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Topic: History of #1 vs #2 from 1936-2001
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medinabuckeye1 · « **on:** July 28, 2025, 01:03:31 PM »

I cut this off at 2001 because after that the BCS more-or-less ensured that there would be a #1 vs #2 Bowl game for the NC every year (there was an exception).

In the first 26 seasons of the poll (1936-1961) there were only six games in which #1 faced #2 and Notre Dame was involved in four of them. Also note that all six were in the four seasons from 1943-1946. There were none in the first seven seasons of the poll (1936-1942) and none in the 15 seasons from 1947-1961.

The very first: #1 Notre Dame 35, #2 Michigan 12 on October 9, 1943:
This game was in Ann Arbor but that wasn't enough for the Wolverines as Notre Dame got the very first #1 vs #2 win. Notre Dame went on to win the NC despite a season-ending loss to Great Lakes Navy in part because they also won the second #1 vs #2 game . . .

Second: #1 Notre Dame 14, #2 Iowa Pre-Flight 13 on November 21, 1943:
The second and their second #1 vs #2 game was a home game for the Irish who beat Iowa Pre-Flight in South Bend.

A couple notes on the 1943 season:
It is REALLY weird that Notre Dame won the NC despite losing their final game but the two aforementioned wins as #1 over #2 explain why. In the penultimate poll of the 1943 season the Irish were #1 followed by three teams that they had already defeated:

#2 was Iowa Pre-Flight whom ND beat 14-13 in South Bend on November 20.
#3 was Michigan whom ND beat 35-12 in Ann Arbor on October 9.
#4 was Navy whom ND beat 33-6 in Cleveland on October 30.

Thus, when ND lost to unranked Great Lakes Navy on November 27 they retained the #1 spot and GL Navy simply moved up to #6, right behind 9-0 Purdue . . .

Side note: Do any of our Purdue fans ( @betarhoalphadelta , @grillrat ?) know why Purdue didn't get more attention as a possible #1 in the 1943 season? It appears to me that it was about schedule. Purdue beat Great Lakes Naval 23-13 on the road in their opener but then they missed the other two good BigTen teams (Michigan and Northwestern) so the only team that Purdue played after GL Navy that finished with a winning record was Minnesota. Still, they finished 9-0 and had a win over the team that beat Notre Dame so why did they finish #5 behind four 1-loss teams?

On to the third: #1 Army 23, #2 Navy 7 on December 2, 1944:
The WWII years are weird. In 1943 the Army's ROTC program didn't allow sports but the Navy's did so schools affiliated with the Army (tOSU) tanked while schools affiliated with the Navy did really well. Then both allowed sports in 1944. Anyway, West Point and Annapolis basically had pick-of-the-litter so it should come as no surprise that they had REALLY good football teams in 1944 and Army won the NC.

Fourth: #1 Army 48, #2 Notre Dame 0 on November 10, 1945:
This was the third time ND participated in one of these and the first time that they lost and it was a BAD loss. A few weeks later . . .

Fifth: #1 Army 32, #2 Navy 13 on December 1, 1945:
The war was over by the time this game happened but Army and Navy still had a monopoly on the talent and Army won their second consecutive NC by winning this game.

Sixth: #1 Army 0, #2 Notre Dame 0 on November 9, 1946:
Ask @Cincydawg about this game, he attended it, LoL. Notre Dame won the NC probably partly because while they blasted Navy in Baltimore, Army only barely beat Navy in Philly.

Then there were no #1 vs #2 games for 15 seasons (1947-1961).

I'll cover 1v2 games from the 1960's later.

FearlessF · « **Reply #1 on:** July 28, 2025, 01:51:11 PM »

Quote from: medinabuckeye1 on July 28, 2025, 01:03:31 PM

I cut this off at 2001 because after that the BCS more-or-less ensured that there would be a #1 vs #2 Bowl game for the NC every year (there was an exception).

fine with Husker fans

medinabuckeye1 · « **Reply #2 on:** July 28, 2025, 02:59:22 PM »

After a 15-season hiatus from 1947-1961, 1v2 games returned and we had our first 1v2 bowl game:

Seventh: #1 USC 42, #2 Wisconsin 37 on January 1, 1963 (1962 season) Rose Bowl:
This game is probably best known for Wisconsin's comeback but the comeback came up just short and USC won the NC with this win.

