who don't go to the combine
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sounds like he tore his achilles and will be out 6 months minimum. So he went from top 15-20 pick, to probably 2nd or 3rd rd for no reason. Pro Day couldn't have boosted his stock any further. All it did was hurt it.
Should be a warning to any kids going forward. Don't do Combine and Pro Day. If you nail the combine, like Ojabo did- don't do the pro day.
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sounds like he tore his achilles and will be out 6 months minimum. So he went from top 15-20 pick, to probably 2nd or 3rd rd for no reason. Pro Day couldn't have boosted his stock any further. All it did was hurt it.
Should be a warning to any kids going forward. Don't do Combine and Pro Day. If you nail the combine, like Ojabo did- don't do the pro day.
Lions take Kyle Hamilton at #2. Then take Jameson Williams and Ojabo at #32 and #34, and redshirt them
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Lions take Kyle Hamilton at #2. Then take Jameson Williams and Ojabo at #32 and #34, and redshirt them
wouldn't be a bad draft at all. not sure I'd take Hamilton #2 though. I'd take Hutchinson if the Jags don't.
Pass rusher has way more impact over a game than a safety imo.
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wouldn't be a bad draft at all. not sure I'd take Hamilton #2 though. I'd take Hutchinson if the Jags don't.
I'm assuming they are. And at that point it's Hamilton and some OTs, which is the one position the Lions don't have a huge need at. But yes, if they take one of the OTs, then take Hutchinson over Hamilton
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I'm assuming they are. And at that point it's Hamilton and some OTs, which is the one position the Lions don't have a huge need at. But yes, if they take one of the OTs, then take Hutchinson over Hamilton
just read this...
https://blackandteal.com/2022/03/19/jaguars-draft-aidan-hutchinson-pave/
sounds like Jags are likely taking Hutchinson.
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They should find someone in love with either player and trade down. Every team in the #1 spot should trade down, every year. They suck.
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They should find someone in love with either player and trade down. Every team in the #1 spot should trade down, every year. They suck.
I think that is very true in most cases, but sometimes that #1 pick happens to be a player like Peyton Manning, John Elway, Bruce Smith, or Troy Aikman. Sometimes, you have to take the #1 pick. Especially if it's a QB that you really believe in. Game is completely geared to the QB today- and if you can get a really good one on a rookie deal- that's when you can win big. Once that QB becomes a star and you have to really break the bank to pay him on that 2nd contract- makes it really tough to win and build a team around him.
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The other problem is if every team thinks that way, you can't get value for trading down
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The other problem is if every team thinks that way, you can't get value for trading down
most teams are desperate for that QB- which means in a QB rich draft if you have a top 3-5 pick, you can trade down and get a nice package. this draft sucks for QB's though.
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I think that is very true in most cases, but sometimes that #1 pick happens to be a player like Peyton Manning, John Elway, Bruce Smith, or Troy Aikman. Sometimes, you have to take the #1 pick. Especially if it's a QB that you really believe in. Game is completely geared to the QB today- and if you can get a really good one on a rookie deal- that's when you can win big. Once that QB becomes a star and you have to really break the bank to pay him on that 2nd contract- makes it really tough to win and build a team around him.
The problem is that if you're bad enough to have the #1 pick, your team's problems are way bigger than QB.
Getting that QB to build around doesn't help if you get him killed by his second year and he's shellshocked and never developed.
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I'd look to trade a Number One for a bunch of draft picks and a punter.
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The problem is that if you're bad enough to have the #1 pick, your team's problems are way bigger than QB.
Getting that QB to build around doesn't help if you get him killed by his second year and he's shellshocked and never developed.
I agree with you. Most NFL teams don't though. They are constantly looking for the franchise QB and constantly draft them higher than they should.
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The problem is that if you're bad enough to have the #1 pick, your team's problems are way bigger than QB.
Getting that QB to build around doesn't help if you get him killed by his second year and he's shellshocked and never developed.
This.
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I think that is very true in most cases, but sometimes that #1 pick happens to be a player like Peyton Manning, John Elway, Bruce Smith, or Troy Aikman. Sometimes, you have to take the #1 pick. Especially if it's a QB that you really believe in. Game is completely geared to the QB today- and if you can get a really good one on a rookie deal- that's when you can win big. Once that QB becomes a star and you have to really break the bank to pay him on that 2nd contract- makes it really tough to win and build a team around him.
You'd fit right in with other NFL GMs.
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The problem is that YOU NEVER KNOW that #1 pick will turn out to be a Hall of Famer. None of those players was guaranteed to turn out the way he did. Peyton could have been drafted by the Chargers and had a nice career off the radar with a few 12-4 seasons. Aikman could have been drafted by a team that DIDN'T pull off the most lopsided trade ever.
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You're Monday-morning QBing like a MFer, lol. It's awesome.
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The problem is that if you're bad enough to have the #1 pick, your team's problems are way bigger than QB.
Getting that QB to build around doesn't help if you get him killed by his second year and he's shellshocked and never developed.
I keep wondering how many times this has to happen for it to stop.
If Mdot gets that NFL GM job, maybe it'll never stop.
It's funny, people seem to really resist the randomness of life. There's a universe where Ryan Leaf is a HOFer and does great commercials. There's a universe where David Carr played upright. Another where Jamarcus Russell is a fitness fiend.
Counting the hits and ignoring the misses is how fortune tellers stay in business.
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You'd fit right in with other NFL GMs.
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The problem is that YOU NEVER KNOW that #1 pick will turn out to be a Hall of Famer. None of those players was guaranteed to turn out the way he did. Peyton could have been drafted by the Chargers and had a nice career off the radar with a few 12-4 seasons. Aikman could have been drafted by a team that DIDN'T have pull off the most lopsided trade ever.
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You're Monday-morning QBing like a MFer, lol. It's awesome.
And you have to turn everything personal and be an asshole while you do it. It's... not awesome.
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Is "Monday morning quarterbacking" an insult? It's what...it is. What would you call it? Hindsight is 20/20? I wasn't being insulting at all.
JESUS.
You're inventing things now.
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Is "Monday morning quarterbacking" an insult? It's what...it is. What would you call it? Hindsight is 20/20? I wasn't being insulting at all.
JESUS.
Umm, "Monday morning QB'ing like a MF'er. It's awesome" is a goddamn insult. You're basically saying someone is a simpleton and can't apply the amazing analysis you're dropping on the daily. Only... Your shit stinks too.
Maybe you should read your posts, FROM THE STANDPOINT OF THE RECIPIENT, before you hit "Post". It would help avoid this.
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Don't make a habit of being upset for other people, everyone here will start calling you a bleeding heart democrat or something.
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or something
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Don't make a habit of being upset for other people, everyone here will start calling you a bleeding heart democrat or something.
Oh, I'm not upset for Mdot. He's a big boy and I'm not worried you're going to crush his psyche.
I'm upset because you're being an ass and it's not helping this forum. I'm a level headed guy. If I'm calling your ass out, maybe you're in the wrong.
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We found the arbiter of decorum!!!
Call off the search!!!
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This is lame, at least call me out when I'm actually being an ass. This is nothing.
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We found the arbiter of decorum!!!
Call off the search!!!
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This is lame, at least call me out when I'm actually being an ass. This is nothing.
Ok. Clearly I'm the problem here. No need for self reflection on your part at all :smiley_confused1:
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Mel Kiper brand new updated mock draft has Hutchinson going #1 overall to the Jags. Kyle Hamilton #2 to the Lions.
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has Mel EVER predicted the top 2 picks accurately?
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At this point? Yeah. Much like Lunardi and Bracketology, at this point he's got sources telling him things, he's not doing his own analysis
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I'm amused how the various draft predictions differ, and then vary over time. I understand some trades can change priorities, but really, none of the predictions are interesting to me. Maybe this maybe that.
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Not ideal for Pickett
https://twitter.com/ThePoniExpress/status/1517549901156081668?t=yyb6XKOV7V1TNz8h7ute4w&s=19
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who the heck is Bailey?
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does the Wonderlic even matter though? feel like it doesn't.
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Chicks seem to think so......
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who the heck is Bailey?
The WKU QB that threw the ball like 60 times a game. Transferred from whatever FCS school hired his coach
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does the Wonderlic even matter though? feel like it doesn't.
For QBs? Yes. For everyone else? No
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For QBs? Yes. For everyone else? No
Lamar Jackson had a 13 and was league MVP in 2019. Outlier perhaps, but I also wonder how important this test is.
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I suspect different scouts weight wonderlic differently, just as they do 40 times and other metrics.
I enjoyed the movie "Draft Day" a lot, with Costner, but all this speculation about who gets drafted where is over the top for me.
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Yeah. Don't they realize we'll just find out when the draft occurs?
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Lamar Jackson had a 13 and was league MVP in 2019. Outlier perhaps, but I also wonder how important this test is.
