header pic

Perhaps the BEST B1G Forum anywhere, here at College Football Fan Site, CFB51!!!

The 'Old' CFN/Scout Crowd- Enjoy Civil discussion, game analytics, in depth player and coaching 'takes' and discussing topics surrounding the game. You can even have your own free board, all you have to do is ask!!!

Anyone is welcomed and encouraged to join our FREE site and to take part in our community- a community with you- the user, the fan, -and the person- will be protected from intrusive actions and with a clean place to interact.


Author

Topic: OT: Tech Nerd Thread

 (Read 10191 times)

Gigem

  • All Star
  • ******
  • Posts: 3553
  • Liked:
Re: OT: Tech Nerd Thread
« Reply #224 on: May 22, 2025, 02:51:58 PM »
So as we started discussing a little on the obituaries thread, we often try to align things to decadal times--was something an "80s" thing or a "90s" thing. I think that's both inaccurate and lazy sometimes. At least we don't do that with generations--things like the Baby Boomers or Millennials are aligned to specific cultural eras, not a date year ending in zero.

So I'd ask what you all think about the technological eras of our time. I'll throw a few things out there regarding computing / communication, but we certainly don't need to limit it to that.

My view on some of these:


  • Pre-1981 - the computing prehistoric era: This was essentially the "pre-computer" era for most people. Most were unlikely to do much with computers, even at their jobs. Nobody outside of engineers or tech geeks would have a computer at home. The "IBM PC" hadn't been released yet. Computers, for most people, basically didn't exist.
  • 1981-1992 - the "PC" era: With the release of the IBM PC and then the various clones, we started to see consolidation of operating systems, and therefore software, and a rapid decline in price. However, the PCs of this era didn't really DO much. They were basically tools for things that we could already do, to make it easier. Things such as word processing (instead of using a typewriter), bookkeeping or taxes (doing it on the computer rather than by hand), etc. And generally your computer was "your computer"--it largely wasn't used to communicate. It was merely a tool in your house for tasks you need to accomplish -- and for gaming because you only have SO much work to do lol...
  • 1992-1997 - the "online service" walled garden era: Now we're getting to Windows, we're getting to modems, and we're getting to... America Online! For the first time, regular people (i.e. not BBS nerds) had a way to use that PC to communicate. For many, it would be their first experience with email. However, for most people, getting on AOL was used to "get on AOL". It was not used to get onto a wider internet, which barely existed. The services were provided and curated by AOL. And if you were AOL, you weren't on CompuServe, or Prodigy, etc.
  • 1997-2007 - the "world wide web" era: Here's where I think we started to see people break out of the walled garden, and the growth of web sites--including e-commerce. However, this was still a "computer-based" era. You got onto your computer to go check your email, go to a web site, perhaps read online news/blogs, etc. And at this point, you largely would "go to a web site", not having any curated content, any algorithms feeding you, or any real "platforms". The web era was that--an era of distinct and largely separate web sites.
  • 2007-2018?? - the smartphone/social media era: This was the point--with the iPhone--at which everything really changed. You went from interacting with technology primarily through a device that you either had at home or in a bag/backpack, with a screen and a keyboard, to carrying the world around with you in your pocket. It was also when social media was really hitting its stride--accelerated by the smartphone. However in my opinion this is separate from what I'm about to talk about--at this point social media was still very much about connecting with friends & family, about the people in your life you already know. But this is when it moved from the "web" era to the "platform" era.
  • 2018??-present - the influencer/algorithm era: As I mention above, I think this is when everything got truly supercharged and hyper-focused to push content in your face all day long. I think it differs from the previous social media era, because eventually we all realized that there's only so much we want to interact with friends and family. And the platform era is all about engagement. So they want to drip-feed you content and keep you coming back, and that content will be individualized to YOU and what they believe will cause YOU to remain engaged.
  • Next - the AI era? Not sure what happens next.

Thoughts?
Close.  Pretty much echo's how I feel.  

