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Topic: The 'United' States of America

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longhorn320

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Re: The 'United' States of America
« Reply #182 on: June 24, 2024, 06:36:39 PM »
No. But I meant in the justified acceptable way.
I have never fired a gun in a situation where I was being threatened and hope never to do so

but as you know if you live in or near a big city stuff can go south in a hurry and all citizens should be able to protect themselves when necessary
They won't let me give blood anymore. The burnt orange color scares the hell out of the doctors.

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: The 'United' States of America
« Reply #183 on: June 24, 2024, 08:31:35 PM »
Castle Doctrine can provide legal immunity from criminal prosecution and civil liability for individuals who defend their home, shielding them from criminal charges and lawsuits from the intruder or their family. That said, Castle Doctrine doesn’t provide blanket authorization for using deadly force in every conceivable scenario involving a perceived risk. If the threat is outside your home and doesn’t pose a reasonable threat, your actions won’t be protected by the law.
Defendants also can’t use the Castle Doctrine to justify excessive force – their method of self-defense and the level of force utilized must be considered appropriate in the given situation. While the threat doesn’t have to be holding a deadly weapon to pose a threat, residents should be careful to defend themselves with force proportionate to the perceived threat or else risk a homicide charge.
You won’t be eligible for the protections afforded by Castle Doctrine law if the force you used was not considered reasonable, such as using excessive or lethal means to defend yourself when it wasn’t necessary. However, latitude may be given based on the context of the situation and the inability of a homeowner to know exactly what level of risk they face from an intruder.
Moreover, if you employed a weapon that’s outlawed in Arizona, not only will you not be covered by Castle Doctrine law, you may face legal penalties and jail times for gun misconduct.
Under Castle Doctrine, killing an intruder can be classified as a justifiable homicide (which is not prosecutable) as long someone else in your situation would also genuinely and reasonably believe they were at risk of death, suffering devastating injuries or if a more serious felony would occur if no action was taken.


Yeah, uh, I just grabbed whatever was nearby (hammer).

If I don't collapse his head in, and if he has experience enough to be wary of my right hand attacking, that hammer will draw his attention while down below, my left hand plays stabby-stabby-stab-stab with the knife.

“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

Gigem

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Re: The 'United' States of America
« Reply #184 on: June 24, 2024, 10:06:25 PM »
Yes, my idea is simply an evolution.  And yes, I'm nitpicking some of your points.  You seem awfully combative over this.
Aim small, miss small.  No matter how badly a county is governed in my idea, it only adversely affects that county and not an entire state.  So there's another plus. :)
Did not know slavery was allowed in places like NY etc. Even better, the people voluntarily gave it up. They got rid of it on their own, no war needed. 

Slavery was most definitely brought here by the Europeans. We may have been Europeans at some point, but at what point did we become Americans ?  I think most if not all the founding fathers were born in the colonies. Debatable.  Regardless, we spilled some blood, and it was decided not for us. I’m not ashamed that I have ancestors who fought for the confederacy.  But I can admit they were wrong. 


OrangeAfroMan

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Re: The 'United' States of America
« Reply #185 on: June 25, 2024, 06:16:53 AM »
Why are you trying to differentiate between European and American slave owners?  What a bizarre point to attempt. 
 
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

847badgerfan

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Re: The 'United' States of America
« Reply #186 on: June 25, 2024, 06:59:07 AM »
Anyone here shoot someone at any point?
Yes.

One time, and not deadly.
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NorthernOhioBuckeye

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Re: The 'United' States of America
« Reply #187 on: June 25, 2024, 07:26:54 AM »
Anyone here shoot someone at any point?
No and I hope never to have to. 

Cincydawg

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Re: The 'United' States of America
« Reply #188 on: June 25, 2024, 07:33:23 AM »
Why are you trying to differentiate between European and American slave owners?  What a bizarre point to attempt.
 
He's merely noting where we "inherited" the tradition of slavery.  When Georgia was founded, slavery was forbidden.  That didn't last very long.  The original settlers had pretty lofty ideals that were submerged to economics.  Slavery of course had been common throughout history around the world.

A strange thing is that IF somehow South Carolina had not seceded and Lincoln had remained President of the entire country, it probably would have taken 20-30 more years to get rid of slavery.  Maybe longer than that.  

Hoisted by its own petards, as it were.

