If we limit this to say since 1970, I think that eliminates some folks like the Bear from consideration and probably only Urban and Nick are left, maybe Steve.1992 is when the NCAA set the scholarship limit at 85. So that's a year to think about. Or 1978, when it was capped at 95. Or 1972, when the first limit (105) was enacted.
What Alabama has done of late is quite something, even with a flubb last season with the "GOAT" team.
Bill Snyder.Yep.
Bill Snyder.I like this vote. Saban could not even own his own state while at MSU. Suddenly, he goes to the SEC and his dominant. I have no doubt Saban would have been just average at a place like KSU. In fact, I don't think he could do what Tom Osborne did at Nebraska.
People undersell Saban at Michigan State. He took over a program in shambles and turned it around. It wasn't instantaneous, but it was notable. LSU hired him away because he was doing impressive things in East Lansing.Right. I would have just liked to see a couple more years at MSU. We all know why he left.
Alabama post-Stallings looks a lot like Tennessee post-Fulmer, until Saban arrived.
Coaching matters, and Saban--not the SEC, and not Bear Bryant nor Gene Stallings--is the reason Alabama is what it is today. And what it is is dominant despite playing the most competitive CFB era.
I like this vote. Saban could not even own his own state while at MSU. Suddenly, he goes to the SEC and his dominant. I have no doubt Saban would have been just average at a place like KSU. In fact, I don't think he could do what Tom Osborne did at Nebraska.this is probably true, but the reciprocal is also probably true.
I'm not saying Saban doesn't deserve the GOAT, but I also can't help but remember what he accomplished at MSU vs in the SEC when he had the money, support and talent in his back yard.
Been pretty wild had Superior stayed at FLA,Pete Clairol at USC,and Chippy at Oregon.Wonder how much things would have been different.Prolly better Mark Richt moved alongCarroll at USC in the CFP era would have been scary IMHO. Carroll's Achilles heel at USC was repeatedly losing a random mid-season game to a vastly inferior team (much like tOSU has done the past two years). In the BCS era that closed the Trojans out of the NC race more often than not but in the CFP era it likely would not have had the same impact. Carroll was near-perfect in bigtime matchups.
If the more with less card is going to come up.. King Barry. BCS bowl wins and built a program that will, more likely than not, stand for the long haul.Good Point there was a time when UW,IU,NU were trading last place finishes.He certainly did a much better than avg job given the circumstances.And he didn't have to leave town in front of the Sheriff either.ON WISCONSIN except for the 26th of course
Only OSU, Clemson and OU have won more games in the past 15 years, and that is a result of what that man built. And he built it from... Nothing. Not a helmet. Not anything. Nothing.
Sorry. Not counting Boise and such...
Neither Saban or Meyer is the Greatest of All Time.Who gets that vote for you.
One thing that convinced me that Mark Richt was just an OK coach was watching him get out coached by SOS at USCe who would often beat him with much inferior talent.Doesn't happen very often. Lou Holtz jump-started that program before SoS showed up.
It's interesting when a top level coach goes to a mediocre program and you see a pretty quick change that is more than better recruiting.
Doesn't happen very often. Lou Holtz jump-started that program before SoS showed up.Holtz got them from cratering to mediocre, but it wasn't like they were THAT good.
| 1999 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1999_South_Carolina_Gamecocks_football_team) | Lou Holtz (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lou_Holtz) | 0–11 | 0–8 | — | — | |
| 2000 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2000_South_Carolina_Gamecocks_football_team) | Lou Holtz | 8–4 | 5–3 | Won 2001 Outback Bowl (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2001_Outback_Bowl) vs. Ohio State (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2000_Ohio_State_Buckeyes_football_team), 24–7 | 19 | 21 |
| 2001 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2001_South_Carolina_Gamecocks_football_team) | Lou Holtz | 9–3 | 5–3 | Won 2002 Outback Bowl (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2002_Outback_Bowl) vs. Ohio State (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2001_Ohio_State_Buckeyes_football_team), 31–28 | 13 | 13 |
| 2002 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2002_South_Carolina_Gamecocks_football_team) | Lou Holtz | 5–7 | 3–5 | — | — | |
| 2003 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2003_South_Carolina_Gamecocks_football_team) | Lou Holtz | 5–7 | 2–6 | — | — | |
| 2004 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_South_Carolina_Gamecocks_football_team) | Lou Holtz | 6–5 | 4–4 |
| 2005 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_South_Carolina_Gamecocks_football_team) | Steve Spurrier (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Spurrier) | 7–5 | 5–3 | Lost 2005 Independence Bowl (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_Independence_Bowl) vs. Missouri (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_Missouri_Tigers_football_team), 31–38 | — | — |
| 2006 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_South_Carolina_Gamecocks_football_team) | Steve Spurrier | 8–5 | 3–5 | Won 2006 Liberty Bowl (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Liberty_Bowl) vs. Houston (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Houston_Cougars_football_team), 44–36 | — | — |
