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Topic: Talk of Eliminating Divisions
(Read 8023 times)

LittlePig · « **Reply #126 on:** December 20, 2018, 06:29:29 PM »

The more I think about it, the more I like this idea of getting rid of divisions and have the 2 best teams play in the CCG.

There are so many intersting scheduling options that could be considered without divisions. A new scheduling idea I just thought of, each team would play

4 teams that are full rivals (teams you play every year)
2 teams that are 3/4 rivals (teams you play 3 out of 4 years)
7 teams that are 1/2 rivals (teams you play 2 out of 4 years)

medinabuckeye1 · « **Reply #127 on:** December 20, 2018, 06:36:11 PM »

Quote from: LittlePig on December 20, 2018, 06:29:29 PM

The more I think about it, the more I like this idea of getting rid of divisions and have the 2 best teams play in the CCG.

There are so many intersting scheduling options that could be be considered. A new scheduling idea I just thought of, each team would play

4 teams that are full rivals (teams you play every year)
2 teams that are 3/4 rivals (teams you play 3 out of 4 years)
7 teams that are 1/2 rivals (teams you play 2 out of 4 years)

I think I would really like this set-up. It works with 14 teams and nine games:

4 teams every year = 8 games every two years
2 teams 3/4 years = 3 games every two years
7 teams every other year = 7 games every two years=
Total 13 other teams, 18 games every two years = 9 games per year

I will say that I think setting up all of the full and 3/4 rivals would get a little tricky and I'm sure some people wouldn't like some of the results but overall I think it would be great.

I would be in favor of some unconventional tiebreakers in the event of a 3-way tie for first and/or a two-way tie for second.

medinabuckeye1 · « **Reply #128 on:** December 20, 2018, 06:59:33 PM »

Team	Full	Full	Full	Full	3/4	3/4
Rutgers	Penn State	Maryland	Ohio State	Indiana	Purdue	Michigan State
Maryland	Penn State	Rutgers	Michigan State	Northwestern	Ohio State	Illinois
Penn State	Ohio State	Maryland	Rutgers	Nebraska	Michigan	Minnesota
Ohio State	Michigan	Penn State	Illinois	Rutgers	Nebraska	Maryland
Michigan	Ohio State	Michigan State	Minnesota	Purdue	Nebraska	Penn State
Michigan State	Michigan	Iowa	Wisconsin	Maryland	Rutgers	Northwestern
Indiana	Purdue	Illinois	Northwestern	Rutgers	Wisconsin	Iowa
Purdue	Indiana	Illinois	Northwestern	Michigan	Rutgers	Minnesota
Illinois	Northwestern	Indiana	Purdue	Ohio State	Maryland	Iowa
Northwestern	Illinois	Indiana	Purdue	Maryland	Michigan State	Wisconsin
Wisconsin	Nebraska	Iowa	Minnesota	Michigan State	Indiana	Northwestern
Minnesota	Nebraska	Iowa	Wisconsin	Michigan	Penn State	Purdue
Iowa	Nebraska	Minnesota	Wisconsin	Michigan State	Illinois	Indiana
Nebraska	Iowa	Minnesota	Wisconsin	Penn State	Ohio State	Michigan

utee94 · « **Reply #129 on:** December 21, 2018, 09:55:30 AM »

All the hoops and machinations simply because conferences became too large.

Entropy · « **Reply #130 on:** December 21, 2018, 10:09:29 AM »

utee... correct. I blame Texas.

I think you need divisions so you don't have a championship game a week after playing the same game. What I'd like to see instead is maybe a reset of the divisions every 5 years based upon the previous 5 years win %. Balance it out. I like that idea better than eliminating them.

Ideally, I still think moving MSU to the West and moving Ill to the east adds balance, promotes the idea that 2 schools in the same state play in different divisions, allows for cross over rivals and adds balance. Minor tweak makes more sense to me.

847badgerfan · « **Reply #131 on:** December 21, 2018, 10:45:50 AM »

Big Ten

Illinois
Indiana
Iowa
Michigan
Michigan State
Minnesota
Nebraska
Northwestern
Ohio State
Purdue
Wisconsin

Big 12

Arkansas
Colorado
Iowa State
Kansas
Kansas State
Missouri
Oklahoma
Oklahoma State
Texas
Texas A&M
Texas Tech

Pac 11

Arizona
Arizona State
California
Oregon
Oregon State
Southern California
Stanford
UCLA
Utah
Washington
Washington State

SEC

Alabama
Auburn
Florida
Georgia
Kentucky
Louisiana State
Mississippi
Mississippi State
South Carolina
Tennessee
Vanderbilt

ACC

Central Florida
Clemson
Connecticut
Duke
Florida State
Georgia Tech
Maryland
North Carolina
NC State
Virginia
Wake Forest

Big East

Boston College
Cincinnati
Louisville
Miami
Notre Dame
Penn State
Pittsburgh
Rutgers
Syracuse
Virginia Tech
West Virginia

6 power conferences playing a full round robin (10 games), with 3 OOC games against only other power conference schools. No CCG. Conference winners are in the playoff, along with 2 at large members. All are seeded by playoff committee rankings. TV loves it.

