CFB51 College Football Fan Community
The Power Five => SEC => Topic started by: Drew4UTk on November 26, 2017, 10:53:04 PM
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i ain't gonna let this.... situation.... destroy something i've been trying to build which is a community of fans... i've moved the fire to the RockyTop board, and request you guys leave UT fans alone until things simmer down. it's a painful time and things ought to be hashed out without interlopers scampering by tossing salt in wounds.
some of y'all think that shit is funny.. meanwhile, the site is leaking UT fans just as fast as recruits are decommitting... please just let it rest until the smoke clears and folks are reasonable again.
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I guess since I'm not a Vol this goes here rather than the OP now on the Vol board?
One thing that's been bothering me about this deal since I logged on tonight is why I've never heard about Schiano in connection with the PSU fiasco. If it were well known, how did it escape OSU's notice or why did they hire him? If it wasn't well known, is it even true?
Then I saw the Buckeyes weigh in that this comes from a Clay Travis piece....
I'll say this as politely as I can... Please tell me the fanbase didn't melt down and nuke themselves on the word of CLAY EFFING TRAVIS!!?!
That guy is a total hack, and a well documented one. If he got this right, well even a broken clock is right twice a day I guess.
I think UT should aim higher because the dude has some serious character flaws...obviously OSU doesn't shy away from that. But I do think they'd draw the line at entangling themselves in PSU's mudbath.
If this turns out not to have legs, I'll have little sympathy for the Vol program or it's fans who frigging marched for a Clay Travis piece.
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Oh c'mon......Drew you're acting like I'm dressed like a clown at a funeral. Buck up, man.
If Florida went the full retard like this, you'd love it.
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One thing that's been bothering me about this deal since I logged on tonight is why I've never heard about Schiano in connection with the PSU fiasco. If it were well known, how did it escape OSU's notice or why did they hire him? If it wasn't well known, is it even true?
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It was certainly addressed when he was hired, and it turned out to be a non-issue.
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@MikeDeTiger (https://www.cfb51.com/index.php?action=profile;u=1588) , the whole alignment to Sandusky's activity at PSU is just the 'justification'. what it did was brought those with no knowledge of that situation to some sort of self righteous position against Schiano, however unwarranted. The 'attachment' Schiano has is so slight, it shouldn't even be mentioned. But- to those who only keep a third of an eye on the sport, it was the rallying point.
the backlash from UT fans that have been paying close attention is Schiano himself. Over on B1G land, they act as if he's something special. He isn't. He's just another pretty decent coach, and that's about it- about the same level as Butch Jones or possibly slightly better at first glance... but even that isn't the problem.
here is the disconnect (Schiano isn't even THE subject except that 'they' could use the PSU thing to their advantage to get rid of him, which is just my opinion) :
- Currie told Jones of UT's position and made it clear this was his last season, Jones opted to leave immediately.
- Currie held a press conference indicating UT would (and this is where things actually went wrong) (paraphrased)"UT will make a hire that resembles the high integrity, character and honor.... Money is no object this time.... no compromises will be made in terms of character or known and documented ability... the hire will be someone who will represent the state admirably.... this hire will be ground shaking in terms of impact on the field"
- Currie convenes a council/committee of Haslam, and Fulmer- meets with and offers Gruden.
- This isn't proven, but it's thought that Gruden straight up said no, but either offered or by request (read:$$$) picked up an advisory role.
- It's thought at somewhere around this point Manning, who is not only Alum but also a helluva booster, also took up some sort of advisory role.
- then there is a long silence where people are left in the dark (not saying it's wrong- it's not their business it's the committees) but you and I both know what happens in silence- rumors (grumors) take seed.
- there is information leaked that Currie went to Bahama's via Seattle, where it was rumored he spoke with Petersen (could have been Leech in retrospect and likely was), and then from whatever 'source' (i can't tell you where this came from) there was a sense of "game over; we have our guy"...
- people started the guessing... people reviewed what we KNOW happened not just what people 'thought' was happening, and we figured they had met with their 'ground moving' coach and secured a deal.
- UT wrapped up the worst season in the history of UT football.... losing to Vandy in our own house.
- sunday morning Schiano was mentioned for the FIRST time- and it was said a presser later that day would confirm it.
- Fans went NUTS... Who the hell is Schiano? (most of them screamed this awaiting response)
- response came from a voice desperate for attention in Clay Friggin' Travis who explained who Schiano was (to the uninitiated) and led that story by describing the proximity (however slight) to Sandusky... and people REALLY lost their minds. He rallied to social media calling for fans to revolt- and others followed suit- this isn't ALL on Travis....
- Due to the reaction, the contract was pulled (was it inked already?- ruh roh)...
- The media has a field day- congressmen are involved- the friggin white house press secretary is involved... talking heads everywhere are involved. none of it casts Tennessee in a good light, and Tennessee is rallying for every opportunity to condemn Schiano not only as a coach but as a man.
