CFB51 College Football Fan Community
The Power Four => Big Ten => Topic started by: OrangeAfroMan on December 19, 2025, 05:25:42 AM
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Who you think they'd pick, not necessarily who you'd pick.
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GT
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nd is the only option that brings in more $$$
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And more headaches. We have enough of that.
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maybe we should have a poll regarding headaches we'd like to kick to the curb?
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And more headaches. We have enough of that.
Yeah, we already have one self-righteous, holier-than-thou, entitled a-hole fanbase.
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I went UVA/UNC. It is about eyeballs. Notre Dame brings more than those two but UVA/UNC locks down the 9th (NC) and 12th (VA) most populous states.
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None,nada,no,not,negative
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I went UVA/UNC. It is about eyeballs. Notre Dame brings more than those two but UVA/UNC locks down the 9th (NC) and 12th (VA) most populous states.
cable TV isn't as powerful any longer for the BTN $$ grab.
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Who you think they'd pick, not necessarily who you'd pick.
Why da Hell does the Big Ten need to get to 20 when the rest of you aren't even at 18 yet?
GFY brah.
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FWIW:
If it were strictly up to me I wouldn't have added quite a few of the schools that we added to get to 18 and I think most everyone here is in agreement on that.
The OP didn't ask that and went out of his way to NOT ask who WE would pick but who we think *THEY* will pick.
cable TV isn't as powerful any longer for the BTN $$ grab.
It isn't, but there IS still value in being THE league for a state.
My concern with either FSU or GaTech is that with either of those programs the B1G would be a CLEAR second fiddle to the SEC (UF/UGA) and I don't know that we want to go down that road. Florida (3rd) and Georgia (8th) are more populous than North Carolina (9th) and Virginia (12th) but I think there is at least an argument that we'd be better off bringing in THE major school in NC and VA than a secondary school in FL or GA.
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Notre Dame and Miami.
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I selected ND and Virginia for you B1G'ers.
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FWIW, states by pop:
- 39.4M California - B1G
- 31.3M Texas - SEC
- 23.4M Florida - SEC (the ACC is a clear second even with both Miami and FSU)
- 19.9M New York - ? ? ? The B1G has an argument with Rutgers but CFB isn't all that big here
- 13.1M Pennsylvania - B1G
- 12.7M Illinois - B1G
- 11.9M Ohio - B1G
- 11.2M Georgia - SEC (ACC/GaTech is a clear second and it isn't close)
- 11.0M North Carolina - ACC. NC is odd in that they have WAY too many 'major' conference schools with four (DooK, UNC, NCST, Wake). My perception is that UNC is far-and-away the fan favorite locally.
- 10.1M Michigan - B1G. For decades MI was right behind OH but GA and NC have no surpassed them.
- 9.5M New Jersey - B1G
- 8.9M Virginia - ACC
- 8.0M Washington - B1G
- 7.6M Arizona - B12
- 7.2M Tennessee - SEC
- 7.1M Massachusetts - ACC?
- 6.9M Indiana - B1G and ND
- 6.3M Maryland - B1G
- 6.2M Missouri - SEC
- 6.0M Wisconsin - B1G
- 6.0M Colorado - B12, Colorado will surpass WI soon.
- 5.8M Minnesota - B1G
- 5.5M South Carolina - SEC/ACC, who is the fan favorite locally Clemson or USCe?
- 5.2M Alabama - SEC
- 4.6M Louisiana - SEC
- 4.6M Kentucky - SEC
- 4.3M Oregon - B1G
- 4.1M Oklahoma - SEC
- 3.7M Connecticut - ? ? ? Do they even care?
- 3.5M Utah - B12
- 3.3M Nevada - ? ? ?
- 3.2M Iowa - B1G
- 3.1M Arkansas - SEC
- 3.0M Kansas - B12
- 2.9M Mississippi - SEC
- 2.1M New Mexico - ? ? ?
- 2.0M Nebraska - B1G
- 2.0M Idaho - MWC?
- 1.7M West by god Virginia - B12
- 1.4M Hawaii - ? ? ?
- 1.4M New Hampshire - ? ? ? Do they even care?
- 1.4M Maine - ? ? ? Do they even care?
