CFB51 College Football Fan Community
The Power Five => SEC => Topic started by: OrangeAfroMan on January 05, 2021, 01:28:08 PM
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Still, 28 years into the thing, there have only been 6 different schools to win the SEC Championship game. They are the "haves": Bama, Barn, Florida, UGA, Tennessee, and LSU.
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Whether it's in 2021 or 2051, which of the other 8 "have-nots" will win the SEC in football?
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With Tennessee's problems the last 20 years I have a hard time considering them a have.
Getting back to the original question, A&M is the only one you listed that has a snowball's chance at a SEC title. A&M and Fisher are actually building a power down there and are replete with players that Bama would like to have. Jaylon Jones is a Patrick Peterson level talent at db. Bobby Brown and McKinley Jackson are the best pair of defensive tackles in the league. Mond is a winner at qb and Spiller is a very good rb. Nobody else that you listed has players like this.
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With Tennessee's problems the last 20 years I have a hard time considering them a have.
Getting back to the original question, A&M is the only one you listed that has a snowball's chance at a SEC title. A&M and Fisher are actually building a power down there and are replete with players that Bama would like to have. Jaylon Jones is a Patrick Peterson level talent at db. Bobby Brown and McKinley Jackson are the best pair of defensive tackles in the league. Mond is a winner at qb and Spiller is a very good rb. Nobody else that you listed has players like this.
Hey, easy now …...
It is A&M by the widest of margins.
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I agree.
Why do the "have nots" even bother?
Take Kentucky. A founding member of the SEC, since 1933. Was in the precursor to the SEC as well (Southern Conf). The Wildcats have ONE conference title (1950). One. In 87 years of football. One conference title. What are they doing?
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Mississippi State? You have to go back even further for their ONLY SEC championship (1941). One.
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Ole Miss has SIX! Wow, six, that's great. Except that they have none since 1963. 57 years with nothing to celebrate. 57 "We'll get 'em next years".
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The newbies (Mizzou and A&M) have an excuse. The relative newbies' (Carolina, Arkansas) excuses are fleeting. The Cocks aren't just a have-not in the SEC, but they're also playing "little brother" to their in-state rival. Mizzou came in and BAM, went to Atlanta TWICE in their first 3 years in the SEC. But they've fallen back down to earth. They haven't had to worry about visiting Atlanta since.
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Vanderbilt has never, and I'll predict - will never, win the SEC. They made the mistake of being great 20 years before the SEC existed. The 'Dores were good when the Ivy League was crowning national champions every year, lol. Why do they bother?
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Of course, circa 1990, the same could be said for Florida. Not really, because 1984 happened, but still. I'm not ragging on these programs, I'm earnestly asking what their plans are. What are they doing, honestly?
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Anyway, the more I see the chasm growing between P5 and G5 programs, the more it's revealed that there may be a larger chasm between the 'haves' and the 'have nots' among football programs. I know there are other sports, but football carries the checkbook for entire athletic programs (some, not all).
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I'm just rambling. But imagine all of the haves of the sport to separate from their dead-weight conference brethren. Wouldn't that be something?
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From SEC...
Out: Kentucky, Vanderbilt, Miss State
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From B1G...
Out: Purdue, Indiana, Rutgers
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From ACC...
Out: Virginia, GA Tech, Wake Forest
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From Big XII...
Out: Iowa State, Kansas State, Kansas
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From the PAC...
Out: Oregon State, Washington State, Arizona
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Is there a more amazing fact than Virginia never having won an ACC championship???
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Anyway, if the P5 conferences trimmed the fat, you could get it down to about 50 football programs that make football a priority, have shown some ability to have successful seasons, and they could just face each other.
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The problem you are having and a lot of this weeping and gnashing of teeth about only three or four teams get to play for the NC every year is there are other things of importance that schools play for. Vanderbilt obviously will never play for a championship but the elation for beating Tennessee is immeasurable. There are about 10 teams in the Big 10 that will never play for the title, but they have their Oaken Buckets and Paul Bunyan Axes to celebrate plus they can beat Ohio about once in every 20 years. Those are causes for celebration as are the rare times an Ole Miss or a South Carolina beats Alabama. I think the idea that a school has to play for championships for meaning is over blown.
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True.
But also, in a world of only "haves," a new class of "have nots" would be born. The scope of that world would just be smaller.
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From SEC...
Out: Kentucky, Vanderbilt, Miss State
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From B1G...
Out: Purdue, Indiana, Rutgers
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From ACC...
Out: Virginia, GA Tech, Wake Forest
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From Big XII...
Out: Iowa State, Kansas State, Kansas
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From the PAC...
