CFB51 College Football Fan Community
The Power Five => Big Ten => Topic started by: medinabuckeye1 on November 22, 2020, 03:19:20 AM
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Link to last week's results (https://www.cfb51.com/big-ten/b1g-power-rankings-week-4-18674/).
Votes through @SFBadger96 (https://www.cfb51.com/index.php?action=profile;u=51) , 15 voters:
(https://i.imgur.com/dnIGgA8.png)
Drop the high and low:
(https://i.imgur.com/BzxDaB1.png)
Graphic of rankings so far this year:
(https://i.imgur.com/RebzJGZ.jpg)
Vote distribution:
(https://i.imgur.com/Wi9rGFp.jpg)
COTY/Hot Seat Chart:
(https://i.imgur.com/rnFRESC.jpg)
Schedule/Performance Chart:
(https://i.imgur.com/EwdhWeu.png)
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1. OSU: I was all prepared to put Wiscy up here and then...So, OSU. Clearly a real struggle defending the pass. They didn't get a ton of pressure up front, and they got beat in various ways on the back end. While they won't magically get grizzled vets back there, they will hopefully clean up the big busts back there and make it more difficult. Otherwise, pretty good - ran for 300 and pass for 300. Run defense was stout. They ain't perfect but they ain't bad.
2. Northwestern: If OSU is the Death Star, then Northwestern is the...I dunno, what is the superweapon equivalent to a python? They look to be barely moving and by the end you have suffocated and now you are dead. Whatever it is, they are back, and with a pretty easy schedule remaining it would be really surprising if we don't already have the B1G championship set.
3. Indiana: Penix is awesome and so is Fryfogle.
4. Wisconsin: The knock on them coming in was their lack of skill players on offense. Could they make some plays against a good defense? This week - no. A tough schedule left, too, with Minny, Indiana, and Iowa.
5. Iowa: Another Iowa style buttkicking, where they win by 20 while getting 250 yards of offense. This is a good team, and it's too bad they dropped a couple close ones early or they would be in the mix.
6. Purdue: Slipping into best of the rest territory. The defense let them down against Minnesota, spoiling a night of getting close to 500 yards of offense.
7. Maryland: Man I'm just guessing at this point.
8. Illinois: Kicked Nebraska's butt, maybe found an identity on offense?
9. Minnesota: Might be on the upswing again.
10. Michigan: Not sure what to make of 3 OT's against Rutgers.
11. Penn State: Best thing about 0-5 is the chance to go 0-6.
12. Rutgers: They got spunk, at least.
13. Nebraska: I mean, what the hell.
14. MSU: blech
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1. Ohio State
2. Northwestern
3. Wisconsin
4. Indiana
5. Iowa
6. Purdue
7. Minnesota
8. Maryland
9. Illinois
10. Michigan
11. Michigan State
12. Rutgers
13. Nebraska
14. Penn State
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1. OSU
Until they lose, OSU will always be number 1.
2. NW
NW is a really good team that fools you into thinking they are not very good. They have an elite defense. They are the Best in the West without a doubt.
3. Iowa
Iowa has been winning with defense and the running game, but not sure if Iowa's QB has what it takes to win the next time Iowa is in a close game.
4. Indy
This may seem a little harsh for a team that just lost to OSU by only 7 points but Indiana's resume for the other teams they have beaten keeps getting worse.
5. Wiscy
Was disappointed in their effort against NW. 2 wins are against bad teams.
6. Purdue
Going to cut Purdue some slack after slipping up against Minny. They are a decent team.
7. MD
8. Minny
9. ILL
10. Neb
11. PSU
12. Mich
13. Rut
14. MSU
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1. Ohio State
2. Indiana
3. Northwestern
4. Maryland
5. Wisconsin
6. Iowa
7. Purdue
8. Michigan
9. Illinois
10. Rutgers
11. Minnesota
12. Michigan State
13. Penn State
14. Nebraska
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1. OSU: I was all prepared to put Wiscy up here and then...So, OSU. Clearly a real struggle defending the pass. They didn't get a ton of pressure up front, and they got beat in various ways on the back end. While they won't magically get grizzled vets back there, they will hopefully clean up the big busts back there and make it more difficult. Otherwise, pretty good - ran for 300 and pass for 300. Run defense was stout. They ain't perfect but they ain't bad.
