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Topic: Understanding the NCAA Tournament

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MaximumSam

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Re: Understanding the NCAA Tournament
« Reply #70 on: March 08, 2022, 10:02:30 PM »
Below a certain seed, it's not an actual opportunity - thus the big lie. 
It's an opportunity no matter the seed. The lottery is an opportunity too, people still play and have fun.

MaximumSam

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Re: Understanding the NCAA Tournament
« Reply #71 on: March 08, 2022, 10:03:38 PM »
Hmm, the "it's something good for the players" idea.

I happen to think being "conference tournament champions" and winning your last game in a triumphant moment is better than celebrating an automatic bid to be destroyed in your last game ever (for a vast majority of these guys) by a 2 seed on national TV. 

But I'm probably wrong.
How many teams have declined their bid?

bayareabadger

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Re: Understanding the NCAA Tournament
« Reply #72 on: March 08, 2022, 10:15:08 PM »
So it's not:
a winner of first prize or first place in entertainment value
or
a winner of first prize or first place in money made


Right?
What did you think you were watching? This is an entertainment product that exists in a large scale way to make money.

Poll and rankings are entertainment product to make money. Every iteration of postseason College football has been entertainment product to make money. Just because this is the most functionally pure type of competition, it really seems to confuse people.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2022, 12:33:37 AM by bayareabadger »

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Understanding the NCAA Tournament
« Reply #73 on: March 09, 2022, 12:32:57 AM »
Is that what we want though??
It's poker. As long as you have a chip and a chair, you're alive. Long odds are better than no odds.

I'll never say those NY Giants were the best football team in the NFL that season. But they sure as hell earned the title of Champion. They beat the 18-0 Patriots on the field.

Brutus Buckeye

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Re: Understanding the NCAA Tournament
« Reply #74 on: March 09, 2022, 12:47:49 AM »
That's shallow.....a shallow conference.....with an automatic bid.


Well those two get in every year, and BYU makes it their fair share, and San Fran is poised to get in this year.

Deeper than the Pac 12.
1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Understanding the NCAA Tournament
« Reply #75 on: March 09, 2022, 05:14:37 AM »
It's an opportunity no matter the seed. The lottery is an opportunity too, people still play and have fun.
The lottery is a tax on the poor.  The people with the least amount of disposable income spend the most on impossible odds.  This is the worst thing you could've mentioned.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Understanding the NCAA Tournament
« Reply #76 on: March 09, 2022, 05:16:06 AM »
It's poker. As long as you have a chip and a chair, you're alive. Long odds are better than no odds.

I'll never say those NY Giants were the best football team in the NFL that season. But they sure as hell earned the title of Champion. They beat the 18-0 Patriots on the field.
But it's not long odds vs no odds......it's no odds while pretending its long odds.  

“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Understanding the NCAA Tournament
« Reply #77 on: March 09, 2022, 05:21:20 AM »
What did you think you were watching? This is an entertainment product that exists in a large scale way to make money.

Poll and rankings are entertainment product to make money. Every iteration of postseason College football has been entertainment product to make money. Just because this is the most functionally pure type of competition, it really seems to confuse people.
It is not an entertainment product - it's only ballooned out to become a money-making monster.  
But football could be, and once upon a time was, just another sport with anonymous players.......a women's lacrosse, if you will.  And if no one came to watch them play, they'd still play, have a winner and a loser, and still keep stats.  

As long as the competition side of things exists and matters and isn't lost, yes, people want to watch.  But just because a sport is bastardized into a money-making cow doesn't stop this from being true.  
You set up a framework in which the regular season is irrelevant and you've routinely got .500 teams being crowned champion, and you'll find the stands empty.

We're not there yet, but it's trending that way, across sports.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

Kris60

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Re: Understanding the NCAA Tournament
« Reply #78 on: March 09, 2022, 06:07:19 AM »
It is not an entertainment product - it's only ballooned out to become a money-making monster. 
But football could be, and once upon a time was, just another sport with anonymous players.......a women's lacrosse, if you will.  And if no one came to watch them play, they'd still play, have a winner and a loser, and still keep stats. 

As long as the competition side of things exists and matters and isn't lost, yes, people want to watch.  But just because a sport is bastardized into a money-making cow doesn't stop this from being true. 
You set up a framework in which the regular season is irrelevant and you've routinely got .500 teams being crowned champion, and you'll find the stands empty.

We're not there yet, but it's trending that way, across sports.
You are making counterpoints to your own arguments.   Which is it?  Is it a farce lower seeds are making playoff tournaments because they have no chance to win them or, are sports in danger of losing fans because they are setting up tournaments where .500 teams are routinely crowned champions? 

Which argument are you making?

MaximumSam

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Re: Understanding the NCAA Tournament
« Reply #79 on: March 09, 2022, 06:48:47 AM »
The lottery is a tax on the poor.  The people with the least amount of disposable income spend the most on impossible odds.  This is the worst thing you could've mentioned.
???

Are you saying the NCAA tourney is a tax on the poor? That the teams that are there are somehow being harmed by being there? Your whole point seems to be that Wright State thinks they will win the national championship and is somehow the victim of fraud. This is...probably not correct.

847badgerfan

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Re: Understanding the NCAA Tournament
« Reply #80 on: March 09, 2022, 07:51:26 AM »
How many teams have declined their bid?
Only Marquette comes to mind for me.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Understanding the NCAA Tournament
« Reply #81 on: March 09, 2022, 09:12:44 AM »
It is not an entertainment product - it's only ballooned out to become a money-making monster. 
But football could be, and once upon a time was, just another sport with anonymous players.......a women's lacrosse, if you will.  And if no one came to watch them play, they'd still play, have a winner and a loser, and still keep stats. 

As long as the competition side of things exists and matters and isn't lost, yes, people want to watch.  But just because a sport is bastardized into a money-making cow doesn't stop this from being true. 
You set up a framework in which the regular season is irrelevant and you've routinely got .500 teams being crowned champion, and you'll find the stands empty.

We're not there yet, but it's trending that way, across sports.
Yes, it should be pure, like NCAA Women's Lacrosse...

...which hosted a 42-team tournament to determine its champion in 2021
which hosted a 42-team tournament to determine its champion in 2021.

Brutus Buckeye

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Re: Understanding the NCAA Tournament
« Reply #82 on: March 09, 2022, 11:10:30 AM »
I can tolerate the NCAA Tourney bashing, but I'll be damned if I am going to stand for all of this women's lacrosse bashing.
1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19

bayareabadger

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Re: Understanding the NCAA Tournament
« Reply #83 on: March 09, 2022, 11:13:27 AM »
I can tolerate the NCAA Tourney bashing, but I'll be damned if I am going to stand for all of this women's lacrosse bashing.
I thought that’s why you watch lacrosse, when they use the sticks the bash each other

 

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