- 1.1M Montana - ? ? ?
- 1.1M Rhode (we're not really an) Island - ? ? ? Do they even care?
- 1.1M Delaware - ? ? ? Do they even care?
- 0.9M South Dakota - ? ? ?
- 0.8M North Dakota - ? ? ?
- 0.7M Alaska - ? ? ?
- 0.6M Vermont - ? ? ? Do they even care?
- 0.6M Wyoming ? ? ?
The biggest two most realistically available states as between the SEC and B1G are #9 North Carolina and #12 Virginia and both are growing rapidly. Time to lock them down.
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SEC gets the CSA including the disputed territories which they already have.
Big Ten gets everything else.
It's the only geography that we haven't annihilated yet with the Conference realignment, might as well hang onto it.
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/14/United_States_1864-10-1865.png)
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Yeah, we already have one self-righteous, holier-than-thou, entitled a-hole fanbase.
One?
:57:
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One?
:57:
(https://preview.redd.it/bekphnqftcb41.jpg?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=4a2c36ded36462f53c38b0dc4ca9aa67a5a1a441)
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Yeah, we already have one self-righteous, holier-than-thou, entitled a-hole fanbase.
Oregon is all of that. The B1G invited F'ing cancer into its own body.
IF they are going to 20, they absolutely must get into Florida and Georgia.
FSU and GT fit that bill.
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IF they are going to 20, they absolutely must get into Florida and Georgia.
FSU and GT fit that bill.
Are you not at all concerned about being the second league in a state? Per my previous post, UF and UGA are clearly the #1 schools in those states so if we were to grab FSU/GaTech we would be a CLEAR junior league in those states relative to the SEC.
I think we'd be better off being the undisputed top dog in VA and NC than being a secondary league in FL and GA.
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Are you not at all concerned about being the second league in a state? Per my previous post, UF and UGA are clearly the #1 schools in those states so if we were to grab FSU/GaTech we would be a CLEAR junior league in those states relative to the SEC.
I think we'd be better off being the undisputed top dog in VA and NC than being a secondary league in FL and GA.
Atlanta would be a solid place to go watch a game for most of the fanbases is in the B1G, and Georgia recruiting is very fertile.
We all know about Florida recruiting.
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Florida/FSU is arguable about who is bigger in this state.
Clearly both are ahead of Miami, but it's not clear that Florida actually has more fans than FSU.
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I voted Arizona State because of how stupid and ridiculous it would be to pursue them.
What? Michigan includes Kenny Dillingham in their coaching search and suddenly Sun Devils sports are worthy of the Big Ten?
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Florida/FSU is arguable about who is bigger in this state.
Clearly both are ahead of Miami, but it's not clear that Florida actually has more fans than FSU.
When I've looked into it in the past, it wasn't arguable, UF was WAY ahead.
The only semi-scientific based article I have that touches on this issue is a bit dated but back in 2011 the NYT made an attempt to quantify college football fandom (https://archive.nytimes.com/thequad.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/09/19/the-geography-of-college-football-fans-and-realignment-chaos/), they found that UF has more than twice as many fans as FSU. It has always been my impression that UF more-or-less dominates in Florida with the exception of the immediate areas around Tallahassee and Miami where FSU and Miami reign.
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That's different from what I see here. Going by license plates on cars, it's about equal.
I see lots of these
(https://i.imgur.com/LCF8TlW.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/AyPzAsi.png)
And only a few of these
(https://i.imgur.com/X0YNGM8.png)
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Also lets not forget that UF was coming off of a couple of MNC's when that WSJ article was penned. FSU has mostly been the better program since.
(https://i.imgur.com/csppnH6.png)
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F all 3 Floridah programs
just steal their recruits and let them shrivel on the vine
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Also lets not forget that UF was coming off of a couple of MNC's when that WSJ article was penned. FSU has mostly been the better program since.
It was NYT not WSJ but yeah. I wish they'd update it because I wonder how much recent success impacted things. It came out at the beginning of the 2011 season. End of 2010:
- Auburn
- TCU
- Oregon
- Stanford
- Ohio State
2009:
- Bama
- Texas
- Florida
- Boise
- Ohio State
2008:
- Florida
- Utah
- USC
- Texas
- Oklahoma
2007:
- LSU
- UGA
- USC
- Mizzou
- Ohio State
Based on their method, I'm not sure how much difference it makes. Obviously there are a lot of bandwagon fans out there but I think the serious CFB fans are pretty loyal. A lot of us (like you and I for example) are alums. It isn't like we can erase our diplomas and write "this year's NC" on them.
