CFB51 College Football Fan Community
The Power Four => Big Ten => Topic started by: medinabuckeye1 on July 13, 2026, 04:10:57 PM
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This actually popped up in my feed on a Badger site (https://www.yahoo.com/news/us/articles/18-big-ten-schools-ranked-110232330.html). I arranged it to be more useful:
(https://i.imgur.com/4W0Xj2g.png)
NOTE:
To the extent that the B1G cares about academics anymore, these are not and never have been the academic rankings that they cared about. What they DID care about was graduate/research academics and the money that flows from that.
Honest question for @betarhoalphadelta (https://www.cfb51.com/index.php?action=profile;u=19) and the rest of the Purdue contingent: The ranking listed here for Purdue isn't bad frankly it isn't nearly as high as I expected. Is this an issue where Purdue's engineering undergrad program is really good and the rest isn't or what am I missing?
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Rankings that matter.
ShanghaiRanking's Academic Ranking of World Universities (https://www.shanghairanking.com/rankings/arwu/2025)
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Honest question for @betarhoalphadelta (https://www.cfb51.com/index.php?action=profile;u=19) and the rest of the Purdue contingent: The ranking listed here for Purdue isn't bad frankly it isn't nearly as high as I expected. Is this an issue where Purdue's engineering undergrad program is really good and the rest isn't or what am I missing?
I think portions of this are flaws in the ranking model (https://www.usnews.com/education/best-colleges/articles/ranking-criteria-and-weights)...
42% of the ranking is related to the ability of incoming students to leave with a degree.
- 5% on first year retention rate, 16% on graduation rate, 5.5% on Pell graduation rate, for a total of 26.5%.
This very seriously punishes schools who admit a lot of students and some of them flame out. This often unfairly penalizes large state schools unless they're hyper-competitive in admissions (like Michigan or UCLA).
It rewards extremely selective colleges who only take the ones who can't fail and then... Don't fail. These can often be private schools, hence why Northwestern and USC do really well.
So it's largely a measure of how selective the college is.
Purdue has long been a somewhat egalitarian school that admits a little more widely and from there it's "sink or swim".
- 10% is graduation rate performance, and another 5.5% is Pell graduation rate performance, which added to the former gets you to the 42% I mentioned.
This one is a little more nuanced... It appears to be related to graduation rates relative to incoming freshman quality. Essentially it seems to be a measure of how well-supported students are and how well the university handholds them to graduation.
In this, I don't know how well I can compare Purdue to others. When I was there, I don't recall a tremendous amount of administrative support, but things might be different now.
That said, Purdue hasn't raised their tuition since the 2012-2013 school year. It wouldn't shock me if one of the ways they keep it low is by not constantly inflating their support staff. Which could mean they're not handholding students as much, which might hurt both of the "graduation rate performance" metrics.
Also, there is another metric, 5%, that's related to standardized test scores. That again would reward extremely selective colleges who only take the cream of the crop, vs larger public institutions who admit more widely.
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As an example, look at how closely correlated this is vs the USNWR rankings:
(https://i.imgur.com/YEjMayo.png)
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yup, I was even accepted at Iowa and UNL
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None of the "rankings" matter. Look at the program you are interested in, how many of them are taught by actual professors, then who the professors are.
And even then you can make your academic path what you want. Some of the dumbest kids I graduated with had a connection to UM, paid to get in, and skated by with a 2.2 in General Studies. My brother's best friend graduated high school on probation, went to community college for 2 years, transferred to Western Michigan, transferred to Michigan State, transferred to Michigan. Has a UM degree with 2 semesters of classes there. I know people who went to Eastern Michigan after 2 years of community college that put together a great 4 year curriculum after maturing after taking high school unseriously.
My uncle is a judge in Ohio, only got into Ohio State because in the 70s OSU guaranteed admission to any in state HS grad with a 2.0 GPA. So he went, grew up, then went to law school at OSU, had a 30 year career as an attorney, and then became a judge
College is what you make of it, and literally no employer cares, beyond alumni networking in hiring
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For some it matters when looking for the first job. In my field, once you become licensed nobody cares.
