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Topic: OT - TV shows and Movies

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SFBadger96

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Re: OT - TV shows and Movies
« Reply #1246 on: March 30, 2026, 07:59:23 PM »
To that I say: read the book! :-) Or we can discuss once more people have had a chance to watch the movie.

CatsbyAZ

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Re: OT - TV shows and Movies
« Reply #1247 on: Today at 11:29:30 AM »
Then we have the Fermi Paradox which is ... interesting.

My favorite explanation for the Fermi Paradox is as follows - quoting from Wikipedia:

"It may be that intelligent alien life develops an "increasing disinterest" in their outside world. Possibly any sufficiently advanced society will develop highly engaging media and entertainment well before the capacity for advanced space travel, with the rate of appeal of these social contrivances being destined, because of their inherent reduced complexity, to overtake any desire for complex, expensive endeavors such as space exploration and communication. Once any sufficiently advanced civilization becomes able to master its environment, and most of its physical needs are met through technology, various "social and entertainment technologies", including virtual reality, are postulated to become the primary drivers and motivations of that civilization."


This explanation must be inspired by our own species willingness to retreat into their digital escapes. And at this point in time, I think mankind is nearing an advent of ultimate distraction. Where our virtual worlds will become so sensually immersive that reality will be dismissed by the masses as a "backwater."

The advent of television was an escape, but not so much so that TV could not be relegated to background noise in most settings, while you cooked, folded laundry, or played cards. Video games are an even more engaging escape. And today the conditioning is already in place for a virtual world that the masses won't want to unplug from, to the detriment of taken-for-granted basics of reality - diet, chores, face-to-face friends, etc.



MikeDeTiger

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Re: OT - TV shows and Movies
« Reply #1248 on: Today at 12:48:42 PM »
That could be, but the Fermi Paradox is built on a number of assumptions that are severely out of date.  Fermi originally outlined his puzzle around 1950 or so.  Physics, and our understanding of the fine-tuning of the universe, has made monumental leaps since then, each which exponentially alter the paradigm he was operating in.  Even Stephen Hawking's famous book, A Brief History of Time, assumed that all we needed for an Earth-like planet was a solar system similar to ours (which is no common feat to start out with).  That was only 1988.  Since then the requirements for an Earth-like planet we now know must be present have exploded, both in number requirements and in the probabilities of each requirement that sink the odds ever lower. 

Put simply, a planet capable of supporting advanced life like Earth shouldn't exist.  Anywhere.  The factors that need to be present completely overwhelm the counter-assumptions based on the vastness of space and the potential number of life-sustaining planets it could hold.  The Starship Enterprise roamed around the galaxy, visiting and stumbling upon "M-Class" planets (meaning, like Earth) as if the Milky Way was sneezing those things out with regularity.  In the real world, they're going to be incomprehensibly less probable, if they exist at all.  I say "incomprehensibly" because the probabilities involve numbers so large that they don't mean anything to the human mind.  If I said one thing had a 1 in 10120 chance in occurring.....that wouldn't mean anything to any of us.  If we then said there's 50 of those things with similar odds (there's way more than 50), and they all have to hit the incomprehensible odds, it means even less. 

What amuses me is how science popularizers will regularly gloss over this stuff in pop-level settings.  Interviews, articles, books aimed at laymen, etc.  Catch them in scientific journals, speaking at conferences with their peers, or academic books, etc., and when pressed, their tune changes to a more honest look at the long odds. 

Fermi asks, "Where is everybody?"  My personal Bayesian analysis says "They probably ain't there."  I don't know that for certain.  Neither do I have any first-hand research, obviously.  Just the work and opinions of people who study this stuff. 

That said, if "they" are out there--or will be out there at some point in the future--there is another explanation that seems to be overlooked in the usual conversations.  From what I've seen, the assumption is always that there must be older, more advanced civilizations than ours, so we wonder why they haven't come to see us.  They never seem to consider the possibility that we are the oldest, first civilization (or one of them), and so it's going to be the rest of the universe waiting on us to go visit them, assuming a comparable rate of progress in technology across worlds.  I find that as plausible as any of the other solutions to the paradox commonly proposed.  Perhaps even somewhat likely, since despite the fact that there are stars much older than our own, given the necessity of a bunch of finely-tuned factors I mentioned above, then it could be that if there are other civilizations (or there are going to be others), there won't be nearly so many of them as the vastness of space suggests, and perhaps our planet was the first, despite the fact our sun is younger than many others.  Even if one doesn't consider that the likeliest explanation, it should be on the table with the others. 

Catsby's favorite explanation, while I don't consider it the most likely, I worry has a ring of truth to it. 

 

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