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That's different from what I see here. Going by license plates on cars, it's about equal.
I see lots of these
(https://i.imgur.com/LCF8TlW.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/AyPzAsi.png)
And only a few of these
(https://i.imgur.com/X0YNGM8.png)
I want to get a map and sit down with you and draw a dot where you live and draw a circle of your visible 360 degrees around you. And then show you the 99.9% of the state outside of that circle.
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Also lets not forget that UF was coming off of a couple of MNC's when that WSJ article was penned. FSU has mostly been the better program since.
(https://i.imgur.com/csppnH6.png)
2025 W
2024 W
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I voted Arizona State because of how stupid and ridiculous it would be to pursue them.
What? Michigan includes Kenny Dillingham in their coaching search and suddenly Sun Devils sports are worthy of the Big Ten?
If the Big Ten had any desire to pick some western schools to balance out things, ASU, with its AAU membership, makes sense.
They're the best football program historically out west that the Big Ten doesn't have already (Utah is more recently successful).
Maybe they'd add Cal/Stanford. Maybe FSU and GT. Maybe Miami and ND. Who knows?
I'm stunned ND is still the pick among Big Tenners. You guys must like abusive relationships.
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All that matters is that ND brings more TV money than any other 4 teams on that list combined
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All that matters is that ND brings more TV money than any other 4 teams on that list combined
...which disincentivizes them from sharing it with yous guys.
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Is ND's fan base going to have a bubble in 10-20 years, in terms of aging out? Morbid, I know, but the golden domers are not special to anyone under the age of 35. Their privileged status probably seems really odd to most, actually.
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hopin NBC will finally pull the purse strings
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Is ND's fan base going to have a bubble in 10-20 years, in terms of aging out? Morbid, I know, but the golden domers are not special to anyone under the age of 35. Their privileged status probably seems really odd to most, actually.
missing the 12-team playoff and refusing bowl games will certainly speed things up
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hopin NBC will finally pull the purse strings
Another reason young people have no inkling of ND's special status - network TV. They don't even know what that is.
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I'm not even worried about the mandatory top12 thing for ND. The committee can just sit them at 13. Any random team with an equal or better record can be ranked 12th and defended perfectly well for 5 minutes with Rece Davis.
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Another reason young people have no inkling of ND's special status - network TV. They don't even know what that is.
PeaCock
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I'm stunned ND is still the pick among Big Tenners. You guys must like abusive relationships.
You asked who we thought the conference would pick, not who we would want them to pick.
Don't change your criteria midstream. I selected ND even though I might be more anti-ND than even Badge... It's like I'm the combination of Badge's anger at self-righteous holier-than-thou fan bases, my own Purdue rival-hatred of ND, and your anti-religious animosity toward ND.
But I think the B1G would admit them in a second if they could, even if it's the exact opposite of what I want.
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You asked who we thought the conference would pick, not who we would want them to pick.
Don't change your criteria midstream. I selected ND even though I might be more anti-ND than even Badge... It's like I'm the combination of Badge's anger at self-righteous holier-than-thou fan bases, my own Purdue rival-hatred of ND, and your anti-religious animosity toward ND.
But I think the B1G would admit them in a second if they could, even if it's the exact opposite of what I want.
True, good point.
But I'm still surprised the Big Ten wouldn't have any pride and tell ND to kick rocks, just on principle. The conference can make all the dollars without the Irish.
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True, good point.
But I'm still surprised the Big Ten wouldn't have any pride and tell ND to kick rocks, just on principle. The conference can make all the dollars without the Irish.
They'd do it so the SEC can't have them.
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Oh, I bet the SEC would host the back-room cigar-smoke meeting to freeze the Irish out.
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It's all about the dollars, and--as noted--ND brings more than anyone else on the list.
I wonder if ND would have too much pride and tell the Big Ten to kick rocks, as they did in the 1990s. Although the ROI in the 90s was probably much smaller.