| 2007 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_South_Carolina_Gamecocks_football_team) | Steve Spurrier | 6–6 | 3–5 | — | — | |
| 2008 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_South_Carolina_Gamecocks_football_team) | Steve Spurrier | 7–6 | 4–4 | Lost 2009 Outback Bowl (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Outback_Bowl) vs. Iowa (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_Iowa_Hawkeyes_football_team), 10–31 | — | — |
| 2009 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_South_Carolina_Gamecocks_football_team) | Steve Spurrier | 7–6 | 3–5 | Lost 2010 PapaJohns.com Bowl (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_PapaJohns.com_Bowl) vs. Connecticut (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Connecticut_Huskies_football_team), 7–20 | — | — |
| 2010 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_South_Carolina_Gamecocks_football_team) | Steve Spurrier | 9–5 | 5–3 | SEC East Champions Lost 2010 Chick-fil-A Bowl (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Chick-fil-A_Bowl) vs. Florida St (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Florida_State_Seminoles_football_team), 17–26 | 22 | 22 |
| 2011 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_South_Carolina_Gamecocks_football_team) | Steve Spurrier | 11–2 | 6–2 | Won 2012 Capital One Bowl (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_Capital_One_Bowl) vs. Nebraska (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Nebraska_Cornhuskers_football_team), 30–13 | 9 | 8 |
| 2012 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_South_Carolina_Gamecocks_football_team) | Steve Spurrier | 11–2 | 6–2 | Won 2013 Outback Bowl (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_Outback_Bowl) vs. Michigan (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_Michigan_Wolverines_football_team), 33–28 | 8 | 7 |
| 2013 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_South_Carolina_Gamecocks_football_team) | Steve Spurrier | 11–2 | 6–2 | Won 2014 Capital One Bowl (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Capital_One_Bowl) vs. Wisconsin (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_Wisconsin_Badgers_football_team), 34–24 | 4 | 4 |
| 2014 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_South_Carolina_Gamecocks_football_team) | Steve Spurrier | 7–6 | 3–5 | Won 2014 Duck Commander Independence Bowl (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Independence_Bowl) vs. Miami (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Miami_Hurricanes_football_team), 24–21 | — | — |
Southeastern Conference (East Division) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southeastern_Conference) (2015–present) | ||||||
| 2015 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_South_Carolina_Gamecocks_football_team) | Steve Spurrier (resigned) Shawn Elliott (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shawn_Elliott_(American_football)) | 3–9 | 1–7 |
One thing that convinced me that Mark Richt was just an OK coach was watching him get out coached by SOS at USCe who would often beat him with much inferior talent.I maintain Richt was better than OK. Calling him OK gets into the sort of, not spoiled exactly, but the narrower lens that comes with loving one program.
Holtz got them from cratering to mediocre, but it wasn't like they were THAT good.Never said they were. Just that he jumpstarted it. Also recruited his successor.
Also, SoS wandered the mediocrity wilderness for half a decade before it clicked, and after a brief window, it was gone.
Richt had superior talent, and comparatively mediocre results most of the time. That is why he was fired after two successive 10-3 seasons.I'm sure when your team lost to less talented teams there times, it stands out.
Folks kept seeing coaches like SOS "run all over him" with inferior talent. Some pieces were fundamental things, like covering punt fakes, which Richt's teams messed up repeatedly. Special teams coverages were awful. Little things that are pivotal.
A friend of mine is a Miami fan and was thrilled to get Richt and I told him he probably will be mediocre, not a keeper.
When UGA played USCe, it became VERY obvious that SOS was simply out coaching CMR.
If the more with less card is going to come up.. King Barry. BCS bowl wins and built a program that will, more likely than not, stand for the long haul.For me, Barry is an interesting case.
Only OSU, Clemson and OU have won more games in the past 15 years, and that is a result of what that man built. And he built it from... Nothing. Not a helmet. Not anything. Nothing.
Sorry. Not counting Boise and such...
For me, Barry is an interesting case.Barry's twilight also has to factor in. Three very so-so to less than so-so teams, one magnificent half-team and the 2005 team which was kind of a half team but mostly just weird.
He built it as coach. It endured after him because of him as an AD. I'm not sure at all that Wisconsin would still be what it is without him as AD. Maybe it's now strong enough to survive without him, but I'm not sure it was at the end of his coaching tenure.
Which adds to his career, but I'm not sure how to handle when we're taking about GOAT coaches. I just don't know how to classify him. The AD portion seems like it shouldn't be left out of his legacy, but he wasn't a coach so how does it factor into a coaching GOAT discussion?
I'm mostly referring to "Game Day coaching", where he was average at best IMHO coupled with poor special teams play and some bad game plans going into the game.So he was average one Gameday and maybe with game plans, bad at random special teams miscues and a king at most of the other stuff?
