header pic

Perhaps the BEST B1G Forum anywhere, here at College Football Fan Site, CFB51!!!

The 'Old' CFN/Scout Crowd- Enjoy Civil discussion, game analytics, in depth player and coaching 'takes' and discussing topics surrounding the game. You can even have your own free board, all you have to do is ask!!!

Anyone is welcomed and encouraged to join our FREE site and to take part in our community- a community with you- the user, the fan, -and the person- will be protected from intrusive actions and with a clean place to interact.


Author

Topic: OT-Politics Thread: please TRY to keep it civil, you damned dirty apes

 (Read 3363759 times)

Cincydawg

  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 84316
  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Liked:
Re: OT-Politics Thread: please TRY to keep it civil, you damned dirty apes
« Reply #45234 on: June 12, 2025, 02:41:29 PM »
I stand by my comment.  And sure, they can go after undocumented folks, but not just because someone is money laundering.

And maybe these guys were involved with that, I don't know, I've seen it suggested they were. I would have expected the FBI to be involved if that is the case.


MikeDeTiger

  • All Star
  • ******
  • Posts: 4835
  • Liked:
Re: OT-Politics Thread: please TRY to keep it civil, you damned dirty apes
« Reply #45235 on: June 12, 2025, 02:49:25 PM »
One of my primary objections to this is that it allows the MILLIONS of illegals who came here WITHOUT authorization to effectively "jump the que" and cut in line in front of those who stayed home while pursing LEGAL immigration channels. 

There should NEVER be a "path to citizenship" for people who broke the law because to offer that incentivizes future lawbreaking just like Reagan's stupid amnesty in the 1980's incentivized all the illegals who have come in the ~40 years since. 

My position on immigration is simple:
  • No Amnesty, ever. 
  • No "comprehensive solution" which is a political cover for amnesty, ever. 
  • No Citizenship for illegals, ever. 
  • The 14th Amendment was written and passed to deal with former slaves and was NEVER intended to grant citizenship to the children of illegal immigrants.  Further, the text "All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States..." excludes lawbreakers because until they are apprehended they are not "subject to the jurisdiction thereof".  An interpretation calling for citizenship for kids born here to illegals incentivizes lawbreaking and is flat out ludicrous. 
  • Go home and anyone who came illegally or overstayed a visa goes to the back of the line. 
  • Legal immigration should be restricted to those who have a verifiable job with a sufficiently high pay that their contributions to SSI and Medicare  will be sufficient such that those programs will be better off with them as participants.  This will necessarily be age and income based.  Both systems are going bankrupt so an average wage, even for an entire lifetime from HS Summer job to post-retirement employment is not enough.  Thus, even a youngish prospective immigrant would need to have an earning capacity well above average.  As the prospective immigrant ages the problem gets worse for actuarial reasons.  Thus, a say 50 year old prospective immigrant would probably (not doing calculations here, just guessing) need to be earning around 10X the average wage to even be close. 

It is undoubtedly a compromise.  A compromise, by definition, means neither side will be completely happy.  I view it as an acceptable reset button to address what has already transpired, not as any kind of fix for anything currently happening or which may happen in the future.  i.e., no permanent path to citizenship.  It doesn't perfectly satisfy the rule of law, but it's much closer than what's been happening.  

Cincydawg

  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 84316
  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Liked:
Re: OT-Politics Thread: please TRY to keep it civil, you damned dirty apes
« Reply #45236 on: June 12, 2025, 03:01:51 PM »
Quite a few folks simply over stay their visa.  Maybe they had a student visa from China or India and decide they don't want to go back, so they just stay.

I used to wonder why they check your passport when you LEAVE France (officially).  It's to prevent over staying (or check to see if you did).  The US doesn't check your passport going out, so you can over stay a while, and then decide to leave and there is no penalty.

As for the protests, the below is what I am seeing, a lot of verbiage, not much hard news.