As a poster on another sight said losing Riep and Wint(charged with rape)and Brendan White and Isaiah Pryor(transfers) leaves the DB ranks thin.Not sour apples but the D-Line were getting handcuffed.Even the posters on an MSU board said it.But Penix just might be the best QB in the BIG
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1. Northwestern
2. Ohio State
3. Indiana
4. Wisconsin
5. Iowa
6. Purdue
7. Illinois
8. Maryland
9. Michigan State
10. Michigan
11. Rutgers
12. Nebraska
13. Minnesota
14. Penn State
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1 Ohio State - Not quite clicking like last year. Bit of a 2015 vibe.
2 Northwestern - double digit win over primary challenger in the B1G West.
3 Indiana - came within 1 TD of the elusive OSU/PSU/M hat trick.
4 Wisconsin - they didn't duck Northwestern, and got goosed.
5 Iowa - 2 losses by a combined 5 points, then a lot of ass kicking after that.
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Everyone else sucks
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6 Penn State - they have three cupcakes to fatten up on down the stretch.
7 Minnesota - Beat Purdue and Illinois over the last three weeks.
8 Purdue - Once a contender, now a pretender.
9 Illinois - Lovie just went out there and pulled Frost's pants down.
10 Nebraska - At least they're not the Wolverines.
11 Michigan - Needed triple OT to beat Rutgers.
12 RutgerS - They'll scalp another team or two down the stretch.
13 Michigan tate - Lost their last two games by a combined 73-7, and also relinquisted their S to Rutgers.
n/a Maryland - still hiding under their shell.
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The Good
1) Ohio State
2) Northwestern: That defense is legit
3) Indiana: I wasn't sure about them before OSU game, but they belong
4) Wisconsin
In Limbo
5) Iowa: QB play prevents them from moving into the top tier
A grab bag of Meh
These 4 are pretty interchangeable
6) Purdue
7) Penn State
8) Minnesota
9) Illinois
404 Error Not Found
10) Maryland: I guess?
Oof
11) Michigan
12) Rutgers
13) Nebraska: 1-7 staring them in the face
WTF
14) MSU: I think Nebraska would beat them by 17 points
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1. Ohio St.
2.Northwestern
3. Indiana
4. Wisconsin
5. Iowa
6. Purdue
7. Minnesota
8. Maryland
9. Illinois
10. Michigan
11. Rutgers
12. Nebraska
13. Michigan St.
14. Penn St.
Northwestern and Indiana could be switched. I moved Iowa up one because Purdue faltered, but Purdue was just a stiff-arm away from defeating Minnesota. Purdue has a better record than Minnesota, so I ranked Purdue ahead of Minnesota.
We all have a bad year once in a while, but it is difficult to understand how the bottom 3 could each have a bad year the same year.
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1. Ohio State- not as dominate this week but still won
2. Northwestern- defense does win championships
3. Indiana- top QB in the conference
4. Iowa- starting to play normal football for Iowa
5. Wisconsin looked like they played a tough team without all their pieces
6. Minnesota- a win is a win and each team got a weak PI called 1 led to a TD 1 did not
7. Maryland- COVID year
8. Illinois- getting healthy
9. Purdue- cannot have all the calls go their way
10. Michigan- toughed one out
11. Michigan State- a break in the season
12. Nebraska-Is it getting cold there for Frost
13. Rutgers- improving but not this year
14. Penn State- is it time for a new Coach?
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1) Ohio State
2) Indiana
3) Northwestern
4) Wisconsin
5) Iowa
6) Purdue
7) Maryland
8) Minnesota
9) Illinois
10) Michigan State
11) Michigan
12) Nebraska
13) Penn State
14) Rutgers
I really have no idea how to properly Power Rank the Big Ten. OSU, NW and IU seem to have separated themselves, Wisky and IA have been keeping pace, and then there's the rabble.
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1. Ohio State - Fields looked human but the run game kicked in. The defense played well in the first half, but as has been the case this year, they took their foot off of the gas in the 2nd half. I don't know what it is about this team, but they have yet to put a full game together. But I will concede that they do have issues in the secondary. They need to look at different ways of getting pressure on the QB so they can't sit there and pick them apart.
2. Northwestern - We've always known they play good defense, but with Peyton Ramsey at QB, their offense isn't the dumpster fire that it was a year ago.
3. Indiana - The Hoosiers are going to be a team to be reckoned with while Tom Allen is coaching. If they can continue or even improve their recruiting, they can be a major boost to the conference strength.