When he had good assistants, he had good years for obvious reasons.
If the more with less card is going to come up.. King Barry. BCS bowl wins and built a program that will, more likely than not, stand for the long haul.i agree barry should be in discussion, but imo he's just outside looking in.
Only OSU, Clemson and OU have won more games in the past 15 years, and that is a result of what that man built. And he built it from... Nothing. Not a helmet. Not anything. Nothing.
Sorry. Not counting Boise and such...
Richt had superior talent, and comparatively mediocre results most of the time. That is why he was fired after two successive 10-3 seasons.Georgia should be the best job in all of CFB. A competent recruiter doesn't even have to leave the state and nab a top 5 recruiting class year after year (IMHO, GA is home to the best high school football talent in the land - even more so than TX, FL, and CA, and the gap will continue to widen). It has a huge fanbase, fantastic facilities, awesome college town (easily one of the best in the country. For comparison, Clemson is quaint but rather boring, and Tuscaloosa reeks of grimy truck stop), strong winning tradition, etc. The only thing that's holding it back is the level of commitment - it seems to be content to just be a contender than a champion. The program simply doesn't have the same drive to win that Alabama and Clemson have, it's probably more on par with Ohio State, LSU, and Florida in that department.
Folks kept seeing coaches like SOS "run all over him" with inferior talent. Some pieces were fundamental things, like covering punt fakes, which Richt's teams messed up repeatedly. Special teams coverages were awful. Little things that are pivotal.
A friend of mine is a Miami fan and was thrilled to get Richt and I told him he probably will be mediocre, not a keeper.
When UGA played USCe, it became VERY obvious that SOS was simply out coaching CMR.
For me, Barry is an interesting case.Similar to Devaney as a coach that built the program then moved to the AD to oversee it's success.
He built it as coach. It endured after him because of him as an AD. I'm not sure at all that Wisconsin would still be what it is without him as AD. Maybe it's now strong enough to survive without him, but I'm not sure it was at the end of his coaching tenure.
Which adds to his career, but I'm not sure how to handle when we're taking about GOAT coaches. I just don't know how to classify him. The AD portion seems like it shouldn't be left out of his legacy, but he wasn't a coach so how does it factor into a coaching GOAT discussion?
Saban schedules cupcakes perenially before the Iron Bowl(I mean real Hostess specials),and never comes North after November.Prolly the best coach the last 25 yrs for sure but still doesn't play to the Any Team,Any Time Any Place that Jimmy Johnson embraced
That's why I can't go for Snyder or Alvarez. Snyder was awesome, but Snyder also won two conference titles. Total. He believed in a cupcake-heavy scheduling approach. He's a great coach, but I can't go GOAT there. Barry had his chance. he turned it down to go 39-25 in the twilight of his career with some 7th and 8th place finishes. I appreciate it and everything, but hard to GOAT that.
Saban schedules cupcakes perenially before the Iron Bowl(I mean real Hostess specials),and never comes North after November.Prolly the best coach the last 25 yrs for sure but still doesn't play to the Any Team,Any Time Any Place that Jimmy Johnson embracedthis is such a stupid ass argument. what p5 team travels outside their footprint in nov? aside from maybe nd, and that's mostly because of no conf affiliation.
this is probably true, but the reciprocal is also probably true.those are all valid points as well. I'd probably vote him GOAT, but I'm equally impressed with what others have accomplished.
saban has more resources at bama than all but a few other places could give him. but what he's done with those resources is nothing short of phenomenal. people always say the reason he sends more to nfl than anyone else is because he gets more 4-5 stars than anyone else, which is true. but he also sends those type recruits to nfl at a better rate than any other school, so he does more with the best than anyone else as well.
and the sustained success is remarkable and unprecedented. with this weeks rankings, he now has bama at #1 during a season for 12 straight seasons, and ncaa record.
i'm bias, obviously, but i think saban has a pretty strong case for goat.
having said that, snyder is definitely up there as well, for different reasons. that guy was phenomenal as well, taking probably the worst team in d1 (dead last in win% at time of hire) and turning them respectable, even great for a short while.
urban is hard to judge. there's no arguing he gets results and is a great coach. but there's just something about his short tenures and ready made success at the bigger schools that throws me off. definitely one of the best, though.
spurrier is an all time great, but more in the 10-15 range than 1-3 range. even in last 30 years, he's not the best, imo.
other recent coaches worth mentioning: bowden, paterno, dabo?, patterson (at tcu has done really well and deserves some cred, though not #1 cred), sweatervest, pete carroll, big game bob
those are all valid points as well. I'd probably vote him GOAT, but I'm equally impressed with what others have accomplished.nah, osborne definitely is in the discussion. my list was not exhaustive.
I'm always puzzled why TO is not mentioned more, yet Bowden and Paterno often come up in these discussions. Not just you, but in general. Probably bias on my part.