After waiting almost 16 years between 1v2 matchups #6 and #7, the wait for #8 was barely over 10 months:
Eighth: #1 Oklahoma 7, #2 Texas 28 on October 12, 1963:
This one was a neutral site game in Dallas (Cotton Bowl I presume). The win elevated Texas to #1 and three months later they were still there for another 1v2 game:

Ninth: #1 Texas 28, #2 Navy 6 on January 1, 1964:
Texas became the third team to play two 1v2 games in a season after ND (1943) and Army (1945). This was also the third 1v2 game in a year and the second consecutive year that the season concluded with the top two teams meeting in a Bowl game. Texas secured the NC.

Then we had two seasons without a 1v2 game before a rather famous (or infamous) scoreless tie:
Tenth: #1 Notre Dame 0, #2 Michigan State 0 on November 19, 1966:
This one is most famous for Notre Dame running out the clock. A lot of people (MSU fans most loudly) considered it cowardly but it made sense for them. They were on the road and already #1. After the tie they stayed #1 and won the NC at 9-0-1 ahead of #2 MSU who also finished 9-0-1.

#11: #1 Purdue 37, #2 Notre Dame 22 on September 28, 1968:
This one was in South Bend and visitors scored a huge win. It could be argued that this one didn't live up to the hype as ND suffered another loss (MSU) and a tie (USC) while Purdue suffered two subsequent losses (tOSU, MN). However, this one set up #4 Ohio State's win over #1 Purdue two weeks later. That win catapulted tOSU up to #2 and eventually led to . . .

#12: #1 Ohio State 27, #2 USC 16 on January 1, 1969:
Another 1v2 bowl game! #1 Ohio State secured the NC against a feisty bunch from USC including a running back named O.J. Simpson who would be infamous much later for non-football reasons.

#13: #1 Texas 15, #2 Arkansas 14 on December 6, 1969:
The last 1v2 game of the 1960s was made possible by Ohio State's upset loss at Michigan to a first-year Head Coach from Ohio named Schembechler a few weeks earlier. As the defending Champions and with the bulk of their 1968 roster returning, the Buckeyes were ranked #1 all year until that upset which allowed #2 Texas and #3 Arkansas to each move up a spot. Texas then secured the NC with a win over #5 Notre Dame in the Cotton Bowl.

In the first 34 seasons of the AP Poll (1936-1969) there were only 13 1v2 games (roughly one every third year). That pace didn't change much in the 70s with just three 1v2 games (next post).

medinabuckeye1 · « **Reply #3 on:** July 28, 2025, 03:09:04 PM »

There were no 1v2 games in the 1970 season but there were two in the 1971 season:

#14: #1 Nebraska 35, #2 Oklahoma 31 on November 25, 1971:
On Thanksgiving Day, 1971 the Cornhuskers rolled into Norman and beat the hosts. The losing Sooners nonetheless finished #2 because . . .

#15 #1 Nebraska 37, #2 Alabama 6 on January 1, 1972:
Alabama's first appearance on this list wasn't a great start. The Cornhuskers rolled to the NC with an Orange Bowl win over the Tide. Note that Nebraska thus became the fourth team to play two 1v2 games in a season.

#16 #1 Penn State 7, #2 Alabama 14 on January 1, 1979:
The last 1v2 of the 70s was Alabama's second such game and their first win. Th Tide won the 1978 NC with this Sugar Bowl win over Penn State.

In the first 44 seasons of the AP Poll (1936-1979) there were only 16 1v2 games (roughly one every third year).

utee94 · « **Reply #4 on:** July 28, 2025, 03:16:10 PM »

Quote from: medinabuckeye1 on July 28, 2025, 02:59:22 PM

After a 15-season hiatus from 1947-1961, 1v2 games returned and we had our first 1v2 bowl game:

Seventh: #1 USC 42, #2 Wisconsin 37 on January 1, 1963 (1962 season) Rose Bowl:
This game is probably best known for Wisconsin's comeback but the comeback came up just short and USC won the NC with this win.