847badgerfan

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Re: The 'United' States of America
« Reply #189 on: June 25, 2024, 07:33:58 AM »
I felt I had no choice. I hope to never have to do it again. It's been 39 years.
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847badgerfan

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Re: The 'United' States of America
« Reply #190 on: June 25, 2024, 07:41:07 AM »
Slavery is a confusing topic.

Slaves were offered up to Europeans by their own people.

Should the Europeans have bought? Of course, we now say no. At the time the slaves were looked upon as not quite human, but capable of manual labor that wealthier Europeans didn't want to do. So, they bought.

I always come back to the fact that slaves were offered and sold by their own, and it became a business from which a few privileged Africans became very wealthy.

Not too many people think about this stuff. I do think about it because today "I'm" being blamed. 

I point my finger to Africa and say "Look over there for reparations. They are the ones who sold your distant ancestors."
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Cincydawg

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Re: The 'United' States of America
« Reply #191 on: June 25, 2024, 07:58:20 AM »
It's a complex topic, I agree, discussed at length in the Bible, which was a guide for many back when (more than today).  I know today Lincoln (who I admire generally) is viewed as the "Great Emancipator", but he also was clearly a racist, using terms then we'd not condone at all today.  His solution was basically Liberia.

The first Nazi solution for the Jews was to ship them all to Madagascar.  When that proved impracticable, they went another direction.

It's also notable what prompted the "second secession" of North Carolina and Virginia.

Gigem

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Re: The 'United' States of America
« Reply #192 on: June 25, 2024, 11:28:54 AM »
Why are you trying to differentiate between European and American slave owners?  What a bizarre point to attempt.
 
As somebody pointed out, we (USA) did not invent slavery.  We inherited it.  And some chose to get rid of it willingly.  You used slavery and women's voting rights as a reason to go with some alternate government structure.  

If you bring up things that happened over a century ago, why is it bizarre that I also make a point about things that happened well in the past?  

I try, but fail at making my point clear.  So I'll try to cut to the chase.  

The current government system we have killed slavery over 150 years ago.  We did not start it, we inherited it. 

So, did it not work?  And how would your system work better? 

There would still be areas/counties that had slavery perhaps 20-30 years after 1865.  Sources are scarce, but as far as I can tell the slavery system of the 1800's existed well up into the 20th century in some places.  

MaximumSam

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Re: The 'United' States of America
« Reply #193 on: June 25, 2024, 11:34:47 AM »
Slavery a big part of why Texas is part of the United States and not Mexico

Gigem

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Re: The 'United' States of America
« Reply #194 on: June 25, 2024, 11:47:07 AM »
You seem awfully combative over this.

Not really.  I am just always curious as to why some people think the system we have is so bad.  I mean, really, is it really that bad here?  Turn off the TV, ignore the CNN/Fox News bullshit, think about all the good things in your life.  I think we have it really good.  

I was riding with a friend of mine from Nicaragua, we drove past the voting/polling place.  He turned to me and said, in broken English, "In Nicaragua, we no vote".  

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: The 'United' States of America
« Reply #195 on: June 25, 2024, 11:58:32 AM »
Not really.  I am just always curious as to why some people think the system we have is so bad.  I mean, really, is it really that bad here?  Turn off the TV, ignore the CNN/Fox News bullshit, think about all the good things in your life.  I think we have it really good. 
Our system is the worst. You know, except for all the others :57:

I get where OAM is coming from. We have gotten to a point where some of our politics is so acrimonious because the majority of political power is in Congress. If you try to make a one size fits all policy that has to work for people in Southie in Boston, in Macon, GA, in Cheyenne, WY, in San Francisco, CA, and in Juneau, AK, you're going to end up pissing someone [or everyone] off. Even with state decisions, I live in a state where the needs of LA / SF / San Diego / Sacramento are VERY different than the needs of Tulare / Redding / Blythe / Merced, but the policy doesn't reflect that very well. And most of the voters are in the population centers, so which do you think dominate the decisions? Most of the geographical area of CA isn't powerful in our decision-making, because it's not populous in comparison. 

If each of those places could mostly make their own decisions, they wouldn't have to be mad that someone, somewhere else, made different decisions. Because it wouldn't affect them. And even more importantly, the decisions would be tailored to local needs, so governance could probably be made better and more responsive to their needs. 

It's great in theory, until they go the wrong direction and start infringing on peoples' rights with said decision-making. Which tends to be a lot easier to do on a small scale than a national scale. And is incredibly common on all sides. 

 

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