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Topic: OT-Politics Thread: please TRY to keep it civil, you damned dirty apes

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SuperMario

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40250 on: November 22, 2024, 08:27:45 PM »

The implication is always this: I know a bit part of this data is wrong, and so all the data might be wrong, and so we anything we imagine might be true.
This is a clear mistake that both sides do, all-inclusive verbiage. The implication is not ALWAYS that. The implication for the intelligent mind is that the data or some of the data is wrong, better investigate further. 

Confirmation bias is also a typical flaw. So many of us do it. Heck, how often do we do it with football stats lol? Myself clearly included.

here’s all I’m saying. That data looks incredibly flawed based on life experiences and feedback I get. My next door neighbor is a federal judge. My close friend is an assistant prosecutor. My cousin’s best friend is a local detective. Feedback from MB is local. So maybe the national data is more accurate than the local Ohio data. It’s possible, although I’m not sure that’s likely. When I’ve had life conversations with the people I listed and discussion about how our professional lives are, it consistently comes up about illegals tagged along with crime are becoming an increasingly problematic issue.

my wife’s family lives in New Mexico. Their stories and our experiences there are a different league of immigration issues. And those aren’t feelings. That’s hands on.

id love to be wrong in this area. I hope I am. Both you and SFBadge are guys I’ve had tremendous respect for a long time. I just see this topic very different and if I had a lack of respect, I wouldn’t even entertain the conversation about it at all. I enjoy hearing the stance that differs from mine. It gives perspective and opportunity to further the exploration of my own stance, even when it’s firm.

FearlessF

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40251 on: November 22, 2024, 08:34:29 PM »
Heck, I am incredibly angry that a bunch of white guys keep taking guns and shooting up schools, bars, churches, grocery stores, Las Vegas, etc., etc., etc., and yet the misinterpreting-the-Second Amendment crowd prevents meaningful changes to our gun laws.

what meaningful change to gun laws would you propose ?
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

Honestbuckeye

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40252 on: November 22, 2024, 08:36:24 PM »
what meaningful change to gun laws would you propose ?
He is blaming it on “ white guys”.   

how much further can you take a racist conversation.   
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
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FearlessF

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40253 on: November 22, 2024, 08:39:08 PM »
white guys do plenty of evil stuff

changing gun laws isn't going to change that much
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

jgvol

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40254 on: November 22, 2024, 08:40:17 PM »
How much is too much, and which Americans are we asking to bear the burden of these policies?

How much is too much?  We won’t know until we see it.  Impossible to quantify until we get into it.

As far as the second part:  All of us.  Just like we are all burdened by the policies that lead illegals here.

And you were leading the witness to try and get a gotchca, knowing that blacks/browns would be the targets.  Of course they will be.  I haven’t seen a single horde of migrant caucasians at any entry point seeking asylum, nor any border jumping Scandanavians.  And neither have you. 

If your objection is that white folks will be given the benefit of the doubt, well, you are correct.  As it should be, when all evidence points to the contrary.  Being honest with yourself doesn’t make you a bad guy, which you clearly are not. 

Your heart is in the right place, but you shouldn’t think with it. 

Honestbuckeye

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40255 on: November 22, 2024, 08:42:07 PM »
white guys do plenty of evil stuff

changing gun laws isn't going to change that much
Yes. Everyone of every race does bad stuff. But the “white guys bad, white guys bad” trope just got old enough that it got defeated at the ballot box.   

it’s disappointing to have to se it here.  
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
-Mark Twain

MaximumSam

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40256 on: November 22, 2024, 09:01:12 PM »

Quote
here’s all I’m saying. That data looks incredibly flawed based on life experiences and feedback I get. My next door neighbor is a federal judge. My close friend is an assistant prosecutor. My cousin’s best friend is a local detective. Feedback from MB is local. So maybe the national data is more accurate than the local Ohio data. It’s possible, although I’m not sure that’s likely. When I’ve had life conversations with the people I listed and discussion about how our professional lives are, it consistently comes up about illegals tagged along with crime are becoming an increasingly problematic issue.
The only response I can have to that is that I work in the criminal justice system in Columbus, which isn't exactly a podunk town despite what Michigan fans tell you. I see the waves of crime as they occur. There was a huge wave of stolen Kias and Hyundais because someone figured out you could steal them with a phone charger. I've seen the waves of murders go up and down. Burglaries are way down. Homicides not so much. But I haven't seen much at all of an "illegal" problem when it comes to crime.

SuperMario

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40257 on: November 22, 2024, 09:50:02 PM »
The only response I can have to that is that I work in the criminal justice system in Columbus, which isn't exactly a podunk town despite what Michigan fans tell you. I see the waves of crime as they occur. There was a huge wave of stolen Kias and Hyundais because someone figured out you could steal them with a phone charger. I've seen the waves of murders go up and down. Burglaries are way down. Homicides not so much. But I haven't seen much at all of an "illegal" problem when it comes to crime.
And I appreciate that perspective as it’s probably far more interactive with this issue than my day to day. That being said, why did Columbus receive a 6.6 million dollar federal grant for food and shelter for “migrants, refugees and asylum seekers” if it’s not really a big issue? 

