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Topic: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?

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DunkingDan

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2019, 11:10:18 AM »
And obviously that was my point.  Quite a few subjects do not appear - to me - to lend themselves to political bias.  The sciences, math, engineering, business, English, foreign language,  ...

... some do.  So, indoctrination MAY occur in the topics that can be twisted one way or the other by some professor, sociology, history, whatever.  So, one might claim SOME parts of universities are "indoctrination camps".
Some sciences, English, and Business do lend themselves to political bias. Foreign Languages if they talk about culture and most do lend themselves as well 
President Harry S. Truman said: “The fundamental basis of this nation’s laws was given to Moses on the Mount.  The fundamental basis of our Bill of Rights comes from the teachings…  If we don't have the proper fundamental moral background, we will finally wind up with a totalitarian government which does not believe in rights for anybody except the state.”

Cincydawg

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #15 on: April 11, 2019, 11:20:33 AM »
I don't see much chance of politics intruding into a college level science class, and never saw a hint of it, but as I say, that was a long time ago.

Maybe there could be a remark here or there, but hardly "indoctrination".

Same with business and English etc., perhaps an occasional remark, but not indoctrination, in my opinion.

DunkingDan

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #16 on: April 11, 2019, 07:23:38 PM »
I don't see much chance of politics intruding into a college level science class, and never saw a hint of it, but as I say, that was a long time ago.

Maybe there could be a remark here or there, but hardly "indoctrination".

Same with business and English etc., perhaps an occasional remark, but not indoctrination, in my opinion.
Maybe if you were not so smart and staid awake during classes 
President Harry S. Truman said: “The fundamental basis of this nation’s laws was given to Moses on the Mount.  The fundamental basis of our Bill of Rights comes from the teachings…  If we don't have the proper fundamental moral background, we will finally wind up with a totalitarian government which does not believe in rights for anybody except the state.”

Cincydawg

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #17 on: April 11, 2019, 07:26:49 PM »
I mostly "staid" awake in classes.  I mostly did pretty well in class.  That wasn't my main weakness.

I'm hard pressed to imagine a political angle to a chemistry class, beyond perhaps a comment on something here and there, certainly not what I'd consider "indoctrination".

But my own experience is not relevant because, as I said, it dates to the '70s.  Perhaps someone could give an example how atomic theory or bonding is somehow political.

DunkingDan

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #18 on: April 11, 2019, 07:39:20 PM »
I mostly "staid" awake in classes.  I mostly did pretty well in class.  That wasn't my main weakness.

I'm hard pressed to imagine a political angle to a chemistry class, beyond perhaps a comment on something here and there, certainly not what I'd consider "indoctrination".

But my own experience is not relevant because, as I said, it dates to the '70s.  Perhaps someone could give an example how atomic theory or bonding is somehow political.
There you go again. 
Where did I say Chemistry? 
Do you need glasses?
President Harry S. Truman said: “The fundamental basis of this nation’s laws was given to Moses on the Mount.  The fundamental basis of our Bill of Rights comes from the teachings…  If we don't have the proper fundamental moral background, we will finally wind up with a totalitarian government which does not believe in rights for anybody except the state.”

HK_Vol

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #19 on: April 11, 2019, 10:41:32 PM »
https://thefederalist.com/2019/04/09/will-never-fix-campus-indoctrination-cut-college-subsidies/

We Will Never Fix Campus Indoctrination Until We Cut College Subsidies

SNIP:
However, according to Professor Samuel J. Abrames, an exclusive focus on professors is misplaced. In an opinion article for the New York Times, Abrames wrote, “While considerable focus has been placed in recent decades on the impact of the ideological bent of college professors, when it comes to collegiate life — living in dorms, participating in extracurricular organizations — the ever growing ranks of administrators have the biggest influence on students and campus life across the country.”

According to Abrames, college administrators are the primary driver of programs regularly inundating students with on-campus events, such as “Understanding White Privilege”— a gateway into the Marxist, identitarian myth of Western Civilization as a place of constant oppression in the form of patriarchy, colonialism, cis- and hetero- normativity, and systemic racism.

Abrames calls our attention to the fact that while students self-identify as liberal at a ratio of two-to-one, their professors self-identify as liberal at a ratio of six-to-one, and university administrators—the people responsible for structuring the curriculum and culture of the institution—self-identify as liberal at a ratio of twelve-to-one.

