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Topic: ~2017-18 Big Ten Basketball Thread~

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ELA

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Re: ~2017-18 Big Ten Basketball Thread~
« Reply #840 on: January 28, 2018, 04:58:59 PM »
Painter and Hartman both on point with rivalry sport coats.

ELA

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Re: ~2017-18 Big Ten Basketball Thread~
« Reply #841 on: January 28, 2018, 05:00:19 PM »
Indianas help defense on Haas is awful

MarqHusker

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Re: ~2017-18 Big Ten Basketball Thread~
« Reply #842 on: January 28, 2018, 05:05:32 PM »
Fun game.  Very buzzy the past few days around town.  Flags flying etc.

MarqHusker

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Re: ~2017-18 Big Ten Basketball Thread~
« Reply #843 on: January 28, 2018, 05:29:13 PM »
Some of the FGa by IU, whew they are who I thought they were.

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: ~2017-18 Big Ten Basketball Thread~
« Reply #844 on: January 28, 2018, 06:33:25 PM »
Carsen Edwards has been having a problem with bricked dunks on breakaways...

Certainly picked the right game to get his first collegiate dunk!


https://twitter.com/PurdueOnBTN/status/957732403291684864

medinabuckeye1

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Re: ~2017-18 Big Ten Basketball Thread~
« Reply #845 on: January 29, 2018, 10:35:35 AM »
There were no upsets (per the tiers) this weekend so no change to projections.  For review, here are the tiers (with +/- for upsets):
  • Purdue, Michigan State -1
  • Ohio State even*
  • Nebraska +1, Michigan +1, Maryland, Penn State -1, Minnesota -2*
  • Wisconsin +1, Indiana +1, Northwestern
  • Iowa +1, Rutgers, Illinois -1
Upsets so far have been:
DateWon@/vLost
4-DecUW@PSU
2-JanUNL@NU
6-JanIU@MN
11-JanIA@ILL
13-JanM@MSU
15-JanMN@PSU
20-JantOSUMSG*MN
23-JanNU@MN
25-JanPSU@tOSU
*Ohio State's win over Minnesota is treated as an "upset" because it replaced a Minnesota home game but the game was actually played at MSG in NYC so it should not be credited to Ohio State nor held against Minnesota.  

The projected final standings/BTT seeds are:
  • 17-1 Purdue
  • 16-2 Michigan State
  • 14-4 Ohio State
  • 12-6 Nebraska
  • 10-8 Penn State (wins tiebreaker over M based on H2H, no game in Ann Arbor)
  • 10-8 Michigan
  • 8-10 Maryland
  • 7-11 Wisconsin (wins H2H2H tiebreaker with IU and NU, 2-1)
  • 7-11 Indiana (second in H2H2H tiebreaker with UW and NU, 1-1)
  • 7-11 Northwestern (last in H2H2H tiebreaker with UW and IU, 1-2)
  • 6-12 Minnesota
  • 5-13 Rutgers
  • 4-14 Iowa
  • 3-15 Illinois
The match-ups in the BTT at MSG in NYC would be:
Wednesday, February 28:
  • #11 Minnesota vs #14 Illinois, 8pm, BTN
  • #12 Rutgers vs #13 Iowa, 5:30pm, BTN
Thursday, March 1:
  • #5 Penn State vs RU/IA, 2:30pm, BTN
  • #6 Michigan vs MN/IL, 9pm, BTN
  • #7 Maryland vs #10 Northwestern, 6:30pm, BTN
  • #8 Wisconsin vs #9 Indiana, noon, BTN
Friday, March 2:
  • #1 Purdue vs UW/IU, noon, BTN
  • #2 Michigan State vs UMD/NU, 6:30pm, BTN
  • #3 Ohio State vs M/MN/IL, 9pm, BTN
  • #4 Nebraska vs PSU/RU/IA, 2:30pm, BTN
Saturday, March 3:
  • PU/UW/IU vs UNL/PSU/RU/IA, 2pm, CBS
  • MSU/UMD/NU vs tOSU/M/MN/IL, 4:30pm, CBS
Sunday, March 4:
  • PU/UW/IU/UNL/PSU/RU/IA vs MSU/UMD/NU/tOSU/M/MN/IL, 4:30pm, CBS

FearlessF

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Re: ~2017-18 Big Ten Basketball Thread~
« Reply #846 on: January 29, 2018, 11:11:19 AM »
I'm rooting for the two road teams tonight

Northwestern @ Michigan and Nebraska @ Wisconsin

will also be watching the Jayhawks at the Purple Cats

Monday night hoops is good
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medinabuckeye1

