header pic

Perhaps the BEST B1G Forum anywhere, here at College Football Fan Site, CFB51!!!

The 'Old' CFN/Scout Crowd- Enjoy Civil discussion, game analytics, in depth player and coaching 'takes' and discussing topics surrounding the game. You can even have your own free board, all you have to do is ask!!!

Anyone is welcomed and encouraged to join our FREE site and to take part in our community- a community with you- the user, the fan, -and the person- will be protected from intrusive actions and with a clean place to interact.


Author

Topic: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas

 (Read 103575 times)

Cincydawg

  • Ombudsman for the Secret Order of the Odd Fellows
  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 40901
  • Liked:
Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #2366 on: April 21, 2020, 07:27:51 AM »
Obviously, we can't stick with this plan forever.  It has to evolve at some point.  People will disagree about when that point is reached.

I think personally we are near a point HERE where we can reopen some business operations with precautions.  We should still practice distancing and hand washing and general hygiene practices when going out.  A lot of restaurants near me have outside seating and this is the time of year for that.  Put the tables further apart and let's dine al fresco again.  If anyone personally feels vulnerable or suspicious, they of course can continue to stay indoors.

Mdot21

  • Team Captain
  • *******
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 5489
  • Liked:
Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #2367 on: April 21, 2020, 07:53:42 AM »
No.

It'd be okay to treat areas and regions differently if no one traveled, ever.  But they do.  A lot.
If the effects of the pandemic have been underwhelming, THEN THE PLAN IS WORKING.  You're suggesting we abandon a working plan.  Stop, please.
If the effects of the pandemic have been underwhelming, it might just be because this thing isn't nearly as deadly as the mass hysteria media lead everyone to believe it was.

Two different studies looking at anti-bodies in people through random testing- one done by Stanford and another one by USC/LA County- suggest this thing is far more widespread than anybody thought and it's FAR less deadly than the media hyped it up to be. Those studies suggest the actual fatality rate is anywhere from .1 to .3%.

And there are some very prominent epidemiologists who think these lock-downs do absolutely nothing and are actually counter-productive. See: Professor Johan Glesecke who is one of the world’s most senior epidemiologists, was the first Chief Scientist of the European Centre for Disease Prevention and Control, an advisor to the director general of the WHO, and an advisor to the Swedish Government.

He contends that

  • US policy on lock-down and other European countries are not evidence-based
  • The correct policy is to protect the old and the frail only
  • This will eventually lead to herd immunity as a “by-product”
  • The initial UK response, before the “180 degree U-turn”, was better
  • The Imperial College paper was “not very good” and he has never seen an unpublished paper have so much policy impact
  • The paper was very much too pessimistic
  • Any such models are a dubious basis for public policy anyway
  • The flattening of the curve is due to the most vulnerable dying first as much as the lock-down
  • The results will eventually be similar for all countries
  • Covid-19 is a “mild disease” and similar to the flu, and it was the novelty of the disease that scared people.
  • The actual fatality rate of Covid-19 is the region of 0.1%
  • At least 50% of the population of both the UK and Sweden will be shown to have already had the disease when mass antibody testing becomes available


Everyone needs to watch him talking about it here:




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfN2JWifLCY

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-04-19/sweden-says-controversial-covid-19-strategy-is-proving-effective
« Last Edit: April 21, 2020, 08:00:29 AM by Mdot21 »

847badgerfan

  • Administrator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 13534
  • Liked:
Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #2368 on: April 21, 2020, 07:56:25 AM »
Move the goalposts much?  The idea was to flatten the curve, to prevent our hospital system from being overrun.  By all reasonable accounts, that has been accomplished.  Beyond that the plan was to keep people working and do the least damage to the economic conditions that people have, to feed their families.  That is not working.

not everyone has a nannie and TWO SUB-ZERO fridges full of gourmet ice cream (thanks Gutfield).
Fixed.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

Mdot21

  • Team Captain
  • *******
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 5489
  • Liked:
Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #2369 on: April 21, 2020, 08:05:12 AM »
Fixed.
one is a freezer and one is a fridge. Both together- cost on that set up is close to $30,000. More than a lot of people in this country make in a year. For a f##king place to store her $15 dollar a pint ice cream. That lady is such an out of touch, stupid, evil bitch and I only wish there was a hell for her to rot in. She makes my blood boil in a way that few politicians ever did. She is such a phony, hypocrite, Wall Street, big business shill that couldn't give two shits about "the working man/woman".