Abrames highlights something critical. While professors are responsible for some of the indoctrination happening on college campuses, the newest aspect of on-campus indoctrination comes primarily from the massive, very liberal bureaucratic apparatus that has developed in the last 30 years. It was administrators who told conservatives at Berkeley they had to pay the outrageous sum of $15,000 in security costs to bring Shapiro to speak on their campus, and it was administrators who ultimately offered, then rescinded, an honorary doctorate to Ayaan Hirsi Ali. These acts, combined with the kind of on-campus events Abrames describes, all send an indoctrinating message.

Data from Pew Research shows the effects of this indoctrination. Only 26 percent of people with high school degrees identify as “consistently” or “mostly” liberal, and 48 percent identify as having a mixed opinion. Fifty percent of students starting out with “mixed opinions” (let’s call them “moderates”) going into college come out the other end of the government-subsidized system self-identifying as liberal.

Of those who progress all the way through higher education to attain a graduate degree, 54 percent self-identify as “consistently” or “mostly” liberal and only 22 percent identify as holding “mixed” opinions. Finally, those who remain conservative become more conservative, likely as a response to the heavy, left-of-center indoctrination efforts by college administrators.

HK_Vol

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #20 on: April 11, 2019, 10:42:58 PM »
https://thefederalist.com/2019/04/09/will-never-fix-campus-indoctrination-cut-college-subsidies/

The Costs of Indoctrination Are Steep

The rapid increase in tuition costs correlates strongly to the rapid increase in on-campus administrators. In turn, those tuition increases are made possible by federally guaranteed student loans.

According to a report by the Federal Reserve Bank of New York, increases in government-subsidized student loans led to significant increases in tuition, especially amongst private and for-profit universities. In other words, the more students are enabled to borrow, the more universities increase their tuition. Since 1988, the average cost of a degree from a public four-year institution has increased 213 percent.

Where does this additional tuition money go? Professor Paul F. Campos surveyed the data and presented a startling picture. From 1993 to 2009, colleges and universities increased the total number of administrators by 60 percent while decreasing the number of full-time faculty members.

In 1970, the number of full-time faculty as a percentage of total employees at the average university was 78 percent, but in 2015 that number was only 50 percent. As an example, from 1975 to 2008, the California State University System increased the number of administrators by an astounding 221 percent.

HK_Vol

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #21 on: April 12, 2019, 04:46:53 AM »

https://www.thecollegefix.com/federal-30000-scholarship-granted-to-zero-self-described-conservatives-in-2018/


Federal $30,000 scholarships granted to zero self-described conservatives in 2018

SNIP:
Yet several sources familiar with the selection process told The Fix the ideological imbalance persists largely because of the type of students universities forward to the committee as finalists.

In order to become a Truman scholar, an applicant must undergo a rigorous application process, which includes submitting a nomination letter, three letters of recommendation and a transcript, plus completing a questionnaire and providing a written policy proposal.

Yet which students are forwarded to the Truman committee is up to the individual universities that participate in the program.

It is no surprise, then, that heavily progressive college campuses may be sending forward predominantly liberal students for an allegedly nonpartisan award. As one source noted, the Truman committee can only pick from the finalists they are delivered by the schools.

“The Scholars we select are representative of the pool of applicants that are sent to us,” Yglesias said.

HK_Vol

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #22 on: April 12, 2019, 05:20:34 AM »
But they're JOOOS!

Open Anti-Semitism At UNC And Duke Conference
And somehow get a $250,000 grant.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WwjiHh1b3R8&feature=youtu.be


Cincydawg

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #23 on: April 12, 2019, 07:46:50 AM »
I'm obviously not disputing that campuses tend to be rather liberal. My point is that in many courses, it just cannot be a relevant factor - the sciences, etc.

A professor might mention something about greenhouse gases in physics or chemistry classes, but that science is well understood in terms of the greenhouse effect, so it's not political to cover the topic.

Maybe someone can offer an example of "Leftward Bias" in science or engineering or math or business or ....

Nate924

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #24 on: April 12, 2019, 09:01:44 AM »
https://thefederalist.com/2019/04/09/will-never-fix-campus-indoctrination-cut-college-subsidies/

We Will Never Fix Campus Indoctrination Until We Cut College Subsidies

SNIP:
However, according to Professor Samuel J. Abrames, an exclusive focus on professors is misplaced. In an opinion article for the New York Times, Abrames wrote, “While considerable focus has been placed in recent decades on the impact of the ideological bent of college professors, when it comes to collegiate life — living in dorms, participating in extracurricular organizations — the ever growing ranks of administrators have the biggest influence on students and campus life across the country.”

