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Topic: The Letdown - Let's do some research!

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Kris60

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Re: The Letdown - Let's do some research!
« Reply #14 on: January 03, 2019, 09:40:11 PM »
Dropping Georgia to 2-3 against teams who will finish in the top 15, and Michigan to 0-3
Very true.  It could just be further evidence those teams weren’t quite as good as we thought they were.

utee94

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Re: The Letdown - Let's do some research!
« Reply #15 on: January 03, 2019, 11:22:54 PM »
I'm not sure why you're dwelling on 2008 Texas - they are obviously not in the "letdown" group of teams I specified.  
It's because the narrowly defined group you've decided to outline is wrong.  It's incomplete.  It's a poor sample.  It is not representative.
You're choosing criteria to fit a narrative you've already defined in your head.  You're deliberately imposing your own confirmation bias on the experiment.
It renders your hypothesis inaccurate and inadequate.  It renders your results meaningless.  That you can't fathom this only speaks to how little you understand the data you are so desperately attempting to fit into your preconceived mold.  
It's bad science.  Start over. Do better.  This is really easy stuff.

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: The Letdown - Let's do some research!
« Reply #16 on: January 03, 2019, 11:42:28 PM »
You seem to be saying that unless a team meets the criteria you set forth then they couldn’t possibly be as disappointed at the end of the season as the other teams.  All Texas needed the last game of the season was a loss from Oklahoma in a rivalry game to a very good opponent.  Once Oklahoma won Texas was faced with reality that everything they wanted to accomplish that season was gone.   You don’t think that was disappointing?
I'm saying that what I've observed as a trend is what I've described here.  I'm not claiming to measure the disappointment level of every team that doesn't win the national championship.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: The Letdown - Let's do some research!
« Reply #17 on: January 03, 2019, 11:44:41 PM »
It's because the narrowly defined group you've decided to outline is wrong.  It's incomplete.  It's a poor sample.  It is not representative.
You're choosing criteria to fit a narrative you've already defined in your head.  You're deliberately imposing your own confirmation bias on the experiment.
It renders your hypothesis inaccurate and inadequate.  It renders your results meaningless.  That you can't fathom this only speaks to how little you understand the data you are so desperately attempting to fit into your preconceived mold.  
It's bad science.  Start over. Do better.  This is really easy stuff.
I observed teams tending to lose an inordinate percentage of the time, in a specific situation.  The fact you're labeling that so negatively is odd.  What I observed set the parameters, not my bias.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

utee94

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Re: The Letdown - Let's do some research!
« Reply #18 on: January 03, 2019, 11:46:40 PM »
I observed teams tending to lose an inordinate percentage of the time, in a specific situation.  The fact you're labeling that so negatively is odd.  What I observed set the parameters, not my bias.
We're rejecting that the teams you're observing make up the entire class of teams to consider.
Start over.  Get the science right.  Then at least some of us will reconsider.

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: The Letdown - Let's do some research!
« Reply #19 on: January 03, 2019, 11:50:48 PM »
Please stop pretending to be an authority on this.  You look arrogant and, to me, combative and not worth the trouble.  
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

utee94

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Re: The Letdown - Let's do some research!
« Reply #20 on: January 03, 2019, 11:55:16 PM »
Please stop pretending to be an authority on this.  You look arrogant and, to me, combative and not worth the trouble.  
This is rich, coming from the most abrasive and arrogant poster I've ever encountered on this forum.  Pot, this is Kettle.  Guess what?  You're still black.

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: The Letdown - Let's do some research!
« Reply #21 on: January 03, 2019, 11:57:46 PM »
I am a white.





















:57:
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

utee94

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Re: The Letdown - Let's do some research!
« Reply #22 on: January 04, 2019, 12:06:48 AM »
I am too.

Perhaps I should rephrase that to-- porcelain teacup, this is porcelain saucer, you're still white. :)

Look OAM, I'm not refuting you for the fun of it.  I think your idea is worth exploring. I just don't agree with your data set for the reasons that I, and several other posters on this thread and the other one, have outlined.

If you're attempting to link emotional letdown to bowl game outcomes, then the definition you're trying to use is simply too narrow. There are no reasonable conclusions to be drawn from it, because you're not considering the entire class affected by such letdowns.

Texas 2008 is a pristine example of a team you choose not to consider, and yet had EVERYTHING ripped away at the very last moment.  It wasn't through a loss-- which would be a game-played outcome that they COULD control-- but rather through a coin-flip tie-breaker where they had no control at all, that occurred AFTER their final game of the season. If you don't believe that's emotionally devastating enough to be considered in your very own let-down theory, then I can't honestly believe you understand the point you're trying to make.

