Idk, David McWilliams got canned after beating OU 3 straight times. He just stunk for a year and got fired, right after a SWC championship season.
It's entirely possible Texas doesn't have braindead wealthy donors with 10-gallon hats and backroom handshakes....but I doubt it.
Glen Mason lost 8 of 10 against Wisconsin and 6 of 10 against Iowa (with a whole bunch of no-shows in those losses), and many of you called us crazy for sacking him.Well, we were talking helmet schools here. As an MSU student during the JLS years (03-06), I know we discussed how we would kill to be Minnesota. Dantonio obviously greatly exceeded that, but I don't think he had to
It's the same reason why I don't understand why Little Jimmy's seat isn't nuclear-fusion hot in AA. Sometime he's gotta beat Ohio State.
Maybe Harbaugh gets something of a pass because Ohio State is on a near historic "run", even for OSU. I could see that, logically, if logic plays a role here, sort of like South Carolina's situation (they have a new coach of course). I don't know if Texas thinks that way about OU.Harbaugh gets a pass because a) he took a pay cut, and b) there is nobody available who could do better right now.
Georgia Tech would upset UGA every so often, usually in Athens, to meet somewhat lower expectations there. I think now they've sort of given up on that point.
Harbaugh gets a pass because a) he took a pay cut, and b) there is nobody available who could do better right now.That's a relevant point.
Glen Mason lost 8 of 10 against Wisconsin and 6 of 10 against Iowa (with a whole bunch of no-shows in those losses), and many of you called us crazy for sacking him.Simple...
It's the same reason why I don't understand why Little Jimmy's seat isn't nuclear-fusion hot in AA. Sometime he's gotta beat Ohio State.
| 1951–1953 | Wes Fesler (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wes_Fesler) | 3 | 10–13–4 | .444 |
| 1954–1971 | Murray Warmath (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murray_Warmath) | 18 | 87–78–7 | .526 |
| 1972–1978 | Cal Stoll (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cal_Stoll) | 7 | 39–39 | .500 |
| 1979–1983 | Joe Salem (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Salem_(American_football)) | 5 | 19–35–1 | .355 |
| 1984–1985 | Lou Holtz (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lou_Holtz) | 2 | 10–12 | .455 |
| 1986–1991 | John Gutekunst (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Gutekunst) | 6 | 29–36–2 | .448 |
| 1992–1996 | Jim Wacker (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Wacker) | 5 | 16–39 | .291 |
| 1997–2006 | Glen Mason (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glen_Mason) | 10 | 64–57 | .529 |
| 2007–2010 | Tim Brewster (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tim_Brewster) | 4 | 15–30 | .333 |
| 2010 | Jeff Horton (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeff_Horton) | 1 | 2–3 | .400 |
| 2011–2015 | Jerry Kill (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerry_Kill) | 5 | 29–29 | .500 |
| 2015–2016 | Tracy Claeys (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tracy_Claeys) | 2 | 11–8 | .579 |
| 2017–present | P. J. Fleck (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P._J._Fleck) | 3 | 23–15 | .605 |
Good comment, I think, ADs often fire a coach first it seems, and then look around for who they could hire, and even learn their first 5-6-7 choices are not available or interested (Tenn).The Pirate is the type of coach that could bring national championships to Ann Arbor and not survive based on personality.
Who would you choose to replace Harbaugh right now? You could find something like The Pirate or Huepel I suppose, if they are not entirely unique.
Richt was fired after averaging 9.4 wins a season because he didn't beat Florida consistently (and didn't win an NC).Richt had Cooperitis - there I took the bait 😁
The Pirate is the type of coach that could bring national championships to Ann Arbor and not survive based on personality.I actually wanted him hired when Tressell was fired,he did alot with seemingly little.I remember asking the old big 12 board about him
OK, so I'm gonna ask.
If Jim Harbaugh can't win at Michigan, who could? Who would want to even try?
With Ohio State recruiting at an elite level consistently, it would be tough.
