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Author Topic: #17 Michigan (2-1, 5-1) at Indiana (0-3, 3-3) Post Game  (Read 212 times)

Online Temp430

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#17 Michigan (2-1, 5-1) at Indiana (0-3, 3-3) Post Game
« on: October 10, 2017, 08:42:50 AM »
Michigan heads to Bloomington after the cluster frack in Ann Arbor on Saturday night.   Kickoff is at Noon and will be on ABC/ESPN.  Great D or no some of us think Indiana is quite capable of handing Michigan their second loss if they don't figure out how to fix the OL.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2017, 03:09:00 PM by ELA »


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Online 847badgerfan

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Re: #17 Michigan (1-1, 4-1) at Indiana (0-2, 3-2) Game Week
« Reply #1 on: October 10, 2017, 09:20:51 AM »
I think the key is how the kids in Blue respond to the nut punch they took last weekend. If they come in all pouty IU will take it to them.

Michigan has the better talent at almost every position, even though it's young and it may not being used properly. That last part is on the coaches and they need to get it figured out before the season falls apart on them.

Still, they have only one loss and there is a lot ahead of them if they can get it together. 

Tough to get a take on IU, although that Virginia win looks pretty good. I'm really curious to see how they deal with Michigan's defensive front seven.

Online MaximumSam

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Re: #17 Michigan (1-1, 4-1) at Indiana (0-2, 3-2) Game Week
« Reply #2 on: October 10, 2017, 09:30:10 AM »
Hoosiers now going with RS freshman Ramsey full time as their QB.  Kind of surprising given how Lagow looked against OSU, but from what I've read Indiana's offensive line hasn't been good enough to run anything but quick stuff, and Ramsey is much more mobile.  The defense is still pretty solid, probably good enough to get after Michigan.  Probably a similar game to Purdue, a mostly defensive game where Michigan pulls away (assuming they don't turn the ball over a hundred times).

Online Mdot21

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Re: #17 Michigan (1-1, 4-1) at Indiana (0-2, 3-2) Game Week
« Reply #3 on: October 10, 2017, 09:59:47 AM »
Hoosiers now going with RS freshman Ramsey full time as their QB.  Kind of surprising given how Lagow looked against OSU, but from what I've read Indiana's offensive line hasn't been good enough to run anything but quick stuff, and Ramsey is much more mobile.  The defense is still pretty solid, probably good enough to get after Michigan.  Probably a similar game to Purdue, a mostly defensive game where Michigan pulls away (assuming they don't turn the ball over a hundred times).
This is kind of where I'm at. I think Michigan wins an ugly one and pulls away late in the 2nd half to win by like 10-14 - that's provided they don't turn the ball over on offense like 4-5 times.

Offline Brutus Buckeye

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Re: #17 Michigan (1-1, 4-1) at Indiana (0-2, 3-2) Game Week
« Reply #4 on: October 10, 2017, 11:23:19 AM »
Hoosiers now going with RS freshman Ramsey full time as their QB.  Kind of surprising given how Lagow looked against OSU, but from what I've read Indiana's offensive line hasn't been good enough to run anything but quick stuff, and Ramsey is much more mobile.  The defense is still pretty solid, probably good enough to get after Michigan.  Probably a similar game to Purdue, a mostly defensive game where Michigan pulls away (assuming they don't turn the ball over a hundred times).
Yeah, after the way Lagow looked against OSU, I predicted that they would knock off the Wolverines. 
I no longer feel that way, obviously. I think IU simply took advantage of having an entire off season to prepare specifically for OSU. And the secondary that they faced was quite a bit greener than the one that they were preparing for. 
Michigan handles them easily, imo. 

Offline TresselownsUM

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Re: #17 Michigan (1-1, 4-1) at Indiana (0-2, 3-2) Game Week
« Reply #5 on: October 10, 2017, 12:33:02 PM »
hmm, I dunno.

IU at home, in the dreaded noon kickoff that can provide upsets. IU has been damn close to tagging OSU, UM the past few years. I don't however think a running QB is going to help them a ton in this game, UM's defense is too good.

but, IU can be had on the ground, so as long as UM pounds the rock, plays its usually stellar defense they should be ok.

might be a 24-17 type game though

Online Temp430

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Re: #17 Michigan (1-1, 4-1) at Indiana (0-2, 3-2) Game Week
« Reply #6 on: October 10, 2017, 02:12:01 PM »
Drake Harris is back on offense this week per the Detroit News. 