4. Wisconsin - Still a very good defense, but looked out of sorts on Offense. NW had the Mertz looking confused at times and making mistakes that he had not made so far. Also if I am correct, they were still missing some major pieces to their team.
5. Iowa - If only the Hawkeyes had managed to win their first two games, we would probably talking about them winning the West. They are looking very good right now and probably playing as well as anyone in the B1G.
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I have no idea how to rate any of the teams below here.
6. Purdue - Probably the best of this group. I didn't get to see the game, but I saw the phantom OPI that took away the winning TD catch. They were the latest victim of B1G officiating.
7. Maryland - Hopefully they get to play this weekend to see if they are deserving of my ranking.
8. Michigan - Beat Rutgers but took 3OTs to do it. But they might have finally found their QB.
9. Illinois - With Peters back at QB their offense suddenly looks competent.
10. Rutgers - A big improvement so far under Schiano. Could have beaten the Wolverines had Harbaugh not awakened from his month long daze and realized that Milton was killing them.
11. Minnesota - At least they got the W even thought it appears to be tainted.
12. Michigan State - I don't think they could beat any team above them on a neutral field now.
13. Nebraska - Not good.
14. Penn State - This team just flat out quit. They are mailing it in right now.
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- Ohio State
- Wisconsin
- Northwestern
- Indiana
- Iowa
- Maryland
- Purdue
- Michigan
- Illinois
- Rutgers
- Minnesota
- Nebraska
- Penn State
- Michigan State
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Not my rankings, just for information:
Relative performance against opponents:
Notes:
- I use raw score except that any game decided in OT is considered closer than any game decided in regulation (ie, winning by one point in regulation is a "bigger" win than winning by eight in OT).
- The opponents of the eight teams that have played five opponents (IU, M, RU, PSU, NU, IA, MN, IL) are rated 1-2-3-4-5 with ties treated as half of each (ie, if two teams are tied for the best performance they each get 1.5).
- The opponents of the four teams that have played four opponents (tOSU, MSU, PU, UNL) are rated 1.5-2.5-3.5-4.5 on the theory that IF that opponent had played five, this is the average of the two possible outcomes.
- The opponents of the two teams that have played three opponents (UW, UMD) are rated 2-3-4 on the theory that IF that opponent had played five, this is the average of the three possible outcomes.
Average of 1.60:
- Iowa: First of five (1) against NU,MN, and PSU. First of four (1.5) against MSU. Third of four (3.5) against PU.
Average of 1.63:
- Ohio State: First of five (1) against IU and RU. First of four (1.5) against UNL. Third of five (3) against PSU.
Average of 2:
- Wisconsin: First of five (1) against M and IL. Fourth of five (4) against NU.
Average of 2.20:
- Northwestern: First of four (1.5) against PU. First of three (2) against UW and UMD. Second of five against IA. Third of five (3.5) against UNL.
Average of 2.50:
- Purdue: First of five (1) against IA. Second of five (2) against NU. Third of five (3) against IL. Fourth of five (4) against MN.
Average of 2.60:
- Indiana: First of four (1.5) against tOSU. Second of five (2) against M and RU. Second of four (2.5) against MSU. Last of five (5) against PSU.
Average of 3.10:
- Minnesota: Second of five (2) against IL. Second of four (2.5) against PU. Second of three (3) against UMD. Third of five (3) against IA. Last of five (5) against M.
Average of 3.33:
- Maryland: Second of five (2) against PSU. Third of five (3) against MN. Last of five (5) against NU.
Average of 3.40:
- Penn State: Second of five (2) against IU. Second of four (2.5) against tOSU. Fourth of five (4) against IA. Last of three (4) against UMD. Last of four (4.5) against UNL.
Average of 3.60:
- Michigan: Second of five (2) against MN. Tied for 2nd/3rd of three (3.5) against UW. Fourth of five (4) against IU and RU. Last of four (4.5) against MSU.
- Rutgers: Third of five (3) against IU. Third of four (3.5) against MSU and tOSU. Fourth of five (4) against M and IL.
Average of 3.70:
- Illinois: Second of four (2.5) against UNL. Third of five (3) against RU. Tied for 2nd/3rd of three (3.5) against UW. Last of four (4.5) against PU.
Average of 4.13:
- Nebraska: Third of five (3) against NU. Fourth of five (4) against PSU. Last of four (4.5) against tOSU. Last of five (5) against IL.