After waiting almost 16 years between 1v2 matchups #6 and #7, the wait for #8 was barely over 10 months:
Eighth: #1 Oklahoma 7, #2 Texas 28 on October 12, 1963:
This one was a neutral site game in Dallas (Cotton Bowl I presume). The win elevated Texas to #1 and three months later they were still there for another 1v2 game:

Ninth: #1 Texas 28, #2 Navy 6 on January 1, 1964:
Texas became the third team to play two 1v2 games in a season after ND (1943) and Army (1945). This was also the third 1v2 game in a year and the second consecutive year that the season concluded with the top two teams meeting in a Bowl game. Texas secured the NC.

Then we had two seasons without a 1v2 game before a rather famous (or infamous) scoreless tie:
Tenth: #1 Notre Dame 0, #2 Michigan State 0 on November 19, 1966:
This one is most famous for Notre Dame running out the clock. A lot of people (MSU fans most loudly) considered it cowardly but it made sense for them. They were on the road and already #1. After the tie they stayed #1 and won the NC at 9-0-1 ahead of #2 MSU who also finished 9-0-1.

#11: #1 Purdue 37, #2 Notre Dame 22 on September 28, 1968:
This one was in South Bend and visitors scored a huge win. It could be argued that this one didn't live up to the hype as ND suffered another loss (MSU) and a tie (USC) while Purdue suffered two subsequent losses (tOSU, MN). However, this one set up #4 Ohio State's win over #1 Purdue two weeks later. That win catapulted tOSU up to #2 and eventually led to . . .

#12: #1 Ohio State 27, #2 USC 16 on January 1, 1969:
Another 1v2 bowl game! #1 Ohio State secured the NC against a feisty bunch from USC including a running back named O.J. Simpson who would be infamous much later for non-football reasons.

#13: #1 Texas 15, #2 Arkansas 14 on December 6, 1969:
The last 1v2 game of the 1960s was made possible by Ohio State's upset loss at Michigan to a first-year Head Coach from Ohio named Schembechler a few weeks earlier. As the defending Champions and with the bulk of their 1968 roster returning, the Buckeyes were ranked #1 all year until that upset which allowed #2 Texas and #3 Arkansas to each move up a spot. Texas then secured the NC with a win over #5 Notre Dame in the Cotton Bowl.

In the first 34 seasons of the AP Poll (1936-1969) there were only 13 1v2 games (roughly one every third year). That pace didn't change much in the 70s with just three 1v2 games (next post).

Interesting story about that game-- it was historically played in mid-October, but that year Beano Cook who was a TV exec at ABC, asked the SWC if the game could be moved to the end of the season, in case it ended up being a matchup of top teams. And sure enough, it was. Nixon was present and handed over a "national champions" plaque to Texas head coach Darrell K Royal afterwards, but of course it was the wire service polls that actually awarded the NCs in those years.

medinabuckeye1 · « **Reply #5 on:** July 28, 2025, 04:02:02 PM »

In the 1980s the frequency of 1v2 games increased significantly. Although there were none in the 1979 and 1980 seasons, there were nine in the nine seasons from 1981-1989:

#17: #1 USC 38, #2 Oklahoma 24 on September 26, 1981:
This one REALLY failed to live up to the hype. Oklahoma came in 1-0 and #2 but lost in the Coliseum then tied ISU at home the next week and got drilled by Texas a week after that. Later in the season they lost at Mizzou and got drilled at home by Nebraska such that they ultimately finished 7-4-1 and barely ranked at #20. USC also lost three games after this match-up. They lost at home to lowly Arizona in early October then last at Washington in mid-November then lost their Bowl game to Penn State in January and finished 9-3 and #14.

#18: #1 Georgia 23, #2 Penn State 27 on January 1, 1983:
Penn State won Paterno's first NC with this Sugar Bowl win.

