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Topic: Breaking up Bama: How to save college football?

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OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Breaking up Bama: How to save college football?
« Reply #210 on: January 22, 2021, 10:33:10 AM »
Watch that Seattle kid not be much of a player....
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

MrNubbz

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Re: Breaking up Bama: How to save college football?
« Reply #211 on: January 22, 2021, 10:35:20 AM »
since Bama has the most sunday bound talent, let's stretch the season
Nobody wants a resurgence of the Husker Prick Squad
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FearlessF

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Re: Breaking up Bama: How to save college football?
« Reply #212 on: January 22, 2021, 10:59:50 AM »
I wouldn't say, Nobody"

that might not be accurate
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betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Breaking up Bama: How to save college football?
« Reply #213 on: January 22, 2021, 11:21:14 AM »
It's not even about serial killers, but about people whose minds are beyond what our society is built to include.  Most 160+ IQ people, I assume, are weird and quiet and nice enough.  But I'm sure they struggle with making many (any?) real (normal?) relationships with other people.  And many go crazy or something like crazy-adjacent.  Look at how many philosophers went nuts. 

The human animal is both incredibly limited and endlessly boastful.  It's a helluva combination, and to people to be waist-deep in that kind of society, who sees obvious (to them) ways to make everything better, but not have a voice...yeah, that's going to bother you.  Might not gonna value each human life as much as you should.  Might not care too much about repercussions if you're already going crazy in isolation in your own house - prison or death might not seem like such major deterrents. 
.
But I'm probably wrong.
You claimed that 160+ IQ is a detriment, and that's why there are so many serial killers and people who collect their own toenail clippings at that IQ. 

I asked for evidence. You've given me your own conjecture.

Given that a 160+ IQ is 4 standard deviations above the mean, it should be prevalent in about 1 in 30,000 people, or about 11,000 people overall in the US with an IQ at that level. If it turned them into serial killers, wouldn't we have a lot more serial killers?

Of course then you'd think that it would be impossible for them to relate to anyone, since they're so rare.

But being a 160 doesn't necessarily mean you ONLY can relate to another 160. If you assume you can make meaningful and strong relationships with people up to one standard deviation above or below yourself*, finding people of IQ 145 opens you up to about 1 in 750 people, or 440,000 people in the US with that level of intelligence. 

But I'd postulate that the modern world actually helps to correct for that. People of high IQ cluster. They find their way into academia and think tanks. They find their way into places like Silicon Valley, or NYC, or DC, where they can find other people of high IQ. 

Maybe in 1800, having such a high IQ might not have ever given you an outlet to express it, or other people similar to yourself, and I can imagine that would be very lonely. But this isn't 1800, and it's a lot easier to find other people of high IQ to cluster with. Once you have a few, then the pressures of the world being built for the center of the bell curve rather than the long tails is a lot easier to deal with.

Again, I see it in my own office. In a company with hundreds and hundreds (heck, with our acquisitions we could be over a thousand) PhDs, and many ultra-smart people w/o PhDs, I see the folks who are at the upper end of the distribution even within our own company tend to cluster and hang out with each other. Because they have found people close enough in intelligence and interests to relate to.

Either way... You made the statement. Do you have any actual evidence that extreme high IQ is correlated with sociopathic behaviors such as being a serial killer? I'm sure we could come up with anecdotes (Ted Kaczynski, for example), but we could also come up with killers who were just crazy and not extreme IQ (the DC Sniper). 

 * I don't have empirical evidence for a one-standard-deviation difference being a guide for being able to meaningfully relate to someone. However, in my own experience that tends to be about the range I've found personally. Someone beyond that on the low range, I find they can't keep up with a conversation and can't add any meaningful insight... Even worse, there's often a Dunning-Kruger effect where they can't shut up and keep saying things they THINK are meaningful or interesting, and they're not. Beyond the upper end of the range, I just ask questions and shut up and listen and hope I learn something. I've had that situation where I have something to add and you get that stare in which you realize they've already thought of that, debunked it, and why am I wasting their time?

Cincydawg

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Re: Breaking up Bama: How to save college football?
« Reply #214 on: January 22, 2021, 12:41:03 PM »

Given that a 160+ IQ is 4 standard deviations above the mean, it should be prevalent in about 1 in 30,000 people, or about 11,000 people overall in the US with an IQ at that level. If it turned them into serial killers, wouldn't we have a lot more serial killers?
They are REALLY good at it.