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College is what you make of it, and literally no employer cares, beyond alumni networking in hiring
And IMHO that's not even a thing in most of STEM. If I were hiring I'd be looking at work experience, not where someone graduated.
For some it matters when looking for the first job. In my field, once you become licensed nobody cares.
This. Having a more impressive college name on your resume heading to your first job might open doors. But as I said above, beyond your first job it's going to matter more what experience you have, not where you studied.
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yup, Cincy created a thread for this
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For some it matters when looking for the first job. In my field, once you become licensed nobody cares.
I sort of thought that, but I still think only because of alumni networks.
Engineering is probably a wider net, so maybe it means less. Duquesne is not a great law school, but it attracts a lot of Western PA grads, who stay is Western PA. Pitt was when I was there a top 30 law school. I knew every time I walked into an interview, and there was a Duquesne diploma behind the desk I wasn't getting the job
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I scanned a lot of resumes back in the day, hiring both PhDs and BS level folks. The institution name was of minor interest, but I soon learned how folks with a 3.69 from a decent school often had learned very little.
One of my top BS hires was from Northwestern …. state.
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I probably have hired about 50 people in my life. I've never asked for GPA, nor have I given a rip about where they went to school. It might help me learn something about the person, but I don't care. There's simply no correlation to anybody coming from any school. If I have any institutional bias, it might be people who have come from a very specific company in our industry, that I would avoid (I won't name it).
I've hired into financial services industry. (some out of college grads, bachelor's in whatever, some JDs).
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yup, I was even accepted at Iowa and UNL
Well they have vision and the rest of the world wears bifocals
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yup, in hindsight they should have rejected - dropped their graduation rate numbers
but, UNL cashed a few checks
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None of the "rankings" matter. Look at the program you are interested in, how many of them are taught by actual professors, then who the professors are.
And even then you can make your academic path what you want. Some of the dumbest kids I graduated with had a connection to UM, paid to get in, and skated by with a 2.2 in General Studies. My brother's best friend graduated high school on probation, went to community college for 2 years, transferred to Western Michigan, transferred to Michigan State, transferred to Michigan. Has a UM degree with 2 semesters of classes there. I know people who went to Eastern Michigan after 2 years of community college that put together a great 4 year curriculum after maturing after taking high school unseriously.
My uncle is a judge in Ohio, only got into Ohio State because in the 70s OSU guaranteed admission to any in state HS grad with a 2.0 GPA. So he went, grew up, then went to law school at OSU, had a 30 year career as an attorney, and then became a judge
College is what you make of it, and literally no employer cares, beyond alumni networking in hiring
Mostly agree. Only thing I'd add is more from the perspective of a potential student rather than a potential employer. It might be worth looking at the recruiting pipelines to programs of various schools. For example, PWC, one of the "Big 4" accounting firms likes to target and recruit grads from LSU's accounting department. Is LSU a great, renowned accounting program? I have no idea....I haven't seen anything to suggest it's superior. But PWC, for whatever reason, likes those grads, and if you're willing to move to NYC, it tends to be a good place to get that degree if a nice offer upon completion is paramount. I know of other industries or individual businesses that target other schools' grads for certain things....I don't know so much if it's reputation of the program, some kind of ranking, or most likely they've just had success with certain people and become creatures of habit. But maybe that's something to look at when assessing the value of a degree from different schools.
I probably have hired about 50 people in my life. I've never asked for GPA, nor have I given a rip about where they went to school. It might help me learn something about the person, but I don't care. There's simply no correlation to anybody coming from any school. If I have any institutional bias, it might be people who have come from a very specific company in our industry, that I would avoid (I won't name it).
I've hired into financial services industry. (some out of college grads, bachelor's in whatever, some JDs).
There's a decent amount of evidence showing the positive correlation between where someone finishes in their class and their career success. As opposed to virtually no correlation between career success and where they went to school. i.e., the kid who finishes first in his class at Texas Southern University's law program is likely to have a better career as a lawyer than the kid who finishes middle of the pack with a Yale law degree.