I think like all standardized tests, there are people who test well, and those who don't. But by and large, they test what they are designed to, which may or may not be relevant. I think for QBs, it largely is. Lamar Jackson is a great QB, but largely due to athletic prowess. He wasn't drafted overly high for a QB. For a guy like Kenny Pickett, who is seen anywhere from the 1st to 4th or so best QB in a QB weak draft, I think that's a killer. If I was considering him in the teens, I no longer would be
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Have at it, boys:
https://wonderlictestpractice.com/full-practice-test/
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Have at it, boys:
https://wonderlictestpractice.com/full-practice-test/
Time to find out if Vince Young is posting under a pseudonym here
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Full test, not quick. I had 18 seconds left, I believe.
I used a scratch piece of paper, but no calculator:
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(https://i.imgur.com/XHRjYX9.jpg)
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If that's an accurate representation of the actual test and dudes are scoring like 13 on it, I wouldn't even want them working around heavy machinery, much less leading a professional football team.
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NFL Wonderlic Test: Highest and lowest scores at the NFL Combine (profootballnetwork.com) (https://www.profootballnetwork.com/nfl-wonderlic-test-scores-highest-and-lowest-every-scored-at-the-nfl-combine/#:~:text=WR Kevin Curtis – 48,-Kevin Curtis)
I get a sense team glance at the score as confirmation, or not, of what they already surmise. A surprise here might cause a revision in draft position, but usually they know about where a player will score. Obviously some positions require more intelligence than others, some positions are more instinctive and driven by athletic abilities. I'd bet the OLs have higher scores than DLs in general.
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If that practice test is similar to the real one, I guarantee that time is what causes those low scores. I'm a quick test-taker, whether I do well or not. I only spent a larger amount of time on 1 question and still barely finished.
I'd be willing to bet guys who score an 11 or something did mediocre, but wound up simply not answering the last 12 questions or so.
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A surprising number of people, in college, are functional illiterates. They read about as well as I read German back in the day, slowly, haltingly, and with considerable effort. I'm sure a Wonderlic test in German would have given me a low score.
I knew a fellow in college who once suggested we study together, and I said OK. He labored over each question, I couldn't handle it, I wanted to move on. I think he took tests that way also, I think he was smarter than I was, but I got better grades. He could read well, he just wanted to consider every angle to every question. We went to the same grad school and he flunked out after a year.
Have you money in hand and your order in mind.
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Full test, not quick. I had 18 seconds left, I believe.
I used a scratch piece of paper, but no calculator:
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(https://i.imgur.com/XHRjYX9.jpg)
How many times you have to retake it ? :043:
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A surprising number of people, in college, are functional illiterates. They read about as well as I read German back in the day, slowly, haltingly, and with considerable effort. I'm sure a Wonderlic test in German would have given me a low score.
eins,zwei,drei,vier - to da pub and drink some Bier
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I wonder if you can see all the questions when you take it at nfl combine that can help, much like identifying the sections on lsat which are easier for you. I recall taking wundellrlich w some guys and we were drinking and it was easy to save the more time consuming 3 or 4 problems to the end to ensure collecting easy points.
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How many times you have to retake it ? :043:
It's not difficult at all, everyone should try it.
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I wonder if you can see all the questions when you take it at nfl combine that can help, much like identifying the sections on lsat which are easier for you. I recall taking wundellrlich w some guys and we were drinking and it was easy to save the more time consuming 3 or 4 problems to the end to ensure collecting easy points.
This relates to "test taking ability" and tactics. Some folks aren't good at it.
I had a boss once who was apparently dyslexic. He'd fumble over the simplest terms if he tried to write anything, which he didn't do much. Any meeting that required writing on the board he'd have me do. He wasn't outwardly "dumb", he just couldn't write, and he told me he never read much of anything.
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People being bad test-takers is BS.
If someone has dyslexia or another actual issue, that's obviously real and an obstacle, but I see it as separate.
There are probably tens of millions of people with no such obstacle who claim to be bad test-takers who simply don't know the content and/or have a history of not knowing the content and therefore have no confidence in taking a test going forward.
If you know your stuff, you're not stressed and you'll get the answers right.
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I disagree, I have known some smart people, like the guy I mentioned, who had poor test taking tactics.
I did better on standardized tests in HS than many of my peers and better than I likely "deserved".
If you spend too much time on a tough problem and don't finish, your tactics are bad. This is probably minimized today because so many take courses to improve their scores, we didn't back when.
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If he had dyslexia, that's an issue independent of test-taking ability. Doing poorly on tests was a side-effect of a more important problem.
For people who spend too much time on a individual problem, and they're told not to do that, but still do.....that's called idiocy, not bad test-taking. IF YOU KNOW THE CONTENT, AND DON'T HAVE LARGER ISSUES, YOU DO WELL. Period.
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He didn't have dyslexia, he just got mired in tough problems and wouldn't move along. He was a very smart guy, I idly wonder where he ended up.
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Patton had dyslexia,many exceptional/successful people do
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Yup, some do, usually in a milder form. Being able to read fluently is a definite asset for most.
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Many of the kids at poorer HSs can graduate with only a rudimentary ability to read. That difficulty compounds because they then don't like to read, and won't.
Some get to college of course, athletes or not, and get tutored and directed to specific coursework that may keep them eligible. Barely.
Reading of course is basic, central to nearly everything in life.
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7 Round Mock, with trades
- 1. Jaguars - EDGE AIDAN HUTCHINSON, MICHIGAN
- 2. Lions - EDGE Kayvon Thiodeaux, Oregon
- 3. Texans - S Kyle Hamilton, Notre Dame
- 4. Jets - OT Evan Neal, Alabama
- 5. Giants - OT Ikem Ekwonu, NC State
- 6. Panthers - OT Charles Cross, Mississippi State
- 7. Giants - DE Travon Walker, Georgia
- 8. Falcons - WR GARRETT WILSON, OHIO STATE
- 9. Seahawks - CB Ahmad Gardner, Cincinnati
- 10. Jets - EDGE Jermaine Johnson II, Florida State
- 11. Commanders - WR Drake London, USC
- 12. Vikings - CB Derek Stingley Jr., LSU
- 13. Texans - WR Jameson Williams, Alabama
- 14. Ravens - CB Andrew Booth Jr., Clemson
- 15. Eagles - WR CHRIS OLAVE, OHIO STATE
- 16. Saints - DT Jordan Davis, Georgia
- 17. Chargers - ILB Devin Lloyd, Utah
Eagles trade Pick #18 to Jaguars for 2nd Round (#33), 3rd Round (#65) and 5th round (#157)
- 18. Jaguars - OC TYLER LINDERBAUM, IOWA
- 19. Saints - QB Malik Willis, Liberty
- 20. Steelers - WR Treylon Burks, Arkansas
- 21. Patriots - CB Trent McDuffie, Washington
- 22. Packers - EDGE GEORGE KARLAFTIS, PURDUE
Cardinals trade Pick #23 to Patriots for 2nd Round (#54), 3rd Round (#85), and 4th Round (#127)
- 23. Patriots - ILB Nakobe Dean, Georgia
- 24. Cowboys - DT Devonte Wyatt, Georgia
- 25. Bills - WR JAHAN DOTSON, PENN STATE
- 26. Titans - OG Kenyon Green, Texas A&M
- 27. Buccaneers - OG Zion Johnson, Boston College
- 28. Packers - OT Trevor Penning, Northern Iowa
- 29. Chiefs - S DAXTON HILL, MICHIGAN
- 30. Chiefs - EDGE Boye Mafe, MINNESOTA
Bengals trade Pick #31 to Seahawks for 2nd Round (#40) and 4th Round (#109)
- 31. Seahawks - QB Kenny Pickett, Pittsburgh
- 32. Lions - S Lewis Cine, Georgia
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SECOND ROUND
- 33. Eagles - CB Kaiir Elam, Florida
- 34. Lions - QB Matt Corral, Ole Miss
- 35. Jets - CB Roger McCreary, Auburn
- 36. Giants - S Jalen Pitre, Baylor
- 37. Texans - EDGE DAVID OJABO, MICHIGAN
- 38. Jets - WR Christian Watson, North Dakota State
- 39. Bears - WR Skyy Moore, Western Michigan
- 40. Bengals - CB Kyler Gordon, Washington
- 41. Seahawks - OT Bernard Raimann, Central Michigan
- 42. Colts - EDGE ARNOLD EBIKETIE, PENN STATE
- 43. Falcons - QB Desmond Ridder, Cincinnati
- 44. Browns - DT Travis Jones, Connecticut
- 45. Ravens - OG Tyler Smith, Tulsa
Vikings trade Pick #46 and 5th Round (#156) to Bills for Pick #57 and 3rd Round (#89)
- 46. Bills - RB KENNETH WALKER, MICHIGAN STATE
- 47. Commanders - S JAQUAN BRISKER, PENN STATE
- 48. Bears - DE Logan Hall, Houston
- 49. Saints - WR George Pickens, Georgia
Chiefs trade Pick #50 to Steelers for Pick #52 and 6th Round (#208)
- 50. Steelers - QB Sam Howell, North Carolina
- 51. Eagles - ILB Christian Harris, Alabama
- 52. Chiefs - WR John Metchie III, Alabama
- 53. Packers - TE Trey McBride, Colorado State
- 54. Cardinals - DE DeMarvin Leal, Texas A&M
Cardinals trade Pick #55 to Falcons for Pick #58 and 5th Round (#151)
- 55. Falcons - RB Breece Hall, Iowa State
- 56. Cowboys - DE Cameron Thomas, San Diego State
- 57. Vikings - OG Dylan Parham, Memphis
- 58. Cardinals - OG Darian Kinnard, Kentucky
- 59. Packers - DT Perrion Winfrey, Oklahoma
- 60. Buccaneers - OLB Nik Bonitto, Oklahoma
49ers trade Pick #61 to Chargers for 3rd Round (#79), 4th Round (#123) and 5th Round (#160)
- 61. Chargers - OT DANIEL FAALELE, MINNESOTA
- 62. Chiefs - CB Tariq Woolen, UTSA
- 63. Bengals - DT Phidarian Mathis, Alabama
- 64. Broncos - ILB Chad Muma, Wyoming
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Reading of course is basic, central to nearly everything in life.