MikeDeTiger

  • All Star
  • ******
  • Posts: 4827
  • Liked:
Re: OT: Tech Nerd Thread
« Reply #225 on: May 22, 2025, 03:12:31 PM »
One of the people I have run into in life was one of the key creators of Facebook's algorithm. It made him very wealthy. It also makes him lose sleep at night.

An engineer I know and respect a great deal believes things like that can't really be attributed/blamed on any individual. His perspective: humans are, by nature, inventors. We create before we analyze our creations. He makes this argument about nuclear weapons: he believes they were inevitable. I'm sure he would say the same thing about the algorithm form of marketing. It's an interesting world view.

I feel like that's why God gave us sci-fi writers.  They're sort of our 19th and 20th century prophets, warnings us about the dangers so we don't have to find out for real.  

I note we listen about as well as people tended to listen to the Biblical prophets.  

ELA

  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 22974
  • Liked:
Re: OT: Tech Nerd Thread
« Reply #226 on: May 22, 2025, 03:13:51 PM »
I think the other thing is how computer knowledge there in the "PC" era was much slower to change, and was very industry based.  We got our first PC in 1992.  My grandfather was 67, and had been retired for 3 years.  My dad was 36.  But my dad was in sales, and aside from some light Lotus work, had very little computer interaction.  My grandfather retired from administration at UM, and universities had access to it before almost anyone.  So even though he wasn't in a tech field, and had been retired, without a PC of his own, for 3 years, he came over regularly to help us navigate things.

CatsbyAZ

  • All Star
  • ******
  • Posts: 3232
  • Liked:
Re: OT: Tech Nerd Thread
« Reply #227 on: May 22, 2025, 03:15:24 PM »
  • Next - the AI era? Not sure what happens next.

Dead Internet Theory

medinabuckeye1

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 10799
  • Liked:
Re: OT: Tech Nerd Thread
« Reply #228 on: May 22, 2025, 03:23:54 PM »
An engineer I know and respect a great deal believes things like that can't really be attributed/blamed on any individual. His perspective: humans are, by nature, inventors. We create before we analyze our creations. He makes this argument about nuclear weapons: he believes they were inevitable. I'm sure he would say the same thing about the algorithm form of marketing. It's an interesting world view.
As a history buff I can say without a doubt that his is absolutely true.  

The US Atomic program (what became the Manhattan Project) got started largely because Einstein sent a letter to FDR that basically said "Hey, you really need to look at this because the Germans are WAY ahead of you on it and if it is successful it is a complete game-changer.  

The Manhattan Project borrowed HEAVILY from the British Atomic project which was WAY ahead of ours circa 1941/42 and also benefitted immensely from a ton of other European scientists who fled the Nazi's because they were Jewish.  This also substantially hurt the German Atomic program since they chased off a substantial portion of their best scientists.  

The French, Italians, Soviets, and Japanese also had atomic research programs before and during the war.  That is just off the top of my head, I'm sure there were others as well.  It was absolutely inevitable that someone would eventually figure out how to split atoms and make a really big boom.  

A couple side notes:
I've visited the Trinity site.  That was the site of the first atomic explosion.  We are coming up on the 80th anniversary of that occurrence.  At 5:29 am local time on July 16, 1945 "Gadget" was detonated in the New Mexico desert not far from Alamogordo, NM.  The site is only open a couple days a year which is actually very good because rather than just driving by and snapping a picture of a sign that says "Trinity test happened here" they really do up a major presentation.  There are scientists and historians and a bus tour to the ranch where they put the thing together and you learn a lot about it.  

One of the most fascinating stories of WWII is the story of Moe Berg being assigned to attend a lecture in Zurich (neutral Switzerland) by German Atomic Scientist Werner Heisenberg.  

