CFB51 College Football Fan Community
The Power Four => Big Ten => Topic started by: ELA on December 01, 2024, 04:17:22 PM
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The big thing is building the depth. I said before the season, I liked MSU's starting 22 better than last year, but they certainly lost more than they brought in through the portal, and the depth concerned me. That proved to be the case because while I don't think their total injuries were out of whack statistically, they were heavily concentrated in the defensive back seven.
The DL was ok against the run, but couldn't generate any pressure, and by the end of the year, MSU was starting a walk on true freshman at nickel back. Purdue probably would have beaten us if Walters had realized earlier that he was passing against the worst back seven he had seen all season. And even not realizing it until the second half, it took a dropped deep ball by a wide open WR, and an interception on a pass that was tipped 3 times for MSU to hold on.
I think the ongoing issue is going to be that aside from QBs, interior DL is going to be the most expensive positions in the portal. MSU lost their two starting DTs to Oregon and Miami respectively. I think they can build some depth in the back seven, but I'm very concerned about the trenches going forward.
The offense should get better, simply from OL improvements. I think Chiles is back, he was already well paid to keep him from USC, and I can't imagine this year has increased his value. Nick Marsh is well paid, but turned down better money from PSU because he's an MSU fan, and he likes Chiles. "Better money" might become "silly money" this offseason, so it will be interesting to see if he stays.
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Demetrice Martin appears to be headed back to the west coast and UCLA to be closer to his aging parents after one year as the CBs coach at MSU. Of course he will also be full DB coach and PGC, so it comes with a pay bump.
MSU's recruiting is bad enough, and he was MSU's best one. Some talk that 3 DB commits will flip because of this, 2 west coasters to UCLA, and a DC area kid to Virginia Tech.
MSU might wind up with a class in the 60s.
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Why is he leaving?
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His whole family is on the west coast, but it's also a promotion and a pay raise
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I know but it's only been a year. MSU could promote him too, right?
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I know but it's only been a year. MSU could promote him too, right?
And fire Blue Adams? Martin is a better recruiter than coach. He's been fired by UCLA and Oregon in the past few years. I think he only came because Oregon didn't want him anymore. I'd rather keep him because he's the best recruiter on staff, but in the NIL era, that's worth a lot less than it used to be
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Have to keep Blue Adams.
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Yeah, if he bolts for anything other than a DC job, that's a major issue
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hearing a lot of rumors about frosh WR Nick Marsh hitting the portal. from what I can tell it's just baseless internet talk. MSU has to do everything to keep him put- he's a future 1st-2nd rd NFL draft pick WR. stud.
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I think almost every good player is going to/should hit the portal every year. Might as well start a bidding war
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Some options as Martin's replacement
Archie Collins is Pitt's secondary coach. He played for MSU, and was a grad assistant who Narduzzi took with him as a position coach when he went to Pitt. He would fill a similar role as Martin, as he has been Pitt's top rated recruiter. But he would have less responsibility at MSU than he has at Pitt, although MSU could still presumably pay more, and it's his alma mater.
Gerren DuHart, OSU defensive assistant. Day poached him a couple years back when he was a GA at MSU. Also known as an elite recruiter. Would be a promotion to come back to MSU, but again, could OSU pay him more, or promote him themselves
Renaldo Hill has been an NFL DB coach for the past 7 years. He was not retained by Harbaugh when he got the Chargers job, so he's not currently working. He's only mentioned due to being an alum, no real indication he wants to go back to the college ranks.
De'Angelo Smith, Ohio DB coach. Played for Dantonio at Cincinnati, then was a GA during the peak Dantonio years at MSU. I really like his profile, and he looks like probably the best "coach" of this group. But considering what they lost in Martin, they might need Collins or DuHart for their recruiting. Or maybe it's just about NIL, so go get the best Xs and Os guy you can. I think that's this guy
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MSU added a couple WRs out of the portal. Really interested in Crishon McCray who was All-MAC on a historically bad Kent State team. Very different room next year with Foster graduating, and Glover transferring. I liked Glover a lot, and FSU nearly poached him, but hes one of those guys who looks better in shorts.
IMO, Aziah Johnson, a true freshman who didnt play much, and is also transferring, is the bigger loss. I think he is going to make someone very happy, wherever he is in 2026.
