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Topic: And the Lions are Hungry, But All They See is Poisoned (SOC 11/23/19)

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Cincydawg

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Re: And the Lions are Hungry, But All They See is Poisoned (SOC 11/23/19)
« Reply #154 on: November 24, 2019, 06:12:35 PM »
Taylor may have to console himself with a lucrative NFL contract.

FearlessF

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Re: And the Lions are Hungry, But All They See is Poisoned (SOC 11/23/19)
« Reply #155 on: November 24, 2019, 06:58:09 PM »
a 250 yard game vs the Gophers might help

followed up with a 200 yard game to beat the Buckeyes......... hypesman
"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

bayareabadger

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Re: And the Lions are Hungry, But All They See is Poisoned (SOC 11/23/19)
« Reply #156 on: November 25, 2019, 08:01:37 AM »
I dunno Taylors numbers don't lie,they have to quit handing it to QB's every year.Conferences can give their MVP's to them.Chase sans the infractions would have been a good pick.Depends on Lamb's numbers and not familiar with Brown.No denying JB is having a season though
His issue is he's worse than last year and he's about 200 yards short of the nation's leading rusher, who is from a P5 conference. He's still been awesome, but not that next level.

I have mixed feelings about the QB dominance. On one hand, it's annoying, on another, they control the game more, are putting up more bonkers numbers in context and often add a running element (last year's winner was a 1,000-yard rusher). 

I think the expansion needs to come from the non-traditional spots. Had I a ballot, I might go Young-Burrow-Maybe Hubbard, maybe Lamb, maybe Davonta Smith. 

bayareabadger

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Re: And the Lions are Hungry, But All They See is Poisoned (SOC 11/23/19)
« Reply #157 on: November 25, 2019, 08:03:31 AM »
a 250 yard game vs the Gophers might help

followed up with a 200 yard game to beat the Buckeyes......... hypesman
Accurate. He needs to add 26.7 percent of his current total against a 1-loss team and a team that held him to 2.6 YPC.

I want this a lot, but I do not see it coming to pass. 

FearlessF

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Re: And the Lions are Hungry, But All They See is Poisoned (SOC 11/23/19)
« Reply #158 on: November 25, 2019, 02:22:31 PM »
yup, couple big TV games to showcase his ability

gotta raise to the occasion if you want the trophy
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Cincydawg

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Re: And the Lions are Hungry, But All They See is Poisoned (SOC 11/23/19)
« Reply #159 on: November 25, 2019, 04:03:23 PM »
Which counts more, Big TV Games or Big Sportscenter Highlights?

I suspect the latter, though having them against august opponents helps.

FearlessF

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Re: And the Lions are Hungry, But All They See is Poisoned (SOC 11/23/19)
« Reply #160 on: November 25, 2019, 04:51:21 PM »
usually the Hypesman winner has had at least one if not a few big time highlight plays


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"Courage; Generosity; Fairness; Honor; In these are the true awards of manly sport."

bayareabadger

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Re: And the Lions are Hungry, But All They See is Poisoned (SOC 11/23/19)
« Reply #161 on: November 25, 2019, 05:06:20 PM »
Which counts more, Big TV Games or Big Sportscenter Highlights?

I suspect the latter, though having them against august opponents helps.
Need some big games against very good teams to counterbalance two not great games at the very least. 

SFBadger96

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Re: And the Lions are Hungry, But All They See is Poisoned (SOC 11/23/19)
« Reply #162 on: November 25, 2019, 06:07:17 PM »
JT hardly had a sniff the week that he put 250 yards on Iowa--the most against the Hawkeyes in a long, long time (and the only back to clear 100 against them this season), in a rivalry game with Big Ten chase implications, and with several highlight runs (but no long TDs). He also put 203 on Michigan. He's leading the nation in scoring and second in rushing yards (behind a player who has faced one top-30 rushing defense against which he ran for 116 yards; JT has faced five and is averaging over 137 yards against).

His flaw is merely living up to very high expectations for a running back for a team known for running in a season and time in which quarterbacks are putting up crazy numbers for highly rated teams. 