Average of 4.50:
- Michigan State: Third of five (3) against M. Last of five (5) against IU, IA, RU.
So if you ranked by this it would be:
- 1.60 Iowa
- 1.63 Ohio State
- 2.00 Wisconsin
- 2.20 Northwestern
- 2.50 Purdue
- 2.60 Indiana
- 3.10 Minnesota
- 3.33 Maryland
- 3.40 Penn State
- 3.60 (tie) Michigan
- 3.60 (tie) Rutgers
- 3.70 Illinois
- 4.13 Nebraska
- 4.50 Michigan State
It is astounding to me that #9 PSU, #10 M, #13 UNL, and #14 MSU can all be this bad simultaneously.
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Average of 3.40:
- Penn State: Second of five (2) against IU. Second of four (2.5) against tOSU. Fourth of five (4) against IA. Last of three (4) against UMD. Last of four (4.5) against UNL.
I still say something happened with this team between the tOSU loss and the UMD loss.
The first two performances are not bad at all. They are losses, but to good teams. Their loss to IU was bettered only by tOSU's win over IU and their loss to tOSU was bettered only by IU's loss to tOSU.
The three performances since then are dreadful. Their loss to IA was better only than MSU's loss to IA and they have the worst performances of the year against UMD and UNL.
What happened?
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- Ohio State: This spot changed hands twice over the weekend and ended up right back where it started. Right about 3pm the Buckeyes were up 4 TD's on IU and I was confident that I would have them in this spot. Over the next roughly 25 minutes of game-time in Columbus I was thoroughly unimpressed with the Buckeyes as they got outscored 28-7 by the Hoosiers and I was confident that I would have Wisconsin in this spot. Then Wisconsin accepted the kickoff in Ryan Field and four hours later I was back to having Ohio State in this spot.
- Northwestern: This is a tough call for me between the Wildcats, Badgers, and Hawkeyes but the Cats are 2-0 against those other two so they get #2. They have a case for #1. Their five opponents are better than Ohio State's four and their 10 point win over Wisconsin is impressive. I kept them below the Buckeyes due to their one-possession wins over PU, IA, and UNL.
- Wisconsin: It is close between the Badgers and Hawkeyes but I think the Hawkeyes are going to have to beat the Badgers to take #3 from them.
- Iowa: Their two losses came by five combined points in the first two weeks of the season. Since then they have three blowout wins.
- Indiana: I would have put Purdue here but losing to MN is not a good way to move up in my rankings and the Hoosiers never gave up and put up a hell of a fight in Columbus. When they got down 35-7 it would have been easy to fall apart, they didn't.
- Purdue: Although with that loss to MN they are on notice . . .
- Maryland: Mostly because of the H2H blowout of
- Penn State: As noted above, this team is Jeckyll and Hyde. Their first-two weeks performance would have them at #3 or 4. Their last three weeks would have them at #12 or 13.
- Minnesota: The early blowout loss to M is still holding them back. If they show some fight against UW this weekend I'll move them up.
- Michigan: I think that the MSU loss is just an outlier. Their other two losses at least were to good teams.
- Illinois: I don't know what to do with this team. Great win over UNL and they also beat Rutgers but they got blown out by UW (not a big deal) and Minnesota (a big deal).
- Rutgers: Close losses to the two teams directly ahead of them in these rankings hurt a lot.
- Nebraska: I can't believe I have them this low.
- Michigan State: I can't believe how bad they are.
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Nebraska: I can't believe I have them this low.
I can't believe they suck this badly
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I remember this....
- 7 Maryland: Mostly because of the H2H blowout of
- 8 Penn State:
But not this...
- 10 Michigan: Here because they beat
- 11 Illinois:
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What a tough year to rate the BIG. There is a lot of team A beat B who beat C who beat D who beat A. I think it is very evident how much OOC games matter.
1. OSU - Still the clear #1 but the margin seems to be narrowing. They need to stop taking a nap in the 2nd half if their goal is the CFP because those teams are not as likely to give them a three or four touchdown lead by halftime.
2. NU - Continues to prove themselves, especially as Ramsey gets more comfortable in the offense. The defense is legit.
3. IU - going from overrated to wow, almost! Penix has a case for POY and Allen has a case for COY.
4. Wisconsin - Almost by default because of a lack of confidence in the rest of the league. Will they be eligible for post season?