And as I've noted before, all this animosity towards ND for its having built its own, national brand can be tied directly back to Michigan--specifically Fielding Yost--not wanting to have to compete with ND and not wanting a Catholic university in the conference. So save your bitterness for Michigan and Yost.
(I know you won't--it's ok, you're entitled to your petty grievances, just like I am--but maybe make a little extra space for some anger at Michigan for having caused it.)
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For a long time I thought that the B1G wouldn't take Notre Dame because their academics aren't good enough. Notre Dame fans think that I'm either stoned or joking when I say that because Notre Dame is a very good undergrad school but I'm neither stoned nor joking. The academics that the B1G cared about were the graduate/research programs and Notre Dame is absolutely pathetic on that front. However, we took Oregon so apparently academics don't matter anymore and it is all about eyeballs.
I think that Notre Dame is a difficult possibility to consider because they aren't like the others. The vast majority of CFB fandom is geographically based. Even when it isn't, it frequently is just with a delay. Ie, @OrangeAfroMan (https://www.cfb51.com/index.php?action=profile;u=58) lives in Arizona and is a Florida fan but he grew up in Florida. I'm sure there are also some second and maybe even third generation fans who root for a team from the state that their Dad or Grandfather grew up in.
Notre Dame is different because, I think, most of their fandom is based on religion rather than geography.
They are also different because, in my experience a LOT of Notre Dame fans either have a second school or Notre Dame IS their second school. I know a slew of Catholic Ohioans who are either ND/tOSU or tOSU/ND fans. I'm sure the same thing exists in other states.
I do think that @OrangeAfroMan (https://www.cfb51.com/index.php?action=profile;u=58) has a point here:
Is ND's fan base going to have a bubble in 10-20 years, in terms of aging out? Morbid, I know, but the golden domers are not special to anyone under the age of 35. Their privileged status probably seems really odd to most, actually.
I don't know that it is necessarily as short as 10-20 years but I do think that it is probably in long-term decline. The growth markets to look at are Arizona, Virginia, North Carolina, Georgia, Florida, etc.
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And as I've noted before, all this animosity towards ND for its having built its own, national brand can be tied directly back to Michigan--specifically Fielding Yost--not wanting to have to compete with ND and not wanting a Catholic university in the conference. So save your bitterness for Michigan and Yost.
(I know you won't--it's ok, you're entitled to your petty grievances, just like I am--but maybe make a little extra space for some anger at Michigan for having caused it.)
Seems to be a theme today, it came up in another thread also but always remember, EVERYTHING bad is Michigan's fault.
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Oh, I bet the SEC would host the back-room cigar-smoke meeting to freeze the Irish out.
It'd be the Baptists and their anti-Catholic animosity? :57:
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Is ND's fan base going to have a bubble in 10-20 years, in terms of aging out? Morbid, I know, but the golden domers are not special to anyone under the age of 35. Their privileged status probably seems really odd to most, actually.
I missed this post until @medinabuckeye1 (https://www.cfb51.com/index.php?action=profile;u=1547) quoted it...
But I think that a good portion of Notre Dame's historic fandom has been from people who didn't go to college and couldn't find South Bend on a map... But they were either Irish or Catholic (or both), and so they were Notre Dame fans. Historically both populations were somewhat denigrated in American society. The Irish and Italians were seen as "lesser" than other Europeans, leading to centralizing in more working-class and/or civil service jobs. And Catholics were similarly distrusted, as we saw with JFK and concerns that he'd be more beholden to the Pope and the Vatican than he would be to America and the Constitution. Nothing crystalizes a marginalized population more than a common champion, and I think the Notre Dame Fighting Irish fit that mold.
I think from a demographic perspective, the under-35 set is less religious than they were 40 years ago. And I'd say those who ostensibly identify as Catholic are probably nowhere near as fervent about Catholicism being their "identity" than they were 40 years ago... So the allure of rooting for Notre Dame just because it's a Catholic school maybe is less of a draw.
Being in California for the last 25 years, where there isn't a massive Irish-identity population (i.e. not like NY or Chicago), I can't really say whether the aspect of being "Irish" as core identity has similarly diluted. But I might think that if it has, then it would be another reason why Notre Dame fandom would be naturally waning in the younger generations.