Out: Oregon State, Washington State, Arizona
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Is there a more amazing fact than Virginia never having won an ACC championship???
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Anyway, if the P5 conferences trimmed the fat, you could get it down to about 50 football programs that make football a priority, have shown some ability to have successful seasons, and they could just face each other.
Are you sure on Virginia?
Tennessee played them in the 1990 Sugar Bowl (when that meant something), and they had a bad ass QB at the time. Maybe Shawn Moore.
I can't think of another ACC team that would have been better that year, but I didn't look it up admittedly.
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They lost their last 3 games that year. The Cavaliers were #1 on Nov 3rd, and lost to GT.
Clemson was the ACC bully on the block in the late 80s, pre-FSU.
UVA did share the ACC title with Duke in Spurrier's last year in Durham.
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They lost their last 3 games that year. The Cavaliers were #1 on Nov 3rd, and lost to GT.
Clemson was the ACC bully on the block in the late 90s, pre-FSU.
UVA did share the ACC title with Duke in Spurrier's last year in Durham.
Cool, thanks.
Weird how you could lose 3 straight back then and still make the Sugar Bowl. Or 2 straight plus the bowl game.
On a side note … those 1990 old school uni's were far superior to their new navy blue with crossed swords on the helmet. They should go back to that.
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Cool, thanks.
Weird how you could lose 3 straight back then and still make the Sugar Bowl. Or 2 straight plus the bowl game.
On a side note … those 1990 old school uni's were far superior to their new navy blue with crossed swords on the helmet. They should go back to that.
I think it was still before conference tie-ins and bowl games chose teams before the end of the regular season. Logistics were slow back then? Idk.
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sans aTm no one else will ever win it
the sec problem is unique to that league in that there are too many powers.
in the big xii for ex if tx and ou are down it’s anybody’s game
same in the pac with sc
acc with clemson fsu and mia
big ten w/ mich ohst
for mizzou let’s say, fla, ga, au, ua, lsu, and tenn will never all be down at the same time and the league will always produce at least one playoff caliber power, it’s too deep not too
but as previously stated that doesn’t mean you don’t try as there are other meaningful things to attain. the charm of cfb is all it’s quirks and regional squabbles.
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i was a kid but i remember that uva team and watching the gtech game you mentioned
that was the yr gtech ended up sharing it with cu after the rocket hold in the orange bowl iirc
they used to make those bowl arrangements some times 2-3 weeks before the season ended
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Arkansas has been a power in the past, well, so has Ole Miss if we go back another decade from Arky. Missouri has had strong teams. I almost never say "Never", but I'd say that about Vandy. I would be quite surprised if Ole Miss or Miss State got to the CG, same with USCe and UK in my lifetime. I wonder if Tenn would make it back.
I hope that is a lot of years yet.
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Arkansas has been a power in the past, well, so has Ole Miss if we go back another decade from Arky. Missouri has had strong teams. I almost never say "Never", but I'd say that about Vandy. I would be quite surprised if Ole Miss or Miss State got to the CG, same with USCe and UK in my lifetime. I wonder if Tenn would make it back.
I hope that is a lot of years yet.
Miss State got there in 1998, and lost by 10 to #1 Tennessee.
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Carolina did, too, under Spurrier in 2010. Got waxed by Auburn and Cam Newton.
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SECCG by appearances (1992-2020):
13 - Alabama, Florida
8 - Georgia
6 - LSU, Auburn
5 - Tennessee
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3 - Arkansas
2 - Missouri
1 - Miss State, S.Carolina
0 - Vanderbilt, Kentucky, Ole Miss, Texas A&M
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Why did I put a line there?
Above the line, every program has at least 2 wins (SEC Championships)
Below the line, every program is winless
So while the Hogs have been there 3 times, they were held to a FG twice (didn't compete). In all the games by the have-nots (6 in total), none have come within 10 points of a win (and 3 have been massive blowouts).
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I'd still be surprised if any of those teams got to the CG in my lifetime, whether they've been before or not.
Surprises do happen of course.
The West at the moment is like the B1G East, it's hard to see any of the "down programs" getting there because they likely need Bama/LSU/Auburn ALL to be down (8-4ish).
And that has to pair with Arky or someone being "up" I think A&M obviously can make it.
In the East, it's not as tough if you consider UGA/UF have to slide to make room coupled with someone having a solid year and winning the right games.
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Yeah, I mean Carolina went 11-2 for three straight years, and all they got was 1 appearance in Atlanta and a blowout loss there.
Kentucky has just had a 50-year peak and wasn't close to winning the East.
Vanderbilt is utterly, literally irrelevant.
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Mississippi is not big enough, population-wise, to support 2 successful P5 football programs.