So now its Marsh, these two transfers and a 3/4* true freshman from Ohio. I think Alante Brown might have another year if he wants it, but hed be a 6th year senior coming off back to back season ending injuries, so he might just hang em up
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MSU hires Wake Forests AHC as safties coach
https://twitter.com/JustinThind/status/1876295056447222200?t=m4l05A4sA2s8fwZjBrOdIw&s=19
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https://twitter.com/DarkoStateNews/status/1890164978327646398
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According to this article from The Mirror (https://www.themirror.com/sport/american-football/michigan-state-ford-field-maryland-1014547), there ARE FOUR Spartans fans not happy with playing the last home game at Ford Field:
"Why do this again?? Take away another game at Spartan Stadium?" One fan wrote on X in response to the announcement. "Absolutely pathetic," a second bluntly added.
"Did the networks not like coming to East Lansing in late November when it’s really cold out?" Another fan asked. "What’s wrong with Spartan Stadium? I don’t want anymore games in Ford Field unless we play in the bowl game that they host," one fan suggested.
"Hate this," one supporter said. "What’s worse than taking a home game away for students? Messing up the MHSAA football championship weekend schedule. Stop letting networks do this."
https://twitter.com/MSU_Football/status/1897316652242661581
edit: clarifying The Mirror found FOUR unhappy Spartans fans; And, ELA, your reaction was mine as well - it was noticeable watching on TV that stadium wasn't full for hosting the Thanksgiving week home games.
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Those Thanksgiving weekend games are empty, even when MSU is decent. I don't particularly like it, but I'm also not a season ticket holder. I imagine it will be even less full in Detroit, but I guess MSU is getting paid for it?
PSU with a good MSU team is about the only time its well attended. Once they moved to or rotation with Maryland and Rutgers as well, and they pushed the end of the Big Ten season back a week, it's a ghost town. I guess I feel bad for those three people, but MSU as a fan base can't really be pissed because they weren't showing up for that game anyway
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Sounds like CMU transfer WR Evan Boyd is having a great spring.
Normally Id take it with a grain of salt that you never hear anything but good new out of spring.
But here, its literally the only news Ive heard. So I donbelieve he has... but also makes me a little concerned that nobody else seems to be
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I know this time is good PR season, except the consistent message is that the defense is dominating every scrimmage and the offense looks better when Aiden Chiles is out.
I cant imagine how bad Chiles is playing
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I know this time is good PR season, except the consistent message is that the defense is dominating every scrimmage and the offense looks better when Aiden Chiles is out.
I cant imagine how bad Chiles is playing
Case in point
https://twitter.com/SpartanEarned1/status/1957120508958281835
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Well, MSU had to forfeit 3 years of wins, plus additional penalties for recruiting violations under Mel Tucker.
So I guess NCAA got their pound of flesh for Michigan's cheating
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Notable - Tugger was not cited in these penalties.
That Saeed Khalif guy... scumbag.
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Well, MSU had to forfeit 3 years of wins, plus additional penalties for recruiting violations under Mel Tucker.
So I guess NCAA got their pound of flesh for Michigan's cheating
How many ineligible players did Michigan play? Sling mud to defer attention to one’s own problem. I tried that once. Got me nowhere and I was in the wrong.
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I mean by that technicality, sure.
How many games did MSU use information that was acquired against the rules?
Everyone knew UM would get a slap on the wrist. Big Ten was never going to let a cash cow get dinged by the NCAA, when they could go after a smaller fish and still seem tough
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Notable - Tugger was not cited in these penalties.
That Saeed Khalif guy... scumbag.
He has a show cause, along with Khalif, and the DL coach
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I mean by that technicality, sure.
How many games did MSU use information that was acquired against the rules?
Everyone knew UM would get a slap on the wrist. Big Ten was never going to let a cash cow get dinged by the NCAA, when they could go after a smaller fish and still seem tough
So they were willing to bed rules here but nowhere else? Doubtful.
These topics would be so much more reasonably discussed if more people would acknowledge most programs toe the lines in many areas and sometimes programs get caught, yet there far from the only program testing the waters.
MSU is far from the only program on this topic that went down this path. The reasonable people will dislike it but know that’s true. The unreasonable ones will scream like MSU program was the scum of the earth. In reality, there’s a lot of underlying things that happen that most of us don’t want to know about or admit. It’s just the reality of the game.
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Well, MSU had to forfeit 3 years of wins, plus additional penalties for recruiting violations under Mel Tucker.
As for the two boosters that paid millions to keep Tugger away from LSU, has Michigan State tried to distance themselves from them?
Their assertive association has been damaging to Michigan State:
https://twitter.com/On3sports/status/1988686934290436570
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Huh?
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So they were willing to bed rules here but nowhere else? Doubtful.
These topics would be so much more reasonably discussed if more people would acknowledge most programs toe the lines in many areas and sometimes programs get caught, yet there far from the only program testing the waters.