OrangeAfroMan · « **Reply #132 on:** December 21, 2018, 01:40:03 PM »

Quote from: medinabuckeye1 on December 14, 2018, 09:48:45 AM

A couple things about the chart above:

First, Johns Hopkins is WAY ahead of everybody else. The gap between #1 Johns Hopkins and #2 Michigan is about the same size as the gap between #2 Michigan and #45 Indiana.

Second, if you combine #21 and #35 (which I think would be the appropriate comparison if considering adding UT-Austin) that combined entity would be competing with Michigan and UCSF for #2.

Texas is absolutely the #1 potential prize available out there:
Major research dollars.
Huge population State with good growth.
Very good all-around academics.
Football "helmet" with a huge following.
Very good all-around athletics.
No other plausible addition even comes close to that.

If the B1G (or anybody else) can get Texas, they'll take them and we'd take Oklahoma to get them if it was a package deal.

The single most important question in all the conference re-alignment discussions is this:
Assuming the B12 disintegrates, what will Texas do?

That is the most important question because Texas would clearly be the top expansion target for any of the other four major leagues. The SEC, ACC, B1G, or PAC would take the Longhorns in a heartbeat. Everything else comes after that and is just a matter of schools looking for soft landings and conferences chasing scraps.

All these pluses combined with UT's ego makes me think they wouldn't go rushing anywhere. They'd be an independent, like FSU, Miami, and Penn State used to be. They'd be the new ND. They'd sign a fat TV deal with youtube or Netflix, keep all that money, and be perfectly fine doing so.

medinabuckeye1 · « **Reply #133 on:** December 21, 2018, 04:36:51 PM »

Quote from: OrangeAfroMan on December 21, 2018, 01:40:03 PM

All these pluses combined with UT's ego makes me think they wouldn't go rushing anywhere. They'd be an independent, like FSU, Miami, and Penn State used to be. They'd be the new ND. They'd sign a fat TV deal with youtube or Netflix, keep all that money, and be perfectly fine doing so.

Eh, I'm not so sure that works all that well even for Notre Dame and I think less so for anyone else, even Texas. Some reasons:

I think it is really tough to make the CFP as an independent. Notre Dame did it this year by going undefeated but I feel that if they had lost even one game they'd have been out.
The conference is a financial safety-net. When Ohio State has a bad year in football and nobody watches the Buckeyes and they don't get bowl revenue Ohio State still gets their share of the B1G money.
I think it is getting harder to be an independent because there are less of them. That makes scheduling difficult not just in football but in all the other sports as well.
No conference means no conference titles, ever, in any sport.

In the long-run, I think they'll be in a conference I just can't guess which one.

FearlessF · « **Reply #134 on:** December 21, 2018, 04:42:19 PM »

Quote from: 847badgerfan on December 21, 2018, 10:45:50 AM

6 power conferences playing a full round robin (10 games), with 3 OOC games against only other power conference schools. No CCG. Conference winners are in the playoff, along with 2 at large members. All are seeded by playoff committee rankings. TV loves it.

and better yet...... I love it

LittlePig · « **Reply #135 on:** December 23, 2018, 02:10:44 PM »

Quote from: medinabuckeye1 on December 20, 2018, 06:59:33 PM

Team Full Full Full Full 3/4 3/4
Rutgers Penn State Maryland Ohio State Indiana Purdue Michigan State
Maryland Penn State Rutgers Michigan State Northwestern Ohio State Illinois
Penn State Ohio State Maryland Rutgers Nebraska Michigan Minnesota
Ohio State Michigan Penn State Illinois Rutgers Nebraska Maryland
Michigan Ohio State Michigan State Minnesota Purdue Nebraska Penn State
Michigan State Michigan Iowa Wisconsin Maryland Rutgers Northwestern
Indiana Purdue Illinois Northwestern Rutgers Wisconsin Iowa
Purdue Indiana Illinois Northwestern Michigan Rutgers Minnesota
Illinois Northwestern Indiana Purdue Ohio State Maryland Iowa
Northwestern Illinois Indiana Purdue Maryland Michigan State Wisconsin
Wisconsin Nebraska Iowa Minnesota Michigan State Indiana Northwestern
Minnesota Nebraska Iowa Wisconsin Michigan Penn State Purdue
Iowa Nebraska Minnesota Wisconsin Michigan State Illinois Indiana
Nebraska Iowa Minnesota Wisconsin Penn State Ohio State Michigan