If you were a good coach and willing to put in the effort, what is the top program you'd love to coach today (aside from yours)?Florida.
If Ohio State returns to being "just" Ohio State, UM should be able to upset them 3 times in 10. Ohio State right now is closer to Bama and Clemson than OSU of yore.In all honesty, I think what OSU has accomplished over the past two decades is more impressive--but more fragile--than Alabama or Clemson.
And they still seem to be recruiting at the elite level, top five anyway, consistently. Even a so so coach can produce great teams doing that.
In all honesty, I think what OSU has accomplished over the past two decades is more impressive--but more fragile--than Alabama or Clemson.Lloyd Carr was anything but a sure thing, but he's the only coach to win an NC at Michigan since leather helmets were a thing.
OSU has sustained elite success across two consecutive [not counting interim] coaches. Bama and Clemson have one. Can you trust that Bama will still be Bama post-Saban, or that Clemson will still be Clemson post-Dabo? I think you *have* to expect that both programs will falter when they have to replace those coaches, although it's much more likely to happen at Bama because Dabo is young and probably not going anywhere unless he has NFL dreams.
That's why I am unsure what Day will end up doing. To have three coaches in a row pull that off would be insane. OSU had Tressel and then they brought in a sure-thing prospect in Meyer. Only sure-things aren't always as sure as you'd think, but in this case it was. Now they've got someone who has never had HC experience prior and threw him into one of the most scrutinized programs in the nation... Can he pull this off?
In my opinion the odds are against Day sustaining OSU at anywhere near the same level Tressel and Meyer performed.
That may be more commonplace than weird. Perhaps mediocre coaches cling because they are good schoozers and good promisers.Correct me if I’m wrong, but hasn’t Texas‘s eliteness basically been tied to two coaches, one of whom was considered a perennial underachiever?
I'd take Texas, expectations - for now - are lower. There is no reason Texas can't be elite again that I can discern, unlike say USC or Tennessee or Michigan.
The Pirate is the type of coach that could bring national championships to Ann Arbor and not survive based on personality.I kind of don't agree. Th Pirate is best served at an underdog. He has a habit of winning a few he shouldn't and losing some he should. That kinda flies at at outpost schools (maybe at MissSU), but not with the big boys. If he beats OSU a third of the time, but drops an IU or Purdue game every year, they'll be after him.
The Miss State offense have UGA's defense fits last year. I had to admire the style of it. Given a very accurate QB and some quick wide outs, I think they could score on just about anyone.I think that in a couple of years, when the Pirate has recruited to his system, they're going to be a tough out for just about every team they play, except maybe Alabama based on sheer talent.
I think I'd defend it by having my three down DLs just occupy space and try to swat the ball while dropping 8 in short coverage.
One coach is more than many programs have had.This is true, but if you are in theory that level of program and all but a couple of coaches struggle to bring the floor up, perhaps there is some thing understated about the job that makes it harder than we think
Maybe, but we've never seen what Leach can do at a team with elite talent.That's true, and we likely never will.