Split Narratives: Media Push Extreme Conclusions on LA Immigration Protests, Violence | AllSides


Mdot21

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 16877
  • Liked:

Cincydawg

  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 84316
  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Liked:
Re: OT-Politics Thread: please TRY to keep it civil, you damned dirty apes
« Reply #45239 on: June 12, 2025, 03:18:14 PM »
Poll: 53% of Americans oppose Trump's 'big, beautiful' GOP spending bill | Fox News
Poll: 53% of Americans oppose Trump's 'big, beautiful' GOP spending bill | Fox News

NorthernOhioBuckeye

  • Starter
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 1254
  • Liked:
Re: OT-Politics Thread: please TRY to keep it civil, you damned dirty apes
« Reply #45240 on: June 12, 2025, 03:31:23 PM »
I stand by my comment.  And sure, they can go after undocumented folks, but not just because someone is money laundering.

And maybe these guys were involved with that, I don't know, I've seen it suggested they were. I would have expected the FBI to be involved if that is the case.
I'm just spitballing here, but when illegals are involved in criminal activity, it would make sense that ICE as statutory authority. 

Cincydawg

  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 84316
  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Liked:
Re: OT-Politics Thread: please TRY to keep it civil, you damned dirty apes
« Reply #45241 on: June 12, 2025, 03:46:23 PM »
Sure, just as the FBI can arrest drug dealers or gun runners.  But the primary role of ICE obviously is their ERO section.  They won't be going after money launderers in general.  And again, while I saw that rumor, I saw not reliable confirmation the folks detained were cartel associates.  A few may well have been.

I am pretty sure if ICE ERO had solid evidence of a money laundering scheme, they would have gone in with the FBI.  If it's purely going after undocumented folks, they would have gone in alone.

OrangeAfroMan

  • Stats Porn
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 22038
  • Liked:
Re: OT-Politics Thread: please TRY to keep it civil, you damned dirty apes
« Reply #45242 on: June 12, 2025, 04:02:20 PM »
Poll: 53% of Americans oppose Trump's 'big, beautiful' GOP spending bill | Fox News
Poll: 53% of Americans oppose Trump's 'big, beautiful' GOP spending bill | Fox News
What % of them read the bill?   :57:
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

847badgerfan

  • Administrator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 31751
  • Liked:
Re: OT-Politics Thread: please TRY to keep it civil, you damned dirty apes
« Reply #45243 on: June 12, 2025, 04:04:35 PM »
No more than 5 percent.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

utee94

  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 22891
  • Liked:
Re: OT-Politics Thread: please TRY to keep it civil, you damned dirty apes
« Reply #45244 on: June 12, 2025, 04:05:43 PM »
No more than 5 percent.
And there's only a 10% chance of that!

Cincydawg

  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Global Moderator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 84316
  • Oracle of Piedmont Park
  • Liked:
Re: OT-Politics Thread: please TRY to keep it civil, you damned dirty apes
« Reply #45245 on: June 12, 2025, 04:06:57 PM »
Of those polled, I'd guess zero read the bill.  Probably half, maybe, have read or heard something about the bill in their preferred news outlet, so they KNOW it means Republicans are throwing Grandma over a cliff, ending Social Security and Medicare, and giving huge tax breaks to billionaires.

Either that, or the bill is cutting all sorts of fraud and abuse and wasteful spending and will balance the budget next year.

medinabuckeye1

  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Default Avatar
  • Posts: 10812
  • Liked:
Re: OT-Politics Thread: please TRY to keep it civil, you damned dirty apes
« Reply #45246 on: June 12, 2025, 04:11:39 PM »
Of those polled, I'd guess zero read the bill.  Probably half, maybe, have read or heard something about the bill in their preferred news outlet, so they KNOW it means Republicans are throwing Grandma over a cliff, ending Social Security and Medicare, and giving huge tax breaks to billionaires.

Either that, or the bill is cutting all sorts of fraud and abuse and wasteful spending and will balance the budget next year.
This, unfortunately, is an issue that may frankly be intractable.  

Someone on here a while back said that if Trump said to breathe there are a lot of Democrats who would hold their breath until they passed out.  It was funny but true and goes both ways.  There is a substantial block of voters on each side who are all-in with their news from that side and for whom there will simply never be anything bad about their side nor good about the other side.  

847badgerfan

  • Administrator
  • Hall of Fame
  • *****
  • Posts: 31751
  • Liked:
Re: OT-Politics Thread: please TRY to keep it civil, you damned dirty apes
« Reply #45247 on: June 12, 2025, 04:13:40 PM »
Yep.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

 

Support the Site!
Purchase of every item listed here DIRECTLY supports the site.