Saban schedules cupcakes perenially before the Iron Bowl(I mean real Hostess specials),and never comes North after November.Prolly the best coach the last 25 yrs for sure but still doesn't play to the Any Team,Any Time Any Place that Jimmy Johnson embracedFrom 1995-2000, KSU played only Temple from the Big 6 conferences.
Bowden has all those top 5 finishes in the final poll, Paterno has longevity, those are the only advantages over Doc Tomosborne was hc for 24 years at braska. paterno has longevity over almost everyone, but long tenure should be a knock on osborne.
Switzer's head to head vs Tom and his small winning percentage lead over Tom are valid.
As with Snyder and some other coaches doing more with less, Tom didn't have the recruiting advantages of Switzer or Bowden or possibly Paterno
I don't think it's a coincidence that since Richt left Gawja that they are knocking on the door every year.Just like Cooper in Columbus - they were not the guys to get it done.IMO both should have been dismissed at least 5 yrs before they were.They were too over paid to be "Meh"Carr too...
These days, a part of scheduling is to create the best chance to make the FF (for teams with a shot down the road). You need to balance off days and pastries while appearing to play some tough programs as well OOC.Not now at least. I wonder where Tech goes. I’m guessing they end up where they usually do, solid, occasionally pretty feisty.
UGA has scheduled three prominent P5 programs in 2026-2027 OOC, I'm not sure that is a great idea. I think two is a good number.
(Maybe GaTech shouldn't be considered "prominent" ...)
no one needs to defend their scheduling to me
it's the committee that you need to impress
no coach in their right mind schedules a loss
Tech can't recruit, so they need some kind of gimmicky offense. Fortunately they have given that up, they were annoying to play.That’s my thought. Even O’Leery had some gimmick.
The ACC also plays 8 conference games. I personally don't see 8 or 9 as THE issue, it's playing 10 P5 teams a year for me.
The ACC could have "gamed the system" the best by having one great team and 13 mediocre to awful teams.
I'm fine with scheduling that has ten P5 level teams a year, however you insert the pastries is up to you.I'm certainly fine with that, too.
There is advantage in starting with pasties as a preseason, and advantage in having one before a main rival.
But limit it to two a year.
I'm fine with scheduling that has ten P5 level teams a year, however you insert the pastries is up to you.the difference between this and 9 conference games is what Utee brought up.
There is advantage in starting with pasties as a preseason, and advantage in having one before a main rival.
But limit it to two a year.
this is such a stupid ass argument. what p5 team travels outside their footprint in nov?No more stupid ass than asking Northern teams to come down in Aug/Sept and play in heat over 100 degrees - at Night.Oh no advatage what so ever there.But you do have a point Mercer,Chattanooga,Charleston Southern and WesternCarolina aren't out of their footprint just out of their League
No more stupid ass than asking Northern teams to come down in Aug/Sept and play in heat over 100 degrees - at Night.Oh no advatage what so ever there.But you do have a point Mercer,Chattanooga,Charleston Southern and WesternCarolina aren't out of their footprint just out of their LeagueIf a decent B1G or PAC team plays an early OOC game with an SEC team (or a team like Texas, Oklahoma, or Florida State), they tend to be played in climate-controlled NFL stadiums these days. G5 teams (and bottom-feeder P5 teams) probably won't care as much as long as they get their $1M patsy check.
If a decent B1G or PAC team plays an early OOC game with an SEC team (or a team like Texas, Oklahoma, or Florida State), they tend to be played in climate-controlled NFL stadiums these days. G5 teams (and bottom-feeder P5 teams) probably won't care as much as long as they get their $1M patsy check.Absolutely. Summers in Austin are miserable. Hot, long, brutal, oppressive. There's no water anywhere and beer is illegal.
That said, Southern weather sucks. Northern winters are much more tolerable than long, brutal, oppressive Southern summers.
No more stupid ass than asking Northern teams to come down in Aug/Sept and play in heat over 100 degrees - at Night.Oh no advatage what so ever there.But you do have a point Mercer,Chattanooga,Charleston Southern and WesternCarolina aren't out of their footprint just out of their Leagueaverage highs in tusaloosa in sept are in the mid 80's, and that's the daily high around noon-ish. and no major cfb game vs a quality ooc opp will be played in tuscaloosa at noon. it''l be 2:30 at the earliest, which would be a mid 80's game and dropping. but it'd probably be a night game, when the temp is mid-high 70's. not exactly a murderous advantage. especially considering columbus is about 5-8 degrees off that, with highs in high-70s and lows high-50s, with a similar gametime temp around high 60s-low 70s. ann arbor and east lansing are similar, slightly cooler. madison too. data pulled from some weather website when googling. currentresults.com or something.