5. Iowa - Like above, mostly by default. Dominated last three weeks over teams with a combined 3-9 record with biggest...most impressive...no adjective works...wins over a struggling Michigan and controversial win over Purdue. I bet they wish they could have the 1st two games back.
6. Maryland - Remaining team with a winning record.
7. Purdue - Getting a little credit for a potentially bad call on the road.
8. Minnesota - Caught a break but were in the position that it was needed to win.
9. Michigan - Needed 3OT's to beat possibly the most improved team in the league. Let's see what the QB change will do.
10. ILL - Potentially could beat most of the bottom half but also can get blown out. Not sure which team will show.
11. Rutgers - The W/L record will not show but Schiano is working miracles.
12. UNL - Is Frost on the hot seat or is he getting the 2020 pass?
13. MSU - Only because they do have one win.
14. PSU - 0-5. Overall they may be somewhere slightly above but I can't put them ahead of someone with at least one BIG win.
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I remember this....
But not this...
Oops, my bad. I originally had them right ahead of Rutgers (whom they did beat) but ended up rearranging things and never went back to fix that until now.
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n/a Maryland - still hiding under their shell.
I'm not going to try to change your mind about dirtbaggery in the athletic department at Maryland. But FYI, the university's assessmentas of late last week, per the Washington Post is "Nearly a quarter of the Terps’ roster is in that 21-day process."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2020/11/20/maryland-football-outbreak-schedule/
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I don't really think any team has ducked an opponent in the Big Ten using COVID as the excuse
It's obviously possible, but I hope that wouldn't be the case
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1) OSU: but not as convincing down the stretch as I thought the Buckeyes would be.
2) Northwestern: tough defense.
3) Indiana: didn't quit against OSU.
4) Wisconsin: Ryan Field remains an unusual house of horrors.
5) Iowa: looks like Iowa.
6) Purdue: on the strength of better performances against the better teams?
7) Maryland: not punishing it for not playing.
8) Michigan State: also not punished for not playing
9) Minnesota: wins are good, and against a team I have ranked higher.
10) Illinois: wins are good.
11) Michigan: not a good sign to need triple OT against Rutgers.
12) Nebraska: losses to Illinois are bad.
13) Rutgers: Rutgers.
14) Penn State: can Penn State really be this bad? Will have to start winning to prove it isn't.
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I'm not going to try to change your mind about dirtbaggery in the athletic department at Maryland. But FYI, the university's assessmentas of late last week, per the Washington Post is "Nearly a quarter of the Terps’ roster is in that 21-day process."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2020/11/20/maryland-football-outbreak-schedule/
I'm not definitively accusing anyone of ducking. It is all just good natured message board ribbing. It could happen to anyone. I'm just glad that there is a season.
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8) Michigan State: also not punished for not playing
13. MSU - Only because they do have one win.
12. Michigan State - I don't think they could beat any team above them on a neutral field now.
10) Michigan State
11. Michigan State- a break in the season
13. Michigan St.
9. Michigan State
12. Michigan State
11. Michigan State
I want to preface this by saying that I'm not an MSU hater. I wish they weren't as bad as they are. That said, they aren't just bad, they are horrible. My question is WTF are you guys seeing in them to rank them ahead of ANY other team let alone multiple teams?
Their games, chronologically:
- They lost by 11 at home to Rutgers: In Rutgers' other four games they lost in OT, lost by a FG, lost by 16, and lost by 22. This is, by far, the worst performance of the year against RU, worse than tOSU, IU, M, and IL.
- They won by a FG in Ann Arbor:
- They lost by 42 in Iowa City: In Iowa's other four games they won by 28 and 20 and lost by 1 and 4. This is, by far, the worst performance of the year against Iowa, worse than PU, NU, PSU, and MN.
- They got shutout 24-0 at home by Indiana: In Indiana's other four games they lost by a TD, won in OT, won by 16, and won by 17. This is the worst performance of the year against IU, worse than tOSU, PSU, RU, and M.
The Michigan game is clearly an outlier but even there, that performance against Michigan is only better than MN and RU. It is still worse than UW and IU.
What are you guys seeing that makes you think they are better than any other B1G team?
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I just watched the Husker's performance vs Illinois
and Penn State is O-for
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Could you imagine the SEC like this? It would be like having LSU, Tennessee, and Auburn all being bad.
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1) OSU: but not as convincing down the stretch as I thought the Buckeyes would be.