Some notable comparisons:
Most rushing yards during a three season span:
1) JT
2) Donnel Pumphrey (SDSU)
3) Herschel Walker
4) Ricky Williams
5) Charles White

Most rushing yards in first three seasons:
1) JT (with 247 fewer carries than...)
2) Herschel Walker
3) Ron Dayne
4) LaMichael James

Career Big Ten Rushing Yards:
1) Ron Dayne
2) JT
3) Archie Griffin
4) Justin Jackson (NU)
5) Anthony Thompson

Most 200 Yard-rushing games
1) Ron Dayne (14)
2) JT (12)
2) Ricky Williams (12)
4) Marcus Allen (11)

Rushing Yards Per Game (min 2,500 career yards):
1) Ed Marinaro (Cornell)
2) OJ Simpson
3) Herschel Walker
4) Garrett Wolfe (NIU)
5) JT

JT is averaging 6.8 YPC for his career.
Heisman Trophy Winners YPC (Heisman season):
1) Mike Rozier (7.8)
2) (tied) Billy Sims & Barry Sanders (7.6)
4) Doc Blanchard (7.1)
5) Rashaan Salaam (6.9)
6) Archie Griffin (6.6)
7) Earl Campbell (6.5)--(JT, 2019, currently goes here)

Cincydawg

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Re: And the Lions are Hungry, But All They See is Poisoned (SOC 11/23/19)
« Reply #163 on: November 25, 2019, 07:05:06 PM »
It is a bit like some Hawaii QB who puts up insane passing numbers that gets discounted because ... they pass every down.

A workmanlike very effective and efficient performance doesn't compare with gaudy highlights.  It's just how it is.

SFBadger96

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Re: And the Lions are Hungry, But All They See is Poisoned (SOC 11/23/19)
« Reply #164 on: November 25, 2019, 07:37:02 PM »
Workmanlike is a pretty harsh view of what Taylor has done--and continues to do. The guy has been a beast. And he will likely put up big numbers against Minnesota this week. If the Badgers win, that will raise the profile a bit. If they lose, it won't. But it doesn't matter; he's never seriously been in the conversation. His "best" moment was as an outside possibility after he had 203 yards as the Badgers whupped Michigan.

So he is considered "workmanlike" because he's the latest of the Badgers strongest set of backs for a program known for running the ball. White, Gordon, Ball, and now JT have been the most NFL ready backs the Badgers have had, maybe ever. Moss might have been there, but for the cocaine, Fletcher was a good NFL back, Dayne was never right for the League, then...Anthony Davis and Calhoun are the only others that come to mind (maybe I'm forgetting someone, though).

And among that group, only Gordon had multiple seasons like JT's (to be fair, he was playing in a more crowded backfield to start)--and he's the only one with a better YPC average than JT.

He has hardly been merely workmanlike, and Wisconsin is hardly a MWC school (Hawaii). BUT, this is a quarterback era. So an Oklahoma QB (also playing for a bigger name than Wisconsin) will be in the discussion doing what Oklahoma QBs do, but not a Wisconsin RB exceeding what Wisconsin RB's do.

Also, and maybe it's the chip on the Wisconsin shoulder, but I think if he's a Michigan back--or Ohio State or Alabama--he would be high on the list, even though those programs have also been known to run the ball.

And yes, he is likely to console himself with a decent NFL salary.

FearlessF

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Re: And the Lions are Hungry, But All They See is Poisoned (SOC 11/23/19)
« Reply #165 on: November 25, 2019, 08:20:51 PM »
RBs have it tough

lots of great Husker backs didn't get much notice

of the 3 Heisman winners at UNL, a wingback, Rozier, and a QB

Rozier had this remarkable run vs UCLA in a highly touted Sept Non-con game - some folks remembered it all season - not all games were televised back in 83

Mike Rozier Husker Heisman Winner - YouTube
« Last Edit: November 25, 2019, 08:28:16 PM by FearlessF »
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OrangeAfroMan

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Re: And the Lions are Hungry, But All They See is Poisoned (SOC 11/23/19)
« Reply #166 on: November 25, 2019, 11:47:26 PM »
Yeah, part of Taylor's seemingly uphill climb is the idea that Wisconsin RBs are plug-n-play.  It's not fair and shouldn't matter, but we can't unsee dozens and hours of images and highights and stats from the past 25 years of Badger RBs.
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Cincydawg

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Re: And the Lions are Hungry, But All They See is Poisoned (SOC 11/23/19)
« Reply #167 on: November 26, 2019, 08:00:54 AM »
Yeah, I agree Taylor would get more notice if he were playing at say Northwestern and doing the same things.  By "workmanlike", I mean he is steady and not gaudy.  He goes out and gets "it" done with relatively few highlights on SC.  (I think, I rarely watch SC, I'm sure they feature his runs often enough, but as OAM suggests, he's at Wisconsin, it's expected).

Compare that with Joe Burrow who was added to an historically challenged offense at LSU and lit it up.

As much as anything, for me, this is why I don't particularly care about the award.  I have no clue who the "most outstanding player" would be.  It could be some defensive end somewhere.


 

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