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Re: ~2017-18 Big Ten Basketball Thread~
« Reply #847 on: January 29, 2018, 11:31:29 AM »
Starting to think about the bubble:
Barring collapse the top three (PU, tOSU, and MSU) will obviously be in.  Similarly, barring a miracle the bottom four (MN, RU, IA, IL) will not be playing NCAA Tournament ball this year.  That leaves seven B1G where things could go either way:

7-4 Nebraska:  The blessing and curse for the Cornhuskers is that they have a surprisingly weak B1G schedule.  That is a blessing because they should finish with a pretty strong (looking) league record but it is a curse because their only quality win in conference was over the Wolverines (at home) and they have no remaining chances against likely tournament teams.  Nebraska travels to Madison tonight then has more than a week off before heading to Minneapolis next Tuesday.  We project them to lose both of those road games.  After that they finish with four of five at home and the lone road game is at lowly Illinois so we project them to win their last five and finish 12-6.  I don't think 12-6 would be enough for the Cornhuskers without a quality win (or two) in NYC so I think they need to win at least one of their next two.  

6-4 Michigan:  The Wolverines are probably in better shape than it would at first appear.  We project them to go 4-4 in their last eight to finish 10-8 which is a weak record in the B1G this year.  The good news for Michigan is that of the four projected losses (@NU, @UW, @PSU, @UMD) I think that three are close to toss-ups.  Additionally, of the four projected wins (vsNU, vsMN, vsIA, vstOSU) I believe that the Wolverines do not have more than a token chance of losing in three of those four games.  If the Wolverines do finish 10-8 I believe that they will get to the BTT at MSG in NYC with a lot of work to do but it is reasonably likely that they will finish a couple games better than that and probably safely locked into the NCAA before the games in NYC begin.  

5-5 Penn State:  The Nittany Lions rejuvenated their tournament hopes with their win in Columbus last week but they clearly still have a long way to go.  They have some dreadful losses that they will have to make up for.  We project them to go 5-3 down the stretch to finish 10-8 but that clearly will not be enough.  The problem is that the three projected losses are @MSU (Wednesday), @Purdue, and @ Nebraska.  Of the three, only Nebraska seems likely to flip.  Meanwhile they have two projected wins that could easily flip to losses (vstOSU, vM).  At a minimum, I think they need to win all of the projected wins and knock off the Cornhuskers in Lincoln.  That is a tall order.  

5-5 Indiana:  We project the Hoosiers do go 2-6 down the stretch and finish 7-11 in the B1G.  Even flipping that to 6-2 to finish 11-7 might not be enough so the Hoosiers are rapidly running out of time.  Their next two are at Ohio State (Tuesday) and vsMSU (Saturday).  IMHO, if they don't win one of those two you can stick a fork in them.  

4-5 Northwestern:  We project the Wildcats to go 3-6 down the stretch and finish 7-11 in the B1G.  They probably need to finish 7-2 to have a chance so the Wildcats are also rapidly running out of time.  Their next two are at Michigan (tonight) and at Wisconsin (Thursday).  IMHO, if they don't win one of those two you can stick a fork in them.  

4-6 Maryland:  We project the Terrapins to go 4-4 down the stretch and finish 8-10 in the B1G.  The good news is that three of the projected losses (@PSU, @UNL, @NU) seem like winnable games.  The bad news is that, at a minimum, they probably need to win all of those and the four projected wins.  That would get them to 11-7 which probably isn't in, but it likely is at least on the bubble.  That means that if they lose at Purdue on Wednesday they likely need to win out after that.  

3-6 Wisconsin:  The Badgers have finished in the top-4 in the B1G a staggering 16 years in a row.  Additionally, they have appeared in the last 19 straight NCAA Tournaments.  Both of those streaks are on life support.  They would likely need to win out to finish in the top-4 of the B1G.  The good news is that six of the Badgers' last nine games are at home.  Further good news is that two of the three remaining road games (@IL, @NU) appear to be winnable.  The bad news is that three of the home games (vsM, vsPU, vMSU) look to be likely losses.  We project the Badgers to go 4-5 down the stretch and finish 7-11 in the B1G.  They probably need to be near-perfect to get to NYC on the bubble.  Their next two are home games against Nebraska (tonight) and Northwestern (Thursday).  IMHO, if they don't win both you can stick a fork in them.  