#19: #1 Iowa 12, #2 Michigan 10 on October 19, 1985:
This game is most known to me because it set up one of the famous games of Ohio State lore. Iowa's win kept them at #1 up until they lost to #8 Ohio State in Columbus on November 2, 1985. That said, this game had a major impact on the NC but not for Iowa. Iowa subsequently lost to Ohio State in Columbus and to UCLA in the Rose Bowl but the Wolverines tied Illinois in Urbana and otherwise won out to finish 10-1-1 including a Fiesta Bowl win over Nebraska. Oklahoma won the NC at 11-1 (lost at home to Miami) while Michigan finished #2 at 10-1-1. Had Michigan won in Iowa City in mid-October they'd have probably won the NC.

#20: #1 Oklahoma 16, #2 Miami 28 on September 27, 1986:
Neither team won the NC in 1986 but this game did set up . . .

#21: #1 Miami 10, #2 Penn State 14 on January 2, 1987:
This is a pretty famous bowl game and note that Miami thus played two 1v2 games in the 1986 season going 1-1 with the #2 team getting both wins.

#22: #1 Nebraska 7, #2 Oklahoma 17 on November 21, 1987:
Somewhat like the 2006 tOSU/M game, a lot of the luster was taken off of this by the fact that BOTH teams lost their bowl games so in the final poll OU was #3 and UNL was #6. One of those bowl games was . . .

#23 #1 Oklahoma 16, #2 Miami 20 on January 1, 1988:
Both teams came in undefeated and untied and Miami won the NC with this Orange Bowl win.

#24 #1 Notre Dame 27, #2 USC 10 on November 26, 1988:
En-route to their most recent NC, the Irish won this 1v2 game in the Coliseum.

#25: #1 Notre Dame 24, #2 Michigan 19 on September 16, 1989:
The final 1v2 of the 1980s was another one where the luster was diminished somewhat by what happened later, albeit it wasn't until a lot later. This was the second of what would eventually be 11 straight wins to open the 1989 season for the Irish. Additionally, Notre Dame had won the 1988 title at 12-0 so overall this was their 14th consecutive win in a streak that would ultimately grow to 23 but they lost on the road to Miami at the end of the 1989 regular season. For their part, the Wolverines bounced back from this home loss to win 10 straight before losing the Rose Bowl. In the final poll Notre Dame was #2 and Michigan was #7.

Interesting note about 1989:
Florida State had a weird year. They started with a neutral site loss to a bad USM team then lost at home to a good but not great Clemson team thus starting 0-2 and dropping completely out of the poll. Then the ran of 10 straight wins including beating a solid Auburn team, beating the eventual NC Hurricanes by two TD's, beating the Gators in the Swamp, and slaughtering Nebraska in the Fiesta Bowl. They were probably the best team in the country at the end of the season but how on earth did they lose to USM and at home to Clemson?

medinabuckeye1 · « **Reply #6 on:** July 28, 2025, 04:29:45 PM »

After the 25th 1v2 in September of 1989 there were no more for the rest of the 1989 season and none in the 1990 season so it wasn't until late in 1991 that we got . . .

#26: #1 Florida State 16, #2 Miami 17 on November 16, 1991:
I believe that this was one of Bowden's multitude of losses on a missed FG to Miami. The Hurricanes went on to win the NC while FSU lost in the Swamp two weeks later and finished 11-2 and #4.

#27: #1 Miami 13, #2 Alabama 34 on January 1, 1993:
Alabama won the NC with this Sugar Bowl win.

#28: #1 Florida State 24, #2 Notre Dame 31 on November 13, 1993:
This game was the first time that ESPN sent their Gameday program out on location despite the game itself being on rival network NBC. Notre Dame lost a week later at home to Boston College while Florida State went on to win the NC in spite of the loss by winning out including a win over #7 Florida in the Swamp and a 1v2 bowl win . . .

#29: #1 Florida State 18, #2 Nebraska 16 on January 1, 1994:
This Orange Bowl win secured the NC for the Seminoles.

Note that there was no 1v2 bowl in the 1994 season because #2 Penn State was in the Rose Bowl so instead the BCA put #1 Nebraska against #3 Miami in the Orange Bowl.

