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Topic: Is the Big Ten top to bottom the 2nd best conference in America?

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betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Is the Big Ten top to bottom the 2nd best conference in America?
« Reply #70 on: October 04, 2019, 03:34:37 PM »
you get an auto bid if you win your conference (p5 confs) and are in top 10. i'd feel pretty confident that any p5 conf team with an 12-1 record and conf champ would be top 10, including purdue.
I personally don't necessarily LIKE qualifiers that are outside the team's control such as polls, but I could get behind it.

However I'd pair that maybe with a sliding scale exclusion as an incentive to schedule tougher OOC. Top 10 if you play 9 P5 teams, top 15 in you play 10 P5 teams, and maybe top 25 if you play 11 or more P5 teams. Or something similar to that. 

That makes it even more important to schedule up OOC, but also allows you wiggle room to lose high-profile OOC games without a huge penalty.

I.e. let's say Purdue wins the conference instead as 10-3, and sits at 18th. But their losses were two of their 9 conference games, and they scheduled Clemson and UCLA OOC, beating UCLA handily but losing to Clemson. I think in that case they shouldn't be excluded for losing tough OOC games.

If you make it "top 10", it makes it even more likely that teams will schedule patsies OOC so that they minimize total losses on the schedule, because voters are lazy and typically will rank a 1-loss team ahead of a 2-loss team, ahead of a 3-loss team, regardless of the quality of those losses.

utee94

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Re: Is the Big Ten top to bottom the 2nd best conference in America?
« Reply #71 on: October 04, 2019, 03:38:34 PM »
I personally don't necessarily LIKE qualifiers that are outside the team's control such as polls, but I could get behind it.

However I'd pair that maybe with a sliding scale exclusion as an incentive to schedule tougher OOC. Top 10 if you play 9 P5 teams, top 15 in you play 10 P5 teams, and maybe top 25 if you play 11 or more P5 teams. Or something similar to that.

That makes it even more important to schedule up OOC, but also allows you wiggle room to lose high-profile OOC games without a huge penalty.

I.e. let's say Purdue wins the conference instead as 10-3, and sits at 18th. But their losses were two of their 9 conference games, and they scheduled Clemson and UCLA OOC, beating UCLA handily but losing to Clemson. I think in that case they shouldn't be excluded for losing tough OOC games.

If you make it "top 10", it makes it even more likely that teams will schedule patsies OOC so that they minimize total losses on the schedule, because voters are lazy and typically will rank a 1-loss team ahead of a 2-loss team, ahead of a 3-loss team, regardless of the quality of those losses.
Exactly.  Which is why I want the human element eliminated completely.  

Win the conference, and you're in.  Everyone knows the goal ahead of time, and no subjectivity is involved for inclusion.

Cincydawg

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Re: Is the Big Ten top to bottom the 2nd best conference in America?
« Reply #72 on: October 04, 2019, 04:37:52 PM »
I like humans.  I like most elements, I was never a big fan of yttrium.  

Lighten up, Francis.  Enjoy what we have,mostly some pretty good post season games.

rolltidefan

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Re: Is the Big Ten top to bottom the 2nd best conference in America?
« Reply #73 on: October 04, 2019, 05:03:03 PM »
we just disagree then.
i want the best teams in the cfp. with the limited data, there is a good bit of subjectivity to who that could be. but even with that limited data, there are clear delineations of who is not the best team, and i do not want them included in a tournament to decide the best team regardless of the hardware they ended up with.

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Is the Big Ten top to bottom the 2nd best conference in America?
« Reply #74 on: October 04, 2019, 05:06:42 PM »
I like humans.
Eh. I could do without most of 'em.

utee94

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Re: Is the Big Ten top to bottom the 2nd best conference in America?
« Reply #75 on: October 04, 2019, 05:12:15 PM »
we just disagree then.
i want the best teams in the cfp. with the limited data, there is a good bit of subjectivity to who that could be. but even with that limited data, there are clear delineations of who is not the best team, and i do not want them included in a tournament to decide the best team regardless of the hardware they ended up with.

We definitely disagree, and I don't think this is necessarily true.  If that 9-4 Northwestern team actually knocks off 12-1 Clemson and 13-0 Alabama 2 weeks in a row, as you fear, then I don't think there's any "clear delineation" at all.  I'd say your subjective view was completely wrong.  Nothing personal, humans are fallible and prone to bias and agenda.

So eliminate them.  Completely.  One clear goal-- win your conference and you're in.  Everyone knows exactly what it will take.  Seems absolutely fair to me.

FearlessF

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Re: Is the Big Ten top to bottom the 2nd best conference in America?
« Reply #76 on: October 04, 2019, 05:18:58 PM »
Exactly.  Which is why I want the human element eliminated completely. 

Win the conference, and you're in.  Everyone knows the goal ahead of time, and no subjectivity is involved for inclusion.
win your conference, you are eligible for the 4 team playoff

then seeded 1-4 by strength of schedule
that's it, no whining if you are #5 or #6
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

utee94

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Re: Is the Big Ten top to bottom the 2nd best conference in America?
« Reply #77 on: October 04, 2019, 05:27:45 PM »
win your conference, you are eligible for the 4 team playoff

then seeded 1-4 by strength of schedule
that's it, no whining if you are #5 or #6

4 isn't enough for 5 P5 conferences, why is someone getting left out and who is making that determination?  Whoever it is, I don't trust them and don't want them involved.

Also, how are you handling Notre Dame?

FearlessF

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Re: Is the Big Ten top to bottom the 2nd best conference in America?
« Reply #78 on: October 04, 2019, 05:31:47 PM »
SOS is making that determination - therefore the AD and Coach that set the schedule years before

Notre Dame can join a conference

Or you could do something if you feel the Domers are entitled such as: if they have 1 or fewer loses they are included in the SOS ranking, if they make the top 4 after that, they're in!
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

MrNubbz

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Re: Is the Big Ten top to bottom the 2nd best conference in America?
« Reply #79 on: October 04, 2019, 05:34:40 PM »
4 isn't enough for 5 P5 conferences, why is someone getting left out and who is making that determination?  Whoever it is, I don't trust them and don't want them involved.

Also, how are you handling Notre Dame?
Georgia already took care of that and those T-Sips want nothing to do with Big Ten
Suburbia:Where they tear out the trees & then name streets after them.

utee94

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Re: Is the Big Ten top to bottom the 2nd best conference in America?
« Reply #80 on: October 04, 2019, 05:35:36 PM »
Since I don't think we'll be at 4 teams much longer, there's really no point in arguing that bit. :)

Like bwar said, 8-team playoff, 5 conference champ auto-bids, and 3 at large.  One of those 3 could be slotted for the best G5, I'm not in love with that bit but it could be a necessity if the G5 start screaming about collusion.  Those at-large would also take care of Notre Dame, because I like college football and don't think they should be forced into a conference that they clearly don't want to join.

MrNubbz

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Re: Is the Big Ten top to bottom the 2nd best conference in America?
« Reply #81 on: October 04, 2019, 05:48:16 PM »
And the whole enchilada will be a watered down product with undeserving teams and NFL wanna bees bailing - bank on it
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Cincydawg

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Re: Is the Big Ten top to bottom the 2nd best conference in America?
« Reply #82 on: October 04, 2019, 06:39:04 PM »
I revise my post that I like humans.

I like you guys.

FearlessF

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Re: Is the Big Ten top to bottom the 2nd best conference in America?
« Reply #83 on: October 04, 2019, 06:39:56 PM »
just as it is today, only worser
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

 

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