I have to back up and explain Moe Berg because the guy is flat out fascinating.  He was a professional baseball player in the 1920's and 1930's playing catcher for the Brooklyn Robins (later became the Brooklyn Dodgers), Chicago White Sox, Cleveland Indians, Washington Senators, and Boston Red Sox.  Far from the stereotype of a dumb jock, he was a genius who had graduated magna cum laude from Princeton.  Anyway, during the war he wanted to be involved despite being in his 40's and too old to begin traditional military service.  He eventually joined OSS (Office of Strategic Services, forerunner of the CIA) and worked on a project to capture and interrogate Italian rocket and missile scientists.  In order to do this effectively, Berg had to be smart enough to understand the research.  

In November of 1944 Berg was sent to Heisenberg's lecture in Zurich with orders to shoot and kill Heisenberg if anything that Heisenberg said led him to believe that the Germans were close to a bomb.  Berg correctly deduced that the Germans were nowhere close to a bomb and thus did not kill Heisenberg.  

If you didn't already get this from reading the previous paragraph, think about it for a minute.  A US OSS officer was sent into a neutral country with orders to KILL a foreign scientist.  That is a MASSIVE violation of International Law and local law and just about everything else.  Had Berg actually killed Heisenberg he may well have been executed by the Swiss for murder.  I explain that to explain that the US did not undertake this operation lightly.  It was, however, that important that if the Germans were anywhere close to a Bomb, they HAD to be stopped.  

I think the best quote about Berg to explain him is that late in the war he was assigned to go to Italy and recruit the head of the Italian supersonic research program, Antonio Ferri.  When Berg (a former MLB Catcher) returned with Ferri, FDR commented "I see that Moe Berg is still catching very well."  

betarhoalphadelta

  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 14800
  • Liked:
Re: OT: Tech Nerd Thread
« Reply #229 on: May 22, 2025, 03:50:29 PM »
One of the people I have run into in life was one of the key creators of Facebook's algorithm. It made him very wealthy. It also makes him lose sleep at night.

An engineer I know and respect a great deal believes things like that can't really be attributed/blamed on any individual. His perspective: humans are, by nature, inventors. We create before we analyze our creations. He makes this argument about nuclear weapons: he believes they were inevitable. I'm sure he would say the same thing about the algorithm form of marketing. It's an interesting world view.
I think there's a historical argument that many inventions are somewhat inevitable as a "product of their time" and we credit the person who got there first, when there might have been many who were one step away and might have gotten there in another year or three's time.  

For example, in my industry a big advance was the helium-filled HDD. The issue wasn't that nobody had ever thought of using helium inside an HDD--the concept was well known and it was an engineering problem, not an idea problem. Helium doesn't like to stay where you put it, so the engineering of it all centered around how to seal it into the drive. As it stands, my company was the first to productize it in 2013--but our biggest competitor had a helium product about 2 1/2 years later. It's not like they'd JUST started it. We were just a little farther ahead.

The next truly major technological milestone is called HAMR--using a laser to heat a microscopic dot on the media surface beyond its Curie temp, which makes it easier to magnetically "write" the bit, and then once it cools it is tremendously stable magnetically. Again, this is NOT a technology that nobody has thought of--we've joked for at least a decade that every year, HAMR is "two years away". The problem isn't the concept--its the engineering to make it reliable enough for data center use with appropriate production yields and MTBF. We've been working on it, and our competitor has been working on it. Now what was always "two years away" is finally here. As it stands, they productized it first, but we've publicly announced [or I wouldn't mention it here] our first HAMR product on our roadmap. 

I don't know how many inventions are truly "lightning bolts out of nowhere" sort of inventions. IMHO a great many of them are things that in scientific literature, in industry R&D circles, in the esoteric places where the geeks live, a bunch of people all know what they're trying to achieve, and are actively working towards it. But someone will always be first. 

It's similar to how the calculus developed--largely independently between Newton and Liebniz. But both had access to the "state of the art" of mathematical thought at the same time, and it's not ALL that surprising that they both made the same extrapolations from that to the next logical step separately, independently, and at roughly the same time. Calculus was likely "about to be invented" by someone, and it was just a surprise that the two basically did it at the same time so we can argue over which one did it. 