Correct can't imagine subsisting w/o the pearls of wisdom shared here on a daily basis
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THIRD ROUND
- 65. Eagles - S NICK CROSS, MARYLAND
- 66. Lions - WR Calvin Austin III, Memphis
- 67. Giants - OG Cole Strange, Chattanooga
Texans trade Pick #68 to Jaguars for Pick #70 and 6th Round (#198)
- 68. Jaguars - ILB Quay Walker, Georgia
- 69. Jets - OLB Drake Jackson, USC
Texans trade Pick #70 to Ravens for Pick #76 and 4th Round (#141)
- 70. Ravens - ILB LEO CHENAL, WISCONSIN
- 71. Bears - OT NICHOLAS PETIT-FRERE, OHIO STATE
- 72. Seahawks - DE Myjai Sanders, Cincinnati
- 73. Colts - WR Jalen Tolbert, South Alabama
- 74. Falcons - OLB Kingsley Enagbare, South Carolina
- 75. Broncos - OT Sean Rhyan, UCLA
Texans trade Pick #76 to Browns for Pick #78 and 6th Round (#202)
- 76. Browns - ILB Troy Andersen, Montana State
- 77. Vikings - LB Brian Asamoah, Oklahoma
- 78. Texans - RB Isaiah Spiller, Texas A&M
- 79. 49ers - CB Coby Bryant, Cincinnati
- 80. Texans - OT Abraham Lucas, Washington State
- 81. Giants - ILB Channing Tindall, Georgia
- 82. Falcons - DE Josh Paschal, Kentucky
- 83. Eagles - EDGE Sam Williams, Ole Miss
- 84. Steelers - S Bryan Cook, Cincinnati
- 85. Cardinals - WR Khalil Shakir, Boise State
- 86. Raiders - WR Wan'Dale Robinson, Kentucky
Cardinals trade Pick #87 and 6th Round (#201) to Titans for Pick #90 and 5th Round (#169)
- 87. Titans - TE Greg Dulcich, UCLA
- 88. Cowboys - WR Alec Pierce, Cincinnati
- 89. Vikings - WR DAVID BELL, PURDUE
Cardinals trade Pick #90 to Bengals for Pick #95 and 5th Round (#174)
- 90. Bengals - TE Isaiah Likely, Coastal Carolina
- 91. Buccaneers - TE JEREMY RUCKERT, OHIO STATE
- 92. Packers - ILB Damone Clark, LSU
- 93. 49ers - OG Jamaree Salyer, Georgia
- 94. Chiefs - RB James Cook, Georgia
- 95. Cardinals - CB Marcus Jones, Houston
- 96. Broncos - QB Carson Strong, Nevada
- 97. Lions - EDGE DeAngelo Malone, Western Kentucky
- 98. Saints - OT RASHEED WALKER, PENN STATE
- 99. Browns - TE Cade Otton, Washington
Ravens trade Pick #100 to Jaguars for 4th Round (#106) and 6th Round (#180)
- 100. Jaguars - S KERBY JOSEPH, ILLINOIS
- 101. Eagles - OG Ed Ingram, LSU
- 102. Dolphins - OT Luke Goedeke, Central Michigan
Chiefs trade Pick #103 to Commanders for 4th Round (#113) and 6th Round (#189)
- 103. Commanders - CB Martin Emerson, Mississippi State
- 104. Rams - CB Alontae Taylor, Tennessee
- 105. 49ers - WR Justyn Ross, Clemson
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Is this your mock ELA?
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Is this your mock ELA?
Yes
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Yes
Can't imagine the Browns not taking a WR and probably an Edge with their first 2 picks. Unless they resign Clowney before the draft. Your draft of a DT and ILB would totally shock me. A TE on their 3rd pick definitely possible.
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Can't imagine the Browns not taking a WR and probably an Edge with their first 2 picks. Unless they resign Clowney before the draft. Your draft of a DT and ILB would totally shock me. A TE on their 3rd pick definitely possible.
Limiting trades to just picks in the draft kind of limits things. But I do factor in team needs on a scale of 1-5. WR and EDGE are their two 5 needs, and their board is now clear of 4s and 3s.
Also, I'm better at seeking out where teams would look to trade down than when ones would look to move up, so based on where Cleveland has picked, those positions would be reaches, but it's certainly possible they would be actively trading up
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Apparently the odds just swung heavily, and Travon Walker is now the favorite to be the #1 overall pick. Sounds like somebody knows something
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We'll find out soon enough.
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Apparently the odds just swung heavily, and Travon Walker is now the favorite to be the #1 overall pick. Sounds like somebody knows something
How many here will watch this program live? Is it kind of fun to watch? Interesting?
The above is somewhat interesting to me as TW was really lesser heralded as a member of that D. I "Heard" more about the other guys, or think I did. Lesser heralded of course does not equate with less proficient.
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2022 NFL Draft: Legend of Georgia's dominant defense will keep growing if unit smothers first round - CBSSports.com (https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/2022-nfl-draft-legend-of-georgias-dominant-defense-will-keep-growing-if-unit-smothers-first-round/?fbclid=IwAR2T-As4pA86Y5ELYCc2TOYFNgZlM3u6FxcBNNNCUEqPiKVJcWpDkZDeSxA)
I'd guess this is a good recruiting pitch anyway. Is this Thursday?
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FOURTH ROUND
- 106. Ravens - OLB JOJO DOMANN, NEBRASKA
- 107. Texans - CB Josh Jobe, Alabama
- 108. Texans - OC CAM JURGENS, NEBRASKA
- 109. Bengals - OC Luke Fortner, Kentucky
- 110. Ravens - WR Velus Jones Jr., Tennessee
- 111. Jets - LB BRANDON SMITH, PENN STATE
- 112. Giants - CB Zyon McCollum, Sam Houston State
- 113. Chiefs - LB Darrian Beavers, Cincinnati
Falcons trade Pick #114 to Colts for Pick #122 and 5th Round (#179)
- 114. Colts - TE Jelani Woods, Virginia
- 115. Broncos - CB CAM TAYLOR-BRITT, NEBRASKA
- 116. Broncos - TE Charlie Kolar, Iowa State
- 117. Jets - RB Dameon Pierce, Florida
- 118. Browns - DE Michael Clemons, Texas A&M
- 119. Ravens - DT Matthew Butler, Tennessee
- 120. Saints - TE JAKE FERGUSON, WISCONSIN
- 121. Chiefs - DE TYREKE SMITH, OHIO STATE
- 122. Falcons - S Verone McKinley III, Oregon
- 123. 49ers - EDGE Amare Barno, Virginia Tech
Eagles trade Pick #124 to Raiders for Pick #126 and 7th Round (#227)
- 124. Raiders - OT Max Mitchell, Louisiana
- 125. Dolphins - RB Rachaad White, Arizona State
Eagles trade Pick #126 to Titans for Pick #131 and 6th Round (#219)
- 126. Titans - OT Zach Tom, Wake Forest
- 127. Cardinals - CB Jalyn Armour-Davis, Alabama
- 128. Ravens - OC Dohnovan West, Arizona State
- 129. Cowboys - WR Kyle Phillps, UCLA
- 130. Bills - CB Joshua Williams, Fayetteville State
Eagles trade Pick #131 to Buccaneers for Pick #133 and 7th Round (#248)
- 131. Buccaneers - RB Kyren Williams, Notre Dame
- 132. Packers - WR Romeo Doubs, Nevada
- 133. Eagles - OT Kellen Diesch, Arizona State
- 134. 49ers - DT Neil Farrell Jr., LSU
- 135. Chiefs - DL Zachary Carter, Florida
- 136. Bengals - OG Chris Paul, Tulsa
- 137. Panthers - OG THAYER MUNFORD, OHIO STATE
- 138. Steelers - OT Braxton Jones, Southern Utah
- 139. Ravens - DE Dominique Robinson, Miami(Ohio)
- 140. Packers - OG Lecitus Smith, Virginia Tech
- 141. Texans - ILB D'Marco Jackson, Appalachian State
- 142. Rams - ILB Terrel Bernard, Baylor
- 143. Titans - CB Damarri Mathis, Pittsburgh
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Huskers coning off the board???