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One of my top BS hires was from Northwestern …. state.
In Louisiana?
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i.e., the kid who finishes first in his class at Texas Southern University's law program is likely to have a better career as a lawyer than the kid who finishes middle of the pack with a Yale law degree.
Those end up in DC, right?
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yup, Cincy created a thread for this
I didn't see it, sorry. Please merge.
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:57:
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The rankings are always dumb because there’s someone at some schools who figure out how to game them and then the schools who are trying to rank well rank well, and it all falls apart.
Plus, as I learned growing up near UC Berkeley, just because you have some kick ass graduate programs doesn’t mean you have an all-around great undergraduate teaching school.
When I first got hired, my boss said Wisconsin on the resume caught his eye, but it was pretty entry level and I had a decent enough portfolio. In hiring now, I think colleges sometimes offer a little hint about a person, but often that bears out with the rest of the stuff.
I also did a hiring last year and wondered why someone went to three state flagship schools. Bet you can guess.
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The rankings are always dumb because there’s someone at some schools who figure out how to game them and then the schools who are trying to rank well rank well, and it all falls apart.
Plus, as I learned growing up near UC Berkeley, just because you have some kick ass graduate programs doesn’t mean you have an all-around great undergraduate teaching school.
When I first got hired, my boss said Wisconsin on the resume caught his eye, but it was pretty entry level and I had a decent enough portfolio. In hiring now, I think colleges sometimes offer a little hint about a person, but often that bears out with the rest of the stuff.
I also did a hiring last year and wondered why someone went to three state flagship schools. Bet you can guess.
They like football?
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Question for @MarqHusker (https://www.cfb51.com/index.php?action=profile;u=41) , @bayareabadger (https://www.cfb51.com/index.php?action=profile;u=1571) , @847badgerfan (https://www.cfb51.com/index.php?action=profile;u=5) or anyone else who does hiring.
We've mentioned thoughts on how much schools matter, but how much do transcripts matter for you?
Example: One graduate took 7 years to graduate, but the transcript is clean (I mean it's straightforward). Another graduate also took seven years to complete their degree, but the transcript has a lot of drops. You can see the grades are good for the completed classes, but the dropped classes clearly impeded speedy progress.
This is a real life example contrasting two people I know. You wouldn't know any of this as the hiring agent, but the situations are: The first graduate lost both parents young, had to work, could not carry a full load, and took 7 years to graduate. But she plodded along through her degree with good grades. The second graduate had no such difficulties, but dropped multiple classes because he struggled at various points (and in his case, I just happen to know it most likely was due to the fact that he wasn't putting maximum effort into it).
Now, you wouldn't know those details, but really, imo, you can kind of sus out the general story. A transcript that indicates a slow progression is different than a transcript that indicates a slow progression with a lot of dropped classes along the way. And the longer it goes (7 years, in their cases), that starts to be a glaring difference, for me.
So I'm wondering, beyond the degree held and the school they got it from, how much attention to transcripts do you pay? Or do you even bother with them at all? I noticed after I went back to school and was job-hunting, not once was I ever asked for my transcript. But if it were me, I think I'd want to take a look at those.
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Ive never asked for a transcript in my life.
I may notice or query an applicant's timeline if it stands out for some reason.
Grades? I have never bothered. I would be more attracted to someone w a Series 24 securities license and an alum of directional U than someone w an AB from Harvard, JD from Yale, perfect Grades, law review
Ive hired from Top 30 all the way down to places ive never heard of which are likely unranked or lower tier
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Transcripts only matter when you're looking for that first job, and yes, I looked at them and sometimes made decisions to not hire based on them.
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We used to have meetings of all the hiring managers with "slots". We'd sift through maybe 50 resumes* in an hour and pull any that merited interest. Usually ten or so would make the first cut, and then folks would argue who got to bring them in for a site interview.
*Many had comments from an on campus recruiter who had interviewed the person. I found often these were useless, some of the interviewers thought every candidate was stellar. I later wound up on the other side of this equation.