Im asking not in a smug fashion, but in a way that I just don’t get it. Why is so much money being thrown around to this issue while the same groups that are throwing it are saying it’s not an issue. I just can’t wrap my head around it and I’m open to insight that connects dots that I’m not:

Cincydawg

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40258 on: November 23, 2024, 05:35:56 AM »
I find it very difficult to get what appears to be reliable numbers on illegal immigration.  The topic is overly politicized obviously.  Folks use whatever figures confirm their biases.  As for the "white guys" and "guns" comment above, I'm pretty sure that was trolling for entertainment.

I find sfbadger often has a PoV worth consideration.

I note whenever some immigrant commits a heinous crime, it's all over Fox News, not so much anywhere else, so it feeds as certain bias, but it's not statistical.  Some immigrants commit heinous crimes, many do not, some are in gangs, many are not, some white guys commit heinous crimes also.  

Heck, even getting widely agreed to figures on things like unemployment and inflation and GDP seems impossible these days.

MaximumSam

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40259 on: November 23, 2024, 06:53:57 AM »

Quote
That being said, why did Columbus receive a 6.6 million dollar federal grant for food and shelter for “migrants, refugees and asylum seekers” if it’s not really a big issue? 
I'm not going to pretend to know how the federal grant program on immigration works. That said, per the Columbus press release on the matter, it was related to an apartment complex they declared a nuisance and eventually closed, which displaced the people living there, who were apparently largely Haitian refugees. But these aren't illegal immigrants.


Columbus also has a large Somali population. When we took a lot of Somali refugees during their civil war, they set up in a few cities. Minneapolis was one, and Columbus was another. I imagine anytime refugees are allowed entry, there is some effort and money spent to make sure they have somewhere to go.

Cincydawg

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40260 on: November 23, 2024, 07:00:38 AM »
Getting funding for "immigrants" from the Feds is not relevant to who commits crimes.  

Imagine in a group of say a thousand immigrants, one of them murders someone and it goes "viral", but the other 999 just tried to get along in life.  The inference is they all must be shady at least, the statistics say otherwise.  I don't know what the numbers are.

bayareabadger

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40261 on: November 23, 2024, 07:19:04 AM »
And I appreciate that perspective as it’s probably far more interactive with this issue than my day to day. That being said, why did Columbus receive a 6.6 million dollar federal grant for food and shelter for “migrants, refugees and asylum seekers” if it’s not really a big issue?

Im asking not in a smug fashion, but in a way that I just don’t get it. Why is so much money being thrown around to this issue while the same groups that are throwing it are saying it’s not an issue. I just can’t wrap my head around it and I’m open to insight that connects dots that I’m not:
That number doesn't seem all that large? 

Like it would be large if it was my net worth, but Columbus is a pretty big city. If one in 45 people in the city is a migrant/refugee/asylum seeker, that's 20,000 total people, not a terribly large group. If you take that $6.6 million across even a group that size (which might be more, might be less), it's about $110 per person per year. So in the scheme of all that not a terribly large spend. 

I get three times that much in lunch subsidies because I go into the office regularly at work. 

FearlessF

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40262 on: November 23, 2024, 09:15:27 AM »
he U.S. Marine Corps has hit full operational capability for the service’s MK22 Mod 0 Advanced Sniper Rifle (ASR), the service announced this week, a feat that took place a full year ahead of schedule due to the rifle already being fielded by U.S. Special Operations Command (SOCOM) and the Army.

With every Marine reconnaissance and infantry unit, as well as military occupational specialty schools now sporting the bolt-action MK22, the service said it is providing snipers a more versatile and sustainable weapon as Marines prepare for a potential conflict with China.

The MK22 replaces the M40A6 (a derivative of the long-serving Remington 700 platform) and MK13 Mod 7 rifles, and its barrels are chambered for 7.62X51 mm, .300 Norma Magnum and .338 Norma Magnum rounds, which the service said will help Marines hit targets from farther away when needed, and with greater precision.

The MK22 also sports a caliber agnostic 7-35 variable power Precision Day Optic (PDO).

“The M317 Precision Day Optic (PDO) paired with the MK22 is a game changer,” Brian Nelson, the MK22 project officer for Marine Corps Systems Command, said in a statement announcing the rifle’s arrival in the force.

While the MK22 is heavier than its predecessors, having one gun that can swap out calibers will benefit the force as it prepares for a West Pacific war with China as part of the Force Design 2030 revamp of the service, the Marines said in 2022, when snipers began testing the new rifle. MK22’s arrival means Marines will only have to have different ammunition and extra barrels on hand in order to cover two caliber types currently fired by the M40A6 and MK13 Mod 7. This saves on logistics, with just one platform having to be supported by armorers instead of two.

The MK22 also features a 10-round detachable magazine and is viewed as a more sustainable weapon by the Marines, with less maintenance time and repairs that can be done at a lower level, eliminating the need to send the firearm to an intermediate repair location.

A so-called “condemned barrel” will no longer take the weapon out of the fight, the Marines said.
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Cincydawg

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Re: OT-Catch all thread - Personal attacks will result in a time out
« Reply #40263 on: November 23, 2024, 09:27:40 AM »
I hate the concept of any western Pacific war.

 

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