Kris60

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Re: The Letdown - Let's do some research!
« Reply #23 on: January 04, 2019, 08:08:45 AM »
I'm saying that what I've observed as a trend is what I've described here.  I'm not claiming to measure the disappointment level of every team that doesn't win the national championship.
When looking at some of your posts on this topic in the Bowl SOC thread and then your responses you seem to be contradicting yourself from one thread to the other.  Here you say you aren’t claiming to measure the disappointment level of every team that doesn’t win the national championship.  But in the SOC thread you say this in response to Marq Husker’s findings:
“You’re not willing to acknowledge the emotional difference in going 11-1 and losing in September and going 11-1 with your only loss being in the 12th game.  I can’t help you.”
That response leads to believe you are very much trying to measure the disappointment levels of teams.  You also challenge utee to do his own research but when MarqHusker did just that you immediately dismissed it because the parameters for disappointment weren’t exactly like what you came up with.
Losing your last game that cost you a chance at a national title is extremely disappointing.  No one argues that.  But so is needing one result in the last week and not getting it (2008 Texas).  So is winning your last game and having the voters decide to put someone else in (2014 TCU, 2018 Ohio St).
You seem to have narrowly defined what ultimate disappointment is in your view and any evidence to the contrary you are putting your fingers in your ears, closing your eyes, and shaking your head.

MrNubbz

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Re: The Letdown - Let's do some research!
« Reply #24 on: January 04, 2019, 11:22:28 AM »
It's because the narrowly defined group you've decided to outline is wrong.  It's incomplete.  It's a poor sample.  It is not representative.
You're choosing criteria to fit a narrative you've already defined in your head.  You're deliberately imposing your own confirmation bias on the experiment.
It renders your hypothesis inaccurate and inadequate.  It renders your results meaningless.  That you can't fathom this only speaks to how little you understand the data you are so desperately attempting to fit into your preconceived mold.  
It's bad science.  Start over. Do better.  This is really easy stuff.
Good posts ITT 94 - you get a Yuengling
Suburbia:Where they tear out the trees & then name streets after them.

MrNubbz

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Re: The Letdown - Let's do some research!
« Reply #25 on: January 04, 2019, 11:26:10 AM »
This is rich, coming from the most abrasive and arrogant poster I've ever encountered on this forum.
What about fearless and I?We're not getting off to a good start in the New Year,Buster
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utee94

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Re: The Letdown - Let's do some research!
« Reply #26 on: January 04, 2019, 11:39:34 AM »
What about fearless and I?We're not getting off to a good start in the New Year,Buster
Sorry to exclude you.  You're a real jackwagon and I wish you nothing but ill will in this New Year.  And lots and lots of malty beers, of course. :)


betarhoalphadelta

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Re: The Letdown - Let's do some research!
« Reply #27 on: January 04, 2019, 12:09:45 PM »
When looking at some of your posts on this topic in the Bowl SOC thread and then your responses you seem to be contradicting yourself from one thread to the other.  Here you say you aren’t claiming to measure the disappointment level of every team that doesn’t win the national championship.  But in the SOC thread you say this in response to Marq Husker’s findings:
“You’re not willing to acknowledge the emotional difference in going 11-1 and losing in September and going 11-1 with your only loss being in the 12th game.  I can’t help you.”
That response leads to believe you are very much trying to measure the disappointment levels of teams.  You also challenge utee to do his own research but when MarqHusker did just that you immediately dismissed it because the parameters for disappointment weren’t exactly like what you came up with.
Losing your last game that cost you a chance at a national title is extremely disappointing.  No one argues that.  But so is needing one result in the last week and not getting it (2008 Texas).  So is winning your last game and having the voters decide to put someone else in (2014 TCU, 2018 Ohio St).
You seem to have narrowly defined what ultimate disappointment is in your view and any evidence to the contrary you are putting your fingers in your ears, closing your eyes, and shaking your head.
OAM set his criteria narrowly, that is true. He did so because he believes there is a qualitative emotional difference between a "final loss" and a "September loss". 
It honestly makes sense. Ohio State, for example, had time to emotionally process the loss to Purdue. They knew it might be considered a damning loss by the committee, and continued their season. They ended up accomplishing some of their goals--beating Michigan, winning the CCG, and although they missed out on the CFP, they ended up in the Rose Bowl. And then, to top it off, they had an additional emotional goal--to send Meyer out on a high note. 
Michigan, on the other hand, did not have a damning loss. They had a tough-fought close road loss to Notre Dame, a team that ended up undefeated and was a shoo-in for the CFP. All they had to do to get to the CFP was knock off Ohio State, and then they'd have as close to a lay-up in a CCG as you can get with Northwestern, and they'd have been in. But they lost. So instead of going to the CCG, instead of their consolation prize being the ROSE Bowl on NYD, they ended up losing and facing Florida in a rematch of the Citrus Bowl that nobody cared about. So much so that quite a few players even sat out.
Now, does that mean that OAM's criteria is a complete theory of quantifying "disappointed teams"? Probably not. But that doesn't invalidate that his criteria itself is meaningful. 

 

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