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Topic: Weather, Climate, Environment, and Energy

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FearlessF

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #1988 on: December 30, 2019, 04:13:31 PM »
he other crisis in the 70's, perhaps to distract us from the conflict in Vietnam, was that fossil fuels were going to run out in the next decade

no more oil, gasoline, coal.

rationing gasoline in California in the 70's
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utee94

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #1989 on: December 30, 2019, 04:23:14 PM »
he other crisis in the 70's, perhaps to distract us from the conflict in Vietnam, was that fossil fuels were going to run out in the next decade

no more oil, gasoline, coal.

rationing gasoline in California in the 70's
Yeah, that was present in the 80s as well.  I did a summer program at Northwestern University iduring the summer before my senior year in high school.  It was a Science/Engineering program where you took 5 courses over the course of 6 weeks, and completed a semester-long research project as well.  And sprinkled in throughout, were seminars on various topics.

One of those seminars was focused on environmentalism, and some well respected scientists of the time assured us that we were going to run out of fossil fuels by the year 2000.

FearlessF

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #1990 on: December 30, 2019, 04:26:02 PM »
smart guys aren't always so smart
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Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #1991 on: December 30, 2019, 05:11:05 PM »
The future is often unpredictable.  I have a book around here somewhere predicting life in the 21st century dated about 1980.  It is hilarious, really.  There was a "consultant" back in the day named Faith Popcorn, really, who gave speeches and whatnot about the coming of whatever.  I think she was wrong so often it was useful, but she got rich.

FearlessF

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #1992 on: December 31, 2019, 10:49:13 AM »
It's been happening for centuries

why do folks ALWAYS buy the snakeoil?
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Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #1993 on: December 31, 2019, 10:54:24 AM »
https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/a29821418/the-numbers-arent-everything/?src=socialflowFBRAT&fbclid=IwAR1S-5i0AbNcoDvz96rx0m1i73ghbY9pGfxw3t7h1Di44srmBzJFdglgbUQ

Nice article about cars and numbers, relevant to my peak hp supposition.

As for predicting the future, "we" have a vested interest in trying.  Where will the DJIA be at the end of next year?  At the end of 2025?  Who will be elected President?  

A "news show" i'd like to see is an analysis of "THE NEWS" from one year ago today, covering what was the BIG ITEM and whatever became of it.  I'm pretty sure it would be hilarious, "Can you believe we were all upset/excited about that?"

FearlessF

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #1994 on: December 31, 2019, 11:37:16 AM »
great idea

I assume most "news" outlets would not be in favor
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Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #1995 on: December 31, 2019, 12:17:50 PM »
I suggested this a while back to John King, he said it sounded like a good idea, but he may have been pandering.

utee94

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #1996 on: December 31, 2019, 03:03:33 PM »
Well, each "side" of the news would gladly do it to the stories run by the other.  I doubt they'd have much interest in self-reflection though.

Cincydawg

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #1997 on: December 31, 2019, 03:08:55 PM »
The major story often is the same across networks, a hurricane, fires in CA, some shooting spree, some international event, politics of course ... and a year later, "we" can't recall much of anything about them, in the main, which suggests to met that a lot of our "news" is really of little consequence when seen in hindsight.

Maybe they like to hype stories for ratings ....

utee94

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #1998 on: December 31, 2019, 03:16:17 PM »
The major story often is the same across networks, a hurricane, fires in CA, some shooting spree, some international event, politics of course ... and a year later, "we" can't recall much of anything about them, in the main, which suggests to met that a lot of our "news" is really of little consequence when seen in hindsight.

Maybe they like to hype stories for ratings ....
NO WAY!!!!!! :)


I do think the long format news magazines like Time used to perform this function for us, at least somewhat.  But I haven't picked up a Time from a newstand in a decade.  Are there even newstands anymore?

CWSooner

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #1999 on: January 02, 2020, 07:05:26 PM »
Why electric cars still don't live up to the hype: Charles Lane
By Charles Lane 14 hrs ago

With a new decade starting, it’s time for conscientious columnists to undergo their self-administered decennial performance reviews.

I’ll start — and try to keep it focused. For the past 10 years, I’ve waged a quixotic counteroffensive against electric-car boosterism, raining skepticism on the vehicles’ potential to cure climate change, much less to be the clean, green wave of the transportation future.