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I'd still be surprised if any of those teams got to the CG in my lifetime, whether they've been before or not.
Surprises do happen of course.
The West at the moment is like the B1G East, it's hard to see any of the "down programs" getting there because they likely need Bama/LSU/Auburn ALL to be down (8-4ish).
And that has to pair with Arky or someone being "up" I think A&M obviously can make it.
In the East, it's not as tough if you consider UGA/UF have to slide to make room coupled with someone having a solid year and winning the right games.
LOL. Not much different over here, are you?
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Yeah, I should have made the point more clearly.
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Cool, thanks.
Weird how you could lose 3 straight back then and still make the Sugar Bowl. Or 2 straight plus the bowl game.
On a side note … those 1990 old school uni's were far superior to their new navy blue with crossed swords on the helmet. They should go back to that.
Including the Bowl game, UVA lost 3 of their last four games. After a 3 point loss to GT (eventual co-NC), they won at UNC, lost at home to Maryland, and at VT. They may have gotten a pass from the Sugar Bowl because they played those last two games without Shawn Moore, who was still leading the nation in passing efficiency after the UNC win.
I do remember that, in 1990, a school had to have completed their season before accepting a Bowl bid.
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It's interesting that Missouri stepped in and quickly won the East twice. Obviously any time the normal powers are down, one of these programs can have a pretty good year and win it. Something that happened twice in fairly recent memory seems likely to happen again one of these days, but not soonish.
Has a four loss (reg season) team made a "major bowl game"? Probably someone won a conference like that back in the day?
1999 was a down year for the Pac-10, with almost every team finishing 7-5 or worse. The Stanford Cardinal were the clear champions, going 7-1 in conference and earning a berth in the Rose Bowl.They didn’t fare so well out of conference, though, getting routed 69-17 by Texas to start the year and losing to 3-7-1 San Jose State to follow up.Stanford put up a fight against Wisconsin in the Rose Bowl, holding them to a mere 17 points, but ended up losing 17-9.Answered my own question, they were 8-4 going to the Rose Bowl.
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UConn was 8-4 when they won the Big East, and made it to the 2011 Fiesta Bowl.
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In 1979, UGA lost four nonconference games but was 5-0 in conference play going into a game with Auburn. Had they won that, they would have been picked for the Sugar Bowl with possibly a 7-4 record. They lost to four ACC teams, three of them in Athens.
Alabama was undefeated but would not have been selected because they had been the previous year.
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It seems we agree basically.
Vandy - no chance on a century unless something massive changed
Ole Miss, UK - they might win it in 30 years, probably likely neither of them will
Arkansas MSU- a bit more likely with the right coach
A&M - reasonably likely to win the West in the next 10-15 years.
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In 1979, UGA lost four nonconference games but was 5-0 in conference play going into a game with Auburn. Had they won that, they would have been picked for the Sugar Bowl with possibly a 7-4 record. They lost to four ACC teams, three of them in Athens.
Alabama was undefeated but would not have been selected because they had been the previous year.
The 'no repeat' rule back in the day was asinine.
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The 'no repeat' rule back in the day was asinine.
A lot of rules back in the day were "odd" when it comes to bowl games.
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In 1979, UGA lost four nonconference games but was 5-0 in conference play going into a game with Auburn. Had they won that, they would have been picked for the Sugar Bowl with possibly a 7-4 record. They lost to four ACC teams, three of them in Athens.
Alabama was undefeated but would not have been selected because they had been the previous year.
HUH!? The SEC has never had a "no repeat" rule. 1979 Bama played in the Sugar Bowl. As did 1978 Bama. As did 1977 Bama.
And 1980 Bama would have played UGA in the Sugar Bowl had they beaten ND. Sugar Bowl committee was at their game in Birmingham to extend an invitation to the winner. ND won 7-0.
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Maybe he's just been telling himself that for the past 50 years? lol
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My recollection is they would have been eligible and preferred over Bama because of the repeat thing, not that there was some no repeat rule per se.
It was a topic of discussion before the Auburn game as to whether UGA would have been picked, or forced to be picked, because they would have been 6-0 in conference play.
About Them Dawgs! Blawg: Win Over Rebs Stopped Bleeding (patrickgarbin.blogspot.com) (http://patrickgarbin.blogspot.com/2011/09/win-over-rebs-stopped-bleeding.html)
A week later, Georgia upset touchdown-favorite LSU in Athens and, only a month later, the Bulldogs found themselves where they had been a year before during their banner season: just one game shy of an SEC championship and a trip to the Sugar Bowl.
The "rule" was in case of a tie, the team selected would have been selected longer in the past than the other. I recall discussion that UGA should turn it down with a 7-4 record anyway.