That's a good list. I might suggest just a few tweaks.
I can see NW wanting to have Iowa as a full rival instead of Indy. I can see Iowa playing along with that, and take NW as a full rival too instead of MSU.
MSU and Indy should be full rivals instead.

utee94 · « **Reply #136 on:** December 24, 2018, 10:24:49 AM »

Quote from: medinabuckeye1 on December 21, 2018, 04:36:51 PM

Eh, I'm not so sure that works all that well even for Notre Dame and I think less so for anyone else, even Texas. Some reasons:
I think it is really tough to make the CFP as an independent. Notre Dame did it this year by going undefeated but I feel that if they had lost even one game they'd have been out.
The conference is a financial safety-net. When Ohio State has a bad year in football and nobody watches the Buckeyes and they don't get bowl revenue Ohio State still gets their share of the B1G money.
I think it is getting harder to be an independent because there are less of them. That makes scheduling difficult not just in football but in all the other sports as well.
No conference means no conference titles, ever, in any sport.
In the long-run, I think they'll be in a conference I just can't guess which one.

Agree with all your points, and especially the final two. There's a reason schools are moving FROM independence, to conference affiliation. Notre Dame is a rare exception, and Texas ain't Notre Dame.
Scheduling for football only would be tough enough, just imagine how complex it would be for the non-revenue sports that play much longer schedules. Notre Dame has "parked" its non-revenue sports in the ACC, but the analogous conference for Texas to park its non-revenue sports would be... the Big XII. Which probably wouldn't exist without Texas, so then the next best is some G5? If you think Texas is arrogant, can you imagine the howling from the billionaire boosters if UT baseball, volleyball, and basketball aren't competing on the P5 level? Red McCombs donates millions annually to the UT softball team, there's no way he wants to see them in the AAC or similar. And Red McCombs is one of the very biggest of the big cigars at Texas.
If football ever decoupled from the other sports at a national level with respect to conference affiliation, then it might be possible for Texas (and others) to make more moves. Without that, the entirely of the rest of the sports are always going to be a factor. And a regional conference makes the most sense for those sports.
Texas is in the B12 because it makes the most sense. I don't anticipate this changing even with the next round of conference broadcast rights negotiation. If OU decided to bail then I think Texas would have to consider a change, if not then I expect both schools to sit tight, right where they are.

medinabuckeye1 · « **Reply #137 on:** December 26, 2018, 11:02:52 AM »

Quote from: 847badgerfan on December 21, 2018, 10:45:50 AM

6 power conferences playing a full round robin (10 games), with 3 OOC games against only other power conference schools. No CCG. Conference winners are in the playoff, along with 2 at large members. All are seeded by playoff committee rankings. TV loves it.

I don't necessarily disagree with this in theory, but I see no reason to discuss it because it is completely outside the realm of possibility at least for the foreseeable future. Nobody is going to voluntarily leave the B1G and we aren't kicking anyone out anytime soon so why bother discussing it?
Expansion, on the other hand, does seem to be reasonably likely at some point in the future. I've always thought that 14 made no sense. My thoughts:

With nine (like the old ACC) you can play everyone on an eight-game schedule.
With ten you can play everyone on a nine-game schedule.
With 12 you can play all of your division (six teams, five games) and half of the other division on an eight-game schedule or more than half of the other division on a nine-game schedule.
With sixteen you can go to the Pod system to keep from losing touch with non-divisional conference-mates.

All of those things seem better to me than this goofy 14 team thing where you play the other six in your division every year then play the seven non-divisional teams occasionally.

847badgerfan · « **Reply #138 on:** December 26, 2018, 11:27:21 AM »

What we have now absolutely sucks. While it is good that the West contains mostly long-standing members, it means that "we" only get to see the other long-standing members on a rotational basis. I can't complain too much as a Badger fan, because they got M for 6 years and then OSU for 6 years. Hopefully there will be a major change after 2025.

FearlessF · « **Reply #139 on:** December 26, 2018, 11:32:51 AM »

why bother discussing any realignment of eliminating divisions?

we have absolutely no control or input into the decision

what is going to happen is going to happen - just like our current situation that sucks balls

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Topic: Talk of Eliminating Divisions

LittlePig

Re: Talk of Eliminating Divisions

medinabuckeye1

Re: Talk of Eliminating Divisions

medinabuckeye1

Re: Talk of Eliminating Divisions

utee94

Re: Talk of Eliminating Divisions

Entropy

Re: Talk of Eliminating Divisions

847badgerfan

Re: Talk of Eliminating Divisions

OrangeAfroMan

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medinabuckeye1

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FearlessF

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LittlePig

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utee94

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medinabuckeye1

Re: Talk of Eliminating Divisions

847badgerfan

Re: Talk of Eliminating Divisions

FearlessF

Re: Talk of Eliminating Divisions