More than a few people (my Tesla-owner friends very much included) have questioned this fixation, and I freely admit it’s an odd one.

I just figured that someone in an otherwise credulous press had to sort through the cloud of wishful thinking, political rhetoric and sheer commercial hype surrounding this subject, and it might as well be me.

Mass adoption of electric cars, however, cannot occur unless they can do everything gas-powered vehicles can do — including the ability to go hundreds of miles before refueling, and refueling easily — at a comparable total cost of ownership. Otherwise, electric cars will be a niche product for upper-income folks. And government subsidies for them will be a regressive transfer of social resources in return for little climate benefit, given that the U.S. power grid the cars draw from is 64% fueled by coal and gas.

Nothing happened in the past decade to undermine this basic critique. Government, both federal and state, subsidized electric-car sales and production to the tune of several billion dollars, yet as of March 2019, there were 1.18 million electric vehicles on the road in the United States — less than 0.5% of the total. Households earning $100,000 or more per year own two-thirds of electrical vehicles, with many of the owners benefiting from a $7,500 federal tax credit.

Globally, electric-car adoption is also modest relative to optimistic forecasts. Of the 86 million cars sold in the top 54 world markets in 2018, 1.26 million, or 1.5%, were electrical vehicles. That’s nowhere near then-Nissan chief executive Carlos Ghosn’s 2010 prognostication of 10 percent of global sales by 2020.

My biggest error, in hindsight, was to underestimate the financial staying power of Elon Musk’s cash-burning Tesla Motors, which I thought would exhaust investors’ patience long before it conquered the complexities of mass-producing quality vehicles. Tesla’s Model 3 is the most popular electric car on the market, with 111,000 sold in the first nine months of 2019. Owners swear by it.

Tesla’s survival, though, may be the exception that proves the rule. (And we’ll see how it does now that Congress has allowed that tax credit to lapse.) Ballyhooed start-ups such as Coda, TH!NK and Fisker all went bankrupt before 2015 — Fisker after defaulting on an Energy Department loan at an ultimate cost to taxpayers of $139 million.

Chevrolet discontinued its Volt, a plug-in hybrid, in 2019 after selling only about 150,000 since the car launched in 2011. That same year, President Barack Obama had set a goal of having 1 million plug-in vehicles on the road by 2015.

But wait. What about recent reports that Volkswagen is making big new investments in electrics? Or Ford’s announcement of a new all-electric Mustang crossover? GM, Chevy’s parent company, says it, too, is preparing a new generation of electrical vehicles.

Established automakers are indeed about to ramp up electric offerings, providing Tesla with its most serious competition yet.

They are doing so, however, more as a response to regulatory pressure from governments — even after the Trump administration scaled back fuel-economy standards — than as a response to demonstrated customer demand, which lately has favored gas-powered SUVs and pickups.

The problem, as industry leaders acknowledge in their quieter moments, is still the same: getting the total cost of owning an electrical vehicle down to that of a gas equivalent. There’s uncertainty about key variables such as how much more battery costs will fall and the global supply of rare-earth elements.

GM President Mark Reuss recently wrote that electrical vehicle-gas cost parity may happen “within a decade.” Honda CEO Takahiro Hachigo told Automotive News Europe: “I do not believe there will be a dramatic increase in demand for battery vehicles, and I believe this situation is true globally.”

A mid-2018 report by JPMorgan Asset Management noted that the median global forecast by industry experts is 125 million electrical vehicles on the road worldwide by 2030, which would be less than 10 percent of the total. “I’m taking the ‘under’ rather than the ‘over,’ ” the report’s author, Michael Cembalest, added.

Me, too. Let’s reconvene in 10 years to see who wins that wager, and to assess the true costs and benefits of the bet that big government and big business have placed on the electric car.

Charles Lane writes for The Washington Post.
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FearlessF

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #2000 on: January 02, 2020, 08:56:28 PM »
the U.S. power grid the cars draw from is 64% fueled by coal and gas.


this seems low compared to what I've read here.

my electric provider is VERY proud that they have just gone over 50% on wind/solar for their customers in Iowa

Iowa is one of the top wind producers
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Brutus Buckeye

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Re: Weather, Climate, and Environment
« Reply #2001 on: January 02, 2020, 09:06:19 PM »
When it is the result of all you guys breaking wind, it actually adds to the greenhouse gas effect.
1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19

 

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