MSU is far from the only program on this topic that went down this path. The reasonable people will dislike it but know that’s true. The unreasonable ones will scream like MSU program was the scum of the earth. In reality, there’s a lot of underlying things that happen that most of us don’t want to know about or admit. It’s just the reality of the game.
They determined both programs cheated to win games. One school had to forfeit the games they cheated to win, the other didn't. It's not overly complicated
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So I guess NCAA got their pound of flesh for Michigan's cheating
Tarkinian was right.
The NCAA is a complete joke. This and tatgate pale in comparison to wholesale cheating by Auburn (Cam Newton) and Michigan (Connor Stallions) and yet tOSU and MSU had to vacate wins while Auburn and Michigan didn't.
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Summation: other programs cheated far worse than my program. Look at their program not mine. They cheated so bad their wins were allowed to stand and mine vacated, proving how right I am and how bad the system is.
Seems like the real cheaters who get their wins vacated scream the loudest about other programs.
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Fellas, this isn't the UM/OSU hate thread...
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Summation: other programs cheated far worse than my program. Look at their program not mine. They cheated so bad their wins were allowed to stand and mine vacated, proving how right I am and how bad the system is.
Seems like the real cheaters who get their wins vacated scream the loudest about other programs.
No
Summation: Multiple programs cheated to win games. Certain cheaters have the wins they cheated to gain stripped, and other cheaters did not. Usually tied to how much money you make the conference. Tark called it out 30 years ago, and nothing has changed
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Can we talk about a few pairs of sneakers in Madison?
Sheesh.
Michigan got away with a slap on the wrist. Maybe MSU absolutely deserved the stripping of their wins, but I don't know how anyone can look at the sanction against Michigan and think anything other than "special treatment." The NCAA's treatment of marquis programs certainly raises eyebrows.
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Pretty sure NCAA drops the hammer harder when it comes to playing ineligible players. It’s why OSU football got in so much trouble for Tatgate, Michigan basketball for Ed Martin scandal, and SMU football the death penalty.
Admittedly I have not read about the MSU thing at all, but playing ineligible players is always going to bring down the most severe consequences from NCAA. That has mostly gone away because of NIL, now the players are allowed to be paid over the table and out in the open- so I have no clue how you get popped playing ineligible players unless it was some academic fraud where they are changing players grades or something.
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Fellas, this isn't the UM/OSU hate thread...
(https://ci3.googleusercontent.com/meips/ADKq_NaXxE0ieCRUgTp20bwbXleBJTS3x43S9s9Rfgk8ohQtm6uyGatL67jrIW5G5XkdRK0cNic7cJKmaU_HeVfRQbA7z3P95TUVovgvcRoDKQlqqRQ=s0-d-e1-ft#https://media.tenor.com/wY5DoyVpgEgAAAAM/jon-stewart-eat.gif)
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Can we talk about a few pairs of sneakers in Madison?
Sheesh.
Michigan got away with a slap on the wrist. Maybe MSU absolutely deserved the stripping of their wins, but I don't know how anyone can look at the sanction against Michigan and think anything other than "special treatment." The NCAA's treatment of marquis programs certainly raises eyebrows.
Daddy deep pockets Donors,the limp biscuits that are the NCAA fined them as they needed the coin. 4 fired coaches and one probably going up the river using his same hacking abilities on female students accounts - NCAA be like
(https://ci3.googleusercontent.com/meips/ADKq_NYAdXg0ABtTHcF1iC1yTt6BP_f-j45EU0N2SsNSvm8HHGDKafEbu5JR5hC1dP1T1RpWkW4pNxT4FDtjpXge-KQAx0KmpAgsh8GSK9fgAvmqfXd7zk2KyrsdLOe_Xw5i=s0-d-e1-ft#https://media.tenor.com/images/e4ae71099eeeccdaaf1495af637ac4c7/tenor.gif)
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(https://ci3.googleusercontent.com/meips/ADKq_NaXxE0ieCRUgTp20bwbXleBJTS3x43S9s9Rfgk8ohQtm6uyGatL67jrIW5G5XkdRK0cNic7cJKmaU_HeVfRQbA7z3P95TUVovgvcRoDKQlqqRQ=s0-d-e1-ft#https://media.tenor.com/wY5DoyVpgEgAAAAM/jon-stewart-eat.gif)
This is when I quietly exit left 🫣
(https://i.imgur.com/oCpOoMW.jpeg)
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Summation: other programs cheated far worse than my program. Look at their program not mine. They cheated so bad their wins were allowed to stand and mine vacated, proving how right I am and how bad the system is.