Even with 4 playoff teams per season, there's still not enough spots for every helmet program to get their 2-3 appearances per decade.I'm mobile, so I can't look it up. But without getting too deep into who should have gone, and just going with who the AP top four going into the bowls were. How many playoff appearances would each of the helmet schools have had in the seventies, which I think we all agree is the most helmety decade
| [th]Rank[/th] [th]Team (FPV)[/th] [th]Conf[/th] [th]Rec[/th] [th]Pts[/th] [th]Last Week[/th] | ||||||
| 1 | < 1 | Minnesota (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1960&teamid=1) (17.5) | Big Ten | 8-1 | 433.5 | DNP (Did not play) |
| 2 | < 3 | Mississippi (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1960&teamid=55) (16) | SEC (Southeastern) | 9-0-1 | 411 | |
| 3 | < 2 | Iowa (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1960&teamid=61) (12.5) | Big Ten | 8-1 | 407.5 | |
| 4 | < 7 | Navy (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1960&teamid=33) | Ind (Independent) | 8-1 | 262 |
| [th]Rank[/th] [th]Team (FPV)[/th] [th]Conf[/th] [th]Rec[/th] [th]Pts[/th] [th]Last Week[/th] | ||||||
| 1 | < 1 | Alabama (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1961&teamid=25) (26) | SEC (Southeastern) | 10-0 | 452 | W 34-0 N Auburn |
| 2 | < 2 | Ohio State (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1961&teamid=31) (20) | Big Ten | 8-0-1 | 436 | |
| 3 | < 4 | Texas (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1961&teamid=66) | Southwest | 9-1 | 348 | |
| 4 | < 3 | LSU (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1961&teamid=13) (1) | SEC (Southeastern) | 9-1 | 335 |
| [th]Rank[/th] [th]Team (FPV)[/th] [th]Conf[/th] [th]Rec[/th] [th]Pts[/th] [th]Last Week[/th] | ||||||
| 1 | < 1 | USC (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1962&teamid=6) (42) | AAWU (Athletic Association of Western Universities) | 10-0 | 509 | W 25-0 H Notre Dame |
| 2 | < 2 | Wisconsin (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1962&teamid=36) (5) | Big Ten | 8-1 | 428 | |
| 3 | < 3 | Mississippi (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1962&teamid=55) (2) | SEC (Southeastern) | 9-0 | 393 | |
| 4 | < 4 | Texas (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1962&teamid=66) | Southwest | 9-0-1 | 343 |
| [th]Rank[/th] [th]Team (FPV)[/th] [th]Conf[/th] [th]Rec[/th] [th]Pts[/th] [th]Last Week[/th] | ||||||
| 1 | < 1 | Texas (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1963&teamid=66) (34) | Southwest | 10-0 | 460 | DNP (Did not play) |
| 2 | < 2 | Navy (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1963&teamid=33) (10) | Ind (Independent) | 9-1 | 418 | |
| 3 | < 3 | Illinois (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1963&teamid=74) | Big Ten | 7-1-1 | 361 | |
| 4 | < 4 | Pittsburgh (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1963&teamid=9) (5) | Ind (Independent) | 9-1 | 340 |
| [th]Rank[/th] [th]Team (FPV)[/th] [th]Conf[/th] [th]Rec[/th] [th]Pts[/th] [th]Last Week[/th] | ||||||
| 1 | < 2 | Alabama (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1964&teamid=25) (34.5) | SEC (Southeastern) | 10-0 | 515.5 | W 21-14 N Auburn |
| 2 | < 3 | Arkansas (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1964&teamid=32) (11.5) | Southwest | 10-0 | 486.5 | |
| 3 | < 1 | Notre Dame (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1964&teamid=7) (6) | Ind (Independent) | 9-1 | 442 | L 20-17 A USC |
| 4 | < 4 | Michigan (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1964&teamid=48) (3) | Big Ten | 8-1 | 400 |
| [th]Rank[/th] [th]Team (FPV)[/th] [th]Conf[/th] [th]Rec[/th] [th]Pts[/th] [th]Last Week[/th] | ||||||
| 1 | < 4 | Alabama (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1965&teamid=25) (37) | SEC (Southeastern) | 9-1-1 | 537 | W 39-28 N #3 Nebraska (Orange) |
| 2 | < 1 | Michigan State (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1965&teamid=113) (18) | Big Ten | 10-1 | 479 | L 14-12 N #5 UCLA (Rose) |
| 3 | < 2 | Arkansas (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1965&teamid=32) (1) | Southwest | 10-1 | 413 | |