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FIFTH ROUND
- 144. Panthers - ILB Malcolm Rodriguez, Oklahoma State
- 145. Broncos - RB Jerome Ford, Cincinnati
- 146. Jets - TE Cole Turner, Nevada
- 147. Giants - WR Danny Gray, SMU
- 148. Bears - CB Akayleb Evans, Missouri
- 149. Panthers - CB Derion Kendrick, Georgia
- 150. Bears - RB Brian Robinson Jr., Alabama
- 151. Cardinals - RB Zamir White, Georgia
- 152. Seahawks - CB Mario Goodrich, Clemson
- 153. Seahawks - OT Matt Waletzko, North Dakota
- 154. Eagles - DT HASKELL GARRETT, OHIO STATE
- 155. Cowboys - OG Spencer Burford, UTSA
- 156. Bills - OG Justin Shaffer, Georgia
- 157. Eagles - RB Tyler Allgeier, BYU
- 158. Patriots - WR Erik Ezukanma, Texas Tech
- 159. Colts - CB TARIQ CASTRO-FIELDS, PENN STATE
- 160. 49ers - S Tycen Anderson, Toledo
- 161. Saints - S Smoke Monday, Auburn
Eagles trade Pick #162 and 6th Round (#219) to Bills for Pick #168 and 6th Round (#203)
- 162. Bills - CB Kalon Barnes, Baylor
- 163. Jets - S DANE BELTON, IOWA
- 164. Raiders - T/G Cade Mays, Tennessee
- 165. Raiders - ILB JACK SANBORN, WISCONSIN
- 166. Eagles - QB Bailey Zappe, Western Kentucky
- 167. Cowboys - LB Mike Rose, Iowa State
- 168. Eagles - TE Jalen Wydermyer, Texas A&M
- 169. Cardinals - DT Otito Ogbonnia, UCLA
- 170. Patriots - OG Marquis Hayes, Oklahoma
- 171. Packers - WR Charleston Rambo, Miami
- 172. 49ers - RB Pierre Strong Jr., South Dakota State
- 173. Giants - DL Thomas Booker, Stanford
- 174. Cardinals - TE James Mitchell, Virginia Tech
- 175. Rams - OG LOGAN BRUSS, WISCONSIN
- 176. Cowboys - S Leon O'Neal, Texas A&M
- 177. Lions - CB Mykael Wright, Oregon
- 178. Cowboys - OT Dare Rosenthal, Kentucky
- 179. Falcons - WR Tyquan Thornton, Baylor
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2022 NFL Draft: Legend of Georgia's dominant defense will keep growing if unit smothers first round - CBSSports.com (https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/2022-nfl-draft-legend-of-georgias-dominant-defense-will-keep-growing-if-unit-smothers-first-round/?fbclid=IwAR2T-As4pA86Y5ELYCc2TOYFNgZlM3u6FxcBNNNCUEqPiKVJcWpDkZDeSxA)
I'd guess this is a good recruiting pitch anyway. Is this Thursday?
See ya in 42 yrs ;D
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Yeah, I'd guess they will win another in ten years, the recruiting is too good there. It's obviously not "easy" and a lot of elite teams have lost somewhere critically. Ohio State in 1998 is perhaps the best example?
I think there are only 5-8 programs today with a legit chance outside someone have a "Joe Burrough" kind of player. Ohio State is clearly one of them and should win an NC in the next ten, at least one. It would be interesting to "bet" on who wins at least one before 2032.
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SIXTH ROUND
- 180. Ravens - OT Cordell Volson, ND State
- 181. Lions - LB Jeremiah Gemmel, North Carolina
- 182. Giants - OC Alec Lindstrom, Boston College
- 183. Texans - OG Joshua Ezeudu, North Carolina
- 184. Vikings - LB MICAH MCFADDEN, INDIANA
- 185. Bills - EDGE Jeffrey Gunter, Coastal Carolina
- 186. Bears - WR JALEN NAILOR, MICHIGAN STATE
- 187. 49ers - DE ESEZI OTOMEWO, MINNESOTA
- 188. Jaguars - WR Dontario Drummond, Ole Miss
- 189. Chiefs - OT Obinna Eze, TCU
- 190. Falcons - ILB Aaron Hansford, Texas A&M
- 191. Vikings - DT John Ridgeway, Arkansas
- 192. Vikings - S J.T. Woods, Baylor
- 193. Cowboys - OLB JESSE LUKETA, PENN STATE
- 194. Saints - OLB Zakoby McClain, Auburn
- 195. Chargers - TE CHIGOZIEM OKONKWO, MARYLAND
- 196. Ravens - RB D'vonte Price, FIU
- 197. Jaguars - DT Marquan McCall, Kentucky
- 198. Texans - DL Jayden Peevy, Texas A&M
- 199. Panthers - QB Jack Coan, Notre Dame
- 200. Patriots - S Yusuf Corker, Kentucky
- 201. Titans - WR Tre Turner, Virginia Tech
- 202. Texans - LB JOSH ROSS, MICHIGAN
- 203. Eagles - OC Luke Wattenberg, Washington
- 204. Titans - DE Eyioma Uwazurike, Iowa State
- 205. Texans - QB Kaleb Eleby, Western Michigan
- 206. Broncos - EDGE Christopher Allen, Alabama
- 207. Texans - P Matt Araiza, San Diego State
- 208. Chiefs - OG ANDREW STUEBER, MICHIGAN
- 209. Bengals - OT VEDERIAN LOWE, ILLINOIS
- 210. Patriots - CB Cordale Flott, LSU
- 211. Rams - RB Abram Smith, Baylor
- 212. Rams - OLB Alex Wright, UAB
- 213. Falcons - OT Nick Zakelj, Fordham
- 214. Chargers - DE Myron Tagovailoa-Amosa, Notre Dame
- 215. Cardinals - S Sterling Weatherford, Miami(Ohio)
- 216. Colts - CB Chase Lucas, Arizona State
- 217. Lions - DL Kalia Davis, Central Florida
- 218. Rams - DE Isaiah Thomas, Oklahoma
- 219. Bills - DL MATT HENNINGSEN, WISCONSIN
- 220. 49ers - TE AUSTIN ALLEN, NEBRASKA
49ers trade Pick #221 to Browns for 2 7th Round Picks (#223 and #246)
- 221. Browns - WR BO MELTON, RUTGERS
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FIFTH ROUND
- 144. Panthers - ILB Malcolm Rodriguez, Oklahoma State
- 145. Broncos - RB Jerome Ford, Cincinnati
- 146. Jets - TE Cole Turner, Nevada
- 147. Giants - WR Danny Gray, SMU
- 148. Bears - CB Akayleb Evans, Missouri
- 149. Panthers - CB Derion Kendrick, Georgia
- 150. Bears - RB Brian Robinson Jr., Alabama
- 151. Cardinals - RB Zamir White, Georgia
- 152. Seahawks - CB Mario Goodrich, Clemson
- 153. Seahawks - OT Matt Waletzko, North Dakota
- 154. Eagles - DT HASKELL GARRETT, OHIO STATE
- 155. Cowboys - OG Spencer Burford, UTSA
- 156. Bills - OG Justin Shaffer, Georgia
- 157. Eagles - RB Tyler Allgeier, BYU
- 158. Patriots - WR Erik Ezukanma, Texas Tech
- 159. Colts - CB TARIQ CASTRO-FIELDS, PENN STATE
- 160. 49ers - S Tycen Anderson, Toledo
- 161. Saints - S Smoke Monday, Auburn
Eagles trade Pick #162 and 6th Round (#219) to Bills for Pick #168 and 6th Round (#203)
- 162. Bills - CB Kalon Barnes, Baylor
- 163. Jets - S DANE BELTON, IOWA
- 164. Raiders - T/G Cade Mays, Tennessee
- 165. Raiders - ILB JACK SANBORN, WISCONSIN
- 166. Eagles - QB Bailey Zappe, Western Kentucky
- 167. Cowboys - LB Mike Rose, Iowa State
- 168. Eagles - TE Jalen Wydermyer, Texas A&M
- 169. Cardinals - DT Otito Ogbonnia, UCLA
- 170. Patriots - OG Marquis Hayes, Oklahoma
- 171. Packers - WR Charleston Rambo, Miami
- 172. 49ers - RB Pierre Strong Jr., South Dakota State
- 173. Giants - DL Thomas Booker, Stanford
- 174. Cardinals - TE James Mitchell, Virginia Tech
- 175. Rams - OG LOGAN BRUSS, WISCONSIN
- 176. Cowboys - S Leon O'Neal, Texas A&M
- 177. Lions - CB Mykael Wright, Oregon
- 178. Cowboys - OT Dare Rosenthal, Kentucky
- 179. Falcons - WR Tyquan Thornton, Baylor
Rams love them UW linemen. They already have two starting.