Seems like the real cheaters who get their wins vacated scream the loudest about other programs.
LoL, BS.
This isn't a tOSU/M thing. It is an integrity issue as fans of MSU and UW just explained.
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Michigan got away with a slap on the wrist. Maybe MSU absolutely deserved the stripping of their wins, but I don't know how anyone can look at the sanction against Michigan and think anything other than "special treatment." The NCAA's treatment of marquis programs certainly raises eyebrows.
Pot stirring aside, it’s the world we live in. I’m not supportive of it in any fashion, if we are being real in a non-inflammatory type conversation. Sadly, it happens in many ways across many segments of society. Here’s an off-topic example - Wells Fargo, they create millions of fraudulent fake accounts in consumers names. Any mid-size average bank, credit union or financial institution would have been shut down, including multiple arrests. Wells Fargo had 2 trillion in assets and were fined $3 billion. An absurd number given the circumstances and what happened.
we live in a world where power and capital dictate consequences of improper actions being exposed. By no means am I excusing it, nor condoning, but something we just have to deal with. Can still rub us entirely the wrong way, but doesn’t change its reality and our ability to change it.
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Tarkinian was right.
The NCAA is a complete joke. This and tatgate pale in comparison to wholesale cheating by Auburn (Cam Newton) and Michigan (Connor Stallions) and yet tOSU and MSU had to vacate wins while Auburn and Michigan didn't.
same as the Big Ten (joke)
the conference can police it's own, but refuses to do so.
apparently, that's the reason the NCAA exists, ........... so the conference can stand back and blame the NCAA for stupid rules and enforcements
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same as the Big Ten (joke)
the conference can police it's own, but refuses to do so.
apparently, that's the reason the NCAA exists, ........... so the conference can stand back and blame the NCAA for stupid rules and enforcements
IMHO, conferences policing their own is never going to be a viable option because they compete with each other and the minute the SEC drops a punishment that is (and it will be) perceived as lenient on a cheater school like Auburn, the B1G will be under immense pressure to be similarly lenient with their own cheater school (Michigan). Conferences policing their own will inevitably become a race to be the most lenient. It isn't a viable option.
This goes well beyond flagrant cheating such as Stallions at Michigan or the Cam Newton situation at Auburn and also encompasses the more garden variety, run of the mill lawbreaking. My view is that in the portal/NIL era individual programs and conferences simply cannot police themselves because the pressure from those providing the money is too much for them to resist. Ie, if Julian Sayin goes out and gets a DUI or if Gunner Stockton get busted doing 125 MPH in a School Zone or if Arch Manning gets busted for a bar fight it isn't realistic to expect Ryan Day, Kirby Smart, or Steve Sarkisian to adequately discipline them because they simply cannot. The boosters who paid BIG money to get those guys to play for tOSU/UGA/UT simply will not stand for the HC benching them.
The only practical way forward, IMHO, is to establish NCAA-wide discipline that is SWIFT and SURE. The NCAA's glacial pace simply will not work for these types of issues because, in the hypotheticals above, Sayin, Stockton, and Manning would graduate (and probably retire from the NFL) before the NCAA got around to imposing any penalty. It NEEDS to be a small committee of former coaches, AD's, and University Presidents who meet weekly in-season and impose discipline for issues such as those. As for the bigger issues (Auburn/Newton, Michigan/Stallions) the NCAA's worthlessness is on full display and simply has to be rectified for the good of the sport. Allowing Auburn to play for (and win) a NC when literally everyone knew that Cam Newton had been paid to play there (back when that was impermissible) and then allowing Michigan to play for (and win) a NC when literally everyone knew that they operated a massive in person scouting regime that was not permitted just destroys the integrity of the game.
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One of the wins they are vacating was the CMU game where Connor Stallions was on the sidelines for CMU
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Yeah only Michigan and Auburn. Nothing with USC paying players and families. Forget about OsU paying players and trying to retell the story only about gold pants and tattoos. DiGeronimo had nothing to do with paying kids at all. Only two programs have ever crossed the line. Tattoos and good pants like like saying Bernie Madoff only made bad investments. Scream loudest and it must be true.
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hey I for one applaud Tugger. like the great Bear Bryant once said....
if ya ain't cheating ya ain't tryin'
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Yeah only Michigan and Auburn. Nothing with USC paying players and families. Forget about OsU paying players and trying to retell the story only about gold pants and tattoos. DiGeronimo had nothing to do with paying kids at all. Only two programs have ever crossed the line. Tattoos and good pants like like saying Bernie Madoff only made bad investments. Scream loudest and it must be true.