#30: #1 Nebraska 62, #2 Florida 24 on January 2, 1996:
Nebraska's second of three titles in four years was secured with this Fiesta Bowl win.

#31: #1 Florida 21, #2 Florida State 24 on November 31, 1996:
@OrangeAfroMan asked earlier about why this game doesn't get more mention in "GOTC" and I'll come back to that. The Seminoles won this one then lost badly to Florida in their next game in the Sugar Bowl. There again was no 1v2 because #2 ASU was in the Rose Bowl. Florida ultimately won the NC because they won the second game and because Ohio State cleared the deck for them by winning the Rose Bowl.

There was no 1v2 bowl in the 1997 season because #1 Michigan was in the RoseBowl so instead the BCA put #2 Nebraska against #3 Tennessee.

#32: #1 Tennessee 23, #2 Florida State 16 on January 4, 1999:
This was the first of the BCS Championship Games.

#33: #1 Florida State 46, #2 VaTech 29 on January 4, 2000:
The second of the BCSNCGs.

847badgerfan · « **Reply #7 on:** July 28, 2025, 04:48:38 PM »

Good stuff MB!

FearlessF · « **Reply #8 on:** July 28, 2025, 04:59:52 PM »

Quote from: medinabuckeye1 on July 28, 2025, 04:02:02 PM

#19: #1 Iowa 12, #2 Michigan 10 on October 19, 1985:
This game is most known to me because it set up one of the famous games of Ohio State lore. Iowa's win kept them at #1 up until they lost to #8 Ohio State in Columbus on November 2, 1985. That said, this game had a major impact on the NC but not for Iowa. Iowa subsequently lost to Ohio State in Columbus and to UCLA in the Rose Bowl but the Wolverines tied Illinois in Urbana and otherwise won out to finish 10-1-1 including a Fiesta Bowl win over Nebraska. Oklahoma won the NC at 11-1 (lost at home to Miami) while Michigan finished #2 at 10-1-1. Had Michigan won in Iowa City in mid-October they'd have probably won the NC.

#22: #1 Nebraska 7, #2 Oklahoma 17 on November 21, 1987:
Somewhat like the 2006 tOSU/M game, a lot of the luster was taken off of this by the fact that BOTH teams lost their bowl games so in the final poll OU was #3 and UNL was #6. One of those bowl games was . . .

#29: #1 Florida State 18, #2 Nebraska 16 on January 1, 1994:
This Orange Bowl win secured the NC for the Seminoles.

#30: #1 Nebraska 62, #2 Florida 24 on January 2, 1996:
Nebraska's second of three titles in four years was secured with this Fiesta Bowl win.

I was in attendance at 4 of them

medinabuckeye1 · « **Reply #9 on:** July 28, 2025, 05:09:33 PM »

Quote from: medinabuckeye1 on July 28, 2025, 04:29:45 PM

#31: #1 Florida 21, #2 Florida State 24 on November 31, 1996:
@OrangeAfroMan asked earlier about why this game doesn't get more mention in "GOTC" and I'll come back to that. The Seminoles won this one then lost badly to Florida in their next game in the Sugar Bowl. There again was no 1v2 because #2 ASU was in the Rose Bowl. Florida ultimately won the NC because they won the second game and because Ohio State cleared the deck for them by winning the Rose Bowl.

Thinking about this question was part of the reason that I did this post. I think there are three big reasons, prospective, retrospective, and frequency.

Looking prospectively, the 1996 regular season UF/FSU game was only #1 vs #2 for five days. Florida State didn't ascend to #2 until after Ohio State got upset by Michigan and back in 1996 the poll still didn't come out until Monday so this particular UF/FSU game was only #1 vs #2 for the week leading up to the game. The immediately previous #1 vs #2 was hyped as #1 vs #2 for a month. Some of the other regular season games were that way as well. In 2006 the Wolverines ascended to #2 in the October 15 poll after Florida lost to Auburn. Thus, the 2006 iteration of The Game was anticipated as #1 vs #2 for more than a month.