I'm still processing what I saw on Saturday. I was so disappointed by the end of the game that:
- You would have thought my team lost, and
- You would be forgiven for forgetting that my team had a four TD lead on a top-10 opponent.
Here is an interesting way to look at it. Starting from immediately after IU's first TD and ending with Ohio State's fifth TD, here is what the two teams did:
Ohio State:
- 7 plays, 75 yards, TD
- 8 plays, 76 yards, TD
- 9 plays, 93 yards, TD
- 6 plays, 75 yards, TD
- 30 plays, 319 yards, 4 TD's Total
Indiana:
- 3 plays, 7 yards, Punt
- 4 plays, 68 yards, Fumble
- 1 play, knee, halftime
- 8 plays, 75 yards, no points Total
That was from 11:03 remaining in the second quarter to 12:10 remaining in the third quarter (ie, less than 1/4 of the game.
In that 1/4 of the game, the Buckeyes absolutely dominated on a pace to get 1,200+ yards and 112 points. In the other three quarters of the game Indiana outscored tOSU 35-14.
I'm not really sure what to make of that. Is it good that Ohio State can be SO DOMINANT at times or bad that at other times (most of the game) they were pretty meh.
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https://twitter.com/PurdueSports/status/1329997169676455936
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https://twitter.com/PurdueSports/status/1329997169676455936
based only on one PI call or are you looking at both of the controversy PI calls?
the one that replay shows the MN Defender never touched a WR but got a PI called against him that extended a drive for a touch down for Purdue to get closer than 10 points
or
the one that shows a weak push off of a WR on a MN defender to create separation that took away a go a head score? keeping in mind the flag was thrown before the pass was completed so the Ref had no Idea the outcome when he threw the ball just that the WR pushed off
or
the fact that the QB then went a head and threw a Pick instead of a 2nd TD to effectively end the game
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I'm talking about the one from a ref:
- From St Paul, MN
- Who made a critical call in the 2018 Minnesota / Fresno State game extending the Gopher's game-winning drive
- Calling an OPI that was so egregious that literally the entire sports world (not just Boilers) is claiming robbed the rightful outcome, AND...
- Was so egregious that several major betting sites (FanDuel, DraftKings, PointsBet) refunded bettors based on this outcome
In 42 years of life I've never seen that called as OPI.
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I want to preface this by saying that I'm not an MSU hater. I wish they weren't as bad as they are. That said, they aren't just bad, they are horrible. My question is WTF are you guys seeing in them to rank them ahead of ANY other team let alone multiple teams?
Their games, chronologically:
- They lost by 11 at home to Rutgers: In Rutgers' other four games they lost in OT, lost by a FG, lost by 16, and lost by 22. This is, by far, the worst performance of the year against RU, worse than tOSU, IU, M, and IL.
- They won by a FG in Ann Arbor:
- They lost by 42 in Iowa City: In Iowa's other four games they won by 28 and 20 and lost by 1 and 4. This is, by far, the worst performance of the year against Iowa, worse than PU, NU, PSU, and MN.
- They got shutout 24-0 at home by Indiana: In Indiana's other four games they lost by a TD, won in OT, won by 16, and won by 17. This is the worst performance of the year against IU, worse than tOSU, PSU, RU, and M.
The Michigan game is clearly an outlier but even there, that performance against Michigan is only better than MN and RU. It is still worse than UW and IU.
What are you guys seeing that makes you think they are better than any other B1G team?
IMO, Michigan was the outlier, even with as bad as Michigan is looking so far. If they had lost that game they would be behind PSU. I just have a hard time putting a team who is yet to win above anyone who actually did win one BIG game (on the road), my comment for PSU says this as well.
Also, if you look at IA@PSU, if it wasn't for a couple big plays for PSU in the 3rd, that score could have been a 30 point difference at home. Even with the weird year that it is, I still have to place getting crushed at home as worse than getting crushed on the road. If you look at your game comparisons, Iowa's other wins were on the road (@Minn and @PSU) so the point differential is a little skewed.
If these two played on a neutral field, I would have a tough time picking a winner. Since we can't do a 13a and 13b, one of them had to be 14 so I went with the team who is yet to win, even tho 4 of their losses have been to teams with a winning record. FWIW, even tho MSU isn't exactly improving, PSU looks to be regressing like the players have quit.