Cincydawg

  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 84284
  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Liked:
Re: OT: Tech Nerd Thread
« Reply #230 on: May 22, 2025, 04:27:42 PM »
Quite a few major inventions were accidents:

7 Momentous Inventions Discovered by Accident | HISTORY

15 Of The Coolest Accidental Inventions | HowStuffWorks

To these, I would add Teflon and Nylon.  There are quite a few chemical reactions discovered by accident (one of no account was discovered by me, by accident).

I'd argue the "accidents" would have occured sooner or later, but the inventions were not what the person was trying to achieve.

betarhoalphadelta

  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 14800
  • Liked:
Re: OT: Tech Nerd Thread
« Reply #231 on: May 22, 2025, 04:31:12 PM »
One of the people I have run into in life was one of the key creators of Facebook's algorithm. It made him very wealthy. It also makes him lose sleep at night.

An engineer I know and respect a great deal believes things like that can't really be attributed/blamed on any individual. His perspective: humans are, by nature, inventors. We create before we analyze our creations. He makes this argument about nuclear weapons: he believes they were inevitable. I'm sure he would say the same thing about the algorithm form of marketing. It's an interesting world view.
As it relates to a wider point, it brings up certain questions. 

I agree that to an extent we are an inventive species, and we will invent without really considering the consequences of our invention. AI, of course, is a key aspect of this.

I personally believe that if we were to achieve artificial general intelligence (AGI), it will be a short step from there to artificial superintelligence (ASI). The reason is that human intelligence is REALLY difficult to scale. To "build" a human capable of extending the knowledge in any particular field, you are typically going to need 18 years of basic development, multiple years of college, either an advanced degree or a LOT of time learning on the job in a particular field, and then and only then are they really able to do something interesting. But they're only able to do something interesting in their own field. To migrate from one field to another basically is not ALL that far removed from starting from scratch. I think I'm really good at what I do; if I wanted to reverse course and then try to be as good at what I do at something like medicine, I'd have no chance of doing it before I hit retirement age. 

However, with computers, that's not really the case. What one computer learns can be nearly instantly transferred to another. It's like The Matrix; plug in and download the information and suddenly "I know kung fu" or "I can fly a helicopter". And there's no requirement to sleep, or to eat, or to rest in general. Once you have AGI, you can effectively instantly replicate and have 1000x AGI, and those 1000x AGIs can work diligently on trying to invent one ASI, and then once you have one ASI... It all spirals. 

And we're going down this road without any idea of where that spiral leads. Is it a Skynet / The Matrix hellscape? Maybe. We don't know, and won't know, until we create it. 

From an ethical standpoint, I'm not "working in AI". But the products my company produces are absolutely a part of this entire burgeoning AI world, so I can't throw my hands up and say I'm not a part of it. I don't know how to feel about that, if it all goes horribly wrong. 

Cincydawg

  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 84284
  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Liked:
Re: OT: Tech Nerd Thread
« Reply #232 on: May 22, 2025, 04:32:50 PM »
I know who to blame.

FearlessF

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 46552
  • Liked:
Re: OT: Tech Nerd Thread
« Reply #233 on: May 22, 2025, 04:50:00 PM »
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

Cincydawg

  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 84284
  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Liked:
Re: OT: Tech Nerd Thread
« Reply #234 on: May 22, 2025, 04:54:07 PM »
Tickling the Dragon's Tail.