Drake Back to WR

Coaches probably thought a WR with some experience running routes is needed after watching DPJ's film from Saturday night.
« Last Edit: October 10, 2017, 02:23:43 PM by Temp430 »
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Online Mdot21

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Re: #17 Michigan (1-1, 4-1) at Indiana (0-2, 3-2) Game Week
« Reply #7 on: October 10, 2017, 06:57:29 PM »
Drake Harris is back on offense this week per the Detroit News.  

Drake Back to WR

Coaches probably thought a WR with some experience running routes is needed after watching DPJ's film from Saturday night.
I don't get why he was moved to CB in the first place. That one was a real head scratcher. Maybe Harbaugh thought he could strike lightning again when he moved Richard Sherman to CB from WR at Stanford?

Drake Harris' story has been a wild one. His sophomore year in high school put him on the recruiting map and his junior year he just exploded- and probably would've been a 5* recruit had he not missed his entire senior year due to injuries. Then in 2014 at Michigan he had to redshirt because of injury. Then he was injured again in 2015. He basically missed 3 years of football because of injuries. 2016 was the first season he was healthy and then in 2017 they moved him to CB.

I really thought Drake Harris was going to be a star. He was just so smooth and his ball skills and size in high school were about as elite as it gets.

Online Mdot21

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Re: #17 Michigan (1-1, 4-1) at Indiana (0-2, 3-2) Game Week
« Reply #8 on: October 10, 2017, 07:04:47 PM »
They threw the ball to DPJ like 4 times. I saw one play where he smoked his man and clearly was interfered with and there was no flag. I only saw one play that was kind of bad- he had his guy beat deep and took himself out of the play by drifting too close to the sideline and carrying himself out of bounds instead of giving himself a shot at catching a ball in bounds. That's going to happen to a true freshman that they NEVER effing play. 

That's my biggest gripe with Harbaugh and his staff. You had 4 games to get the kid ready to play. And you wait until arguably the 2nd biggest game of the season before you actually use him? GTFO. They had a ton of opportunities against live competition to actually use him against Florida, Purdue, Cincinnati, and Air Force. THOSE are the games to rep young guys so they can be READY to play Michigan State's, Wisconsin's, and Ohio State's. You don't just NEVER play them against live bullets and then say- oh hey kid go do it against MSU even though we've only thrown you like 3 passes total in 4 games and never really played you much in the previous 4 games.

You only get better at football by playing football. They had 4 games against 4 teams that were over-matched to work DPJ in. They chose not to give him run. They've got no one to blame but themselves. 

Online MichiFan87

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Re: #17 Michigan (1-1, 4-1) at Indiana (0-2, 3-2) Game Week
« Reply #9 on: October 10, 2017, 07:27:14 PM »
I'm not sure what came of that report that Drake Harris was joining the basketball team, but he's definitely more useful as a receiver than defensive-back.

The defense should be good enough for Michigan to win, no matter how the offense looks. Indiana has had a lot of turnovers, so I fully expect Michigan to get at least one defensive score or at least put the offense in great field position to do so. Their defense hasn't been that great, either. Also, John O'Korn was the starter when Michigan won this game last year, as ugly as it was. If the offense gets the TEs more involved they should be able to get some decent big plays like they did against Purdue. Keeping the defense honest by trying to throw it deep a few times will also help the running game, which looked better against Sparty. Of course, special teams could make a big difference, as well.
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Online Mdot21

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Re: #17 Michigan (1-1, 4-1) at Indiana (0-2, 3-2) Game Week
« Reply #10 on: October 11, 2017, 07:55:02 PM »
I'm not sure what came of that report that Drake Harris was joining the basketball team, but he's definitely more useful as a receiver than defensive-back.

