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Topic: Misfits Thread

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847badgerfan

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #7756 on: August 30, 2020, 03:14:48 PM »
It's too much to ask if you deny systematic racism. 
Thanks for the input.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

Cincydawg

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #7757 on: August 30, 2020, 03:16:28 PM »
A few days ago, a guy approaches me asking for something to eat, or some money, I forget his story.  I say wait here, I'll bring you a sandwich in 15 minutes (it was near home).  I walk home, fix a sandwich, throw in a cold Coke can, and some crackers.  I got back, he's waiting, and he asks me, again, for money.

I don't carry cash around.  I tell him that, he gets a bit smarmy telling me he really needs money.  Sorry, I don't have cash, I walk off.

He's cussing me out as I walk off.

I think he threw the sandwich in the garbage can.


Cincydawg

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #7758 on: August 30, 2020, 03:17:13 PM »
By "systemic", I suppose we mean "in the system", right?  Meaning by government?  Or just "The System"?


bayareabadger

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #7759 on: August 30, 2020, 03:19:19 PM »
A few days ago, a guy approaches me asking for something to eat, or some money, I forget his story.  I say wait here, I'll bring you a sandwich in 15 minutes (it was near home).  I walk home, fix a sandwich, throw in a cold Coke can, and some crackers.  I got back, he's waiting, and he asks me, again, for money.

I don't carry cash around.  I tell him that, he gets a bit smarmy telling me he really needs money.  Sorry, I don't have cash, I walk off.

He's cussing me out as I walk off.

I think he threw the sandwich in the garbage can.


Substance abuse problems are an ugly thing. 

Cincydawg

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #7760 on: August 30, 2020, 03:28:51 PM »
Substance abuse problems are an ugly thing.
Yeah, he wasn't incoherent, he was very skinny, probably 30ish.  Claimed he needed a MARTA ticket to get home.  I'm used to the panhandlers around here.  Some of the homeless are so out of it they have no idea where they are.  It's very sad.

bayareabadger

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #7761 on: August 30, 2020, 03:29:11 PM »
I'd like to see some posts on solutions to racial inequity. Is that too much to ask?
In your usual vein, more and better training. A friend works in an industry that slants pretty white. His company would like to hire diverse, but the candidate pool is always shallow and usually does better. There's an org that offers specific training for minority groups that gives a little leg up, but it's a small one. 

I wish I knew some way to make poverty easier to grind out of. Obviously the legal system is for punishing, but something that punishment puts someone in a cycle of financial setbacks that inhibits a road to prosperity (think court fees, fines, etc.)

Another tough spot is housing. How do you create places where people can live safely/somewhat cleanly when they start from nothing?

I wish I had a lot of really good suggestions, but of course if I did, I'd probably be working in a field to try to bring them to reality in a big way. 

bayareabadger

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #7762 on: August 30, 2020, 03:35:03 PM »
Yeah, he wasn't incoherent, he was very skinny, probably 30ish.  Claimed he needed a MARTA ticket to get home.  I'm used to the panhandlers around here.  Some of the homeless are so out of it they have no idea where they are.  It's very sad.
I had a roommate who offered a person in such a situation a ride when I happened to be in the car. It became clear when we dropped her off this was kind of a thing, something between mental illness and substance abuse. Weeks later he found the person in the same spot asking for the same ride. 

And that's a problem I possess no good answer or policy for. We live in a deeply free country, and that means that you're free not to accept help, even if it's the thing you need help with driving you not to seek it. 

CWSooner

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #7763 on: August 30, 2020, 03:41:29 PM »
. . . I think the challenge is that help can only come from 'the people' and the government can't just wait around and hope for that to happen. 

Almost like you have $5 in your hand and there's a homeless person outside a restaurant.  You know giving them the money probably won't genuinely help....do you wait around, hoping someone give them some food (actual help) from the restaurant or do you just give them the $5?  You don't want to walk away, but you don't want to stay and look like a jerk. 

What does a government do when the only genuine help and the path towards equality can only be provided by the people?
But what if "government help" is a major reason that the homeless person is homeless?  (And, in real life, that is often the case.)  Is more of it going to be the fix?
We've had major government help since 1966 (when the War on Poverty/Great Society programs began coming on line) and the poverty rate is now what it was then--it bumps along between 11% and 14%.
It's not only blatantly discriminatory policies like FHA redlining that have hurt poor people in general and black people particularly, it's also "good" legislation like minimum-wage laws, which make it harder for less-educated, less-skilled, less-experienced workers find work.  That impacts black people disproportionately.  And there's the Wagner Act--organized labor's "Magna Carta"--of the New Deal.  It dictated that businesses contracting with the federal government must pay the "prevailing wage."  That meant the union wage.  And most trade unions excluded blacks.  Awhile back I read an analysis (the details of which I now unfortunately forget) showing that that policy is still adversely affecting black Americans.
In general, many federal welfare programs have discouraged work and encouraged single-parent families, which are exactly the wrong incentives for poor people in general and especially for black Americans, where the lack of a father, married to the mother, in the home helping to raise the children, is at the heart of many social ills.
I'd be willing to try a negative income tax plan like Milton Friedman (Mr. Free Market) advocated ca. 1970.  Basically, the government sets a certain amount of income for a given family size, and if the family income is less than that, the government pays 80% (or some other percentage) of the difference.  There's help, but there's still an incentive for the breadwinner(s) of that family to keep striving for more income.  And it would eliminate vast swaths of the welfare bureaucracy, which may be a major reason that it didn't make it through Congress back during the Nixon administration.  Those welfare workers are unionized, and they vote, and their unions donate to political campaigns.
I'd like to see some social stigmas return.
For fathers who don't bother to marry the mothers of their children, and then abandon them to go spread their pollen elsewhere.  (Oops!  That would describe some large proportion of professional athletes, our idols.)
For unwed mothers in general (on principle) and especially for young, poor unwed mothers.  Cheap contraceptives are widely available, but we subsidize bad choices, encouraging more of them.
For parents who can't manage to get up in the morning and feed their children, leaving it up to the schools to do the job instead.
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longhorn320