| 4 | < 5 | UCLA (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1965&teamid=59) (1) | AAWU (Athletic Association of Western Universities) | 8-2-1 | 391 |
| [th]Rank[/th] [th]Team (FPV)[/th] [th]Conf[/th] [th]Rec[/th] [th]Pts[/th] [th]Last Week[/th] | ||||||
| 1 | < 1 | Notre Dame (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1966&teamid=7) (41) | Ind (Independent) | 9-0-1 | 506 | DNP (Did not play) |
| 2 | < 2 | Michigan State (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1966&teamid=113) (8) | Big Ten | 9-0-1 | 471 | |
| 3 | < 3 | Alabama (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1966&teamid=25) (7) | SEC (Southeastern) | 10-0 | 428 | W 34-7 N #6 Nebraska (Sugar) |
| 4 | < 4 | Georgia (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1966&teamid=73) | SEC (Southeastern) | 9-1 | 332 |
| [th]Rank[/th] [th]Team (FPV)[/th] [th]Conf[/th] [th]Rec[/th] [th]Pts[/th] [th]Last Week[/th] | ||||||
| 1 | < 1 | USC (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1967&teamid=6) (36) | AAWU (Athletic Association of Western Universities) | 9-1 | 474 | DNP (Did not play) |
| 2 | < 2 | Tennessee (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1967&teamid=28) (11) | SEC (Southeastern) | 8-1 | 436 | |
| 3 | < 5 | Oklahoma (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1967&teamid=50) | Big 8 | 8-1 | 311 | W 21-14 A Nebraska |
| 4 | < NR | Indiana (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1967&teamid=45) | Big Ten | 9-1 | 245 | W 19-14 H Purdue |
| [th]Rank[/th] [th]Team (FPV)[/th] [th]Conf[/th] [th]Rec[/th] [th]Pts[/th] [th]Last Week[/th] | ||||||
| 1 | < 1 | Texas (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1969&teamid=66) (22) | Southwest | 10-0 | 580 | W 15-14 A #2 Arkansas |
| 2 | < 3 | Penn State (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1969&teamid=68) (5) | Ind (Independent) | 10-0 | 492 | |
| 3 | < 2 | Arkansas (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1969&teamid=32) | Southwest | 9-1 | 426 | L 15-14 H #1 Texas |
| 4 | < 4 | Ohio State (http://www.collegepollarchive.com/football/ap/teams/by_season.cfm?seasonid=1969&teamid=31) (1) | Big Ten | 8-1 | 374 |
I'm mobile, so I can't look it up. But without getting too deep into who should have gone, and just going with who the AP top four going into the bowls were. How many playoff appearances would each of the helmet schools have had in the seventies, which I think we all agree is the most helmety decadeHa, I was just looking up stuff for the best non-NC thread, so I'll share here:
The Pirate is the type of coach that could bring national championships to Ann Arbor and not survive based on personality.
If we have say 8 Blue Bloods, obviously they could all participate in four years twice in theory.Ten years ago Bama won the first of two BTB NCs. And lost but the one game the year before in 2010 to $cam and NC Auburn. In fact every year since Saban was hired in 2007 the NC has been Alabama or a team that beat Alabama except in 2013 when Auburn lost on the last play of the NCG to FSU.
If we have say 16 programs with realistic chances to make a playoff, it gets dicier obviously, but all 16 COULD do it in four years of course, in theory.
The problem of course is one can pencil in Clemson Bama Ohio State in most years and the other 11 are vying for slot 4 often as not.
As we have noted, ten years ago Clemson/Bama were not dominant, and they may not be in five more years. Ohio State seems position to make the playoffs more than ha;f the time, it would appear.
We obviously have programs also having incredible runs, FSU and Miami come to mind, and then a relative collapse for whatever reason. Ohio State is by far I think the program with the fewest bad years. I don't know if history will repeat or not. Bama and Clemson could be one bad hire away from mediocrity just as FSU and Miami were.Even Mike Dubose and Mike Shula had 10 win seasons with Bama. You have to go all the way back to Whitworth in 1955-1957 to find complete mediocrity at Bama. Actually that was complete whatever is below mediocrity, or even lower. Bama couldn't score, much less win. Shutout eleven times in those three years. Have been shutout but eleven more times in the sixty three seasons since then.