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It's Big Ten at tackles and center (MSU's Brian Allen), covering for the Big XII guards
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Would be fun to have a computer playoff between All Time College teams from the same program. I think the usual suspects would do pretty well. Maybe Ohio State would win out? ND?
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SEVENTH ROUND
- 222. Jaguars - CB Jack Jones, Arizona State
- 223. 49ers - QB Skylar Thompson, Kansas State
- 224. Dolphins - OG Tyrese Robinson, Oklahoma
- 225. Steelers - CB Jaylen Watson, Washington State
- 226. Bengals - RB Ty Chandler, North Carolina
- 227. Eagles - DE Tyree Johnson, Texas A&M
- 228. Packers - RB Zonovan Knight, NC State
- 229. Seahawks - WR Makai Polk, Mississippi State
- 230. Commanders - TE Daniel Bellinger, San Diego State
- 231. Bills - S Percy Butler, Louisiana
- 232. Broncos - S Delarrin Turner-Yell, Oklahoma State
- 233. Chiefs - TE Grant Calcaterra, SMU
- 234. Broncos - WR Kevin Austin Jr., Notre Dame
- 235. Jaguars - RB Tyler Badie, Missouri
- 236. Chargers - CB Decobie Durant, SC State
- 237. Eagles - P JORDAN STOUT, PENN STATE
- 238. Rams - S Bubba Bolden, Miami
- 239. Colts - S Reed Blankenship, Middle Tennessee
- 240. Commanders - OG Chasen Hines, LSU
- 241. Steelers - OG Ja'Tyre Carter, Southern
- 242. Panthers - WR Reggie Roberson Jr., SMU
- 243. Chiefs - QB Cole Kelley, SE Louisiana
- 244. Cardinals - OLB Jeremiah Moon, Florida
- 245. Texans - RB HASSAN HASKINS, MICHIGAN
- 246. 49ers - OC Dawson Deaton, Texas Tech
- 247. Dolphins - DT CHRIS HINTON, MICHIGAN
- 248. Eagles - RB Jerrion Ealy, Ole Miss
- 249. Packers - OLB Darien Butler, Arizona State
- 250. Vikings - RB ZaQuandre White, South Carolina
- 251. Chiefs - K Cade York, LSU
- 252. Bengals - ILB ELLIS BROOKS, PENN STATE
- 253. Rams - FB/TE CONNOR HEYWARD, MICHIGAN STATE
- 254. Chargers - WR Jaivon Heiligh, Coastal Carolina
- 255. Chargers - DT Eric Johnson, Missouri State
- 256. Cardinals - ILB Chance Campbell, Ole Miss
- 257. Cardinals - OT Jean Delance, Florida
- 258. Packers - S Isaiah-Pola Mao, USC
- 259. Chiefs - OG/OC Jack Snyder, San Jose State
- 260. Chargers - LB Adam Anderson, Georgia
- 261. Buccaneers - CB Jermaine Waller, Virginia Tech
- 262. 49ers - ILB Nephi Sewell, Utah
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Highest rated players by position on my big board who went undrafted
- QB - E.J. Perry, Brown
- RB - Tyler Goodson, Iowa
- WR - Josh Johnson, Tulsa
- TE - Derrick Deese Jr., San Jose State
- OT - Luke Tenuta, Virginia Tech
- OG - Ben Brown, Ole Miss
- OC - Xavier Newman-Johnson, Baylor
- DE - Tre Williams, Arkansas
- DT - D.J. Davidson, Arizona State
- OLB - Ali Fayad, Western Michigan
- ILB - Kyron Johnson, Kansas
- CB - Isaac Taylor-Stuart, USC
- S - Qwynnterrio Cole, Louisville
- K - Cameron Dicker, Texas
- P - Jake Camarda, Georgia
10 highest rated undrafted Big Ten players
- RB Tyler Goodson, Iowa
- CB Vincent Gray, Michigan
- RB Isaih Pacheco, Rutgers
- S Brad Hawkins, Michigan
- WR Samori Toure, Nebraska
- WR Ty Fryfogle, Indiana
- TE Peyton Hendershot, Indiana
- OC Doug Kramer, Illinois
- EDGE Noah Burks, Wisconsin
- EDGE Ben Stille, Nebraska
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I just perused a list of Dawg first rounders, and between 1960 and 1980 they had TWO overall, over 20 years.
1969 — Bill Stanfill, DE, Miami Dolphins (11th overall pick) - Stanfill wasted little time in cementing himself as a true playmaker for the Dolphins and helped the team win Super Bowl VII and VIII. He was a five-time Pro Bowl selection and led the NFL in sacks (18.5) in 1973 and ultimately retired with 69.5 sacks and 8 fumble recoveries.
1972 — Royce Smith, G, New Orleans Saints (8th overall) - A consensus All-American with the Bulldogs in 1971, Royce spent two seasons with the Saints before coming home to play for the Atlanta Falcons for three seasons and appeared in 62 career games.
They will probably have 4 or 5 tomorrow.
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Travon Walker from Georgia getting lot of media/betting hype to go #1 overall. See a lot of similarities between him and Rashan Gary in terms of athletic ability and size and that in the production doesn't quite match the insane talent. Walker checked in at 6'5" and 272 lbs at the combine and ran 4.51, Gary came in at 6'4.5", 277 lbs and ran 4.57. Those kind of testing numbers at that size are just freak show.
Gary went #12 overall- Packers moved him to 3-4 OLB, took him a couple years to develop and pop- but he had a whale of a season in 2021 and is one of the best young pass rushers in the NFL. Gary is #3 on PFF's highest graded defensive players under 25 list grading out at 89.3, Maxx Crosby (24 years old) with the Raiders is #1 at 91.4, Micah Parsons (22 years old) with the Cowboys is #2 at 89.8.
Aidan Hutchinson is a more polished, finished product, and he's got ideal size and athletic ability for the position, but Walker is just a freak show. Will be interesting to see which one of them goes #1.
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I'd love for someone to create a VR thing where you actually get to feel what it's like to be 6'5", 270 and able to run a 4.5. Conversely, you'd have an option to experience what it's like to be Danny DeVito.
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My 40 time today would be glacial. I do wind sprints, and I feel like it's barely faster than my slow jogs. The effort is there.
I might have run a 5.5 back in the day, maybe? At 180. Probably not.
I think I once ran a 100 in 13 flat, but my memory may be off.
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My 40 time today would be glacial. So continents drift apart faster? You,Bob Eucker,myself,that glacier and a couple of the lumps here should get the spikes on
I think I once ran a 100 in 13 flat, but my memory may be off. Down Hill?
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Probably, I was a decent runner back in HS, but the mile was more my size.
Even though I was a decent HS athlete, my point is how far off these times I would have been.
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I definitely belief times get better in a game with interest and adrenaline factoring in
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No doubt, I've mentioned before how times in the 40 could change for quicker players if they wore pads and gear, while the big guys might not change nearly as much.
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These fans are insane
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MSU should have offered him then
https://twitter.com/FOS/status/1519838056186003457?t=cFG6xdcNfKE5RVECCdnQlw&s=19
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Lions actually hit two home runs I thought. This could be the start of a turnaround for them. If they get Ojabo or Nakobe Dean in the 2nd rd they are absolutely crushing it.
Speaking of Dean- blows my mind he didn't go 1st round.