Schiano may be a good coach... he may be a good man... he was never the caliber that UT was promised, and still isn't. that is nothing against him- he may have even done well at UT. UT fans may even have warmed up to give him a shot- IF there weren't talking heads looking for a way to be relevant and willing to slander as a means to be relevant...
here is what could have been done differently, and it's NOT a long list... IF these clowns had made this approach, the landing would be a lot smoother if or if not Schiano was the next head coach. And before you think it or say it- the only way you can get by with doing this without this small measure is to hire within the family as UF did with Mullen (kudos, UF does it right)...
- socialize the possibility of a largely unknown coach prior to inking a contract, and do it AFTER the dust has settled on the ABSOLUTE WORST season a once proud school has endured.
- measure/gauge reaction and move accordingly- focus on who matters, not just a fan base (and the less initiated of the fan base who listen to Clay friggin' Travis) but the boosters and boards. this is public money, not private. this is the most critical hire ever as acknowledged by many of the initiated- there isn't a lot of 'time' and it's definitely NOT on UT's 'side', but there is more time than to make an assertive announcement hours after the end of the worst season ever when wounds are fresh and offering only hours to adjust before making it 'official'.
Currie & Co. fumbled the hell out of the rock. He'll be lucky to keep his job. Seriously, there is that much angst against him that quickly.
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"...... he was never the caliber that UT was promised"
Through all that... this is the phrase that sticks out to me most. The biggest mistake made here was promising something to his fanbase that he couldn't guarantee he could deliver. When you set the stage for "Gruden or bust" essentially... then your chances of looking like the fool at the end of the day are pretty high. Gruden was never, ever going to take that job... And most casual observers from outside the UT family could see that plainly.
Your AD should be out of job by lunch today.... if he's not already. That is a bungled coaching search that will live in college football infamy.
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Petersen? I'd dance in the road draped only in a UT flag... helluva hire that never happened.
Patterson? We had our chance- had the guy locked... in '08... and blew him off for Kiffin... still, I would have same reaction as i would for Petersen.
Leech? can't see it... but, who knows. would be willing to light a small candle and guard it hoping for the best..
Gundy was mentioned early... would be proud to be a fan of a team led "by a MAN"...
Gruden? the impact would be remarkable... the talent and staff that would/could be assembled would be mind blowing... however, over a five year haul and compared to a 'Petersen', as an example, I'd wager Petersen to have a slightly better record.... over a ten year haul, Petersen would have a lot better record... over a two year period? UT would have stacked the deck.
understand, Gruden (even if he would come to UT) would only be there for a few seasons- that was the entire plan most initiated UT fans sought- get him here, stop the bleeding instantly, fill out his staff and preferably with his replacement already identified, and groom... two season's then 'Thanks Chucky... Love ya brother'... 'Tee? Welcome home, we're proud to call you our HC' but that was a bridge too far and with the miser of Haslam (thinks he's the smartest guy in the room) it never had a chance.
but again, the promise of 'ground shaking' and 'money is no object' ought not ever been mentioned. they set themselves up for this.
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I feel for you, Drew. It is certainly weird how this thing went sideways so fast. The whole smearing of Schiano should never have happened, IMO. Anyhow, I hope it settles down soon.
I gotta say the talk about Mike Leach put a smile on my face. I could just see him transforming the Vol Navy into a bunch of pirates. I don't know if he could return UT to prominence but he would be entertaining.
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I guess since I'm not a Vol this goes here rather than the OP now on the Vol board?
One thing that's been bothering me about this deal since I logged on tonight is why I've never heard about Schiano in connection with the PSU fiasco. If it were well known, how did it escape OSU's notice or why did they hire him? If it wasn't well known, is it even true?
Then I saw the Buckeyes weigh in that this comes from a Clay Travis piece....
I'll say this as politely as I can... Please tell me the fanbase didn't melt down and nuke themselves on the word of CLAY EFFING TRAVIS!!?!
That guy is a total hack, and a well documented one. If he got this right, well even a broken clock is right twice a day I guess.
I think UT should aim higher because the dude has some serious character flaws...obviously OSU doesn't shy away from that. But I do think they'd draw the line at entangling themselves in PSU's mudbath.
If this turns out not to have legs, I'll have little sympathy for the Vol program or it's fans who frigging marched for a Clay Travis piece.