i agree barry should be in discussion, but imo he's just outside looking in.Do they? I don't have access to any of the ftbobs data, but this says otherwise. The explanation is below.
fwiw, bama also has more wins over last 15 years (2004-2018). :)
| Rank | Team name | Winning Percentage | Games Won | Games Lost | Games Tied | Games Played |
| 1 | Boise State (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Boise_State) | 0.83249 | 164 | 33 | 0 | 197 |
| 2 | Oklahoma (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Oklahoma) | 0.79500 | 159 | 41 | 0 | 200 |
| 3 | Ohio State (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Ohio_State) | 0.83243 | 154 | 31 | 0 | 185 |
| 4 | Clemson (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Clemson) | 0.74627 | 150 | 51 | 0 | 201 |
| 5 | Wisconsin (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Wisconsin) | 0.74874 | 149 | 50 | 0 | 199 |
| 6 | Louisiana State (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Louisiana_State) | 0.76289 | 148 | 46 | 0 | 194 |
| 7 | Alabama (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Alabama) | 0.80328 | 147 | 36 | 0 | 183 |
| 8 | Georgia (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Georgia) | 0.73367 | 146 | 53 | 0 | 199 |
| 9t | Oregon (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Oregon) | 0.72165 | 140 | 54 | 0 | 194 |
| 9t | Texas Christian (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Texas_Christian) | 0.72917 | 140 | 52 | 0 | 192 |
| 11 | Virginia Tech (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Virginia_Tech) | 0.69000 | 138 | 62 | 0 | 200 |
| 12 | Florida (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Florida) | 0.69430 | 134 | 59 | 0 | 193 |
| 13 | Auburn (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Auburn) | 0.68205 | 133 | 62 | 0 | 195 |
| 14t | Southern Cal (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Southern_Cal) | 0.72527 | 132 | 50 | 0 | 182 |
| 14t | Texas (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Texas) | 0.68394 | 132 | 61 | 0 | 193 |
| 16t | Utah (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Utah) | 0.68229 | 131 | 61 | 0 | 192 |
| 16t | Penn State (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Penn_State) | 0.68586 | 131 | 60 | 0 | 191 |
| 18 | West Virginia (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=West_Virginia) | 0.67539 | 129 | 62 | 0 | 191 |
| 19 | Oklahoma State (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Oklahoma_State) | 0.66667 | 128 | 64 | 0 | 192 |
| 20 | Florida State (http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/records/fetch-team.pl?team=Florida_State) | 0.67568 | 125 | 60 | 0 | 185 |
| Year | Won | Lost | Tied | Notes |
| 2008 | 12 | 2 | ||
| Was 7-6 in 2007; required to vacate first five wins due to textbook scandal. (Alabama appealed and the NCAA rejected the appeal on 03/23/2010.) | ||||
| 2007 | 2 | 6 | ||
| Was 6-7 in 2006; required to vacate all six wins due to textbook scandal. | ||||
| 2006 | 0 | 7 | ||
| Was 10-2 in 2005; required to vacate all ten wins due to textbook scandal. |
I certainly prefer the weather of much of CA to just about anywhere in the US. Twentynine Palms is not one of those places.
I prefer the taxes and cost of living here though.
The wife wants to go to France for a MONTH in January and February. Winters near Paris are pretty grim in my experience, overcast, cold, damp.
They had a 6" snow fall last time we did that. it was pretty.
That said, Southern weather sucks. Northern winters are much more tolerable than long, brutal, oppressive Southern summers.Agreed to each their own.Many I know moved back for that reason,spent at least as much time indoors for the opposite reason.
I lived "up north" 38 years. It's not that cold in general in November.Maybe my view is skewed as the Canadian-Ontario winds blow across the lake into N.Ohio 3 yrs ago the 1st week of Nov. when Buffalo got buried in literally 5ft of snow - we got 2.My Nephew,wife and kids live in ATL for 20 yrs on Peach Tree something or other he said summers are miserable.Context I guess,doesn't bother the kids so much.Anyway it's much easier IMO for a team to head north and play in 34-53 deg.weather than for one to head south and play in tmps from mid 85-92 and it could be a lot worse.Cleveland gets more snow and colder temps than Chicago on avg,Buffalo gets it worse than us.Winds usually sweep in from the west across the Great Lakes dropping more snow the further East you go
I'm fine with scheduling that has ten P5 level teams a year, however you insert the pastries is up to you.I think Utee's point about scheduling 8 conference games as opposed to 9 is a valid one. Saying that it all evens out when teams play 10 P5 opponents is just not true. Playing 9 conference games plus an OOC P5 opponent is not the same thing as scheduling 8 conference games and 2 OOC P5 opponents.
There is advantage in starting with pasties as a preseason, and advantage in having one before a main rival.
But limit it to two a year.