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I'm talking about the one from a ref:
- From St Paul, MN
- Who made a critical call in the 2018 Minnesota / Fresno State game extending the Gopher's game-winning drive
- Calling an OPI that was so egregious that literally the entire sports world (not just Boilers) is claiming robbed the rightful outcome, AND...
- Was so egregious that several major betting sites (FanDuel, DraftKings, PointsBet) refunded bettors based on this outcome
In 42 years of life I've never seen that called as OPI.
I've been watching college and NFL football longer than 42 years
never seen that called
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My view is that 8-14 are all bad. How bad is hard to tell. MSU has a terrible result against Rutgers, a good result against Michigan, and two expected results against far superior teams. Hard to judge how that relates to the other 8-14 teams that are also bad. Could MSU sit at the bottom? Sure it could. Penn State is currently o-fer, which seems crazy, but it's true. At least MSU has a win. And is MSU's win any worse than Illinois' or Nebraska's, or...
Point is they all kinda suck.
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I've been watching college and NFL football longer than 42 years
never seen that called
Here is the rule on offensive pass interference.
Offensive pass interference is contact by a Team A player beyond the neutral zone that interferes with a Team B player during a legal forward pass play in which the forward pass crosses the neutral zone. It is the responsibility of the offensive player to avoid the opponents. It is not offensive pass interference (A.R. 7-3-8-IV, V, X, XV and XVI):
1. When, after the snap, a Team A ineligible player immediately charges and contacts an opponent at a point not more than one yard beyond the neutral zone and maintains the contact for no more than three yards beyond the neutral zone. (A.R. 7-3-10-II)
2. When two or more eligible players are making a simultaneous and bona fide attempt to reach, catch or bat the pass. Eligible players of either team have equal rights to the ball (A.R. 7-3-8-IX).
3. When the pass is in flight and two or more eligible players are in the area where they might receive or intercept the pass and an offensive player in that area impedes an opponent, and the pass is not catchable.
The play (https://twitter.com/i/status/1329997479497117696)
Did Payne Durham exercise is responsibility to avoid the opponent, or did he initiate contact with the opponent? If only Payne Durham had not extended his arm toward the opponent and apparently made contact with him, there would be no reason to post sour grapes about the officiating. The official had a good view. And, if Payne Durham hadn't extended his arm we wouldn't be talking about this because he probably would have beaten the defender who he was much taller than, was downfield of, and the ball was thrown only where the receiver could catch it.
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What are you guys seeing that makes you think they are better than any other B1G team?
First, I want to point to my disclaimer that I have no idea how to rank the bottom teams. :)
After further examination, if I were to rank them again, I may move Nebraska ahead of MSU. However, I really don't have confidence in that either. You could put MSU, Nebraska and PSU in a bag and pull them out in any order and probably be as close to correct as any other order right now.
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true, by the letter of the rule it can be called
I've just never seen it called in decades of watching football
I often think about the letter of the rule when a penalty is called on Nebraska. Just don't give the Ref any reason to even think about calling a penalty. It's simple.
the official saw what he saw. he threw the flag. It's up to his judgement. I've just not seen an official judge that type of contact a foul in the past.
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https://twitter.com/i/status/1330002833991741440 (https://twitter.com/i/status/1330002833991741440)
anyone see a PI on this one
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he did put his hand on his back
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I've been watching college and NFL football longer than 42 years
never seen that called
In the OSU game, Fryfogle and Wade were hand fighting all the way down the field. At the last second the WR grabbed the front collar of Wade , threw him to the ground, caught the pass and went in for TD. They actually called Wade for PI!
Michigan got a similar PI call in the end zone late v Rutgers. Was clearly offensive PI- but was called on defender.
They rarely get offensive PI right.
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they rarely call offensive PI at all
when they do, it's usually very obvious
not just a receiver extending an arm
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Results posted, votes through @SFBadger96 (https://www.cfb51.com/index.php?action=profile;u=51) , 15 voters.
I want to talk about this chart for a minute:
(https://i.imgur.com/KSGxRCN.jpg)
I call it the COTY/Hot Seat Chart. Buckeye Fans often complain that Ohio State's coach basically never wins COTY. It doesn't bother me. COTY is basically an award for the coach of the team that most exceeded expectations. Thus, Ohio State's coach is effectively ineligible because expectations in Columbus are so high that they can't be exceeded by enough to win this award.
