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Topic: The Ukraine Topic

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FearlessF

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #56 on: February 27, 2022, 10:43:12 PM »
May be an image of 1 person and text that says 'War itself is, of course, a form of madness. It's hardly a civilized. pursuit. It's amazing how we spend so much time inventing devices to kill each other and so little time working on how to achieve peace." ~Walter Cronkite'
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"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

FearlessF

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #57 on: February 27, 2022, 10:50:35 PM »
May be an image of 9 people and text that says 'War isn' hell. War is war and Hell is hell, and of the two, war lot worse. How do you figure that, Hawkeye? Easy,Father. Easy, Father. Tell Ûl. me, who goes Hell? Sinners,|believe. believe. Exactly. There are no innocent bystanders in Hell. But war is chock full of them. Little kids, criples, old ladies. In fact, except for few of the brass, almost everybody involved is an innocent bystander.'
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"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

Cincydawg

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #58 on: February 28, 2022, 07:15:19 AM »
I don't see how even tactical nukes is of any use to Putin.  Ukrainian forces are not concentrated (much) that I can figure.  They aren't useful as city busters, even if he wanted to take out a city for some reason.  I think it's just meant as a warning as NATO reinforces near his borders.  He has much of his military engaged and unable to respond to any NATO incursion, so he sends a nuclear warning not to try that.

I would guess any Ohio class subs we have docked are getting ready to deploy as fast as they can, they generally do 6 months gold and 6 blue but can surge if needed.
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Cincydawg

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #59 on: February 28, 2022, 07:21:07 AM »
Quote from: OrangeAfroMan on February 27, 2022, 04:51:54 PM
So a non-nuclear yet harsh counter-attack is really stupid.  Mkay.

We know where all their shit is.  For the U.S. to finally be able to declare war on a country would be a relief.  Like Superman fighting someone his own size....no more pulling punches, no more worrying about stopping the bad guy without killing him......just unleash hell on an enemy. 

Russia would be a fucking ghost.  A rumor.  History book fodder like Sumer and sanskrit. 
I assumed by "unleash hell" you meant a nuclear first strike, as opposed to the notion we could bomb Moscow conventionally.
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Cincydawg

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #60 on: February 28, 2022, 07:24:16 AM »
To note, I don't think this thread benefits from more discussion about how neoNazis are in Ukraine and part of their military.  We all get the point, it needn't be made again.  Please stick to apolitical comments and observations about the conflict.

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MrNubbz

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #61 on: February 28, 2022, 08:15:46 AM »
Quote from: Mdot21 on February 27, 2022, 10:00:05 PM
crying a river for them? hardly. pointing out a disgusting racist as day post by the official twitter account of the Ukrainian national guard which is praising a neo-nazi group (Azov Battalion) that is under their banner and part of their forces (since 2015) for dipping bullets in pigs lard and calling Muslims orcs - is hardly crying a river for them.

Could you imagine if an official twitter account US or any other Western country did the same thing? Cause I can't.
They(Chechens) by their own behavior according to someone who lived there deserved every shitty response.Oh god they were called names,so were the assholes busting up cities here - you reap what you sow.They would wipe you,me and every one else on this board off of this Earth.If those roles were reversed you are deluded if you think you'd have a voice.Want to pull for the Ukranians fine they were not poking the bear
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MrNubbz

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #62 on: February 28, 2022, 08:39:19 AM »
Quote from: Mdot21 on February 27, 2022, 11:49:56 AM
so who is going to bomb Washington DC for.... Vietnam, Panama, Iraq I, Afghanistan, Iraq II, Libya, and Syria? We gonna bomb ourselves?
Vietnam was definitely different than the others a populous country during the height of the cold war being infiltrated/supported by Russia/China who both supplied either men/materiel/bombs/bullets etc and the sitting government requesting US involvement/assisstance.I'm all for draining the special interest swamp over here though
« Last Edit: February 28, 2022, 08:46:44 AM by MrNubbz »
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MrNubbz