While most fan bases have some natural perpetuity in graduating alumni, being close family of graduated alumni, etc, Notre Dame never had that. It was always driven by cultural identity. I think it's possible that draw is simply getting weaker as some of those core identity signifiers weaken.
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They'd do it so the SEC can't have them.
yes, there's only one apple yet to pick
the SEC & Big trying to out do the other's TV contract
neither conference REALLY wants ND for reasons, but........ the money reason trumps all
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It's all about the dollars, and--as noted--ND brings more than anyone else on the list.
I wonder if ND would have too much pride and tell the Big Ten to kick rocks, as they did in the 1990s. Although the ROI in the 90s was probably much smaller.
And as I've noted before, all this animosity towards ND for its having built its own, national brand can be tied directly back to Michigan--specifically Fielding Yost--not wanting to have to compete with ND and not wanting a Catholic university in the conference. So save your bitterness for Michigan and Yost.
(I know you won't--it's ok, you're entitled to your petty grievances, just like I am--but maybe make a little extra space for some anger at Michigan for having caused it.)
You don't think that we direct enough anger and bitterness towards the Wolverines? :o
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he has a point
I thought the Big Ten Conference should have punished Michigan for cheating in conference games
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I want to get a map and sit down with you and draw a dot where you live and draw a circle of your visible 360 degrees around you. And then show you the 99.9% of the state outside of that circle.
I don't need you (a teacher) to sit me (a land surveyor) down with a map (now that's funny). I know where I live and I've been all over the state.
Where I live is pretty much dominated by the Midwest, with some fNE and fCanada sprinkled in.
Of that group, I'd say Ohio and Michigan are the most represented here.
I see more OSU and Michigan decorations on cars than I see Florida. And it's not close. I even see more Wisconsin than Florida.
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(https://midbaynews.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/09/Most-popular-license-plate-in-each-county-1536x1156.png)
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Very rare to see a USF plate, even in Tampa.
You can get Georgia Bulldog, Auburn and Bama plates here. Even seen those.
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There are 70K Seminole plates in the state right now. 90K Gator plates.
In the tri-county area here, UF has many more than FSU.
3,782 UF > 2,746 FSU
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I don't need you (a teacher) to sit me (a land surveyor) down with a map (now that's funny). I know where I live and I've been all over the state.
Where I live is pretty much dominated by the Midwest, with some fNE and fCanada sprinkled in.
Of that group, I'd say Ohio and Michigan are the most represented here.
I see more OSU and Michigan decorations on cars than I see Florida. And it's not close. I even see more Wisconsin than Florida.
Then stop being Captain Anecdote over here. Sheesh.
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I've been all over the state. When was the last time you were in SWFL or S FL? TPA/StP?
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I've been all over the state. When was the last time you were in SWFL or S FL? TPA/StP?
Sigh.
So my lesser (having been there less) anecdote paling in comparison to your anecdote still doesn't mean anything even vaguely resembling actual data.
Use your brain. Not your posting-on-the-football-board brain, your actual brain. Please.
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2 teams??????
(https://i.imgur.com/ahwSDBr.png)
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ok Stanford!!!
(https://i.imgur.com/fcjYFov.png)
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And more headaches. We have enough of that.
i mean…you are joking (?). there is no bigger prize left than nd. there should be enough powers in that league by now to keep them in line. i’d strike now if they’re really that po’d (?) at the acc.
but my guess is they don’t join - as long as tv wants them in the mix they will have access. something would have to leverage them. i voted them and miami based on the question’s phrasing but they’ll end up with perhaps miami and uva, nc, or gt.
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fMiami is in the middle of a lawsuit filed by Wisconsin for tampering, and it is also backed by the Big Ten conference.
fMiami is not getting an invite. Don't need more cancer in the conference.
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Bama and Georgia.
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That would go against the Big Ten's preference for quantity over quality. Stick with your Marylands and UCLAs.
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Big Contraction opinion poll
drop Maryland & Rutgers
or
drop UCLA and Warshington
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Big Contraction opinion poll
drop Maryland & Rutgers
or
drop UCLA and Warshington
All 4, plus USC and fOregon.