Cincydawg

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Re: Breaking up Bama: How to save college football?
« Reply #215 on: January 22, 2021, 12:48:27 PM »
Paul Dirac: The man who conjured laws of nature from pure thought | Science | The Guardian

Einstein described him as “balancing on the dizzying path between genius and madness.”


MrNubbz

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Re: Breaking up Bama: How to save college football?
« Reply #216 on: January 22, 2021, 01:04:28 PM »
Might not care too much about repercussions if you're already going crazy in isolation in your own house - prison or death might not seem like such major deterrents. 

I know the older I get a life sentence doesn't mean what it use to.There could be a pivot point coming up in the next few years
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OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Breaking up Bama: How to save college football?
« Reply #217 on: January 22, 2021, 01:43:34 PM »
You claimed that 160+ IQ is a detriment, and that's why there are so many serial killers and people who collect their own toenail clippings at that IQ.
See, you make a leap here. 
Never did I say it's WHY THERE ARE SO MANY SERIAL KILLERS. 
So the rest of your sassiness is moot. 
Please don't make leaps.


Here, I'll bet you a dollar that there are more serial killers per person over a 160 IQ than there are from 90-100.  How's that?  No, don't have the stats, can't get the stats, probably aren't any stats.  
« Last Edit: January 22, 2021, 01:56:04 PM by OrangeAfroMan »
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

FearlessF

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Re: Breaking up Bama: How to save college football?
« Reply #218 on: January 22, 2021, 01:46:24 PM »
I don't leap much a tall anymore
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

betarhoalphadelta

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Re: Breaking up Bama: How to save college football?
« Reply #219 on: January 22, 2021, 02:01:15 PM »
Then you have those at 160+, where it's more of a detriment than a blessing.  Serial killers, people who collect their nail clippings, etc.
See, you make a leap here. 
Never did I say it's WHY THERE ARE SO MANY SERIAL KILLERS. 
So the rest of your sassiness is moot. 
Please don't make leaps.
Okay. You just used being a serial killer as one outcome of high intelligence being a detriment. I assume you understand the concept of "loaded language" and why we might focus on that. 

But I'll step away from focusing purely on serial killers.

Do you have any evidence for correlation between extreme high intelligence being a detriment rather than a blessing? 

Does it result in lower lifetime earnings relative to the 130 or 100 IQ cohort? Does it result in lower ratings of happiness or satisfaction in life relative to the 130 or 100 IQ cohort? Does it result in higher levels of criminality, sociopathic behavior, or mental health diagnoses relative to the 130 or 100 IQ cohort? Do you have any studies showing any of this? 

Or did you just make it up?

OrangeAfroMan

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Re: Breaking up Bama: How to save college football?
« Reply #220 on: January 23, 2021, 02:22:33 AM »
Let's call it a proposal.  

Since happiness plateaus at income of $80,000/yr, I doubt any average wealth gains 160 IQ people have over 130 IQ people have is largely irrelevant in that measure.  My source is a study I saw once.  

I'd be stunned if 160 IQ people didn't have more criminality, psycho behavior, etc than 130 IQ people, per capita.  Idk where to get stats on that.
“The Swamp is where Gators live.  We feel comfortable there, but we hope our opponents feel tentative. A swamp is hot and sticky and can be dangerous." - Steve Spurrier

Cincydawg

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Re: Breaking up Bama: How to save college football?
« Reply #221 on: January 23, 2021, 08:54:07 AM »
Let's call it a proposal. 

Since happiness plateaus at income of $80,000/yr,
Is this a true statement?  

A vastly wealthy person COULD have an income of $80 K if he wanted of course.

I'd opine I was happier making more than that than when I made that.

Of course, that was not the sole factor.

I do appreciate that vast wealth brings its own set of unique problems.

847badgerfan

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Re: Breaking up Bama: How to save college football?
« Reply #222 on: January 23, 2021, 09:04:06 AM »
$80K would be plenty to be happy with in Arkansas. Not so much in Orange County, CA.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

MrNubbz

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Re: Breaking up Bama: How to save college football?
« Reply #223 on: January 23, 2021, 09:50:15 AM »
I'd like to try it in NE Ohio
Suburbia:Where they tear out the trees & then name streets after them.

 

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