Saban schedules cupcakes perenially before the Iron Bowl(I mean real Hostess specials),and never comes North after November.Prolly the best coach the last 25 yrs for sure but still doesn't play to the Any Team,Any Time Any Place that Jimmy Johnson embracedJimmy Johnson coached an independent - they had 11 games to fill, not just 3-4 OOC games. You had to take games you'd prefer not to back then, in that situation. Granted, there were a ton of independents, but still.
Georgia should be the best job in all of CFB. A competent recruiter doesn't even have to leave the state and nab a top 5 recruiting class year after year (IMHO, GA is home to the best high school football talent in the land - even more so than TX, FL, and CA, and the gap will continue to widen).Literally all the evidence disagrees with this.
Still complaining about SEC teams not breaking the rules......ffsBreaking the rules? Nobody has said they are.
Breaking the rules? Nobody has said they are.You can apply whatever slanted phrasing you want, but you're still complaining that the SEC hasn't changed the scheduling rules/practices it has had in place. You're complaining that they're not volunteering to make things harder on its members, in terms of winning as many games as possible - without any rule stating that they must.
Gaming the system? You bet.
You can apply whatever slanted phrasing you want, but you're still complaining that the SEC hasn't changed the scheduling rules/practices it has had in place. You're complaining that they're not volunteering to make things harder on its members, in terms of winning as many games as possible - without any rule stating that they must.
It looks so petty.
You're wanting an entity to depart from a status quo that is working out well for it, with there being no incentive to do so. Huh? Wha? I guess I just don't understand bitching about an inaction...the SEC didn't actively go from 9 to 8 conference games. If that had happened, it would make sense for you to complain. But to carry on about an inaction is bizarre.
My point would be to have a rule nationally that every P5 team has to play ten P5 level teams a year, whether it is 8/2 or 9/1 becomes irrelevant.Again, this simply isn't true. And Fearless, C-Dubb, and I have explained it multiple times.
Still complaining about SEC teams not breaking the rules......ffsStill misinterpreting/bitching about others post in a BIG Forum.....ffs
Again, this simply isn't true. And Fearless, C-Dubb, and I have explained it multiple times.Great Post Lock the thread
SEC teams could potentially go 14-0 in that 9th game because it is OOC. That same result is mathematically impossible for B1G teams, by necessity they must go 7-7 in that 9th game because it is in-conference. That's as simple and clear as I can make it.
14-0 is way better than 7-7. Now, certainly, the SEC could also go 0-14 in that 9th game since it is OOC. But I think we all know that isn't currently happening, because SEC teams aren't scheduling tough opponents in that slot, and it's not likely to change in the future. As you yourself stated, if SEC teams were forced to schedule another P5 in that slot, then the phones of the ADs at Kansas, Indiana, Rutgers, Oregon State, and the entire ACC, would be ringing off the hook.
Comparing relative conference strength seems silly to me and usually results in incorrect analysis and conclusions, but the way the current post-season is set up, it remains important. And the difference in that potential delta of 7 more losses within your own conference can make a large impact on the perception of relative conference strength.
And yes, of course, if the B1G and B12 don't like it, they can drop to 8 conference games and arrange the FCS Cupcake Weekend just as the SEC does. It's entirely within their power to do so.
You can apply whatever slanted phrasing you want, but you're still complaining that the SEC hasn't changed the scheduling rules/practices it has had in place. You're complaining that they're not volunteering to make things harder on its members, in terms of winning as many games as possible - without any rule stating that they must.You're still complaining with your continued condescending attempts to correct others legitimate views/opinions that has their place.Feel free to move along to an SEC Forum,by all means-we'll survive the vacuum.In before the Lock :cheer:
It looks so petty.
Yeah, and if you go 14-0 in the OOC game, good for you, it's data.
You also could go 0-14. The odds are a conference would be either 8-6 or 6-8 with equal probability.
If you schedule a P5 team 8 years ahead of time, you have only a suggestion as to how good they might be. If you scheduled Wake Forest this year, you might be surprised.
And there are not enough Kansas types to go around. These would be two game series in the main. If someone picks off Vandy as a pastry, you also lose revenue in the away game on the gate.
I don't think teams would be able to cherry pick pastries if limited to P5 level teams with much consistency, they would try no doubt, but they'd run out of teams available. And if they schedule Kansas, great for them, the Big 12 teams get the same benefit.
Well, obviously I disagree entirely.
And ten would be a lot better than what we have now anyway. Playing three pastries with zero chance to win would change to two pastries and one P5 level team that MIGHT turn out to be pretty good in 8 years.
Better for CFB and better for the fan, even if magically every SEC team somehow rounded up all the pastry P5 programs to play year after year (which I think is largely not practicable across the board, some would get left out, and Vandy would be tempting for other P5 programs).
Kansas is better than Georgia State.