The defense should be good enough for Michigan to win, no matter how the offense looks. Indiana has had a lot of turnovers, so I fully expect Michigan to get at least one defensive score or at least put the offense in great field position to do so. Their defense hasn't been that great, either. Also, John O'Korn was the starter when Michigan won this game last year, as ugly as it was. If the offense gets the TEs more involved they should be able to get some decent big plays like they did against Purdue. Keeping the defense honest by trying to throw it deep a few times will also help the running game, which looked better against Sparty. Of course, special teams could make a big difference, as well.
Defense is great. But it's also hyper-aggressive- which every team Michigan has faced has used against them to score some points. Brown is GREAT at making adjustments- so if you're going to score on him it better be early. He's a hard coach to out-scheme for 4 QTRs.

What worries me to death is the offense. IF Michigan turns it over 5 times against Indiana they will lose. Period.

I'd start Peters and shake up the OL. Burn a redshirt of one of the freshman tackles if you have to- move Kugler to Left Guard, or slot Ruiz in at Center and start Bredeson at RT. Simplify the offense. Take more shots deep. Use Chris Evans more in different ways. Do whatever you have to do to get things going.

This is all obvious. Which of course means O'Korn will start, the OL won't be shaken up, they'll continue to misuse the best weapon they have in Chris Evans, and the play-calling will still suck.

Who knew that when Harbaugh was hired- going on year 3 the offense just can't get going. His defenses have been lights out all 3 years. Especially since getting Don Brown. Those offenses though....my god. I'd kill for that 2015 offense right about now.

Online LetsGoPeay

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Re: #17 Michigan (1-1, 4-1) at Indiana (0-2, 3-2) Game Week
« Reply #11 on: October 12, 2017, 04:45:09 AM »
The move from Lagow to Ramsey had to happen. Lagow played well against OSU but has been terrible otherwise. His accuracy is awful. You can only throw fades to the big WRs so much before defenses start playing that and Lagow can’t hit spots accurately enough to counter it. I can’t count the number of times he has thrown five feet above or behind open receivers already this year. Throw in the O-lines struggles on the right side and the fact that that he’s as mobile as a statue and that’s recipe for disaster. Ramsey makes the read option game work and is accurate in the passing game. He’s sparked the team every time he’s come in. His problem is that he doesn’t have a big arm. Teams can sit deep and force him to throw underneath. Sooner or later his lack of zip will bite him on the curl routes and a pick-6 will happen too. It almost did twice against Charleston Southern. 

IU also needs to stick with freshman Morgan Ellison and sophomore Cole Gest at RB. They are the best so far this season at finding holes opened up by the line and hitting them hard. Gest especially gets there quick and decisively. Mike Majette has been the starter and is good in blitz pick-ups and is a good receiver but offers little in the ground game especially inside where he gets nothing, ever. 

Marcelino Ball will still be out this game too. He’s the hybrid safety/LB player in IU’s defense and is an absolute stud. He’ll be sorely missed against Michigan. He’s great against the run.

I agree that this should be a low scoring, defensive game.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2017, 04:48:07 AM by LetsGoPeay »

Online Temp430

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Re: #17 Michigan (1-1, 4-1) at Indiana (0-2, 3-2) Game Week
« Reply #12 on: October 12, 2017, 10:31:02 AM »
The weather for the game Saturday looks to be warm and sunny so that's a help.
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Online Mdot21

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Re: #17 Michigan (1-1, 4-1) at Indiana (0-2, 3-2) Game Week
« Reply #13 on: October 12, 2017, 12:42:55 PM »
The weather for the game Saturday looks to be warm and sunny so that's a help.
That's good news. Especially for a QB like O'Korn who doesn't have the strongest arm AND still takes chances with the football trying to fit in places he probably shouldn't.

If the kid had a Brett Favre or Matt Stafford arm strength- that'd be one thing. He doesn't- but he still tries to fit balls into tight windows. Since his he doesn't have that kind of arm strength and he still plays like that it means he needs the weather to be perfect and zero wind in order for him to complete some of those riskier throws.

Only two games he ever started at Michigan were Indiana last year and MSU this year. Both of them were windy as hell and it was snowing for the Indiana game and raining like a monsoon for the MSU game.

