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Topic: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost

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betarhoalphadelta

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #476 on: November 24, 2020, 01:41:23 PM »
I imagine a good OC with a great QB makes for a lethal combo, as a competent OC can mix in plays that compensate for more average WRs, and a very good TE is a duh help.  I suppose if the OL is porous if can render a great QB somewhat impotent.

I heard the term "Cover Zero" from the Dawg QB, I had not heard that before, I understand the meaning, I'm not sure why the term had escaped me, maybe they just call it man to man otherwise?  He was commenting that Miss State was in Cover Zero fairly often and that is why he went up top (duh).
To go back to this, cover zero simply means no deep support. No players are tasked with either deep zone responsibilities or deep support for the corners in M2M coverage.

However it wouldn't be clear to also just call it "man to man", because in multiple defensive looks where you have deep support you're also in man to man on all the underneath receivers. 

If you're playing "Cover 2 Man" you have 4 pass rushers, 5 underneath pass defenders each with man responsibility, and the two deep safeties to offer deep pass defense support to any defenders that reach that level, each with one side of the responsibility. But because it's man coverage, any underneath defender is expected to run the deep route with their man. 

Whereas if you're playing "Cover 2 Zone", your 5 underneath pass defenders are going to have purely a shallower zone responsibility. They pass any vertical receivers to the safeties, rather than follow them. 

I'm not sure you see a lot of cover 2 zone these days against modern pass offenses. It has an issue that you're vulnerable in the middle of the field, and thus if your two outside receivers are running fly routes while your slot or TE is running seam, you've got a big hole open. So you'll often see the "Tampa 2" where you show cover 2 and then send a third cover defender (perhaps a speedy LB or nickel defender) to the middle of the field while the safeties take the sides, or you just play a Cover 3. 

Problem being if you show Cover 3 you're alerting the QB that you're probably in a zone, whereas if you show Cover 2 it can go either way. Hence the Tampa 2 which is a 3-deep zone but at the snap shows as Cover 2. 

And of course, if the defense is showing cover zero you know they're in M2M, so if you trust your receivers in one on one matchups you take a lot more deep shots.

MrNubbz

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #477 on: November 24, 2020, 01:44:08 PM »
Thank You Bwarb - you get a Yuengling
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FearlessF

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #478 on: November 24, 2020, 01:58:35 PM »
could someone please explain this to Harbaugh and Brett Farve?
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

MrNubbz

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #479 on: November 24, 2020, 02:03:34 PM »
What's Favre got do with anything?
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FearlessF

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #480 on: November 24, 2020, 02:04:50 PM »
hah, he's admitted that he played a year or two in the NFL w/o knowing what a "nickel" or "dime" defense meant.
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

MrNubbz

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #481 on: November 24, 2020, 02:07:48 PM »
Knew what a nickel/dime bag was prolly - nothing wrong with that though
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Cincydawg

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #482 on: November 24, 2020, 03:24:17 PM »
I understand Cover Zero as explained, I just don't see how you can play Cover Zero Zone.

If your safeties are "in the box", the could play zone close to the line once the QB fades back to pass.  They aren't going to be able to help cover a streaking WR.  The could pick up a RB on a wheel route or a TE of course, but then they'd be playing man.

It's pretty neat how the game has evolved and defenses with it.  The old notion that D wins championships is pretty much out the window now, no?

I had to listen over the radio, but the Miss State offense seemed to be tough to defend, a lot of quick short passes, at least UGA wasn't defending it well.  Maybe you need to jump some of those routes.

Or play Cover Zero Zone.


Temp430

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #483 on: November 24, 2020, 03:30:48 PM »
Cover Zero sounds like a name for a strip club.
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FearlessF

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #484 on: November 24, 2020, 03:32:26 PM »
well, I think it's still true, that if your opponent doesn't score, you can't lose

but, really in this age, there just aren't many shutouts or games that end w/o 40 points total.

with the rules favoring offense, it seems defenses are at a decided disadvantage from the past.
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

Cincydawg

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #485 on: November 24, 2020, 03:32:40 PM »
Cover Zero sound like a name for a strip club.
Heh.  One near us had a sign up that said "Temporarily Clothed".

There is a section north of us about 2 miles that has a whole string of rather seedy looking strip clubs.  

FearlessF

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #486 on: November 24, 2020, 03:34:16 PM »
gee, that's stumbling distance
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Cincydawg

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #487 on: November 24, 2020, 03:39:52 PM »
Not really my thing.  Duh.  That area is transitioning/gentrifying, so it's a weird mix right now of new apt buildings and some cool restaurants and strip clubs and a liquor store (that I use).  The Sweetwater Brewery is up near there and that's a super nice spot to go when weather is nice.  There is a huge Kroger that has a bar inside the grocery store.  We don't go to that one.

FearlessF

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #488 on: November 24, 2020, 03:42:25 PM »
oh, that wasn't a suggestion

just an observation 
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: #FireHarbaugh - #FireFrost
« Reply #489 on: November 24, 2020, 03:59:03 PM »
Cover Zero sounds like a name for a strip club.
I'm guessing it wouldn't apply to the cover charge.

 

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