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Topic: Helmet Team Ranking Exercise

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Geolion91

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Re: Helmet Team Ranking Exercise
« Reply #210 on: July 31, 2017, 10:55:28 AM »
Georgia
Clemson
Auburn

rolltidefan

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Re: Helmet Team Ranking Exercise
« Reply #211 on: July 31, 2017, 12:42:36 PM »
uga
au
clemson

uga and au are so close, and clemson isn't far behind either. this is a good group.

Cincydawg

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Re: Helmet Team Ranking Exercise
« Reply #212 on: July 31, 2017, 12:46:32 PM »
Once again, many rank them in order of all time wins:  791  744  709.


I think that is all we are doing here with some minor changes.

utee94

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Re: Helmet Team Ranking Exercise
« Reply #213 on: July 31, 2017, 03:37:15 PM »
This one still open?


Georgia
Auburn
Clemson


OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Helmet Team Ranking Exercise
« Reply #214 on: July 31, 2017, 04:00:51 PM »
Once again, many rank them in order of all time wins:  791  744  709.


I think that is all we are doing here with some minor changes.

Counting the deceased board, I think you've posted this about 17 times on this thread.  We get it, thanks.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

Brutus Buckeye

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Re: Helmet Team Ranking Exercise
« Reply #215 on: July 31, 2017, 04:11:08 PM »
You're not just gonna sit there and take that, are ya CincyDawg?


Georgia
Auburn
Clemson
1919, 20, 21, 28, 29, 31, 34, 35, 36, 37, 42, 44
WWH: 1952, 54, 55, 57, 58, 60, 61, 62, 63, 65, 67, 68, 70, 72, 74, 75
1979, 81, 82, 84, 87, 94, 98
2001, 02, 04, 05, 06, 07, 08, 09, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17

FearlessF

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Re: Helmet Team Ranking Exercise
« Reply #216 on: July 31, 2017, 04:37:40 PM »
well, if one program has 699 wins and another program has 799 wins, it could be expected that the program with more wins would have more stature


it gets interesting when the win totals are closer or if a program like Florida St. got a later start and therefore many fewer wins
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ELA

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Re: Helmet Team Ranking Exercise
« Reply #217 on: July 31, 2017, 05:43:43 PM »
sorry, Bill


got used to calling him B.OB
Fans forgetting your coach's name = not helmet

ELA

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Re: Helmet Team Ranking Exercise
« Reply #218 on: July 31, 2017, 05:53:27 PM »
well, if one program has 699 wins and another program has 799 wins, it could be expected that the program with more wins would have more stature


it gets interesting when the win totals are closer or if a program like Florida St. got a later start and therefore many fewer wins
I think once you get past those first 7-10, it's not "helmet" anymore.

Ranking the helmet status of non-helmet schools is misleading.

I think beyond those top 7-10 we are simply ranking our perception of the programs, which is why it will largely mirror those lists.  Those 7-10 at the top are a little difference because we are measuring how their status is in the absence of results, to measure strength.

When the group is UM, Texas, Oklahoma, we are measuring "helmet."

When the group is MSU, Texas A&M, Oklahoma State, we are measuring program perception.

I think there is a difference.

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Helmet Team Ranking Exercise
« Reply #219 on: August 01, 2017, 12:52:30 AM »
We will determine the cutoff for helmet status, but not until we have an ordered list.  Let's not skip to the last step...
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

ELA

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Re: Helmet Team Ranking Exercise
« Reply #220 on: August 01, 2017, 09:30:51 AM »
We will determine the cutoff for helmet status, but not until we have an ordered list.  Let's not skip to the last step...
Right, I'm just saying, I think we are measuring different things at the top than for the rest of the list.

I think there are certain determiners of helmet status, and only helmet (maybe the borderline ones) have it, so beyond that all schools are equal in terms of helmetness, so we are ranking something different in these other groups.

Drew4UTk

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Re: Helmet Team Ranking Exercise
« Reply #221 on: August 01, 2017, 11:50:30 AM »







I needed help with these, as perception (and what we're using?) was so very close... But, the metric I went with is all time bowl win percentage.  These aren't really that close.  I kinda blew it wide open.

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Helmet Team Ranking Exercise
« Reply #222 on: August 01, 2017, 12:37:34 PM »
Prettyyyyy
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

Cincydawg

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Re: Helmet Team Ranking Exercise
« Reply #223 on: August 01, 2017, 12:58:54 PM »
My key notion of "helmetosity" is how readily pollsters rank a team higher than it otherwise would be.  This doesn't have some magical cut off in my opinion, but shades of gray.  When a program like Boise State has some success, folks find it a lot easier to rank them 3-4-5 spots higher than otherwise, if not more.


I don't think pollsters put much thought into rankings, especially once they get below about 10.  They read a little bit and see that Team X has Y starters returning off an 8-5 squad last year and figure they will be around 12th, or 14th, or 18th, who really cares?  It's not as if there is accountability for anything.


So they get to 20-25 and are throwing darts, but they are going to find it easier to rank a "Georgia" 20th than they are a Kansas State 20th just because of the helmet.


I doubt they bother to think much about an Alabama or an Ohio State other than a very cursory "Who's back?" glance, and then they go top five every year.  Until their helmet loses luster.  Then they start out 12th.  Until the luster really tarnishes.




 

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