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I'm with ya, Brother
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Negative expansion. Rutgers to the SEC.
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I missed this post until @medinabuckeye1 (https://www.cfb51.com/index.php?action=profile;u=1547) quoted it...
But I think that a good portion of Notre Dame's historic fandom has been from people who didn't go to college and couldn't find South Bend on a map... But they were either Irish or Catholic (or both), and so they were Notre Dame fans. Historically both populations were somewhat denigrated in American society. The Irish and Italians were seen as "lesser" than other Europeans, leading to centralizing in more working-class and/or civil service jobs. And Catholics were similarly distrusted, as we saw with JFK and concerns that he'd be more beholden to the Pope and the Vatican than he would be to America and the Constitution. Nothing crystalizes a marginalized population more than a common champion, and I think the Notre Dame Fighting Irish fit that mold.
I think from a demographic perspective, the under-35 set is less religious than they were 40 years ago. And I'd say those who ostensibly identify as Catholic are probably nowhere near as fervent about Catholicism being their "identity" than they were 40 years ago... So the allure of rooting for Notre Dame just because it's a Catholic school maybe is less of a draw.
Being in California for the last 25 years, where there isn't a massive Irish-identity population (i.e. not like NY or Chicago), I can't really say whether the aspect of being "Irish" as core identity has similarly diluted. But I might think that if it has, then it would be another reason why Notre Dame fandom would be naturally waning in the younger generations.
While most fan bases have some natural perpetuity in graduating alumni, being close family of graduated alumni, etc, Notre Dame never had that. It was always driven by cultural identity. I think it's possible that draw is simply getting weaker as some of those core identity signifiers weaken.
I agree and I want to add this:
With religious identity there is another long-term change. If you go back to say the 1950s and 1960s the US was probably something like 95% religious with about 90% of that being Christian and the bulk of the rest being Jewish. Protestants always made up the bulk of the Christians and when Christians were ~90%, Protestants were a large overall majority. Today there are a LOT more of what would have been "other" in a 1950s/1960s chart. I'm talking here about atheists, Buddhists, Muslims.
I'm NOT vouching for the reliability of Pew but the first google hit on "religious identity in the US" was this link (https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2025/02/26/religious-landscape-study-religious-identity/). According to it, just in the last 17 years (2007-2024) the Christian percentage dropped to 62% from 78% and the Protestant percent dropped to 40% from 51%. The Catholic share also dropped to 19% from 24%.
These are major long-term shifts. Protestants made up a majority of Americans from early in Colonial times until the last few years. Catholics probably haven't been below 20% since at least the early 1900s and maybe longer.
Back when the VAST majority of Americans identified as "Christian" the Catholics were the "other". Now that Christian is barely a majority and Protestants are NOT a majority alone, I think that most people mentally group Catholics in with Protestants. Ie, when @OrangeAfroMan (https://www.cfb51.com/index.php?action=profile;u=58) goes off on his anti-religious tangents he doesn't make distinctions between Protestants and Catholics and those attacked by him tend to see the whole of Christians as allies.
My point is that Catholics simply aren't (either in reality or in perception) the "other" anymore. They are fully a part of the bare majority of Americans who identify as "Christian". That inherently makes their identity as "Catholic" less relevant compared to their identity as "Christian".
I don't know if I'm doing a good job of explaining this but consider a geographic example:
- If someone from the Cleveland area asks where I'm from, I say Medina.
- If someone from Cincinnati asks I say Cleveland.
- If someone from the Midwest outside of Ohio asks, I say Ohio.
- If someone from California asks, I say The Midwest.
- If someone from Europe asks, I say the US.
- If an alien at Roswell asked, I'd say Planet Earth.
My point is that the specificity of your identity varies based on the context:
- If you are Protestant and in a group of all (or nearly all) Protestants then your identity within that group becomes Methodist or Baptist or whatever.
- If you are in a group of nearly all Christians (like 50s/60s America) then your identity within that group becomes Catholic or Protestant.
- If you are in a group of nearly all religious people but <50% Protestant then your identity within that group becomes Christian.
- If you are in a group where ~50% are religious and 50% are not religious then your identity becomes "believer".