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7 Round Mock, with trades
- 1. Jaguars - EDGE AIDAN HUTCHINSON, MICHIGAN
- 2. Lions - EDGE Kayvon Thiodeaux, Oregon
- 3. Texans - S Kyle Hamilton, Notre Dame
- 4. Jets - OT Evan Neal, Alabama
- 5. Giants - OT Ikem Ekwonu, NC State
- 6. Panthers - OT Charles Cross, Mississippi State
- 7. Giants - DE Travon Walker, Georgia
- 8. Falcons - WR GARRETT WILSON, OHIO STATE
- 9. Seahawks - CB Ahmad Gardner, Cincinnati
- 10. Jets - EDGE Jermaine Johnson II, Florida State
- 11. Commanders - WR Drake London, USC
- 12. Vikings - CB Derek Stingley Jr., LSU
- 13. Texans - WR Jameson Williams, Alabama
- 14. Ravens - CB Andrew Booth Jr., Clemson
- 15. Eagles - WR CHRIS OLAVE, OHIO STATE
- 16. Saints - DT Jordan Davis, Georgia
- 17. Chargers - ILB Devin Lloyd, Utah
Eagles trade Pick #18 to Jaguars for 2nd Round (#33), 3rd Round (#65) and 5th round (#157)
- 18. Jaguars - OC TYLER LINDERBAUM, IOWA
- 19. Saints - QB Malik Willis, Liberty
- 20. Steelers - WR Treylon Burks, Arkansas
- 21. Patriots - CB Trent McDuffie, Washington
- 22. Packers - EDGE GEORGE KARLAFTIS, PURDUE
Cardinals trade Pick #23 to Patriots for 2nd Round (#54), 3rd Round (#85), and 4th Round (#127)
- 23. Patriots - ILB Nakobe Dean, Georgia
- 24. Cowboys - DT Devonte Wyatt, Georgia
- 25. Bills - WR JAHAN DOTSON, PENN STATE
- 26. Titans - OG Kenyon Green, Texas A&M
- 27. Buccaneers - OG Zion Johnson, Boston College
- 28. Packers - OT Trevor Penning, Northern Iowa
- 29. Chiefs - S DAXTON HILL, MICHIGAN
- 30. Chiefs - EDGE Boye Mafe, MINNESOTA
Bengals trade Pick #31 to Seahawks for 2nd Round (#40) and 4th Round (#109)
- 31. Seahawks - QB Kenny Pickett, Pittsburgh
- 32. Lions - S Lewis Cine, Georgia
Not bad, really, as good as the pros I suspect. Were there any shockers in the actual? I did not expect Nakobe Dean to go first round.
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Few thoughts
Patriots are getting crushed for reaching for Cole Strange, and rightfully so. But they only did because the Chargers also reached to grab Zion Johnson, at a position where they didn't really have a need. He was easily the best OG in the draft, but would have been perfectly fine for the Patriots, who needed one, at the end of the round.
Ravens clearly are just going best on their board, position be damned
Only 3 of the top 30 on my board are still out there. QB Malik Willis (#18), CB Andrew Booth Jr. (#19) and ILB Nakobe Dean (#21)
A lot of rumors there will be a run on QBs early in the round, so Lions should have their pick have back seven help at #46. Hopefully, obviously Booth or Dean. If Dean is gone, hopefully secondary help. Jalen Pitre and Jaquan Brisker would be the safeties worth looking at; and beyond Booth, Roger McCreary and Kyler Gordon would be options at CB
My top 10 going into Day 2
- QB Malik Willis, Liberty
- CB Andrew Booth Jr., Clemson
- ILB Nakobe Dean, Georgia
- EDGE Boye Mafe, Minnesota
- EDGE David Ojabo, Michigan
- QB Matt Corral, Ole Miss
- CB Roger McCreary, Auburn
- CB Kyler Gordon, Washington
- EDGE Arnold Ebiketie, Penn State
- OT Bernard Raimann, Central Michigan
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I did not expect Nakobe Dean to go first round.
I did. I was shocked he didn't go 1st round. They don't seem to care that much about size for LB's anymore. Devin Bush and Devin White both went pretty high lately- and they were around 5'11/6'0, 230-235 range- same as Dean.
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Few thoughts
Patriots are getting crushed for reaching for Cole Strange, and rightfully so. But they only did because the Chargers also reached to grab Zion Johnson, at a position where they didn't really have a need. He was easily the best OG in the draft, but would have been perfectly fine for the Patriots, who needed one, at the end of the round.
Ravens clearly are just going best on their board, position be damned
Only 3 of the top 30 on my board are still out there. QB Malik Willis (#18), CB Andrew Booth Jr. (#19) and ILB Nakobe Dean (#21)
A lot of rumors there will be a run on QBs early in the round, so Lions should have their pick have back seven help at #46. Hopefully, obviously Booth or Dean. If Dean is gone, hopefully secondary help. Jalen Pitre and Jaquan Brisker would be the safeties worth looking at; and beyond Booth, Roger McCreary and Kyler Gordon would be options at CB
My top 10 going into Day 2
- QB Malik Willis, Liberty
- CB Andrew Booth Jr., Clemson
- ILB Nakobe Dean, Georgia
- EDGE Boye Mafe, Minnesota
- EDGE David Ojabo, Michigan
- QB Matt Corral, Ole Miss
- CB Roger McCreary, Auburn
- CB Kyler Gordon, Washington
- EDGE Arnold Ebiketie, Penn State
- OT Bernard Raimann, Central Michigan
Patriots always have WTF drafts, and Belichik figures it out. Especially when it comes to linemen picks. I don't trust the guy to pick skill players, but he's pretty money on the line guys. Watch this guy be a top guard and no one should be shocked if he is.
Ravens are a pretty good team who have the luxury of going best player available imo.
Lions get Booth, Dean, or Ojabo and I think they have to be jumping for freaking joy. I'd prefer Dean but I fear he may be gone at #46. Ojabo would be hard to pass up if he's there. Kid was a top 15-20 pick if he doesn't injure his achilles at the Pro Day. His upside is insane. This was really his first year of playing meaningful football and he had 11 sacks. Kid is from Africa and Scotland and didn't play football until his junior year of high school.
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Ah, the NFL draft.....where players go from high-interest for me to no-longer-give-a-damn.
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Ah, the NFL draft.....where players go from high-interest for me to no-longer-give-a-damn.
(https://i.imgur.com/PmMGcp2.jpeg)
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Teams with active QB needs are taking FCS LBs over him in the 2nd round now?
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All three starting UGA LBs were drafted now. I think they are losing a lot on defense.
I still think Zamir White is a good get if he stays healthy (knees).
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Ravens are a pretty good team who have the luxury of going best player available imo.
There's probably less than 5 teams at any given time that can afford to take the approach of drafting the best available talents over addressing immediate needs. The Arizona Cardinals used to do this when Whisenhunt was coaching during Kurt Warner's quarterbacking. This gave the Cardinals immediately fieldable talent at low cost across the roster while certain needs, such as the OL, lingered as an Achilles heel season after season.
Franchises that can take this approach have the confident advantage of player development. Meaning they'll draft a stud LB despite having a stable group of LB while also badly needing a Center, who they draft at a later round where development can hopefully make up for passing up better Center prospects.
The Cardinals were excellent at developing skill positions and the secondary, which lead to the misthinking they were effective at player development across the board, which lead to a talented yet unstable roster.
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Ravens freaking crushing the draft so far. As usual. Kyle Hamilton inexplicably falls to them at 14. Steal. Then they get maybe the best OL in the entire draft in Tyler Linderbaum late in the 1st, and then they steal David Ojabo- who would've been a top 15 pick if he didn't tear his achilles a month ago- in the 2nd round. Then they get DT Travis Johnson from UCONN who ESPN had as the #42 prospect overall in this draft at pick #76.
Jets are crushing it too. Shockingly. Gardner is going to be a better NFL CB than Stingley imo and they just sat there and got to take him. Garrett Wilson was the best WR in the draft imo. DE Jermaine Johnson was a really nice value pick at the end of the 1st rd. He's a very talented athlete. Then they got Breece Hall at RB in the 2nd and Jeremy Ruckert at TE in the 3rd. Those were all really good picks.
Giants did really well too, getting Thibbodeaux at #5, Evan Neal at #7 and Wan'Dale Robinson in the 2nd rd. Thibbodeaux is a boom or bust prospect imo, but they didn't have to reach to get him and if he puts it together- he could wind up being the best DE in the draft. Neal isn't quite talented enough to play LT in the NFL imo- but he'll be a rock solid RT for a decade and again..they didn't have to reach up to get him. Robinson is just explosive, he can do a lot in the slot and in the backfield on reverses and special teams.
I like what the Eagles did as well when you take the AJ Brown trade into consideration. Smith & Brown are going to be a hell of a young WR duo. Smith is 23 and Brown is 24. Jordan Davis paired up with Fletcher Cox in the middle is going to be a problem, and they needed to look to the future as Cox is on the last year of his deal. They stole Nakobe Dean in the 3rd rd- and he's going to come in and start for them right away.
I loved what the Lions did in the 1st round. After that....ummm...not so much. Ojabo goes literally the pick before them in the 2nd, and they take another DE- Josh Paschal- when they needed secondary and linebacker help more than they needed another DE. I'd understand taking another DE if that DE was Ojabo- that's a big value pick once he rebounds from the injury. They should've taken Nakobe Dean or Jaquan Brisker there imo. Don't really have a problem with their 3rd rd pick- but I'd have loved to see them take David Bell from Purdue there and really build their WR corps. St. Brown, Jameson Williams, and David Bell would be a hell of a young cheap WR corps to build around for the next 4-5 years.
Atlanta's draft looks kinda bad to me. They massively reached for Drake London. He does not have the speed/quickness to be a dominant #1 WR in the NFL today.