And of course some teams play their 9 game conference slate and zero P5 opponents (Ohio State this year). It's not uncommon. But, it would mean teams who play an 8 game conference slate would be on more even ground with those who play 9. They'd both be playing ten P5 level teams. As it is now, Alabama plays "Duke" and three complete pastries. Wouldn't it be "BETTER" if they had to play Duke AND North Carolina?
Better for CFB and better for the fan, even if magically every SEC team somehow rounded up all the pastry P5 programs to play year after year (which I think is largely not practicable across the board, some would get left out, and Vandy would be tempting for other P5 programs).It seems disingenuous to say “Duke” and three patsies. Bama has generally tried to schedule a good team there. The run has been:
Kansas is better than Georgia State.
And of course some teams play their 9 game conference slate and zero P5 opponents (Ohio State this year). It's not uncommon. But, it would mean teams who play an 8 game conference slate would be on more even ground with those who play 9. They'd both be playing ten P5 level teams. As it is now, Alabama plays "Duke" and three complete pastries. Wouldn't it be "BETTER" if they had to play Duke AND North Carolina?
Every place has pros and cons, except Austin, TX. I hear it's the place you want to be.No Cons except for the electrical engineer types that frequent that bastion of weirdness
and the poor excuse for BBQYeah, I tried several places out there, they were mediocre at best.
You're still complaining with your continued condescending attempts to correct others legitimate views/opinions that has their place.Feel free to move along to an SEC Forum,by all means-we'll survive the vacuum.In before the Lock :cheer:What's with the mentioning of locking the thread? Opposing ideas too scary? My condescension is in direct correlation with the evidence provided by the other side, so if I seem especially condescending, then it's because the evidence opposing my views is lacking.
Blue Ash Chili has a six way which adds deep friend jalapenos. I order that, hold the beans, and it's not bad at all.The only 2-3-4-5 way food mention I know of is how you want your hash browns at Waffle House.
I would demur from the beans, so you can also get a 4-way onion, as opposed to a 4-way bean.
One way - chili
Two way - chili over spaghetti
Three way - topped with cheddar cheese
Four way - can add EITHER onion OR beans
Five way - onion AND beans included
Six way - fried jalapenos.
Blue Ash Chili has a six way which adds deep friend jalapenos. I order that, hold the beans, and it's not bad at all.What would you call it if you wanted a bowl of chili, topped by cheese, onions and fried jalapenos?
I would demur from the beans, so you can also get a 4-way onion, as opposed to a 4-way bean.
One way - chili
Two way - chili over spaghetti
Three way - topped with cheddar cheese
Four way - can add EITHER onion OR beans
Five way - onion AND beans included
Six way - fried jalapenos.
What would you call it if you wanted a bowl of chili, topped by cheese, onions and fried jalapenos?Well, first you wouldn't be in Cincinnati.
6-5+4+3-2+1 = 7 Way?
What's with the mentioning of locking the thread? Opposing ideas too scary?Much better presentation....Baby Steps - you get a Yuengling
I've never had any, of course. But as we've discussed before, it's really just a type of spaghetti sauce. As long as I'm not going in thinking it's like MY kind of chili, I'll probably enjoy it. I like pasta, I like sauce, I like cheese on top of pasta and sauce. One of the other toppings is onions right? I regularly put onions on top of Texas-style chili so I can understand that, too. I'm not sure I'd really dig beans in the middle of my spaghetti and sauce dish, but I'll try anything once.Too many carbs.Now remove the pasta,replace w/beans(pinto,kidney,black) then you have the base of a good Chili - simple.Raw onions on top
Blue Ash Chili has a six way which adds deep friend jalapenos. I order that, hold the beans, and it's not bad at all.I would try this...........
Well, first you wouldn't be in Cincinnati.I would also try this...........
But if you wanted a bowl of Cincy chili without spaghetti, it would be a 6-way hold the spaghetti and beans.
and horrible yucky chili that has no beansCrazy Talk
You can apply whatever slanted phrasing you want, but you're still complaining that the SEC hasn't changed the scheduling rules/practices it has had in place. You're complaining that they're not volunteering to make things harder on its members, in terms of winning as many games as possible - without any rule stating that they must.Nick Saban must be pretty petty too, as he wants--or at least says he does--the same thing.
It looks so petty.
You're wanting an entity to depart from a status quo that is working out well for it, with there being no incentive to do so. Huh? Wha? I guess I just don't understand bitching about an inaction...the SEC didn't actively go from 9 to 8 conference games. If that had happened, it would make sense for you to complain. But to carry on about an inaction is bizarre.
Obviously the Big 10 had a reason to go to 9 games in conference
the reason was money from the Big Ten Network
since the SEC network isn't offering more money to it's members, there is no incentive to change
the Big Ten wanted more money, it got what it wanted. Whining to the NCAA to make it "fair" with other conferences is petty.