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #7764 on: August 30, 2020, 03:45:35 PM »
Yeah, he wasn't incoherent, he was very skinny, probably 30ish.  Claimed he needed a MARTA ticket to get home.  I'm used to the panhandlers around here.  Some of the homeless are so out of it they have no idea where they are.  It's very sad.
I was getting gas a few months ago and this guy driving another getting gas came up to me and ask me if I would lend him $10 for gas money to get home

He was dressed reasonably and his car was fairly modern

He tells me he accidentally left home without his wallet 

I told him Id put $10 gas in his car for him and he accepted

afterwards he thanked me and asked for my phone number and I said forget it just do the same thing for someone else if needed

my point in posting this is sometimes folks just need a little help 
They won't let me give blood anymore. The burnt orange color scares the hell out of the doctors.

Cincydawg

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #7765 on: August 30, 2020, 03:45:56 PM »
I once was "poor", in quotes because while I was constantly short of money, I had parents as backup.  I discovered that when you have no backup, being poor means having to take on credit card debt.  Your old car breaks down, you have to have it to get to your job.  OK, you run up credit card debt at 22% interest.  Any minor hiccup means you have to give something up or go further into debt.  You likely owe someone for some ten year old car as it is, and he'd love to repo the car on you.  The you lose your job and have to find one you can walk to, making maybe $8/hr instead of $12.  It spirals out of control quickly without a break.

So, maybe to try and better yourself you take night classes while working to become an RN or something, but that costs money.  You're doing everything "right", but just need a break.  That's the person I'd like to help, but they are too busy trying to get by to know how to seek help.

I really admired the kids at our HS who came from "nothing" and ended up being something.  They often had a mother pushing them.

Cincydawg

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #7766 on: August 30, 2020, 03:47:38 PM »
We do have negative income tax today of course.

CWSooner

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #7767 on: August 30, 2020, 03:50:31 PM »
We do have negative income tax today of course.
Earned Income Tax Credit?  Does it work as I described Friedman's plan?
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CWSooner

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #7768 on: August 30, 2020, 03:54:22 PM »
The Dispatch Weekly
Our Best Work From a Truly Ugly Week in America
Riots and looting and vigilantism have us all on edge.

Rachael LarimoreAug 2937227




Back when protests first sprang up in response to George Floyd’s death, I was actually a little optimistic. Let me explain. Even as riots and looting took place in Minneapolis and other large cities, peaceful demonstrations and marches were taking place in small towns and quiet suburbs all over the country. 
My hometown (Alliance, Ohio) was featured in national news stories for its successful protest. Our oldest son attended a Black Lives Matter rally and march in our suburb, and we live in a county where Donald Trump got 68 percent of the vote in 2016. Not only was it peaceful, the chief of police gave a heartfelt speech to the crowd, and thanked the organizers for helping increase his awareness. More people than I can count shared Dave Chappelle’s 8:46 special. Occasionally, a fruitful and respectful conversation broke out on social media. It seemed like there was a glimmer of hope not only that we could make some headway on racism in America but that maybe people weren’t quite as divided as we thought.
So much for all of that. Activists took advantage of sympathetic mayors in big cities, giving us the CHAZ/CHOP in Seattle (where protesters made demands about “defunding the police” behind blockades protected by armed civilians) and more than two months of nightly violence in Portland. As mayors became nervous about deploying police to maintain the peace, violent crime has increased.
The events of the past week were like a spark hitting the embers of a dying fire. The police shooting of Jacob Blake in Kenosha, Wisconsin, prompted a whole new round of protests, though news of such happenings being peaceful are sparse. Instead, we’ve seen protesters badgering diners at restaurants. We’ve seen looters destroy businesses owned by immigrants and minorities. And, worst of all, a teenager armed with a long rifle allegedly shot three people and killed two in Kenosha.
I can’t help but feel we are in a precarious place as a nation now. We were too polarized as a nation already as we headed into what was sure to be a fraught election year. The pandemic and the violence have only exacerbated that.  And it seems like we’ve lost the ability to make obvious, rational arguments. It should be easy to condemn violence and looting in favor of peaceful demonstrations. Instead, we have mayors and city councils goading police chiefs into resigning, and NPR featuring authors who write books literally titled, In Defense of Looting. Similarly, it should be easy to condemn  vigilantism, but instead we have people trying to make a hero out of Kyle Rittenhouse
Andrew Sullivan wrote about the violence this week, and cautions that the Democrats are “walking into a trap” in terms of the election. Bridget Phetasy, a writer and podcaster who describes herself as “politically homeless” and whose work I’ve really come to enjoy, puts it in even starker terms: “Almost everyone I know here in LA is buying a gun, stocking up on water and wondering what the aftermath of the election results will look like. If Trump wins, I reckon America will burn. If Trump loses, America will burn. Either way, I’m preparing for America to burn.”
I wouldn’t say that I’m not quite that pessimistic yet. But I will say that in our conversations with our kids about these matters, it’s getting a little harder to say with confidence that our country is better than the current moment would indicate, or that we’re strong enough to overcome these struggles. . . .

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Cincydawg

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Re: 2020 Offseason Stream of Unconciousness
« Reply #7769 on: August 30, 2020, 04:05:28 PM »
Earned Income Tax Credit?  Does it work as I described Friedman's plan?
Not exactly.  But it's there.  One could argue it should be expanded and enlarged.

 

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