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Topic: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy

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MrNubbz

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #3066 on: July 15, 2020, 08:21:34 AM »
Quote from: Cincydawg on July 15, 2020, 07:33:39 AM
The American Revolution was unusual/unique in being started and led by very educated wealthy people.  Usually, the wealthy don't start revolutions.


Well they used to be taxed - that burden has been thrust on the rapidly shrinking middle class
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Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #3067 on: July 15, 2020, 08:48:59 AM »
I seem to recall that the higher income folks pay a significant portion of US income taxes each year.  The folks who mostly skate don't have earned income and get favorable rates, and no FICA taxes.

Thank goodness.

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CWSooner

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #3068 on: July 15, 2020, 12:21:55 PM »
Quote from: Cincydawg on July 15, 2020, 07:33:39 AM
The American Revolution was unusual/unique in being started and led by very educated wealthy people.  Usually, the wealthy don't start revolutions.
I disagree with that.

It was a "conservative" revolution in the sense that it was about preserving rights that were being threatened as opposed to demanding new ones, but there were plenty of ordinary people who were in on the start of it.  Paul Revere, for example, doesn't fit the "very educated wealthy" label.  Nor does Sam Adams, who had attended Harvard but was a failure in business.
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MichiFan87

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #3069 on: July 15, 2020, 12:46:29 PM »
If you haven't heard, here's Biden's updated and more ambitious clean energy plan: https://www.utilitydive.com/news/biden-outlines-2t-plan-to-invest-in-renewables-electrification/581637/

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847badgerfan

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #3070 on: July 15, 2020, 12:53:57 PM »
All I see in that is more of the same BS. 

In 2008, we were gonna be all good by 2020. 

I'll be long gone by the time any of this happens. Probably my kids too. And theirs, if they have any.


:hum:
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Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #3071 on: July 15, 2020, 01:00:34 PM »
Quote from: MichiFan87 on July 15, 2020, 12:46:29 PM
If you haven't heard, here's Biden's updated and more ambitious clean energy plan: https://www.utilitydive.com/news/biden-outlines-2t-plan-to-invest-in-renewables-electrification/581637/


That "summary" is a bit lacking in detail, for my tastes.

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FearlessF

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #3072 on: July 15, 2020, 01:10:50 PM »
Quote from: CWSooner on July 15, 2020, 12:21:55 PM
 "very educated wealthy" label.  Nor does Sam Adams, who had attended Harvard but was a failure in business.
well, he did attend Harvard

did he gain a degree?
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betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #3073 on: July 15, 2020, 01:13:22 PM »
Quote from: Cincydawg on July 15, 2020, 07:33:39 AM
The American Revolution was unusual/unique in being started and led by very educated wealthy people.  Usually, the wealthy don't start revolutions.


Quote from: CWSooner on July 15, 2020, 12:21:55 PM
I disagree with that.

It was a "conservative" revolution in the sense that it was about preserving rights that were being threatened as opposed to demanding new ones, but there were plenty of ordinary people who were in on the start of it.  Paul Revere, for example, doesn't fit the "very educated wealthy" label.  Nor does Sam Adams, who had attended Harvard but was a failure in business.
I'd also mention that it was unusual/unique in that it wasn't really a "Revolution". 

We didn't conquer Britain, depose King George III, and take over the British Empire. It was effectively a war of independence/secession, which is a completely different animal than a revolution. 
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Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #3074 on: July 15, 2020, 01:13:40 PM »
Quote from: 847badgerfan on July 15, 2020, 12:53:57 PM
All I see in that is more of the same BS.
It means he "promises" to spend a lot of money over some undetermined period of time on unspecific things that will work magic.

I'd like to see more of a general outline of an idea of a rough scheme myself, and of course a candidate who almost certainly would not be in office in 2028 can promise just about anything by 2035, and blame Congress/ the other party if it fails anyway.


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Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #3075 on: July 15, 2020, 01:14:31 PM »
It was a revolt against local government, the governors appointed by the King.  
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betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #3076 on: July 15, 2020, 01:31:04 PM »
Quote from: Cincydawg on July 15, 2020, 01:14:31 PM
It was a revolt against local government, the governors appointed by the King. 
Yes, but it's still important to clarify the difference between a war of independence and, say, the French or Russian or Chinese revolutions where the existing rulers were completely deposed and replaced. 

The governors were expendable. King George III was never personally in danger from America, which changes a lot of the way a war is approached. 
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CWSooner

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #3077 on: July 15, 2020, 04:01:25 PM »
Quote from: FearlessF on July 15, 2020, 01:10:50 PM
well, he did attend Harvard

did he gain a degree?
I think so.  My point about him is that he wasn't wealthy.
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CWSooner

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #3078 on: July 15, 2020, 04:14:23 PM »
Quote from: Cincydawg on July 15, 2020, 01:14:31 PM
It was a revolt against local government, the governors appointed by the King.
I'm going to disagree again.  Those governors (not appointed by the king in proprietary colonies) were mostly carrying out imperial policy.  They were the overseas government imposed at the local level.  But by 1776, the rebellion was not just against the local objectionable policy of the moment, but about the overall ability of parliament/king to impose objectionable policies.  George Washington didn't take command of the Continental Army after the Battle of Bunker Hill because of things the government of Virginia was doing.
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Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #3079 on: July 15, 2020, 04:22:37 PM »
The result was dissolution of the governing entities extant here and replacing them with Articles of Confederation, obviously.

And when that didn't work, they tried something different.

The A of C make for interesting reading I think.

I guess when Southern Chad "revolted" and became a new country, it was considered to be a revolution, by some anyway, and with the Confederacy.  I suspect we understand the term might not be entirely the correct one, just as "civil war" is not entirely the correct one either.
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