Drew started this thread last month and I appreciate his approach, but there are countless facts that the national sports media misled regarding this situation and it pisses me off that they get away with it. Clay Travis did not start this revolt. People inside UT’s athletic department did not like what was happening. I know this for a fact because I know people there who told me and fans who were protesting. All UT fans would like to forget this as much as me, but this will likely be coming back up in the media down the road. This is a sports question with obvious legal implications: How do you folks see this playing out? Will Schiano sue UT for defamation of character or will he sue UT for breach of contract or both or neither? The national media is acting like lawyers without much legal knowledge. For example, I saw an article stating that it's very likely that there is going to be a Schiano settlement, but these media darlings don’t give any details as to how this would legally play out because they don’t have a clue. Here’s how I see these two questions: Schiano would be stupid to sue and I seriously doubt he does because if Schiano sues, it opens himself up for depositions about his time at Penn State because that will be the crux of why he didn’t get the job if he sues for defamation. People argue that the two are unrelated. I don’t think they are unrelated because that was one of the reasons UT fans didn’t want Schiano, which UT acquiesced to. Plus, who does Schiano sue for defamation since UT didn’t write on the rock? I'm sure that Schiano just wants to bury it over whatever money he would get on a defamation case. Furthermore, defamation lawsuits are very difficult to win as only about 13% are successful. Schiano cannot say UT committed defamation. Does Schiano know which fan wrote the allegations on the rock? If so, Schiano can sue him, but what kind of damages or restitution could the fan pay? It is thus hard to find lawyers who will take the case. It is ridiculous that in many cases, the costs of litigating the suit can be greater than the actual money at stake in the lawsuit. If Schiano sues UT over breach of contract--which I think is the more viable case—he still has an uphill battle because UT’s Policy on Contracts explicitly states that employees may sign contracts in the name of the University only if they have authority to sign as set forth in UT’s Policy and the term “Contract” is defined, broadly, to mean any document intended to set forth an agreement or arrangement between the University and an outside party. A person who signs a Contract on behalf of the University without authority may be subject to disciplinary action up to and including termination, which would mean that UT can fire John Currie with cause and consequently not have to pay him his buyout. A person who signs without authority in some cases even may be liable for the obligations, debts and risks under that Contract. Thus, John Currie, acting AD at the time could be liable for damages to Schiano and not UT if Currie violated UT’s contract policy. The University will not be bound by the terms of a Contract signed by an individual without authority unless an Officer of the University subsequently agrees that the University will honor the Contract. The Chancellor of the University must be informed in advance about all Significant Commitments, before the commitment is communicated to any Counterparty. Contracts relating to Significant Commitments must be reviewed and signed by an Officer of the University and reviewed by the General Counsel of the University. It’s known that UT’s Chancellor did not sign the MOU between Schiano and Currie nor did UT’s Chief Operating Officer, which prevents the MOU from being legally binding. The national sports media hammered UT for damaging Schiano’s reputation, but Schiano should have done a better job of clearing his own name when his name came up in a deposition beyond denying it such as who he spoke with, when and where and suing the coach who told Mike McQueary that Schiano told him that he saw Sandusky molesting a child in the shower. Not to mention that the media has no problem reporting baseless sexual assaults by people against celebrities. I guess they all get to sue for defamation too. Finally, most in the national college football media chose to ridicule the Tennessee fan base, but this is entirely wrong. “The Tennessee fan base didn’t hire Lane Kiffin for one year and then have him leave. They didn’t hire Derek Dooley and then watch him leave. And they didn’t buy Butch Jones’s bullcrap for five years about building the program up brick-by-brick. That was the Haslam family and their handpicked athletic directors. The Haslam’s had gone 0-3 on hires and now they wanted the chance to make another one, a guy no one else wanted and, frankly, that no one else is even interviewing. The Haslams are billionaires and they run the Tennessee athletic department like a feudal kingdom. They hire and fire, they make every major decision, they nod and administrators jump. They’ve got the governor’s office locked up in the state and an NFL football team — if you want to count the Browns as an NFL team — and while their company is currently under federal prosecution for a variety of misdeeds, they control everything at the University of Tennessee and much in the state as well. John Currie was the Haslam family’s handpicked athletic director. He exists to do their bidding. Countless other top donors to the University of Tennessee have thrown up their hands, aghast at the power wielded by the Haslams, but no one has been able to challenge their power and win. Now maybe you could argue the Haslams are good for Tennessee if they actually made good decisions, but effectively they have been running University of Tennessee athletics like they’ve been running the Cleveland Browns — badly. Tennessee football has become the Cleveland Browns of the SEC. So the fans were sick of it.Thus, the story of Tennessee’s fans finally standing up to the awful administration that has run their program into the ground should have been one that was told by the national college football media. But instead the national media focused on Tennessee fans standing up for themselves and not allowing their administration to make yet another awful hire BY BLAMING THE FANS FOR BEING AWFUL.” The national sports media is all about protecting their sources and the status quo. We have seen enough now to know that they care nothing about the truth. A book will be written about this ordeal in the coming months possibly called, "Rocky Road on Rocky Top." Yes, this was ugly on a national stage, but it was actually necessary to drain the swamp of Haslam alligators. Now, UT can move forward with having Fulmer as AD who should have gotten the job nine months ago.
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