The second, and I think more important reason is the retrospective: Florida ended up winning the 1996 NC but note that they actually LOST this game. Thus, this game didn't really set up their win and if you reversed the outcome and made Florida the winner of the regular season game I don't think that it changes anything. In the pre-bowl poll:

11-0 FSU
11-0 ASU
11-1 UF
10-1 tOSU
13-1 BYU

If Florida wins in Tallahassee then I'm guessing it would have been:

12-0 UF
11-0 ASU
10-1 FSU
10-1 tOSU
13-1 BYU

Maybe Ohio State would have been ahead of FSU but that would only matter if FSU and tOSU won the Sugar and Rose Bowls respectively. In retrospect I think that the 1996 "GOTC" between UF and FSU made no difference. It was obviously HUGE at the time because we didn't KNOW that it would work out that way. At the time Nebraska was still hanging around at 10-1 with an early season loss to ASU and had they defeated Texas in the B12CG they would have been put up against the UF/FSU winner. When you watched the 1996 UF/FSU game you probably thought that UF's NC hopes were finished. It seemed to matter a LOT at the time and it would have if things had worked out differently but in retrospect, it really didn't matter.

The final big reason, I think, is the frequency of these games. As I outlined above there was a 15 season stretch from 1947 through 1961 when there were no 1v2 games. There were only three such games in the entire decade of the 1970s. It was HUGE back then in part because it was rare. By 1996 the BCA had been established in an effort to make it happen in the bowls EVERY year. The Gators had just played a 1v2 game less than a year earlier and the earlier one was clearly more consequential because it was the last game of the season, for the NC. Two years before that FSU had played in one that was for the NC. By 1996 these simply weren't all that rare.

medinabuckeye1 · « **Reply #10 on:** July 28, 2025, 05:13:16 PM »

Quote from: FearlessF on July 28, 2025, 04:59:52 PM

I was in attendance at 4 of them

I've also been to four:

#2 Ohio State over #1 Miami 31-24 in 2OT in the Fiesta Bowl on January 3, 2003.
#1 Ohio State over #2 Michigan 42-39 on November 18, 2006.
#2 Florida over #1 Ohio State 41-14 on January 8, 2007.
#2 LSU over #1 Ohio State 38-24 on January 7, 2008.

FearlessF · « **Reply #11 on:** July 28, 2025, 05:32:30 PM »

we've been blessed

OrangeAfroMan · « **Reply #12 on:** July 28, 2025, 09:22:00 PM »

Good stuff!

The WWII teams were "weird" for several reasons beyond the Army thing.
First off, they were like college football all-star teams, fielding players who excelled at schools all across the country.
Secondly, they were allowed to have young pro players as well.
Third, those great players were on and off the roster, as they might be deployed at any time.
For example, Iowa Pre-Flight's depth chart and roster as a whole looked very different from one game to the next.

MarqHusker · « **Reply #13 on:** **Today** at 12:14:21 AM »

Ive been to 3 and my Dad can be seen working the Nixon detail in some of the footage of the Ark at Texas game.

Spoiled indeed.

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Topic: History of #1 vs #2 from 1936-2001

medinabuckeye1

History of #1 vs #2 from 1936-2001

FearlessF

Re: History of #1 vs #2 from 1936-2001

medinabuckeye1

Re: History of #1 vs #2 from 1936-2001

medinabuckeye1

Re: History of #1 vs #2 from 1936-2001

utee94

Re: History of #1 vs #2 from 1936-2001

medinabuckeye1

Re: History of #1 vs #2 from 1936-2001

medinabuckeye1

Re: History of #1 vs #2 from 1936-2001

847badgerfan

Re: History of #1 vs #2 from 1936-2001

FearlessF

Re: History of #1 vs #2 from 1936-2001

medinabuckeye1

Re: History of #1 vs #2 from 1936-2001

medinabuckeye1

Re: History of #1 vs #2 from 1936-2001

FearlessF

Re: History of #1 vs #2 from 1936-2001

OrangeAfroMan

Re: History of #1 vs #2 from 1936-2001

MarqHusker

Re: History of #1 vs #2 from 1936-2001