This chart is a comparison of preseason power ranking to current power ranking. The teams on the left (in the positive) led by Maryland at 5.97 are substantially exceeding preseason expectations. The teams on the right (in the negative) "led" by Penn State at -8.30 are substantially trailing preseason expectations.
If your team is on the left, your coach is in the running for COTY. If your team is on the right then your coach should probably rent rather than buy a home in town.
What stands out to me is that I don't ever remember seeing a team as badly trailing preseason expectations as Penn State is right now. They started out ranked #2 and it was nearly unanimous (their average was 2.10 so barely below #2) and now they are tied with MSU for dead last.
Viewing the season as a whole, I think that PSU is underrated. Their 13 point loss to tOSU and their OT loss to IU are the second best performances all year against those two teams (worse only than IU against tOSU and tOSU against IU). However, the trend is alarming to say the least and the fact that they still haven't won a game is obviously beyond problematic. In the three games since those first two they have:
- A 16 point home loss to Maryland. This is, by far, Maryland's biggest win of the year as their other was an OT win over Minnesota at home. Worst performance so far this year against Maryland.
- A seven point loss to Nebraska. This is Nebraska's only win of the year. Worst performance so far this year against Nebraska.
- A 20 point home loss to Iowa. This is better in that Iowa has done better against two teams (42 point win vs MSU, 28 point win @MN) but it is still a three possession home loss.
Looking at this chart I feel like PSU/M is close to a must-win for both coaches:
- With a loss PSU would drop to 0-6. Even if they won in Picastaway and beat MSU they'd only finish 2-6 after starting the year as the presumed primary challenger to Ohio State in not only the B1G-E, but the whole league.
- With a loss M would drop to 2-4. That is better than PSU, obviously, but Michigan also has a tougher remaining schedule with a visit from Maryland and a trip to Columbus remaining. Thus, if they lose to PSU the Wolverines can't finish .500 without beating both Maryland and Ohio State.
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2. Northwestern- defense does win championships
Not according to Saban
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Not according to Saban
It can win division championships...in the right division :57:
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Not according to Saban
how did Saban do in the Big Ten?
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Looking at this chart I feel like PSU/M is close to a must-win for both coaches:
- With a loss PSU would drop to 0-6. Even if they won in Picastaway and beat MSU they'd only finish 2-6 after starting the year as the presumed primary challenger to Ohio State in not only the B1G-E, but the whole league.
- With a loss M would drop to 3-3. That is better than PSU, obviously, but Michigan also has a tougher remaining schedule with a visit from Maryland and a trip to Columbus remaining.
Well they are 2-3 now, so a loss would actually drop them to 2-4.
It would take a win in order to propel them to 3-3.
Probably just a typo, but we cannot be gifting the Wolverines a win here. :111:
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HA!You're a cold man BB
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Well they are 2-3 now, so a loss would actually drop them to 2-4.
It would take a win in order to propel them to 3-3.
Probably just a typo, but we cannot be gifting the Wolverines a win here. :111:
My bad, fixed.
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In the OSU game, Fryfogle and Wade were hand fighting all the way down the field. At the last second the WR grabbed the front collar of Wade , threw him to the ground, caught the pass and went in for TD. They actually called Wade for PI!
Michigan got a similar PI call in the end zone late v Rutgers. Was clearly offensive PI- but was called on defender.
They rarely get offensive PI right.
When we were kids that kind of contact, i.e. hand-fighting was unthought-of, as anything other than a penalty. Forty-five years later, I think, maybe I should have challenged the officials, as they may not see, or may not have the willingness to pull the flag.
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Officials more often than not called contact once the ball was in the air on either side as I remember it.....when I still played and conestogas were crossing the prarie
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yup, back in the good old daze, if the defender touched the receiver whilst the ball was in the air, the flag came out.
on the other hand, once the ball touched the receiver, the defender could shatter his helmet nearly killing the receiver w/o penalty
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Yeah, I think things have gone to far with hand fighting. I'm sick of watching a WR have his arm held and be forced to try a one-handed catch on a deep ball with no penalty flag.
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Ed Zachery
although, this doesn't seem to keep offenses from putting up bigger and bigger numbers
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Yeah, I think things have gone to far with hand fighting. I'm sick of watching a WR have his arm held and be forced to try a one-handed catch on a deep ball with no penalty flag.
Honestly on the Durham TD catch, you could have called the DB for DPI if you're going to call him for OPI. The DB grabbed his arm and held him up too.