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Topic: #15 Wisconsin (2-1, 4-2) at #12 Michigan (4-0, 6-1) Post Game

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MarqHusker

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Re: #15 Wisconsin (2-0, 4-1) at #12 Michigan (3-0, 5-1) Game Week
« Reply #154 on: October 13, 2018, 12:46:04 AM »
I read WSJ daily.  I've had enough of his shtick.  Mostly because he's such an NFL honk.   He really does loath Michigan.

Mdot21

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Re: #15 Wisconsin (2-0, 4-1) at #12 Michigan (3-0, 5-1) Game Week
« Reply #155 on: October 13, 2018, 01:02:21 AM »
lots of rumors that Tarik Black might be a go for Wisconsin. Black posted something vague and cryptic on his twitter and the rumors are out of control. Please be true.

Anonymous Coward

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Re: #15 Wisconsin (2-0, 4-1) at #12 Michigan (3-0, 5-1) Game Week
« Reply #156 on: October 13, 2018, 01:48:03 AM »
lots of rumors that Tarik Black might be a go for Wisconsin. Black posted something vague and cryptic on his twitter and the rumors are out of control. Please be true.
I'm reading the same. It's on twitter, on the radio, and - super weird - may have broken first by the commentators in the USF-Tulsa game.
Mostly I'm confused. (1) That's a lot of smoke but I don't know if it's real. (2) If real, how unlike Harbaugh to have let it out before gametime! (3) Just like with Solomon practicing last week, I am incredulous at how accelerated this recovery has been. Actually with Black it seems even harder to believe since there's relatively little benefit to bringing him back too early (the WRs have more than enough depth for the offense to function "normally").

Mdot21

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Re: #15 Wisconsin (2-0, 4-1) at #12 Michigan (3-0, 5-1) Game Week
« Reply #157 on: October 13, 2018, 02:18:40 AM »
I'm reading the same. It's on twitter, on the radio, and - super weird - may have broken first by the commentators in the USF-Tulsa game.
Mostly I'm confused. (1) That's a lot of smoke but I don't know if it's real. (2) If real, how unlike Harbaugh to have let it out before gametime! (3) Just like with Solomon practicing last week, I am incredulous at how accelerated this recovery has been. Actually with Black it seems even harder to believe since there's relatively little benefit to bringing him back too early (the WRs have more than enough depth for the offense to function "normally").
my guess if Black is back, he'll have a pitch count.
And the sooner he gets back to full form, the scarier it makes this offense. DPJ and Nico have both been playing really well. A bit inconsistent, but pretty damn well for a pair of true sophomore WR's playing with a new QB. And let's not forget that QB just got here in like March and has had to learn a new system that was drastically different to what he played in HS and at Ole Miss. Adding Black to that WR mix to go along with Gentry at TE? In my best Bart Scott voice, CAN'T WAIT.
Chris Evans should be back as well. And my HOPE of all HOPES is that they feature him in the passing game. As a runner he's pretty hit or miss, not really crazy about him there, but Evans is a real weapon in the pass game. Complete mismatch for any LB or S. Big doses of Evans in the pass game and on screens could take this offense to another level. He is that good of a receiver and that deadly in open space.

Anonymous Coward

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Re: #15 Wisconsin (2-0, 4-1) at #12 Michigan (3-0, 5-1) Game Week
« Reply #158 on: October 13, 2018, 06:36:06 PM »
We're on the verge of a maxed out FB/HB/TEs in a phonebooth battle, so this is apropos:

Anonymous Coward

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Re: #15 Wisconsin (2-1, 4-2) at #12 Michigan (4-0, 6-1) Post Game
« Reply #159 on: October 13, 2018, 11:59:37 PM »
Given the Badger attrition in the secondary, I really expected Michigan to attack them there. But that wasn't it. No doubt Michigan tried to go through the air more than they produced (and, I don't know who those back-ups were back there but for a long time they were a reliable blanket of Michigan's WRs). But ultimately it was on the ground where they made their hay. I know this isn't a vintage UW unit, but this wasn't my expectation. I think UW really missed Loudermilk in this one. Especially on those QB keepers (though I wasn't paying close enough attention to know whether they went to the side he'd have been assigned.