Online Mdot21

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Re: #17 Michigan (1-1, 4-1) at Indiana (0-2, 3-2) Game Week
« Reply #14 on: October 12, 2017, 04:03:34 PM »
awesome break down of the offense vs. MSU by MgoBlog. Love how they break things down play by play. Basically: Michigan's run game is struggling because the backs have bad vision and the coaching staff insists on running an inside zone blocking scheme and the OL just cannot do it for whatever reason. They are much more effective in a gap blocking scheme team running the power and iso. 11 rushes with the zone blocking scheme netted a whopping 25 yards. 14 with the gap block scheme netted 68. 2.27 YPC vs. 4.8+ YPC. Yeah...maybe they should ditch that zone block scheme....just a thought. RB's other than Higdon are missing free yards with bad vision- particularly Evans. Evans isn't living up to the pre-season hype. Grant Perry is the only reliable WR. DPJ made rookie mistakes with his route running- took himself out of plays.

McDoom and Crawford are both getting open but struggling at catching the ball. O'Korn is just bad. The pass protection was better than it looked- O'Korn ran panicked himself into sacks and pressures. Nolan Ulizio is just really bad at all forms of blocking, period. His replacement at RT Juwann Bushell Beatty can run block surprisingly well- but he's pretty much just as horrible in pass pro as Ulizio. TE Sean McKeon can't really block at all. Kinda makes sense he's barely 240 pounds. Tyrone Wheatley is just crushing dudes and destroying people on blocks when he's in the game- makes sense- he's 6'6, 275 minimum. Wheatley needs more playing time. Immediately. Mike Onwenu is destroying people in the run game. Makes sense. He's 6'3, 360 minimum.

Just bad offense- bad coaching- bad play-calling, bad execution- just all-around BAD.


MGoBlog. http://mgoblog.com/content/upon-further-review-2017-offense-vs-michigan-state#more

Online PortlandSpartan

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Re: #17 Michigan (1-1, 4-1) at Indiana (0-2, 3-2) Game Week
« Reply #15 on: October 13, 2017, 05:48:03 PM »
Not going to read it, so I'll just assume ol Brian gives zero credit to MSU and UM just shot themselves in the foot all game long.  Yet another victory by birthright that UM gave away.

Online ELA

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Re: #17 Michigan (1-1, 4-1) at Indiana (0-2, 3-2) Game Week
« Reply #16 on: October 13, 2017, 07:03:54 PM »
His post MSU game posts are usually so full of hot takes though

http://mgoblog.com/content/spartans-your-profession-loser

Online Mdot21

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Re: #17 Michigan (2-1, 5-1) at Indiana (0-3, 3-3) Post Game
« Reply #17 on: October 14, 2017, 06:53:54 PM »
Total. Shit. Show. 

Have to basically roll with O'Korn now against Penn State since Peters hasn't been repped against live bullets. They are going to get destroyed by Penn State. It won't be pretty. 

Online SuperMario

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Re: #17 Michigan (2-1, 5-1) at Indiana (0-3, 3-3) Post Game
« Reply #18 on: October 14, 2017, 08:24:36 PM »
Total. Shit. Show.

Have to basically roll with O'Korn now against Penn State since Peters hasn't been repped against live bullets. They are going to get destroyed by Penn State. It won't be pretty.
Completely agree. The offense is very painful to watch. Peters should have seen reps today. Penn State is going to roll. They are a talented team.

Online Mdot21

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Re: #17 Michigan (2-1, 5-1) at Indiana (0-3, 3-3) Post Game
« Reply #19 on: October 14, 2017, 09:07:36 PM »
Completely agree. The offense is very painful to watch. Peters should have seen reps today. Penn State is going to roll. They are a talented team.
Yeah, I have a hard time faulting them for starting O'Korn against MSU. He played pretty well against Purdue on the road in relief for Speight. You thought maybe with a bye week that'd give him 2 weeks of 1st team reps and see how he does against MSU. That's not a game you typically want to start a freshman. And then the weather was so awful in the 2nd half- not sure it'd have been a good idea to throw Peters to the wolves there. But perfect weather against Indiana- would have been the perfect opportunity to give Peters a little bit of a shot. 
Michigan's defense is really good. But they are on the field all game. And the offense has turned it over so much and set teams up with either points or short fields to get points. If that offense could just score points and string drives together and not turn it over that defense would just be that much better. 
Have a really hard time seeing the offense doing anything in Happy Valley. I predict that Penn State will score at least 1 defensive touchdown off an O'Korn turnover and that they will also get a return touchdown. Michigan's defense gives up a TD or two. I'll say 31-3. Penn State will get 14 from the D/ST's, get 3 off a short field off a Michigan turnover, and they'll score 14 on offense. I'm being generous giving Michigan 3 points. But Nordin has a huge leg so he'll probably hit like a 59 yarder for Michigan's only points. There Will Be Blood.