Then we'd send a letter to schedule a day visit, the candidate would come in and get a greeting from some higher level manager and then give a one hour seminar on their work, which was make or break. Then two one hour interviews, then after lunch we'd show them around. It is a pretty exhausting day for the interviewee.
Did the resume matter? Some.
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I will note, ive evolved a bit in how I approach more junior level interviews. I spend more intentional time expressing what the role is AND what it isn't. Our industry can be a bit elusive/abstract and we want to demystify as much as we can so we dont somebody that thinks this is something else.
That's been a good move to help self screen and scare off folks who think they are coming into a 'Finance' job and then are shocked to find out that our world of Finance is Compliance and Governance!
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Agreed, I'd only care about grades for a new college grad... But I'm not typically hiring NCGs.
Once someone has a few years in the industry, they're rated on what they've done in the workforce, not what they did in school.
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I was musing about some of the dumb questions I got asked back when, like "Where do you see yourself in ten years?".
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They like football?
He started in a few spots across three conferences!
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Agreed, I'd only care about grades for a new college grad... But I'm not typically hiring NCGs.
Once someone has a few years in the industry, they're rated on what they've done in the workforce, not what they did in school.
Well, yes.
I guess I forgot to mention I'm talking about NCG's and "entry-level" jobs. I wouldn't expect anyone to be worried about transcripts for more advanced positions taken by someone with industry experience.
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I was musing about some of the dumb questions I got asked back when, like "Where do you see yourself in ten years?".
I was thinking about that recently--brought it up with my dad when I was visiting him last weekend as well...
I've never had a "career plan". I've just sort of tried to do my job as best I can, and when various opportunities opened in front of me, to step into them. So far it's worked out pretty well.
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Question for @MarqHusker (https://www.cfb51.com/index.php?action=profile;u=41) , @bayareabadger (https://www.cfb51.com/index.php?action=profile;u=1571) , @847badgerfan (https://www.cfb51.com/index.php?action=profile;u=5) or anyone else who does hiring.
We've mentioned thoughts on how much schools matter, but how much do transcripts matter for you?
Example: One graduate took 7 years to graduate, but the transcript is clean (I mean it's straightforward). Another graduate also took seven years to complete their degree, but the transcript has a lot of drops. You can see the grades are good for the completed classes, but the dropped classes clearly impeded speedy progress.
This is a real life example contrasting two people I know. You wouldn't know any of this as the hiring agent, but the situations are: The first graduate lost both parents young, had to work, could not carry a full load, and took 7 years to graduate. But she plodded along through her degree with good grades. The second graduate had no such difficulties, but dropped multiple classes because he struggled at various points (and in his case, I just happen to know it most likely was due to the fact that he wasn't putting maximum effort into it).
Now, you wouldn't know those details, but really, imo, you can kind of sus out the general story. A transcript that indicates a slow progression is different than a transcript that indicates a slow progression with a lot of dropped classes along the way. And the longer it goes (7 years, in their cases), that starts to be a glaring difference, for me.
So I'm wondering, beyond the degree held and the school they got it from, how much attention to transcripts do you pay? Or do you even bother with them at all? I noticed after I went back to school and was job-hunting, not once was I ever asked for my transcript. But if it were me, I think I'd want to take a look at those.
They don’t? The issue is I still might not be able to read the exact reason for the longer time. Or for the drops. If you’re dropping because you’re struggling or because you’re helping your alcoholic parents, obviously a different beast.
I don’t think I’d trust a person who dropped enough classes for grade to spend seven years in college, mostly because that’s too much money to spend when you’re not good at this. (Granted, I’ve not hired a stem person whose classes clearly map onto skills.
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I was musing about some of the dumb questions I got asked back when, like "Where do you see yourself in ten years?".
I’ve told interviewers, there are almost zero points in my life where I thought I’d be where I was across a five-year window.
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Yeah, I think a perfectly reasonable response to "Where do you see yourself in 5 years?" is "In your job." Because it's that dumb.
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Yeah, I think a perfectly reasonable response to "Where do you see yourself in 5 years?" is "In your job." Because it's that dumb.
I did that once. I got the job (but never his, as I left to start my own gig).