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Topic: Xs and Os Discussion

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Cincydawg

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Xs and Os Discussion
« on: August 03, 2022, 03:53:18 PM »
As I really don't know much about "inside football", I thought maybe some of youse guys could enlighten me, and perhaps others.

Here is my first question, it's first and ten from your own 25, the QB comes up to the line and surveys the defense, what's he looking for specifically?  Presume said defense is of a standard type.

FearlessF

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Re: Xs and Os Discussion
« Reply #1 on: August 03, 2022, 04:13:38 PM »
he's looking to see if the defensive alignment is stacked against the play called in the huddle. 

He may have the latitude to audible to a different run play or a pass play if the defense is crowding the center of the line and an inside run is the play

Otherwise he's checking LBs and safeties to guess what coverage they are playing - zone or man
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Honestbuckeye

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Re: Xs and Os Discussion
« Reply #2 on: August 03, 2022, 04:40:53 PM »
As I really don't know much about "inside football", I thought maybe some of youse guys could enlighten me, and perhaps others.

Here is my first question, it's first and ten from your own 25, the QB comes up to the line and surveys the defense, what's he looking for specifically?  Presume said defense is of a standard type.
The degree of complexity in the NFL is substantially greater than at the college level, but now even most good college offices have a variety of options prepared when the quarterback is preparing to receive the snap.
as fearless said, the quarterback is trying to assess the defensive alignment to ensure that it’s not stacked against a play that was already called. That’s the basic version.  Is the office going to run the ball to the boundary? If yes is the defense stacked to the boundary on the line or in the secondary?  He can always audible out of that into something different.

Some of the more advanced college offenses don’t even have a play called, just a formation. From there the quarterback makes an assessment of whether the defense is focused on a run or a pass. Or, are they in a loose zone which allows for short completions underneath, or most likely is there a one on one match up to the outside that can be taken advantage of?

also now with the proliferation of the RPO, the quarterback might call the play at the line and it is both a run and a pass, with a quarterback making the Quick decision based on the movements of one particular defensive player, most often a linebacker or defensive end.
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
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FearlessF

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Re: Xs and Os Discussion
« Reply #3 on: August 03, 2022, 04:59:26 PM »
also now with the proliferation of the RPO, the quarterback might call the play at the line and it is both a run and a pass, with a quarterback making the Quick decision based on the movements of one particular defensive player, most often a linebacker or defensive end.
this is most effective when the defense shows a disguise and then shifts the Dline to another gap, or the linebackers show run defense and then drop back just before the snap

same goes for the safeties moving at the snap
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

bayareabadger

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Re: Xs and Os Discussion
« Reply #4 on: August 03, 2022, 07:58:13 PM »
In the mix: Counting box numbers, checking if the D is unbalanced to one side, trying to ID 1 or 2 high safeties, IDing a passing game mismatch in the slot, trying to diagnose pressure threats.

And if there's motion, seeing how the defense moves with it. 

Honestbuckeye

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Re: Xs and Os Discussion
« Reply #5 on: August 03, 2022, 08:01:01 PM »
As I really don't know much about "inside football", I thought maybe some of youse guys could enlighten me, and perhaps others.

Here is my first question, it's first and ten from your own 25, the QB comes up to the line and surveys the defense, what's he looking for specifically?  Presume said defense is of a standard type.
Here is a straightforward, short video that illustrates basic and a few advanced
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=v_61y2yr_9g
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
-Mark Twain

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Xs and Os Discussion
« Reply #6 on: August 03, 2022, 10:33:55 PM »
I'm not sure FSU should be teaching anything about football.  
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Xs and Os Discussion
« Reply #7 on: August 03, 2022, 10:53:27 PM »
The answer to your question is different at different levels, as has already been said.

At the high school level, the QB (if the HC trusts him to) is probably limited to about 3 pre-snap things:
1 - ID the MLB (to see if the defense is balanced)
If the defense is unbalanced and a run to the crowded side is called, he might do a simple audible.  Say it's a run to the right and the safety creeps way up on that half of the field, he'd yell something like "check - Lucy" which flips the same play to the left.  He'd say any word starting with L. 
2 - Is the coverage man or zone (pre-determining if he may be throwing more to a spot or area vs leading his receiver(s) with tight coverage)
Again, for high school, a man in motion gives it away, but so could positioning.  If a safety is walking up and aligning himself with a slot receiver, that man suggest man.  If both safeties are ready to backpedal at the snap, they're probably in a cover 2 zone. 
3 - generally looking for an obvious blitz - if he can tell where they're coming from, then he can automatically throw to the vacated space - a quick dump off to the TE if the LB who would be covering him or that zone threatens blitz.
.
If a QB can do all that with some consistency in HS, he's good and if he can do any more than that, he's probably a name guy on recruiting rankings.  I doubt many of the super-athletic guys can do all 3 consistency (because they don't have to, in order to be successful).
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

NorthernOhioBuckeye

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Re: Xs and Os Discussion
« Reply #8 on: August 04, 2022, 08:22:18 AM »
I'm not sure FSU should be teaching anything about football. 
Now, that was funny. :72:

Cincydawg

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Re: Xs and Os Discussion
« Reply #9 on: August 04, 2022, 08:32:21 AM »
Do they tolerate mediocrity?

Cincydawg

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Re: Xs and Os Discussion
« Reply #10 on: August 04, 2022, 08:38:17 AM »
I mentioned before that the defensive alignment, to me, very often looks very standard, and yet the QB sees something, or perhaps he's noting it's standard and calls out an assignment (as does the center).  Let's say the play called is a short pass to the TE on a crossing pattern.  It's the first play of the game.  The D is not in any special alignment, they are where they often are.  Is there anything that would cause the QB to audible or point or anything?

Honestbuckeye

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Re: Xs and Os Discussion
« Reply #11 on: August 04, 2022, 08:48:47 AM »
I mentioned before that the defensive alignment, to me, very often looks very standard, and yet the QB sees something, or perhaps he's noting it's standard and calls out an assignment (as does the center).  Let's say the play called is a short pass to the TE on a crossing pattern.  It's the first play of the game.  The D is not in any special alignment, they are where they often are.  Is there anything that would cause the QB to audible or point or anything?
Yes.  If you watch that short video I included above ( and it has nothing to do with Florida State), there are several things that could cause concern.
if the defense brings a safety up to man press coverage on the tight end, it will be difficult for the tight end to get open on a crossing pattern in the proper timing if he is jammed at the line by a good safety.  However this will create an opening in the seam on which ever side the tight end he is targeting is lined up on.  The quarterback may audible to a corner covered receiver to drag route into that scene since the safety has been pulled across the middle trying to follow the tight end.

In today’s modern off fence to quarterback would just read that and keep the same play because that drag route is already being run and will be open anyway if the tight end is not open
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
-Mark Twain

Cincydawg

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Re: Xs and Os Discussion
« Reply #12 on: August 04, 2022, 08:57:22 AM »
I watched the video, it was helpful, but I specified the defense is in a very "vanilla" formation.  I noted the D alignment often, to me, looks the same play after play (though as noted I don't get the end zone view of it).  

First play of the game won't the D generally be in a very standard formation and defense?

Honestbuckeye

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Re: Xs and Os Discussion
« Reply #13 on: August 04, 2022, 09:26:17 AM »
https://matchquarters.com/2016/08/22/tight-end-sets-vs-match-quarters/


A good read on the chess match that is todays attempts to defend spread or pro spread offenses.  
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
-Mark Twain

 

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