The Trump 2020 campaign is already grilling her. God that video ad was amazing. Calling her Nancy Antoinette and quoting her "let them eat ice cream".

Mdot21

  • Team Captain
  • *******
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 5489
  • Liked:
Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #2370 on: April 21, 2020, 08:15:13 AM »
biggest paper in Germany going in hard at Xi Jinping and China over the virus and their cover-up.

https://www.jpost.com/international/germanys-largest-paper-to-chinas-president-youre-endangering-the-world-625074

I've been seeing the same kind of stuff from UK, France, Japan, Italy, Australia media/politicians. I really think these guys cooked their own goose. China couldn't have flubbed this any worse. This will be their downfall. It's about damn time the US and it's allies woke up to the China problem. Just terrible that it took something like this to wake people up.

Honestbuckeye

  • All Star
  • ******
  • Posts: 2667
  • Liked:
Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #2371 on: April 21, 2020, 08:22:34 AM »
biggest paper in Germany going in hard at Xi Jinping and China over the virus and their cover-up.

https://www.jpost.com/international/germanys-largest-paper-to-chinas-president-youre-endangering-the-world-625074

I've been seeing the same kind of stuff from UK, France, Japan, Italy, Australia media/politicians. I really think these guys cooked their own goose. China couldn't have flubbed this any worse. This will be their downfall. It's about damn time the US and it's allies woke up to the China problem. Just terrible that it took something like this to wake people up.

That’s good.  The fact that the test of the world is on this obvious human tragedy China caused, eliminates the media creed here in the USA to not talk about anything that places blame where it really belongs.
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
-Mark Twain

MaximumSam

  • Legend
  • ****
  • Posts: 8622
  • Liked:
Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #2372 on: April 21, 2020, 08:31:55 AM »
Maybe China was just optimistic

utee94

  • Global Moderator
  • Legend
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 7776
  • Liked:
Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #2373 on: April 21, 2020, 08:44:24 AM »
Obviously, we can't stick with this plan forever.  It has to evolve at some point.  People will disagree about when that point is reached.

I think personally we are near a point HERE where we can reopen some business operations with precautions.  We should still practice distancing and hand washing and general hygiene practices when going out.  A lot of restaurants near me have outside seating and this is the time of year for that.  Put the tables further apart and let's dine al fresco again.  If anyone personally feels vulnerable or suspicious, they of course can continue to stay indoors.

Correct.  Like I said, different regions can-- and should-- treat it differently.  Scalpel, not a sledgehammer.

The only purpose of shutdowns was to flatten the curve to prevent the hospitals from becoming overrun.  It was not done to prevent the spread.  Containment is impossible.  It was NEVER possible.  

There will be future waves.  Those waves COULD last forever.  They SHOULD get smaller over time.  People still contract, and die from, the Swine Flu.  

People need to get used to the idea that this is here among us, it's here to stay, and we must learn to live with it.  

Mdot21

  • Team Captain
  • *******
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 5489
  • Liked:
Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #2374 on: April 21, 2020, 08:57:14 AM »
That’s good.  The fact that the test of the world is on this obvious human tragedy China caused, eliminates the media creed here in the USA to not talk about anything that places blame where it really belongs.
the corporate puppets helped China become the power it is today.

In 1990, China's economy was on par with the Netherlands. In 1999 before they joined the WTO, it was not even a trillion dollar economy. Today it's the second largest economy in the entire world and is projected to surpass the US economy by 2040.

China has been aggressively trying to get it's currency used as a world reserve currency for the last 8-10 years. China's ultimate stated goal is to replace the US dollar as the worlds currency. China in 2018 just started trading oil in yuan. This was huge news that no one talks about. The petro-yuan was announced in 2017, but went into affect in 2018. It's stated goal is to replace the US dollar with the yuan as the dominant currency in which oil is traded.

China has been aggressively trying to disrupt and re-route world trade routes with it's belt and road initiative in order to dominate global trade. The US Navy dominates the worlds' oceans and thereby controls most major shipping lanes. China's belt and road initiative aims to spend trillions of dollars to build new infrastructure in countries all over the world to bypass those shipping lanes and disrupt world trade.