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Lions just need to tank this year so they can get Bryce Young or CJ Stroud in 2023. I'd be happy as hell with either one. I think Stroud has a bit more NFL upside, just due to more size and better arm strength.
Pairing Will Anderson up with Aidan Hutchinson would also be incredibly enticing though.....talk about wreaking havoc on offensive lines and QB's....
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Don't know why Hutchinson slipped to #2 or why some are talking noise about him just because he didn't run an insane 40 time like Walker or Thibbedoux.
At the combine his 40 time was 4.74- which is a better time than either Bosa brother ran. His 3-cone time of 6.73 and his short shuttle time of 4.15 are the fastest times for any player over 6'4 and 250+ pounds since 2003- according to Mina Kimes of ESPN. Hutchinson is 6'7 and 260 pounds. Don't get people talking like he's not athletic or that he's maxed out lol. He's not. He's only played 2 years in college, his true freshman year he was a rotational bench warmer behind a pair of 1st rounders in Rashan Gary and Kwity Paye and a pair of 2nd rounders in Chase Winovich and Josh Uche.
He started as a sophomore and had a really nice season- then his junior year was COVID year in which he missed basically that entire season with a broken leg which required surgery. He basically started just two years in college- his sophomore and senior years- and he was productive as a sophomore in his first year as a starter with 10 TFL's and 4 sacks, and well his senior year he developed into a f**king animal. He's not a redshirt, he's a true senior that is only 21 years old and his frame could easily carry another 15-20 pounds of muscle and he's a plus athlete for the position.
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Don't know why Hutchinson slipped to #2 or why some are talking noise about him just because he didn't run an insane 40 time like Walker or Thibbedoux.
He slipped one spot, in what may have been a coin flip between two very accomplished athletes. The folks who do this for a living chose the other guy, who also is pretty good. One spot. And I've seen criticism of the choice of Walker, which is to be expected of course. Those who can do, those who can't write about it.
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The fun part is judging a draft before any of them play a down.
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As I have said before, if I had to make a living accurately predicting which college players would be good pros I would be a very poor man.
Having said that, this concept that the NFL has become a passing league has never been more obvious than this draft. I think we all understand the lack of QBs taken, but so much focus on wide receivers, edge rushers, and defensive backs and virtually little to no focus on running backs.
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Yup. I read an article that analyzed how many first rounders end up playing significantly. It was better than random of course, but it didn't speak well for talent evaluations. There will be 3-4-5 total busts in the first round, and 3-4-5 more who play some but don't reach expectations. If the "pros" can't do this well, I know I couldn't do better.
I wish good things for the former Dawgs, but with emphasis on "former" and I rarely watch pro football, or care about it. I certainly can't evaluate the draft order at this point.
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I don't doubt their talent evals, but whether or not a player is successful involves so many other things besides talent.
Rating a draft in the moment is silly, of course, because it's simply rating it compared to the consensus...nothing more. And as you said, the consensus isn't great.
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Maybe we could judge each draft 8 years down the line?
Cover the current draft, all the focus on the first 2 rounds. But for the lagging later round coverage, do a deep-dive on the draft from 8 years prior. Then it makes some sense, no?
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I'm sure they look at "intangibles" as best they can, as well as talent, durability, success in college, etc. Obviously some players are great in college and for some reason don't pan out later, and vice versa. It's a bit like the 4-5 star HS players, maybe a LOT like it.
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3 years is a fair time to judge a draft, IMO. The average career is only slightly longer than that. After 3 years, you know if you have a bust or a great one, in most cases.
Aaron Rodgers comes to mind as an exception, as he sat behind Favre for his first 3 before becoming a star. I don't think that happens much anymore though. They make too much money to sit and wait.
Steve Young didn't do much in Tampa or in SF, until Montana retired.
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I'm focusing more on the player's fit into the team....it's not like hoping your draftee is a round peg for a round hole - considering the turnover rate of players at all positions, the hole can be round, square, star-shaped, etc., and is constantly changing. The coordinators change every few years, too, so you're basically drafting a guy in the hopes that he will be able to excel in any situation, which is unlikely for any player, no matter how good.
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With all the moving parts, no one is LIKELY to succeed. But if you luck out and hit on enough guys being solid contributors and lady luck helps with the breakout players at least at the rate of chance, you might avoid "bad" drafts.
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QB is probably the one position where a great player might sit 3-4 years before getting a shot. I think a great player likely needs to have a ten year career minimum.
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3 years is a fair time to judge a draft, IMO. The average career is only slightly longer than that. After 3 years, you know if you have a bust or a great one, in most cases.
Aaron Rodgers comes to mind as an exception, as he sat behind Favre for his first 3 before becoming a star. I don't think that happens much anymore though. They make too much money to sit and wait.
Steve Young didn't do much in Tampa or in SF, until Montana retired.
But you know for a fact that each additional year you wait, your observation will be more accurate. So why the rush?
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Because the average career is NFL (not for long). 3.3 years.
(https://i.imgur.com/QrLH0Hw.png)
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But great players are not average. I'd guess the average may include a player on the scout team who makes a handful of games and quits.
A median would be a better metric I think.
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The ‘average career length is 3.5 years’ stat needs clarification : nfl (reddit.com) (https://www.reddit.com/r/nfl/comments/gqhkg9/the_average_career_length_is_35_years_stat_needs/)
If you make a roster opening day the average career is 6.1 seasons.
If you make it 3 seasons, your average is 7.9.
If you are a first round pick? 9.3.
Play in a single Pro Bowl? 11.7.
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Because the average career is NFL (not for long). 3.3 years.
[img width=500 height=387.995]https://i.imgur.com/QrLH0Hw.png[/img]
Great, so after 3 years, you'll be able to split the draftees into 2 groups: "not playing anymore" and "still playing." Really useful.
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Great, so after 3 years, you'll be able to split the draftees into 2 groups: "not playing anymore" and "still playing." Really useful.
That would require a median, not an average of data not normally distributed. This "average" is a distorted figure, not really relevant, in my view.
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That's not the point. The point is that it fails to distinguish between a backup and a pro-bowler.
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To distinguish between "still active" and "not playing any more", you need the median, not the average. The median may well be 5-6 years. I couldn't find data on it oddly enough.
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Probably because people don't know what median is.
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Great, so after 3 years, you'll be able to split the draftees into 2 groups: "not playing anymore" and "still playing." Really useful.
The median, as I said, would likely be 5-6-7 years, not 3. And in the above, you'd need the median.
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I think you do this on purpose.
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Yes, if "it" is making important distinctions clear, I do it on purpose.
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As I have said before, if I had to make a living accurately predicting which college players would be good pros I would be a very poor man.
Having said that, this concept that the NFL has become a passing league has never been more obvious than this draft. I think we all understand the lack of QBs taken, but so much focus on wide receivers, edge rushers, and defensive backs and virtually little to no focus on running backs.
yup. it's all passing now. rule changes have geared it toward offenses to the point where it's almost unfair. this was just a really bad QB draft at the top. No elite level guys. Next year we'll have two in CJ Stroud and Bryce Young. Lions get either one of those guys- man they'll be on their way.
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I don't doubt their talent evals, but whether or not a player is successful involves so many other things besides talent.
Rating a draft in the moment is silly, of course, because it's simply rating it compared to the consensus...nothing more. And as you said, the consensus isn't great.
.
Maybe we could judge each draft 8 years down the line?
Cover the current draft, all the focus on the first 2 rounds. But for the lagging later round coverage, do a deep-dive on the draft from 8 years prior. Then it makes some sense, no?
100%. Situation and coaching they go into matters just as much if not more than the players actual talent. Lot of talented players go to really bad teams and play for really bad coaches and never develop.
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3 years is a fair time to judge a draft, IMO. The average career is only slightly longer than that. After 3 years, you know if you have a bust or a great one, in most cases.
Aaron Rodgers comes to mind as an exception, as he sat behind Favre for his first 3 before becoming a star. I don't think that happens much anymore though. They make too much money to sit and wait.
Steve Young didn't do much in Tampa or in SF, until Montana retired.
agree 100%, three or four years is plenty of time to judge a draft.
while this is true of Tampa Bay- they were just the most awful team ever in the league at the time- Young had no help. In San Fransisco when Walsh threw him into games while Montana was at his peak- Young made some plays now- and Young won the league MVP award the year Montana had to sit out due to back and elbow injuries. Montana didn't retire, San Fransisco traded him to Kansas City because Young proved to be too good not to keep when he actually got to start because of Montana's injuries.
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I think you do this on purpose.
:043:
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QB is probably the one position where a great player might sit 3-4 years before getting a shot. I think a great player likely needs to have a ten year career minimum.
where does this happen? this does not happen anymore. the only time in the last 25 years or maybe longer this has happened was with Aaron Rodgers. You're talking about an extremely rare one off which was a situation that involved two of the greatest QB's ever.