https://twitter.com/MattRHinton/status/1051305552591118341

But again, I think that's misleading because of injuries and this being a relative off-year. Still, am glad for our OL and Warriner. We're not there yet, but those guys are (sometimes slowly) on their way.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2018, 12:13:28 AM by Anonymous Coward »

Anonymous Coward

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Re: #15 Wisconsin (2-1, 4-2) at #12 Michigan (4-0, 6-1) Post Game
« Reply #160 on: October 14, 2018, 12:01:29 AM »
Also, after wasting that glorious meme above, Ben(ch) Mason barely featured. Michigan really advanced the QB read-option in this one. I'm always curious how much of that (extensively flashing new offensive themes/looks all of a sudden) is specifically about the opponent at hand, how much is about giving future opponents more to prepare for, and to which extent the answer can be both.

SuperMario

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Re: #15 Wisconsin (2-1, 4-2) at #12 Michigan (4-0, 6-1) Post Game
« Reply #161 on: October 14, 2018, 12:24:26 AM »
Really didn’t expect that outcome at all. Wisconsin has quite a few curious calls in this game. I’m not sure why they continued to try to pass during important downs. A couple notable times it blew up in their face when they seem to run to the left side at will. Odd. Would have been frustrating to be a Badger fan tonight.

Patterson still confuses me, which I know I’m the minority here. He made some great plays with his legs. Also made some great throws. BUT.. something is up with him throwing down field when a receiver isn’t wide open. He is either incredibly reluctant to throw a pick or he doesn’t see the field well. I really think it’s the forward because his judgment and seeing the defense on option reads tonight was fantastic. I’d be ok with him taking a few more chances. Kid definitely has a great arm.

Ok. Finally, a big Harbaugh win. Now do it again.


Anonymous Coward

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Re: #15 Wisconsin (2-1, 4-2) at #12 Michigan (4-0, 6-1) Post Game
« Reply #162 on: October 14, 2018, 12:49:14 AM »
Really didn’t expect that outcome at all. Wisconsin has quite a few curious calls in this game. I’m not sure why they continued to try to pass during important downs. A couple notable times it blew up in their face when they seem to run to the left side at will. Odd. Would have been frustrating to be a Badger fan tonight.

Patterson still confuses me, which I know I’m the minority here. He made some great plays with his legs. Also made some great throws. BUT.. something is up with him throwing down field when a receiver isn’t wide open. He is either incredibly reluctant to throw a pick or he doesn’t see the field well. I really think it’s the forward because his judgment and seeing the defense on option reads tonight was fantastic. I’d be ok with him taking a few more chances. Kid definitely has a great arm.

Ok. Finally, a big Harbaugh win. Now do it again.


Agree on the score being unexpected. As for your two questions. I think I can explain both of those (or at least I noticed both during the game and can share my best guess from then):
About Patterson, 
  • if you're talking about why he had such happy feet (looked physically unsettled early), giving up on his routes in the 1st quarter: Only from recollection, I think those were all quick routes and exceptionally well covered. So quitting on them was the right idea and would explain why he pulled the ball and seemed reluctant to throw. (A good follow-up question is *why* these athletic WRs and TEs were so well covered versus a deeply injured UW secondary)
  • if you're talking about why Michigan struggled so much against zone defense. I have no idea. It's a good question. I think it's fixable, though
As for UW and why it stopped running in the 2nd half: Michigan's pass D ruined their aerial game. Until that final drive, Hornibrook had only passed for ~25 yards. Which allowed the Michigan defense to load the box and crash on every play, whether run or not. And I'll admit, UW still successfully ran on a lot of those. Their OL is incredible. However, once Michigan started crashing like that, the results became high variance. About 50/50 between 5-7 yard gains and 2-4 yard gains. So running had two issues: (1) if you can't break a big one, it's almost impossible to go the whole length of the field like that versus this defense. Because eventually, it's likely that you'll get two of those 2-4 yard gains out of three plays and force a punt. So they needed to somehow beg Michigan to unload the box. (2) Running more often would only have dripped the clock away faster.
(Of course at that point, it barely mattered and trying to pass didn't work. But I think it's best to evaluate the decision not on whether it worked but on whether it made good sense. And I think this did.)
« Last Edit: October 14, 2018, 01:03:06 AM by Anonymous Coward »