China has been aggressively trying to stop being just a factory mill for from Western companies- and move heavily to start to manufacturing high-value goods from Chinese state-backed companies in high-tech/high-value fields like semi-conductors, aerospace, pharmaceuticals with it's Made In China 2025 initiative. Their plan is for 70% of all high-tech/high-value that is manufactured in China to be manufactured by Chinese state-backed entities- by the year 2025. And where the hell did these bastards get any of that tech to manufacture those kind of items in high-tech/high-value fields? From US! They either stole it from us, or our very stupid companies gave them tech/trade secrets willingly via forced technology transfers for access to the Chinese market.

If the US doesn't fight those bastards tooth and nail right now, and beat them back, I am afraid of what this country will look like in the future for the younger generation.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2020, 09:00:05 AM by 847badgerfan »

847badgerfan

  • Administrator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 13534
  • Liked:
Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #2375 on: April 21, 2020, 08:58:36 AM »
Maybe China was just optimistic
Nope. They were evil.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

Honestbuckeye

  • All Star
  • ******
  • Posts: 2667
  • Liked:
Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #2376 on: April 21, 2020, 08:59:25 AM »
the corporate puppets helped China become the power it is today.

In 1990, China's economy was on par with the Netherlands. In 1999 before they joined the WTO, it was not even a trillion dollar economy. Today it's the second largest economy in the entire world and is projected to surpass the US economy by 2040.

China has been aggressively trying to get it's currency used as a world reserve currency for the last 8-10 years. China's ultimate stated goal is to replace the US dollar as the worlds currency. China in 2018 just started trading oil in yuan. This was huge news that no one talks about. The petro-yuan was announced in 2017, but went into affect in 2018. It's stated goal is to replace the US dollar with the yuan as the dominant currency in which oil is traded.

China has been aggressively trying to disrupt and re-route world trade routes with it's belt and road initiative in order to dominate global trade. The US Navy dominates the worlds' oceans and thereby controls most major shipping lanes. China's belt and road initiative aims to spend trillions of dollars to build new infrastructure in countries all over the world to bypass those shipping lanes and disrupt world trade.

China has been aggressively trying to stop being just a factory mill for from Western companies- and move heavily to start to manufacturing high-value goods from Chinese state-backed companies in high-tech/high-value fields like semi-conductors, aerospace, pharmaceuticals with it's Made In China 2025 initiative. Their plan is for 70% of all high-tech/high-value that is manufactured in China to be manufactured by Chinese state-backed entities- by the year 2025. And where the hell did these bastards get any of that tech to manufacture those kind of items in high-tech/high-value fields? From US! They either stole it from us, or our very stupid companies gave them tech/trade secrets willingly via forced technology transfers for access to the Chinese market.

If the US doesn't fight those bastards tooth and nail right now, and beat them back, I am afraid of what this country will look like in the future for the younger generation.
People will call you an extremist for such language.  But/ you are right!
« Last Edit: April 21, 2020, 09:01:13 AM by 847badgerfan »
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
-Mark Twain

Cincydawg

  • Ombudsman for the Secret Order of the Odd Fellows
  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 40901
  • Liked:
Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #2377 on: April 21, 2020, 09:00:12 AM »
We still don't know some critical things about COVID that are pretty critical in how we forecast the future with it.

Is it seasonal?

Will it mutate?

What is the real R naught?

How long does immunity last for folks already exposed (or vaccinated)?

How many have had it without symptoms?  (Or had mild symptoms.)

How effective are any of the antivirals at treating the seriously ill?

Do we have anything that is prophylactic medicinally?

Mdot21

  • Team Captain
  • *******
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 5489
  • Liked:
Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #2378 on: April 21, 2020, 09:00:49 AM »
Maybe China was just optimistic
Yeah...OR...maybe they disappeared/murdered whistleblowers, scrubbed the internet, censored WeChat, reprimanded officials, destroyed evidence, and sat on key info instead of sharing it with the world.

847badgerfan

  • Administrator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 13534
  • Liked:
Re: Coronavirus discussion and Quarantine ideas
« Reply #2379 on: April 21, 2020, 09:02:58 AM »
We still don't know some critical things about COVID that are pretty critical in how we forecast the future with it.

Is it seasonal?

Will it mutate?

What is the real R naught?

How long does immunity last for folks already exposed (or vaccinated)?

How many have had it without symptoms?  (Or had mild symptoms.)

How effective are any of the antivirals at treating the seriously ill?

Do we have anything that is prophylactic medicinally?
We may never have all of the answers, unless China ponies up and allows an international panel to investigate the lab in which this virus came from.

Don't hold your breath.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

 

Support the Site!
Purchase of every item listed here DIRECTLY supports the site.