The whataboutism is strong with this one but it falls apart upon even a cursory glance. You were on the highest of high horses over tatgate. What our coach did was wrong and The Ohio State University had the integrity to fire a National Championship winning coach for it. There was contrition and acknowledgement of wrongdoing.
The problem with Michigan is that there is no institutional integrity and no contrition from the fans, instead we get this:
hey I for one applaud Tugger. like the great Bear Bryant once said....
if ya ain't cheating ya ain't tryin'
That is the difference. I have to applaud @Mdot21 (https://www.cfb51.com/index.php?action=profile;u=1595) because at least he is honest enough to admit it. The rest of you can't seem to acknowledge that Stallions was far worse than everything involved in tatgate. It is literally the worst cheating scandal in the modern history of college football and the response from the institution and the fanbase makes it worse.
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I wasn’t on a high horse. I was appalled at the amount of noses in the air, smug responses of people trying to claim it was as simple as gold pants and tattoos when there was layers and layers deeper to the story. Don’t worry, it’s whataboutism. It’s about OSU and their fans having so much integrity and Michigan and all their fans are low character dirtbags supporting a terrible program with no moral code so their fans must have one either.
And it all goes back to a simple fact. A university and football program don’t define a fans character and those that claim it does have a flaw in theirs.
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It’s about OSU and their fans having so much integrity and Michigan and all their fans are low character dirtbags supporting a terrible program with no moral code so their fans must have one either.
Was it that hard to admit this?
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IMHO, conferences policing their own is never going to be a viable option because they compete with each other and the minute the SEC drops a punishment that is (and it will be) perceived as lenient on a cheater school like Auburn, the B1G will be under immense pressure to be similarly lenient with their own cheater school (Michigan). Conferences policing their own will inevitably become a race to be the most lenient. It isn't a viable option.
fine, that's my point. The Big Ten Conference is a scumbag - a money grubbing scumbag
same as the old SWC, the Big 8, the Big 12, the SEC and all the rest.
the big TV money wiped out integrity
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Wrong thread.
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https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/bigten/2025/11/14/michigan-state-ncaa-cheating-michigan-mel-tucker-vacated-wins/87256501007/?tbref=hp
They’re losing their minds in East Lansing about Michigan, which tracks just about how you’d think.Michigan State fans are ticked off, and frankly, have a right to be. But they’re pointing the finger of blame in the wrong direction.
It’s not Michigan or the NCAA or former coach Mel Tucker — it’s on their very own university.
First, the particulars: the NCAA on Wednesday placed Michigan State on probation for jaywalking, nearly three months to the day after allowing Michigan to get away with stone, cold murder.
The Spartans were forced to vacate 14 wins from 2022-24, while the Wolverines were allowed to keep their national title. A blatant protection of the blue blood university, and an obvious takedown of little brother.
But understand this: if Michigan State truly wanted to fight for the vacated wins or the elimination of other recruiting sanctions, it would’ve come out swinging and the NCAA would’ve backed down.
MSU can’t get the same breaks Michigan gets when it cheats. Of course, Michigan will point to its $30 million fine by the NCAA, compared to Michigan State’s $30,000 fine.
But that ridiculous Michigan fine by the NCAA was in exchange for not vacating wins. You know, the penalty the governing body typically uses for infraction cases where players are ineligible — or when schools gain an competitive advantage by cheating.
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WTH, MSU shouldn't have had to fight for it - the NCAA should be doing the right thing in the 1st place.But CFB World found out 1st hand in July you can buy your way out of big trouble as long as you have Deep Pockets
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First, the particulars: the NCAA on Wednesday placed Michigan State on probation for jaywalking, nearly three months to the day after allowing Michigan to get away with stone, cold murder.
This!
Note that this isn't from an Ohio State fan, it isn't from an MSU fan, it is a neutral observation from USA Today.
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Its not my money, but Im assuming we have a finite amount. So I was fine with giving him another year. But watching tonight, this program is completely dead.
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Its not my money, but Im assuming we have a finite amount. So I was fine with giving him another year. But watching tonight, this program is completely dead.
he's gotta go. just a bad fit. outside looking in at the time of the hire- seemed good- but coaching hires really are crap shoots. just seems like a bad fit all-around, very RichRod to Michigan vibe to it.
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Its not my money, but Im assuming we have a finite amount. So I was fine with giving him another year. But watching tonight, this program is completely dead.
Well, Sparty can't cheat if they're dead so I guess that's good.