Obviously the Big 10 had a reason to go to 9 games in conferenceThat's not why they did it. It could be a consequence, but not right now. They did it to increase strength of schedule for members by adding a quality* team without having to provide a huge payout.
the reason was money from the Big Ten Network
since the SEC network isn't offering more money to it's members, there is no incentive to change
the Big Ten wanted more money, it got what it wanted. Whining to the NCAA to make it "fair" with other conferences is petty.
I lean to thinking a more aggressive slate can be of benefit even if you lose one on occasion. Texas and ND both also gained some cred even in losing.and the network love the ratings
That's not why they did it. It could be a consequence, but not right now. They did it to increase strength of schedule for members by adding a quality* team without having to provide a huge payout.I gotta think money was a huge consequence
* Quality is relative. For example, I'd rather UW play a high MAC, MWC or AAC program than a certain member (for now) of this conference.
Nick Saban must be pretty petty too, as he wants--or at least says he does--the same thing.Saban holds a certain amount of power, I think we'd all agree. He could get pissy and, I believe, enact change when it comes to this issue. But has he? He can safely say he wants 9 games and look good, while doing nothing to create the change. Win-win.
Saban holds a certain amount of power, I think we'd all agree. He could get pissy and, I believe, enact change when it comes to this issue. But has he? He can safely say he wants 9 games and look good, while doing nothing to create the change. Win-win.I wouldn't say that's a given, but it's certainly a possibility.
We all realize this, don't we?
If there was a P5 minimum, we might get some same-conference matchups not counting in the conference standings. Say Indiana isn't on Wisconsin's schedule, but the Badgers would like a P5 cupcake to schedule.....hey, why not IU?The '70s were the last decade of the 20th century in which I paid day-to-day attention to college football, and I don't remember that being common at all. If it happened more than half a dozen times at the major-college level, I'd be amazed.
This was pretty common back in the 70s.
When I interviewed in Cincy, I was fascinated to see so many chili parlors. I like chili and made it often. My first night here I pulled in with my car and a UHaul trailer and unloaded and thought I would sample this chili. There was a Gold Star not far from the apt. I ordered chili and was asked what kind. I looked perplexed and the lady said "2-way, 3-way, 4-way, 5-way, which?". For an instant, I thought I had mistakenly entered a house of ill repute. I told her I just wanted a bowl of chili, which is a one way I suppose.:57:
It was AWFUL. I was hungry, and they offered oyster crackers and hot sauce and I managed to quaff it down but it was far from transcendent.
I don't think I had any more for years. Folks at work would want to go out for it and I would demur.
Blue Ash Chili has a six way which adds deep friend jalapenos. I order that, hold the beans, and it's not bad at all.In Tulsa, Ike's Chili, which goes back to the 1920s and was supposedly Will Rogers' favorite restaurant destination whenever he stopped in town, has something like that, although the named dishes don't go beyond three-way. I don't think it offers fried jalapenos, but you can get the pickled variety, sliced.
I would demur from the beans, so you can also get a 4-way onion, as opposed to a 4-way bean.
One way - chili
Two way - chili over spaghetti
Three way - topped with cheddar cheese
Four way - can add EITHER onion OR beans
Five way - onion AND beans included
Six way - fried jalapenos.
The '70s were the last decade of the 20th century in which I paid day-to-day attention to college football, and I don't remember that being common at all. If it happened more than half a dozen times at the major-college level, I'd be amazed.The SEC used to play a lot of "non-conference" conference games. I don't think anyone else did that.
The '70s were the last decade of the 20th century in which I paid day-to-day attention to college football, and I don't remember that being common at all. If it happened more than half a dozen times at the major-college level, I'd be amazed.I guess I worded that poorly. It was much more common then, compared to now. And it may have been mostly SEC-centric. But it was definitely common for the SEC back in the day (purposeful use of common this time).
. . . There was one year, I think 1971, when UGA has a so so team and an invite to the Sun Bowl. Nebraska was in the running for an NC and somehow lost their last game and all the major bowls were committed, they lost out going to the Cotton who invited whoever beat them. So, the Huskers dropped all the way to the Sun Bowl. They apparently were not happy and demolished UGA. Dooley said he realized after that that they needed a real strength program at UGA.It wasn't 1971.
1969:Yep. I just made an addendum to my post.
http://patrickgarbin.blogspot.com/2011/12/no-fun-in-69-sun.html (http://patrickgarbin.blogspot.com/2011/12/no-fun-in-69-sun.html)
http://www.sunbowl.org/the_sun_bowl_game/recap/36 (http://www.sunbowl.org/the_sun_bowl_game/recap/36)
In 1979, UGA was 6-5 with a 5-1 conference record, and had a lead in their last game at the half which would have made them 6-0 in conference and 0-5 OOC. You don't see that often.Obviously, the SEC sucked in 79
They would have gone to the Sugar Bowl at 7-5 with a 6-0 conference record.
Are you high?I was getting a bit of a buzz. It wore off.