May 21, 1946 - Physicist and chemist Louis Slotin was performing an experiment at Los Alamos, New Mexico with what was later named the demon core, a 13.7 lb core of plutonium. A core was used at the very center of a nuclear weapon, and in the case of an implosion-type weapon, when properly imploded within a bomb - it creates a nuclear explosion. The core was scheduled to be used during the Able shot of Operation Crossroads which took place on June 30, 1946.
The experiment was to induce the first steps of a fission reaction by carefully placing the plutonium core between two beryllium *hemispheres kept separated by the skill of a technician holding a screwdriver.  As the technician maneuvered the screwdriver, he could induce criticality, but he had to be very careful - one slip could result in a prompt critical reaction that could induce lethal radiation. The danger of this procedure earned it the nickname of "tickling the dragon's tail".
At 3:20PM at Los Alamos, Slotin's screwdriver slipped and the beryllium *hemispheres completely encapsulated the plutonium. Observers noted a blue flash of air ionization and a heat wave as Slotin instinctively jerked his hand to throw off the top beryllium sphere - ending the reaction. Not long after as Slotin left the building, understanding he just received a fatal dose of radiation, he vomited - a clear sign that the exposure had been intense. Nine days later after suffering from the agonizing affects of acute radiation poisoning, Slotin died. One medical expert described him as receiving a "three-dimensional sunburn". He was later buried in his hometown of Winnipeg, Manitoba.
The demon core meanwhile was not used during Crossroads (it was considered for use during a third underwater test named "Charlie" that was not carried out due to the intense radiation problems caused by the "Baker" test) and was later melted down and recycled into other cores. Before claiming Slotin's life, an earlier criticality experiment with the demon core had claimed the life of Harry Daghlian.
Along with those radiation casualties at Hiroshima and Nagasaki, Slotin's death provided a clear example of what acute radiation syndrome could do to human beings. Being a scientist, even when facing his imminent death, he realized the importance of documenting his slow and painful deterioration - and footage was later shown to many involved in the American nuclear weapon community in an effort to educate them about the dangers of radiation.



Cincydawg

  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 84284
  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Liked:
Re: OT: Tech Nerd Thread
« Reply #235 on: May 22, 2025, 04:56:47 PM »
The patent idea is a great one, in concept, it doesn't work well today IMHO.  The idea is a quid pro quo:

1.  You describe your invention in such detail that someone else "skilled in the art" could practice it, and, in return,

2.  You get a monopoly right for 20 years (from date of filing).

Folks will often see an invention they can't yet practice and start working on another angle, or further development.  An example, someone patents "a wheel".  You see it, and appreciate that a wheel by itself is not very useful, so you invent and axel.  OK, now you have something, but you can't practice the wheel.

So, you call up the wheel guy and make a "deal deal".

ELA

  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 22974
  • Liked:
Re: OT: Tech Nerd Thread
« Reply #236 on: May 22, 2025, 05:30:26 PM »

No wonder he never held elected office

MikeDeTiger

  • All Star
  • ******
  • Posts: 4827
  • Liked:
Re: OT: Tech Nerd Thread
« Reply #237 on: May 22, 2025, 05:57:58 PM »
I have to back up and explain Moe Berg because the guy is flat out fascinating.  He was a professional baseball player in the 1920's and 1930's playing catcher for the Brooklyn Robins (later became the Brooklyn Dodgers), Chicago White Sox, Cleveland Indians, Washington Senators, and Boston Red Sox.  Far from the stereotype of a dumb jock, he was a genius who had graduated magna cum laude from Princeton.  Anyway, during the war he wanted to be involved despite being in his 40's and too old to begin traditional military service.  He eventually joined OSS (Office of Strategic Services, forerunner of the CIA) and worked on a project to capture and interrogate Italian rocket and missile scientists.  In order to do this effectively, Berg had to be smart enough to understand the research. 

In November of 1944 Berg was sent to Heisenberg's lecture in Zurich with orders to shoot and kill Heisenberg if anything that Heisenberg said led him to believe that the Germans were close to a bomb.  Berg correctly deduced that the Germans were nowhere close to a bomb and thus did not kill Heisenberg.   

There was a movie with Paul Rudd made about Berg a few years ago.  It wasn't great, but it certainly wasn't bad either.  The Catcher Was A Spy.

 

Support the Site!
Purchase of every item listed here DIRECTLY supports the site.