The B12 (XII) Forum, home of the 'Front Porch, y'all' at College Football Fan Site, CFB51!!!

Definitely concur about Mack being a really great coach. In the end he won as many MNC as Stoops.  It seemed like even when he managed to finally beat OU and Stoops they would lose to Tech or some lesser opponent like CU in 2001. Must have been maddening to Texas fans of the era.

Conversely ou could lose to KSU in the CCG and still get in. Hmmmm

Indeed it was.

Unfortunately for Mack, his legacy amongst many Texas fans will always be defined by his general failures against the Sooners.  Such is the nature of that rivalry, there's little room for forgiveness.

But still I wish him well and am glad to see him successful elsewhere. 

I think that's the nature of fandom now, which has been turned into NC-or-bust.  The objective best coach in our school's history has mostly been forgotten, and when remembered, mentioned exactly as he usually was during his tenure, as a moron who couldn't coach. 

Despite taking the school on its best run in history and one of the better runs in cfb history, his legacy is defined by losing the rematch to Alabama. 



.....still irritates me that a team that went 12-1 with a crap schedule could win an NC over a team that went 13-1 with an all-time sos, and they being 1-1 against each other.  C'est la vie. 

Oh I'm not defining Mack Brown's tenure by the NCs or lack thereof.  Truth is that he won one, and played for another, which is already better than the vast majority of coaches out there.  

I'm actually measuring his accomplishments the OLD way.  Beat your rival, win your conference, go to a good bowl.  His legacy is sadly lacking in the first of those, which unfortunately led directly to his struggles doing the second. He did have a pretty good bowl record ultimately, and won some really big ones.  

.....still irritates me that a team that went 12-1 with a crap schedule could win an NC over a team that went 13-1 with an all-time sos, and they being 1-1 against each other.  C'est la vie.

That situation illustrates why I have never been in favor of a playoff.
But nobody asked me, so all I can do is yell at people to get off my lawn.

Indeed it was.

Unfortunately for Mack, his legacy amongst many Texas fans will always be defined by his general failures against the Sooners.  Such is the nature of that rivalry, there's little room for forgiveness.

But still I wish him well and am glad to see him successful elsewhere.

I don't disagree, but think about all the seasons where he beat OU but lost to a lesser team along the way and let OU sneak into the MNC.  I can think of at least 3.  '01 CU, '06 A&M, and '08 Tech.  Even playing for a major bowl in any of those seasons would have lessened the sting.  

I may be misremembering CU because I think OU beat Texas big but Texas still went to the Big XII CCG.  I just remember that Texas had an outside chance at the MNC that year.  I think FSU won it (or maybe Miami).  

I don't disagree, but think about all the seasons where he beat OU but lost to a lesser team along the way and let OU sneak into the MNC.  I can think of at least 3.  '01 CU, '06 A&M, and '08 Tech.  Even playing for a major bowl in any of those seasons would have lessened the sting. 

I may be misremembering CU because I think OU beat Texas big but Texas still went to the Big XII CCG.  I just remember that Texas had an outside chance at the MNC that year.  I think FSU won it (or maybe Miami). 

Miami won it that year and conventional wisdom is that anyone they played would have been a sacrificial lamb.  That might be true.  But they played Nebraska, not OU, in that game.

Anyway Texas lost to OU in 2001 so it doesn't really fall into your exact definition. That loss didn't cost Texas a shot at the B12 CCG but then the Horns turned around and lost to CU 39-37 in Irving, after beating the Buffs 41-7 in Austin.  That's a missed opportunity at a conference championship that lies squarely at Mack's feet for starting Chris Simms over Major Applewhite, who was the better gameday quarterback.  Major almost engineered a furious comeback victory, but fell 2 points short.

The '06 team beat OU pretty handily but lost to both Kansas State and Texas A&M (and Ohio State non-conference).  After the departure of Vince Young, that team just wasn't elite or even close to it.  As great as Colt McCoy played as a freshman, he was still just a freshman.  I don't really blame Mack for anything that season, other than perhaps promoting Duane Akina to DC when he was clearly a good position coach and nothing more.  Oh and OU didn't play for the NC that year either.  Instead they played Boise State in the Fiesta Bowl-- and lost.

'08 is what it is.  A crazy loss on the high plains to Tech when the refs allowed Orakpo and all the other Texas d-linemen to be bear-hugged to the ground all day long, like this play, that ended up injuring Orakpo and knocking him out of that game and the next couple. 


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tM28K2wg8dY

Zero doubt in my mind Texas was the best team in the country that year. That '08 team was significantly better than the '09 team that actually went to the NC game against Alabama.  And Texas did play in a major bowl that year, beating the 10th ranked Ohio State Buckeyes 24-21 in the Fiesta.