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #63 on: February 28, 2022, 08:42:46 AM »
Quote from: OrangeAfroMan on February 27, 2022, 04:46:17 PM
I was under the impression that our bombers are too high for anyone fast enough to harm them and too fast for anyone high enough. 
No?
look up Francsis Gary Powers,that's usually discussed in American History class 
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NorthernOhioBuckeye

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #64 on: February 28, 2022, 08:50:52 AM »
Quote from: OrangeAfroMan on February 27, 2022, 04:46:17 PM
I was under the impression that our bombers are too high for anyone fast enough to harm them and too fast for anyone high enough. 
No?
There was one plane that flew high and fast enough that the Russians could not shoot it down, the SR-71. However it was not a bomber, it was a reconnaissance aircraft that flew over Russia snapping pictures for our intelligence to analyze. It was retired because we now have satellites capable of doing every bit as good a job while being able to instantly send photo's back without putting anyone (pilot) in danger.  
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Cincydawg

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #65 on: February 28, 2022, 08:59:57 AM »
The B-58 probably could have penetrated Russian air space at altitude back in the day, it had a short career.  The B-1A was designed as a high altitude supersonic bomber, but it was halted and eventually redesigned as the B-1B that would go in at low altitude.  (It's nickname is the "Bone", beautiful plane.)

The B-2 might be able to traverse Russian airspace to at least some degree, but as noted, we only have 20 of them.
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Gigem

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #66 on: February 28, 2022, 09:06:56 AM »
Quote from: OrangeAfroMan on February 27, 2022, 04:51:54 PM
So a non-nuclear yet harsh counter-attack is really stupid.  Mkay.

We know where all their shit is.  For the U.S. to finally be able to declare war on a country would be a relief.  Like Superman fighting someone his own size....no more pulling punches, no more worrying about stopping the bad guy without killing him......just unleash hell on an enemy. 

Russia would be a fucking ghost.  A rumor.  History book fodder like Sumer and sanskrit. 

What you're advocating for is basically all out war, like WWIII.  And it would never result in any kind of victory because if you even had sustained success on the ground they'd drop a nuke an obliterate any kind of army as it advanced.  Even on their own soil.  Heck they might even drop a nuke or two over our way just for good measure.  

We'd bomb each other into oblivion, all the while China would sit back and stay quiet until the smoke and dust clears.  Then we'd all be their slaves (for real this time).  

No thanks.  I hate what's happening to Ukraine but it should be up to Europe and their neighbors to help them out.  

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Gigem

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #67 on: February 28, 2022, 09:12:54 AM »
B-52's are big, slow, and mostly defenseless.  They will bring them in only when total air domination has occurred or when the defenses are like those in Afghanistan.  

If we did bomb it would be by smaller planes with few bombs. Like F-15's and F-22's.  Until Air Superiority is reached.  Then they send in the BUFFS.  
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Temp430

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #68 on: February 28, 2022, 09:15:39 AM »
The EU is providing Ukraine with fighter jets among other lethal aid.  Several EU members who are former Soviet bloc nations have Russian built fighters like Poland's Mig-29s that Ukrainian pilots are already familiar with.

https://euobserver.com/world/154450


I must say I'm happy to see the EU taking the lead on sticking it to Putin.
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Cincydawg

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Re: The Ukraine Topic
« Reply #69 on: February 28, 2022, 09:22:15 AM »
The biggest thing Europe "could" do in theory is cut off buying oil and NG from Russia, we could as well.  More realistic is they (Germany) could announce serious plans to develop other sources of NG.  And then do it.

The US imports a surprising amount of oil from Russia since 1995, and we did so when Trump was President as well.  They are our Number 2 supplier.

U.S. Imports from Russia of Crude Oil and Petroleum Products (Thousand Barrels) (eia.gov)

If we didn't of course, China would step in, and we'd buy it from Saudi Arabia instead of China.
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