Anonymous Coward

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Re: #15 Wisconsin (2-1, 4-2) at #12 Michigan (4-0, 6-1) Post Game
« Reply #163 on: October 14, 2018, 02:00:52 AM »
If I had to identify a few of the coaching decisions I thought were questionable, I guess chronologically:

(1) Choosing to receive the ball to start the game (the most benign of these 4, but getting the ball second only helps a defense known for ramping it up to a new level in the 2nd half)
(2) Not calling timeout at the end of the half (Michigan missed this FG, but if Chryst had called TO around 30s, the Harbaugh may not have elected to kick from there (missing, as Michigan did, would have guaranteed UW the ball and time to get into FG range).
(3) Though I think it made sense for UW to lean into the pass game, there were many 4th and short downs on Michigan's half of the field where they punted. You have that OL and JTaylor. Use them, right?
(4) Chryst punted in the 4th when the score was 24-7, which was a kind of forfeit. But then after Lavert's pick-six, he decided to go for a score and even kicked onsides after that TD drive. The second parts are good and competitive. So why was UW punting at 24-7 in the 4th?
« Last Edit: October 14, 2018, 02:02:35 AM by Anonymous Coward »

847badgerfan

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Re: #15 Wisconsin (2-1, 4-2) at #12 Michigan (4-0, 6-1) Post Game
« Reply #164 on: October 14, 2018, 08:16:30 AM »
That was an ugly 2nd half for any UW fan to watch, starting with roughing the snapper. I've seen that called against UW twice now.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

Honestbuckeye

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Re: #15 Wisconsin (2-1, 4-2) at #12 Michigan (4-0, 6-1) Post Game
« Reply #165 on: October 14, 2018, 08:18:14 AM »
What I feel is happening at Michigan is a based on the offense, not the Defense.

How many years/ times have we read all of your glowing reports about their defense being number on, all The shiny statistics ( you see what I did there Dudekd), only to have it not work down the stretch, and in the biggest games.

The difference now is, there is an offense that;
- doesn’t put them in bad positions
- keeps the ball for defense to rest, 
- puts points on the board so Brown can play with house money and get super aggressive.

And it is not because the offense is explosive, which it is AT TIMES.
It is because it has balance. Having the read option threat is HUGE.  Kudos to Harbaugh for letting his other coaches have some say in the offense.

I truly think this could be a CFP caliber team, if they get and stay healthy and continue to expand Patterson’s spread playbook.

What’s missing?

Solid RBs.  Check
Great defense.  check
Ability to pass.   Check
QB who doesn’t throw picks. Check
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
-Mark Twain

Honestbuckeye

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Re: #15 Wisconsin (2-1, 4-2) at #12 Michigan (4-0, 6-1) Post Game
« Reply #166 on: October 14, 2018, 08:27:14 AM »
That was an ugly 2nd half for any UW fan to watch, starting with roughing the snapper. I've seen that called against UW twice now.
Not to say the outcome would change, but that was at a most critical time in the game, where they had forced Michigan into a punt on their first possession of the second half. Like the announcers, I think it was quite embellished by Cheeseman, evidenced by the sideline celebration afterward.  I suspect a good piece of coaching on UMs part.
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
-Mark Twain

847badgerfan

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Re: #15 Wisconsin (2-1, 4-2) at #12 Michigan (4-0, 6-1) Post Game
« Reply #167 on: October 14, 2018, 08:51:01 AM »
Yeah, it was critical, but UM would have worn down that defense no matter what. UW, and more importantly, Hornibrook, had to play a perfect game to have a chance. Instead he turned in probably his worst showing as a Badger. Ballgame.
U RAH RAH! WIS CON SIN!

 

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