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: ~2017-18 Big Ten Basketball Thread~
« Reply #848 on: January 29, 2018, 12:04:35 PM »
Ohio State even*
Minnesota -2*

DateWon@/vLost
4-DecUW@PSU
2-JanUNL@NU
6-JanIU@MN
11-JanIA@ILL
13-JanM@MSU
15-JanMN@PSU
20-JantOSUMSG*MN
23-JanNU@MN
25-JanPSU@tOSU
*Ohio State's win over Minnesota is treated as an "upset" because it replaced a Minnesota home game but the game was actually played at MSG in NYC so it should not be credited to Ohio State nor held against Minnesota.  
IMHO you shouldn't "score" the OSU over MN win as an upset. It was a neutral site game, so I would think that if you remove HFA, a 1-tier advantage team should beat their opponent, which is what happened.
Now, I agree with the asterisk, but I would rather you display it as OSU (-1) and Minnesota (-1) than even and -2, respectively.

PSUinNC

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Re: ~2017-18 Big Ten Basketball Thread~
« Reply #849 on: January 29, 2018, 12:17:28 PM »
Penn State's going to really look back at a few losses later this year and wonder 'what if'.  The home loss to Rider is inexcusable, period.  Squandering a chance to get a road W at IU will ultimately hurt, and the loss at home to Minne will hurt greatly too.  They also squandered a later lead at Northwestern that would have helped RPI tremendously.  

Feels like a year Penn State really had a chance to take a step forward and missed it big time.  

medinabuckeye1

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Re: ~2017-18 Big Ten Basketball Thread~
« Reply #850 on: January 29, 2018, 12:21:45 PM »
IMHO you shouldn't "score" the OSU over MN win as an upset. It was a neutral site game, so I would think that if you remove HFA, a 1-tier advantage team should beat their opponent, which is what happened.
Now, I agree with the asterisk, but I would rather you display it as OSU (-1) and Minnesota (-1) than even and -2, respectively.
I would, but there is a reason I didn't.  
In the spreadsheet where I track these projections I start with each team's projected record in a 26 game double-round-robin:
  • Ohio State is in tier-2 and their projected record in a double-round-robin is 19-7 with road losses to the two  two tier-1 teams and the five tier-3 teams.  
  • Minnesota is in tier-3 and their projected record in a double-round-robin is 14-12 with two losses (each) to the tier-1 teams, and road losses to the one tier-2 team, the other four tier-3 teams, and the three tier-4 teams.  
Next I have four columns for road games not played then four columns for home games not played.  Then I list the projected record in the eight games not played.  
  • Ohio State misses five projected wins (@IL, vsUW, vsNU, vsMN, vsPU) and three projected losses (@MSU, @UMD, @UNL).  
  • Minnesota misses six projected wins (@IL, @RU, vsUMD, vsM, vsPSU, vsUW) and two projected losses (@MSU, @tOSU).  
Next I subtract the projected record in games not played from the projected record in a double-round-robin to calculate the initial projection (before upsets) for each team:
  • Ohio State's is 19-7 less 5-3 = 14-4
  • Minnesota's is 14-12 less 6-2 = 8-10
Then I track the upsets with my +Var, -Var, and Var columns to keep track of the updated projection.  This is a check-figure for my other projection column in which I'm looking at individual games.  

Sorry for the long explanation, but here is the problem:  As my spreadsheet is currently set up, I have to treat the game as an upset because it replaced a Minnesota home game.  I could fix it by adding several new columns to track games moved to neutral sites and the change in projected record created by those moves but it just isn't worth it for something that only comes up once in a while.  That is why I used the asterisk.  It is a lot easier than adding a bunch of columns to my spreadsheet that would only rarely be relevant.  

medinabuckeye1

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Re: ~2017-18 Big Ten Basketball Thread~
« Reply #851 on: January 29, 2018, 12:32:03 PM »
The last time the Badgers played in a BTT game prior to Friday Bill Clinton was POTUS.  Way back On Thursday, March 9, 2000 #6 Wisconsin beat #11 Northwestern.  

FearlessF

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Re: ~2017-18 Big Ten Basketball Thread~
« Reply #852 on: January 29, 2018, 12:39:57 PM »
It's all about the coaching
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847badgerfan

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Re: ~2017-18 Big Ten Basketball Thread~
« Reply #853 on: January 29, 2018, 02:01:27 PM »
It's all about the coaching
I agree to a point. Greg Gard is a very good coach. He took a "disaster" of a team over when Bo stepped down and got to within a hair of the Elite 8. Then he got them to the 16 last season.

This year is about the ponies, and Bo's final class is turning out to be horrible. The young kids are actually pretty good right now, but they are young and need more development. They also have had two key pieces injured for most of the season.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

 

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