My view is that in addition to the fact that there are less younger Catholics, the ones that do exist tend to identify less by that distinction because in the context of 2025 they instead identify more as part of the "Christian" bare majority.
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There are still a lot of Catholics who see ND as their team (1 in 5 Americans is still a lot of Catholic Americans). And there are still a lot of families that raise their kids to cheer for ND. It is, still--and likely for a long while--a national brand, particularly if it stays in the conversation for the CFP and in conference expansion talks.
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There are still a lot of Catholics who see ND as their team (1 in 5 Americans is still a lot of Catholic Americans). And there are still a lot of families that raise their kids to cheer for ND. It is, still--and likely for a long while--a national brand, particularly if it stays in the conversation for the CFP and in conference expansion talks.
I don't disagree but I think that it is a depreciating asset.
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I don't disagree but I think that it is a depreciating asset.
All the schools are depreciating and they are doing it to themselves.
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You may be right, but given the state of CFB right now, is it any worse of a bet than anything else? I would say it is still a better bet.
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ND is going to become like the Cubs - popular because of exposure (WGN-NBC), but not winning anything.
Cool.
And religious numbers are going down because of the internet. Those rural bubbles of pressure and one-sided thinking are gone now and people can interact with others unlike them freely now, no matter where they live.
It's a good thing.
I always found it funny for catholics to cheer for ND, as none of the players are catholic. At least the players on BYU are largely mormon. As if that's a good thing, lol.
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ND is going to become like the Cubs - popular because of exposure (WGN-NBC), but not winning anything.
Cool.
The Cubs are on their Marquis Network now. No longer on WGN.
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Speak of the devil(s):
ND adds BYU to it's schedule, replacing USC.
You gotta be kidding me. Why is it one or the other?!? They refuse to play anything resembling a real schedule. PLAY BOTH!!!
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The Cubs are on their Marquis Network now. No longer on WGN.
Oh ok. I guess I meant the decades before now.
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So based on the B1G vote, you chose ND and Virginia.
Taking UVA out of the expanded SEC, we replace them with Clemson.
Changing the divisions to East-West for all 3 super-conferences:
SEC West: Alabama, Auburn, Ole Miss, Miss St, LSU, Texas, Texas A&M, Oklahoma, Missouri, Arkansas
SEC East: Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, Tennessee, Vanderbilt, Kentucky, Clemson, VA Tech, North Carolina, NC State
.
B1G West: USC, UCLA, Oregon, Warshington, Nebraska, Iowa, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Illinois, Northwestern
B1G East: Michigan, Ohio St, Michigan St, Penn St, Maryland, Virginia, Notre Dame, Indiana, Purdue, Rutgers
.
BAC West: Utah, BYU, Texas Tech, Kansas, Kansas St, Colorado, Cal, Stanford, Arizona, Arizona St
BAC East: Florida St, Miami, GA Tech, Pitt, Louisville, Duke, Syracuse, West Virginia, SMU, TCU
(BAC = Big Atlantic Conf)
The 6 division-winners are in the playoff. They can either have a CCG or not. If they do, it's just for seeding, NOT for a playoff spot. This is because they played everyone else in their own division and have earned their spot.
2 at-large spots.
This year, the division winners would be Indiana, Miami, Texas Tech, Oregon, Georgia, and Ole Miss.
The 2 at-large teams would be Ohio St and Texas A&M
By CFP Ranking:
8 Miami @ 1 Indiana winner vs
5 Oregon @ 4 Texas Tech winner.
7 Ole Miss @ 2 Ohio St winner vs
6 Texas A&M @ 3 Georgia winner
(I switched Ole Miss and A&M to avoid a rematch, because I have a brain)
For the semis and final, the 3 old, traditional bowls rotate - Rose, Orange, Sugar
.
That's the playoff. 8 teams. No byes. 1st round on-campus.
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For the other bowls, you still get great games. They're tiered, so 4 bowls for the teams just out of the playoff, then 4 more for the next-best teams.
It would look something like this:
Fiesta, Cotton, Citrus, Peach
and
Gator, Outback, Holiday, Sun
.
Fiesta: BYU vs USC
Cotton: OU vs Vandy
Citrus: Texas vs Utah
Peach: Alabama vs Notre Dame
.
