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Topic: OT-Politics Thread: please TRY to keep it civil, you damned dirty apes

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SFBadger96

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #43932 on: April 25, 2025, 01:09:22 PM »
IMHO most of your earlier post is very well stated nonsense. 

That said, this portion of it is a necessary response to the later post that I've quoted here:This is obviously a tad understated.  Democrats don't "think" these voters favor them, they absolutely KNOW it. 

It isn't just the legitimate voters that favor Democrats though, the illegitimate voters favor Democrats and that is absolutely a reason for them to oppose requiring ID. 
Have you actually researched it? I'm going to rely on the historical record easily backing me up on this. For starters: https://www.democracydocket.com/analysis/ten-voting-rights-cases-that-shaped-history/

Those are just a handful of Supreme Court cases.
And I added that disclosure because I want to show that I'm not blind to the politics of it. Presumably you agree that, regardless of who they will vote for, American citizens should not be denied the right to vote because they are poor.
What's your basis for claiming that "illegitimate voters favor Democrats?" I know people make that claim in the media, but I have yet to see any legitimate research that supports it. If you know of some, please share.

Cincydawg

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #43933 on: April 25, 2025, 01:11:19 PM »
From what I can discern, voter fraud is primarily ballot harvesting, and mostly has impact on local elections.  Yes, some noncitizens register to vote, but it's nearly always their mistake and misunderstanding, and they don't vote often.  I don't think this is a major issue.  I also am OK with permanent residents voting in local elections if they want, not Federal.

Ballot harvesting is rather tough to limit without some public enforcement which is difficult to prove.

jgvol

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #43934 on: April 25, 2025, 01:41:21 PM »
What's your basis for claiming that "illegitimate voters favor Democrats?" I know people make that claim in the media, but I have yet to see any legitimate research that supports it. If you know of some, please share.

If it didn't benefit democrats, they'd be for voter ID laws.

Research concluded.

Cincydawg

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #43935 on: April 25, 2025, 01:46:28 PM »
The folks inhibited from voting by voter ID laws could well be different from folks who vote illegally.


utee94

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #43936 on: April 25, 2025, 01:56:16 PM »
The folks inhibited from voting by voter ID laws could well be different from folks who vote illegally.


Well, yeah.  The ones who are allegedly "inhibited" aren't dead.

Cincydawg

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #43937 on: April 25, 2025, 01:58:03 PM »
It does take a while, like 2-3 years, to take dead people off the roles.  How many of them "vote" is disputed.


SFBadger96

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #43938 on: April 25, 2025, 02:03:46 PM »
If it didn't benefit democrats, they'd be for voter ID laws.

Research concluded.
Impressive.
And the Fifth Circuit, sitting en banc (all of the judges, not a panel of 3)--a notoriously conservative circuit--ruled against the Texas voter ID law in 2016 (Veasey v. Abbott), finding that it violated the Voting Rights Act because it benefited Democrats?


FearlessF

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #43939 on: April 25, 2025, 02:07:26 PM »
But I have a solution to propose: for a state that passes a voter ID law, require that the state provide the same access to getting a drivers license or state photo ID as is provided for voting, e.g., anywhere the state puts a voting booth, the state also processes state IDs and provide those IDs for free. Also, require the state to process the IDs in the same amount of time it takes to process voter registration.
It seems to me that most citizens are encouraged to have a photo ID by society.  Plenty of good reasons to jump through the hoop to obtain one and keep it active.
Even poor folks - buying cigarettes, beer, driving a vehicle - should see the benefit
the folks that don't seem to want to get along with society are free to do as they please.  I want every citizen to be able to vote if they'd like.  Some folks just don't care, for whatever reason.
I'm not sure the states should feel guilty if they don't provide free IDs and the assistance for everyone, including those that really don't want to be a part of society.
nothing is free
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

Honestbuckeye

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #43940 on: April 25, 2025, 02:09:04 PM »
Y'all should put me and SFB in charge around here.  We'd get'er dun.
No disrespect-  but no thanks.  Scary.  Just because you write well doesn’t mean what you wrote has merit. SFBs long post about voter ID is a great example. 
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
-Mark Twain

SFBadger96

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #43941 on: April 25, 2025, 02:13:39 PM »
No disrespect-  but no thanks.  Scary.  Just because you write well doesn’t mean what you wrote has merit. SFBs long post about voter ID is a great example.
Please feel free to provide evidence that what I wrote is factually wrong. I'm sure there is plenty of opinion baked in, but where was I wrong on the facts?

Cincydawg

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #43942 on: April 25, 2025, 02:17:29 PM »
There are some folks who should be able to vote legally and for whom a DL is irrelevant, difficult to obtain, pointless, etc.  A state IMHO should make it pretty easy for them to obtain a suitable photo ID.


utee94

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #43943 on: April 25, 2025, 02:30:31 PM »
There are some folks who should be able to vote legally and for whom a DL is irrelevant, difficult to obtain, pointless, etc.  A state IMHO should make it pretty easy for them to obtain a suitable photo ID.


In Texas you can get either a DL or a state-issued ID if you do not want or need a DL.   There are also 5 other acceptable photo IDs for voting, including a passport among them.  And they can be expired up to 4 years.  Linked below is an interesting study performed recently (summer 2024) in Texas, about IDs, who has them, who doesn't, etc.


https://cdce.umd.edu/sites/cdce.umd.edu/files/Voter%20ID%20Report%20Texas.pdf

Cincydawg

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #43944 on: April 25, 2025, 02:33:31 PM »
Sure, it's really a question of how hard it is for a few folks to obtain the acceptable photo ID.  I do think for a few people it's not that easy.

Cincydawg

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #43945 on: April 25, 2025, 02:36:00 PM »
About 1.3 million Texans who are US citizens and of voting age (7%) would have difficulty showing documentation proving their citizenship (documentary proof of citizenship, or DPOC). Documents proving US citizenship include US birth certificates, US passports or passport cards, US naturalization certificates, and US certificates of citizenship. One percent of adult Texans who are US citizens and of voting age do not have any DPOC at all, and 6% cannot easily access their DPOC.5 For White Texans, 1% do not have any DPOC, and 4% cannot easily access their DPOC. Nearly all Black and Hispanic Texans have DPOC, but 5% of Black Texans and 8% of Hispanic Texans cannot easily access it. Showing DPOC is harder for Republicans than Democrats. One percent of Republicans do not have DPOC, and 7% cannot easily access their DPOC. Nearly all Texas Democrats have DPOC but 4% of Democrats cannot easily access their DPOC. Younger Texans are three times more likely to have trouble accessing their DPOC than older Texans. One percent of 18-29 year olds have no DPOC at all, but 12% would have trouble accessing their DPOC. While 1% of Texans 30 years old and older do not have DPOC, 4% would have trouble accessing their DPOC. Higher-income Texans are more likely to not have DPOC than lower-income Texans. For Texans making more than $100,000 annually, 2% do not have DPOC, and an additional 2% cannot easily access their DPOC. For Texans making under $30,000 annually, nearly all have DPOC but 5% cannot easily access their DPOC.

 

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