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Topic: Chris Holtmann

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CatsbyAZ

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Re: Chris Holtmann
« Reply #252 on: February 15, 2024, 06:39:18 AM »
Wasn't Holtmann starting to skip postgame pressers? Try firing him for cause, let that attempt ultimately fail, but point made. You know the phrase "don't let the door hit you on the way out?" In this case make it nasty - absolutely let the door hit Holtmann on the way out.

MaximumSam

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Re: Chris Holtmann
« Reply #253 on: February 15, 2024, 06:50:46 AM »
Wasn't Holtmann starting to skip postgame pressers? Try firing him for cause, let that attempt ultimately fail, but point made. You know the phrase "don't let the door hit you on the way out?" In this case make it nasty - absolutely let the door hit Holtmann on the way out.
LOL that seems harsh

Brutus Buckeye

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Re: Chris Holtmann
« Reply #254 on: February 15, 2024, 08:49:01 AM »
Urban was notorious for being hella late to his midweek media obligations, and Paul Keels would be stuck there flapping his gums without him for the first 15 minutes. 

Sounds like the Holtmann was just skipping them altogether. 
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MaximumSam

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Re: Chris Holtmann
« Reply #255 on: February 15, 2024, 08:53:57 AM »
Urban was notorious for being hella late to his midweek media obligations, and Paul Keels would be stuck there flapping his gums without him for the first 15 minutes.

Sounds like the Holtmann was just skipping them altogether.
I'm not aware of him skipping anything. OSU (great historical basketball program) didn't have many media at road games at times he would just speak to them in the hallway.

medinabuckeye1

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Re: Chris Holtmann
« Reply #256 on: February 15, 2024, 09:23:15 AM »
Wasn't Holtmann starting to skip postgame pressers? Try firing him for cause, let that attempt ultimately fail, but point made. You know the phrase "don't let the door hit you on the way out?" In this case make it nasty - absolutely let the door hit Holtmann on the way out.
LOL that seems harsh
I completely agree with @MaximumSam here.  I've wanted to get rid of Holtmann for insufficient on-court performance for literally years but by all accounts he is a good guy, hasn't had off-court scandals, etc.  This isn't a case of hating Holtmann.  It is simply a case of his teams not winning enough games so he had to go.  

I watched Titus' podcast last night and he expressed that he REALLY liked Holtmann as an individual but his on-court performance had become indefensible (Max would have eventually gotten there, I think).  Titus said that wherever Holtmann lands, Titus will root for that program.  Unlike Titus, I don't know him personally so I'm not that far in, but I have nothing against the guy personally, he just wasn't the right coach for Ohio State.  

The only guy in this whole saga that I'm actually mad at is Gene Smith.  I quoted Smith from his press conference where he answered a question about what the standard is for Ohio State Basketball by saying:
"...Be in the hunt, periodically win the Championship, and go deep into the postseason and that hasn't changed.  That hasn't been accomplished and we need to do better. . . ."  

That statement got my ire up a little bit because by that Standard from Gene Smith's own words, Holtmann was a failure two years ago so why did Smith give him a raise and an extension that saddled Ohio State with this $14M buyout?  

I thought he should have been let go after the 2022 season.  Here were his seasons to that point (chronologically):
  • 2018:  25-9/15-3, tied for 2nd/3rd in B1G, one game out of B1G Title, #5 seed in NCAA, 1-1.  
  • 2019:  20-15/8-12, tied for 8th/9th in B1G, 8 games out of B1G Title, #11 seed in NCAA, 1-1.  
  • 2020:  21-10/11-9, tied for 5th/6th/7th/8th in B1G, 3 games out of B1G Title, no NCAA
  • 2021:  21-10/12-8, 5th in B1G, 3.5 games out of B1G Title, #2 seed in NCAA, 0-1.  
  • 2022:  20-12/12-8, tied for 4th/5th/6th in B1G, 3 games out of B1G Title, #7 seed in NCAA, 1-1.  