NFL plays 1st rd QBs right away these days. They almost have to, considering the amount of money QB's are making now. The formula teams look for is what Seattle did, what the KC Chiefs have done, what the Bengals just did. Get a QB on a cheap rookie deal and try to get to the Super Bowl with him asap. Because once that QB gets to his second deal- you're going to have to pay him insane amounts of money to keep him.
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I'm focusing more on the player's fit into the team....it's not like hoping your draftee is a round peg for a round hole - considering the turnover rate of players at all positions, the hole can be round, square, star-shaped, etc., and is constantly changing. The coordinators change every few years, too, so you're basically drafting a guy in the hopes that he will be able to excel in any situation, which is unlikely for any player, no matter how good.
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With all the moving parts, no one is LIKELY to succeed. But if you luck out and hit on enough guys being solid contributors and lady luck helps with the breakout players at least at the rate of chance, you might avoid "bad" drafts.
this 100%. Which is probably why the teams that have stable coaching staffs with identities/schemes they stick to- even if co-ordinators change- like the Ravens or Steelers always seem to have really good players.
Injury luck always plays a huge part as well. Look at players like Andrew Luck or Jake Long or Sterling Sharpe. Those were HOF level players that put up elite seasons and had their careers just devastated by injury. Or Tom Brady...the greatest NFL player ever never happens if Drew Bledsoe doesn't nearly get killed by Mo Lewis of the Jets.
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Georgia had a whopping 15 players drafted in the 2022 NFL Draft, breaking the previous record of 14 players drafted from one school in a single draft which Ohio State (2004 draft) and LSU (2020 draft) shared.
Georgia also had 5 defensive players drafted in the 1st round, which is a record as far defensive only players go. The record for total number of players drafted in the 1st round in 6, a record shared by Miami Hurricanes (2004 NFL Draft) and Alabama (2021 NFL Draft).
Well done Georgia, well done.
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Chris Hinton of Michigan goes from 5* high school prospect to undrafted. He only started one year at Michigan- 2021 season- and he left two years of eligibility on the table to go to the NFL Draft, only to not get drafted. Should be a cautionary tale to every player....don't leave with multiple years of eligibility left on the table unless you're 100% going to get drafted.
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Browns are going to regret passing on Ojabo only to see him go to a division rival. Ravens absolutely crushed this draft.
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Chris Hinton of Michigan goes from 5* high school prospect to undrafted. He only started one year at Michigan- 2021 season- and he left two years of eligibility on the table to go to the NFL Draft, only to not get drafted. Should be a cautionary tale to every player....don't leave with multiple years of eligibility left on the table unless you're 100% going to get drafted.
I usually shrug at these. There's been a million of them. And they all happen for various reasons.
He's a perfectly nice nose tackle who doesn't rush the passer well. Is he gonna be a better prospect next season? Who knows? If he wants to be a fringy NFL player instead of a decent college starter, well, the heart wants what it wants. He shouldn't be hurting for money when it's all said and done.
(I remember watching a mid-major kid who was awesome, but would never solve being too short and too slow. He left a year early because he knew his QB would suck. Went undrafted, bounced around. Ended up earning a modest $16 mil before age 30. Gonna settle into being a solid coach when it all shakes out)
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Browns are going to regret passing on Ojabo only to see him go to a division rival. Ravens absolutely crushed this draft.
100%. Ravens crush most drafts and have a great coaching staff. But that's why the Ravens are the Ravens and always a 10+ win playoff team, and well the Browns are the Browns lol.
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I usually shrug at these. There's been a million of them. And they all happen for various reasons.
He's a perfectly nice nose tackle who doesn't rush the passer well. Is he gonna be a better prospect next season? Who knows? If he wants to be a fringy NFL player instead of a decent college starter, well, the heart wants what it wants. He shouldn't be hurting for money when it's all said and done.
(I remember watching a mid-major kid who was awesome, but would never solve being too short and too slow. He left a year early because he knew his QB would suck. Went undrafted, bounced around. Ended up earning a modest $16 mil before age 30. Gonna settle into being a solid coach when it all shakes out)
I see what you're saying. If a kid really doesn't like school or needs the money- then go. Do what makes you happy. If a player really commits themselves in college to develop and improve over 2 years- well, they obviously absolutely can. Hinton absolutely could develop his game and get better and move up draft boards. He had one year of starting on tape. That doesn't bode well for getting drafted high or at all. You see guys stick around and get better and improve and move up draft boards. It happens all the time. So what you're saying has no basis in fact or reality. Just look at Jermaine Johnson who went in the 1st rd with the Jets. He transferred to Georgia from a community college and he barely put up any #'s at Georgia- he had 6.5 sacks in 3 years there and then transferred to Florida State for his 5th year season and wound up blowing up there winning ACC defensive player of the year and recording 18 TFL's and 13 sacks and going in the 1st round. If he had left for the NFL after his junior year- he might not have ever gotten drafted.
Hinton's dad is a former high 1st round draft pick who played in the NFL for like 10-12 years, something like that. He was famously part of that John Elway trade. And I believe his Mom is a doctor. Hinton and his brothers all went to college on full ride scholarships. I'm going to bet that family isn't hurting for money.
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Browns are going to regret passing on Ojabo only to see him go to a division rival. Ravens absolutely crushed this draft.
Hope you're wrong but I don't think so.After the signing of Watson,I just gave up.Gave up way to much in talent and even more in salary for questionable character.The Browns have to win the whole thing and being highly competitve is no reason to mortgage the future. Dumping all the draft picks makes the remaining pix just that much more important. Where they traditionally haven't practiced common sense. I'm beginning to think they pass out mercury popsickles in Berea
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So what you're saying has no basis in fact or reality.
Never said it couldn't happen.
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I don't doubt their talent evals, but whether or not a player is successful involves so many other things besides talent.
Rating a draft in the moment is silly, of course, because it's simply rating it compared to the consensus...nothing more. And as you said, the consensus isn't great.
.
Maybe we could judge each draft 8 years down the line?
Cover the current draft, all the focus on the first 2 rounds. But for the lagging later round coverage, do a deep-dive on the draft from 8 years prior. Then it makes some sense, no?
These are both excellent pieces of content. The second is more useful, but sports fans really want the first, and thus. someone provides it.
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I doubt my picks would be superior to those paid to do this and who have experience and a wealth of information I lack, except by chance.
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I doubt my picks would be superior to those paid to do this and who have experience and a wealth of information I lack, except by chance.
So many factors go into whether or not an NFL player succeeds. Coaching and scheme fit. Injury luck. And a lot of it I think is maturity and character of a person. It's impossible to predict how young guys in their early 20s who have nothing become millionaires and local celebrities overnight in whatever cities they get drafted to will handle that. Some of them ace that test, others....not so much. Look at Jamarcus Russell or Henry Ruggs. They got millions of dollars and went wild.
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And yet fans persist in complaining about various draft choices, as if they know better.
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the draft is very similar to recruit signing day
although not as many college fans complain about signing day choices
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the draft is very similar to recruit signing day
although not as many college fans complain about signing day choices
similar but different in that Nick Saban or Urban Meyer or Kirby Smart basically pick who they want- where in NFL- you have to take who falls to you or who you can trade up for.
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true
but the success rate of players is similar
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similar but different in that Nick Saban or Urban Meyer or Kirby Smart basically pick who they want- where in NFL- you have to take who falls to you or who you can trade up for.
No the 5* talent all have options,specially if they are choosing between the top3-4 progams.And dabo's watching so he'll have your head for that
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I THINK 5 stars are more successful than first rounders, by some degree, this is an impression, perhaps because first round busts are more obvious.
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because too many QBs are first rounders
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Oh yeah, I think that is a major part of my thesis. The 5 star QBS in college nearly always do really well.
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[img width=811.6 height=830 alt=May be an image of text that says 'Tweet PICKSIX SIX PICK Pick Six Previews @PickSixPreviews PREVIEWS The Dakota's Big Three (North Dakota State, SoDak State, North Dakota) had the same amount of draft picks as Florida's Big Three (UF, FSU, Miami) 6:22 PM. 4/30/22 Twitter Web App 104 Retweets 25 Quote Tweets 433 Likes']https://scontent.fapa1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/279577082_1511711922564509_7182238212381627735_n.jpg?stp=dst-jpg_p843x403&_nc_cat=106&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=5cd70e&_nc_ohc=hcB11PCyR4YAX-17vy6&_nc_ht=scontent.fapa1-1.fna&oh=00_AT-LvKEliLxrazlUhsAQGtULdTjre2b-akwM1-T1EVyTbA&oe=62767576[/img]
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I doubt my picks would be superior to those paid to do this and who have experience and a wealth of information I lack, except by chance.
It's not about this.
An NFL GM can do everything right - pick the best value guys who make sense and have no red flags, etc....and the players still don't succeed. THAT is the point.
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OK, players don't gel as expected, I think that is what I'm saying. It's a bit of a crap shoot, ergo, I don't think MY picks would be superior to the actual picks.