Gator: Tulane vs Houston
Outback: Michigan vs Virginia
Holiday: Arizona vs Iowa
Sun: GA Tech vs James Madison
.
It would sort of be like the old days, where the first 4 pick and chose the 8 teams they wanted to invite, then the next 4 would do it after them. The lesser bowls would be played between the 1st round and semis of the playoff. The better 4 bowls played between the semis and the NCG.
Schedule:
1st round on campuses, Sat Dec 13
Semifinals, Sat Dec 20
Nat'l Championship Game, Jan 1
.
Gator, Outback, Holiday, Sun - spread out between Dec 14-19
Fiesta, Cotton, Citrus, Peach - spread out between Dec 21-31
.
Summary:
The national champion will have been one of the top teams and will earn it on the field.
Every team has an equal opportunity to make the playoff, by winning their division.
Everyone plays everyone else in their division.
There is a spot for super-good teams that don't win their division.
The non-playoff bowls are limited in number and have worthwhile participants - ie rewarding a good season!
24 teams make the postseason altogether.
This is like 17 days of quality football: 1st round on campuses, bowls sprinkled in among teams ranked 17-24th, semifinal games, bowls sprinkled in among teams ranked 9-16th, then the national championship game on January 1st.
.
Exclusivity.
Tradition.
Fairness.
Balance.
All 6 divisions incorporate old rivals plus newbies.
Back to 10-team divisions like conferences used to be.
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It works. It's good. It could be great. But it makes too much sense to ever happen.
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And religious numbers are going down because of the internet. Those rural bubbles of pressure and one-sided thinking are gone now and people can interact with others unlike them freely now, no matter where they live.
It's a good thing.
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Yeah, now you can't even leave your door unlocked in a small town. Wonderful.
No matter your opinion on the theology, it was a useful instrument to control the masses.
An eternity of fire and brimstone was a much more powerful deterrent than the remote possibility of a night or two in the county jail, on the off chance that you actually happen to get caught by an understaffed and incompetent police force.
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camera phones!!!!!
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No matter your opinion on the theology, it was a useful instrument to control the masses.
What an honest take.
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Glad you agree.
I thought you'd go on some rant about how people were going to continue to exhibit morals in a post religious society out of the goodness of their hearts.
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Glad you agree.
I thought you'd go on some rant about how people were going to continue to exhibit morals in a post religious society out of the goodness of their hearts.
That's what I do.
I'm a pretty ethical fella, and I don't do it for fear of eternal consequence, nor reward of a heaven.
I find it endlessly fascinating how little faith believers have in themselves without their deity. They're so fearful of how horribly they'd act, when in reality, they'd be perfectly fine people.
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you don't know that
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A god is a placebo babysitter/police officer.
And no, I don't believe the murder rate or the stopping at a red-light in the middle of nowhere rate would change if a god was disproven. Their fear is unwarranted. It's a simple lack of imagination. For someone who does not go around murdering people while believing in a god to suddenly begin murdering people without believing in a god would happen because....why?
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That's the way things are trending.
I'm not a religious nut, but I'm glad that I live around a bunch of them.
They make pretty good neighbors.
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That's the way things are trending.
I'm not a religious nut, but I'm glad that I live around a bunch of them.
They make pretty good neighbors.
As long as you don't question their delusion belief.
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that would be on you to behave as a good neighbor
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Speak of the devil(s):
ND adds BYU to it's schedule, replacing USC.
You gotta be kidding me. Why is it one or the other?!? They refuse to play anything resembling a real schedule. PLAY BOTH!!!
That surprises me. A cursory look at their series suggests that since they began playing each other in 1926, there's only been 6 years they didn't play.
I thought that was like UT/OU, UF/FSU.....games that you simply don't fail to play whether you're in the same conference or not.
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ND is butthurt from missing the playoff so, they drop the trojans as a protest
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That surprises me. A cursory look at their series suggests that since they began playing each other in 1926, there's only been 6 years they didn't play.
I thought that was like UT/OU, UF/FSU.....games that you simply don't fail to play whether you're in the same conference or not.
Yeah, that's like losing Oklahoma-Nebraska. Another great rivalry down the tubes.
I miss the Notre Dame-Michigan series as well, but this was a lot bigger than that.