That clearly fails by Smith's own standard (which is almost exactly how I view it).  He was only "in the hunt" once and that was in year #1 with Matta's guys.  He hadn't won a title and he hadn't gotten out of the first weekend of the NCAA.  I can totally understand not firing him because those results aren't bad, they just aren't good enough but if you choose to give him more time, you do so with the existing contract or extend him (may be necessary for recruiting purposes) but you extend him with NO raise and NO increase in buyout.  Then if he excels in 2022/23 and 2023/24 you think about a raise.  If he doesn't, you are able to jettison him more cheaply.  

As a fan, I felt that the extension in 2022 was a slap in the face.  I saw it as the Athletic Director telling the fans that he didn't care about BB and that the standard was something MUCH less that what Smith (correctly IMHO) stated yesterday.  If we are giving a guy a raise and an extension for Holtmann's first five years then the standard is "Don't be awful, make the tournament".  The standard, is, was, and always should have been "Be in the hunt, periodically win the Championship, and go deep in the postseason" as Smith stated yesterday so the mistake here was Smith's back in 2022.  

MrNubbz

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Re: Chris Holtmann
« Reply #257 on: February 15, 2024, 11:27:41 AM »
LOL that seems harsh
According to eleven warriors he was blindsided by the firing :043:.The guy must be mushroom - kept in the dark and fed shit.12 million $$$ buyout for that stellar supervision
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medinabuckeye1

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Re: Chris Holtmann
« Reply #258 on: February 15, 2024, 02:19:03 PM »
According to eleven warriors he was blindsided by the firing :043:.The guy must be mushroom - kept in the dark and fed shit.12 million $$$ buyout for that stellar supervision
I'm not disagreeing with you because you are right, 11Warriors has an article with that headline and to that effect. 

That said, I flat don't believe it. I don't think anyone could possibly be that tone deaf. How could you possibly be pulling down literally millions per year with Holtmann's results over the last seven years (particularly the last two) and not be at least somewhat aware that your job status is insecure?

MaximumSam

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Re: Chris Holtmann
« Reply #259 on: February 15, 2024, 04:27:17 PM »
I took that article to mean the timing, not the actual firing itself. As in he didn't get to talk to the team. I think that is low class, but I also don't think that is Mean Gene's way, so not sure what to think about the accuracy of it.

medinabuckeye1

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Re: Chris Holtmann
« Reply #260 on: February 15, 2024, 04:48:54 PM »
https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/game/_/gameId/401597185/south-carolina-auburn

What are the chances that Paris was distracted by other items.

SuperMario

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Re: Chris Holtmann
« Reply #261 on: February 15, 2024, 06:06:08 PM »
I'm not disagreeing with you because you are right, 11Warriors has an article with that headline and to that effect.

That said, I flat don't believe it.
I’ve been telling you for years never to believe anything on 11 Warriors 😇

bayareabadger

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Re: Chris Holtmann
« Reply #262 on: February 15, 2024, 09:46:09 PM »
https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/game/_/gameId/401597185/south-carolina-auburn

What are the chances that Paris was distracted by other items.
Not all that high.

Auburn can run it up on some teams. 

ELA

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Re: Chris Holtmann
« Reply #263 on: February 15, 2024, 11:36:41 PM »
The predictive metrics love Auburn

medinabuckeye1

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Re: Chris Holtmann
« Reply #264 on: February 16, 2024, 12:32:22 PM »
https://www.sportingnews.com/us/ncaa-basketball/news/chris-holtmann-ohio-state-firing-one-and-done-players/7e43bdd82373fcef3f6d6133

You may like this @MaximumSam .

The article mostly talks about Branham and Sensabaugh.

By Gene Smith's words, the standard at Ohio State is to "be in the hunt, win the Championship periodically, and go deep in the postseason."

By that standard Branham and Sensabaugh never contributed anything of note to the program. I don't mean that as a criticism if those kids, they came to Ohio State and played very well. From the perspective of the program, they didn't get us where we need to be because they weren't good enough to overcome the rest of the team's mediocrity but at the same time too good to stick around for the rest of the team to grow around them.

ELA

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Re: Chris Holtmann
« Reply #265 on: February 16, 2024, 12:35:59 PM »
I'd keep an eye on Bucky McMillan at Samford for a number of Power 5 jobs.  SoCon to OSU might be too big of a jump though.  I'd keep an eye on him for like a Washington, Oklahoma State or Vanderbilt

 

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