Online Temp430

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Re: #17 Michigan (2-1, 5-1) at Indiana (0-3, 3-3) Post Game
« Reply #20 on: October 15, 2017, 06:32:38 AM »
Michigan’s passing game is lacking but no sacks, fumbles, or interceptions is a step in the right direction.  JBB is an upgrade at RT.

If Peters or anyone else was ready and better they would be out there.  Truth is O’Korn is it by a mile until Speight returns, if he ever does.
« Last Edit: October 15, 2017, 06:42:05 AM by Temp430 »
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Online MrNubbz

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Re: #17 Michigan (2-1, 5-1) at Indiana (0-3, 3-3) Post Game
« Reply #21 on: October 15, 2017, 07:39:50 AM »
There was one play in the 1st qtr i believe Okorn was fantastic.The pocket collapsed he escaped at least 4 would be tacklers at least one had him and he shook loose rolled right and hit DPJ for 15 -20 yds.I see him do this and think ya he'll be alright.
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Online Mdot21

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Re: #17 Michigan (2-1, 5-1) at Indiana (0-3, 3-3) Post Game
« Reply #22 on: October 15, 2017, 12:13:46 PM »
There was one play in the 1st qtr i believe Okorn was fantastic.The pocket collapsed he escaped at least 4 would be tacklers at least one had him and he shook loose rolled right and hit DPJ for 15 -20 yds.I see him do this and think ya he'll be alright.
There is no denying the kid has really good physical talent. He's very elusive, has good speed, has a pretty good arm. He can make the WOW plays like that. Problem is everything else. He has happy feet in the pocket, he locks onto his 1st read and telegraphs throws, doesn't go through progressions and find the 2nd, 3rd or 4th options. If the first option isn't there he throws it anyway or he bails. 
He had DPJ for a walk-in TD. I mean DPJ smoked his guy by like 5 yards at least- and O'Korn overthrew him. Speight is pretty bad- but one thing he does have is a pretty good deep ball. I'd bet Speight hits that deep ball. 

Online Mdot21

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Re: #17 Michigan (2-1, 5-1) at Indiana (0-3, 3-3) Post Game
« Reply #23 on: October 15, 2017, 01:08:13 PM »
Michigan’s passing game is lacking but no sacks, fumbles, or interceptions is a step in the right direction.  JBB is an upgrade at RT.

If Peters or anyone else was ready and better they would be out there.  Truth is O’Korn is it by a mile until Speight returns, if he ever does.
This offensive coaching staff is absolutely clueless on it's own personnel and it's shocking to me how bad they are. Ulizio was awful at everything. JBB might not be a drastic improvement in pass blocking- but boy he is as a run blocker.

Tyrone Wheatley is 6'6, 275 and he absolutely destroys people blocking when he's in the game at TE. So naturally they play the smaller McKeon and Gentry more and ask them to block- when they both really struggle right now in that department.
They have all these different parts on offense and don't know how to use them and it's astounding. Why do they get paid that kind of money if they can't do their jobs at a high level? 

Chris Evans has been horribly misused this entire year. Need to figure out how to use him? Watch some tape of how Urban used Curtis Samuel.  Took them this long to figure out that Karran Higdon is their best inside runner and say to hell with his lack of pass blocking- we just need to let him run. Kareem Walker had one great run where he showed how to run with violence and then- nothing. Ty Isaac is 6'3, 235 pounds and he runs like he's scared of contact. I don't get it.

Online ELA

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Re: #17 Michigan (2-1, 5-1) at Indiana (0-3, 3-3) Post Game
« Reply #24 on: October 15, 2017, 05:30:19 PM »
It's looking more and more like he picked the wrong QB in SF too

 

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