According to Abrames, college administrators are the primary driver of programs regularly inundating students with on-campus events, such as “Understanding White Privilege”— a gateway into the Marxist, identitarian myth of Western Civilization as a place of constant oppression in the form of patriarchy, colonialism, cis- and hetero- normativity, and systemic racism.

Abrames calls our attention to the fact that while students self-identify as liberal at a ratio of two-to-one, their professors self-identify as liberal at a ratio of six-to-one, and university administrators—the people responsible for structuring the curriculum and culture of the institution—self-identify as liberal at a ratio of twelve-to-one.

Abrames highlights something critical. While professors are responsible for some of the indoctrination happening on college campuses, the newest aspect of on-campus indoctrination comes primarily from the massive, very liberal bureaucratic apparatus that has developed in the last 30 years. It was administrators who told conservatives at Berkeley they had to pay the outrageous sum of $15,000 in security costs to bring Shapiro to speak on their campus, and it was administrators who ultimately offered, then rescinded, an honorary doctorate to Ayaan Hirsi Ali. These acts, combined with the kind of on-campus events Abrames describes, all send an indoctrinating message.

Data from Pew Research shows the effects of this indoctrination. Only 26 percent of people with high school degrees identify as “consistently” or “mostly” liberal, and 48 percent identify as having a mixed opinion. Fifty percent of students starting out with “mixed opinions” (let’s call them “moderates”) going into college come out the other end of the government-subsidized system self-identifying as liberal.

Of those who progress all the way through higher education to attain a graduate degree, 54 percent self-identify as “consistently” or “mostly” liberal and only 22 percent identify as holding “mixed” opinions. Finally, those who remain conservative become more conservative, likely as a response to the heavy, left-of-center indoctrination efforts by college administrators.
This is the real issue facing parents and kids today. The massive amount of student debt has financed this growth, in part. These administrators hold sway over a vast amount of student life and the culture surrounding it. Kids do laugh at the nonsense, and do tend to discount it, if they have a questioning, independent, mature understanding of the environment.
However, these socialists are still able to cast a wide net to indoctrinate the gullible, immature, and weak minded kids to their side. The entire environment is rotten to the core, and demotes diversity of thought below conformance to ideology. The most extreme true believers show up on the news.
Once these kids graduate, saddled with a tremendous debt, in make shift degrees that are offered due to universities being way over funded, they are hamstrung to start with.
The continued aggressive and increasing migration to institutional discrimination against white males, Asians, and those who think differently from the thought police is the real threat to individual freedom and thought.
It will manifest itself in a stronger form, just as it did in Germany in the late twenties, when the economy tanks hard, or when we finally get to the point that other countries won’t continue to loan us money to throw away on the leftist grift of dependency. Along with the basic concept of the rule of law only applying to some individuals, all is in place for the (perceived) strong dictator type to sweep away individual liberties.

All of the talk about which classes propagate this insidious nonsense is irrelevant to the discussion. The whole environment should not be allowed to exist. There is zero leadership in the education systems in this country. But, of course, that is what you get when you allow the federal government into any part of civil life. 

Cincydawg

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #25 on: April 12, 2019, 09:32:35 AM »
I've mentioned before that almost 70% of HS grads in the US attend college,  in Europe the figure is about half that, the ratio is something like 67% to 38%.

Liberals tend to like the European model of all things, and perhaps this is one to which we should aspire, but college here is Big Business these days.

Should an individual who is academically less capable than half of all students go to college?

DunkingDan

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #26 on: April 12, 2019, 03:17:07 PM »
I'm obviously not disputing that campuses tend to be rather liberal. My point is that in many courses, it just cannot be a relevant factor - the sciences, etc.

A professor might mention something about greenhouse gases in physics or chemistry classes, but that science is well understood in terms of the greenhouse effect, so it's not political to cover the topic.

Maybe someone can offer an example of "Leftward Bias" in science or engineering or math or business or ....
 Look up in the sky, its ....... ROFLMAO
President Harry S. Truman said: “The fundamental basis of this nation’s laws was given to Moses on the Mount.  The fundamental basis of our Bill of Rights comes from the teachings…  If we don't have the proper fundamental moral background, we will finally wind up with a totalitarian government which does not believe in rights for anybody except the state.”

HK_Vol

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #27 on: April 12, 2019, 11:47:11 PM »
https://hotair.com/archives/2019/04/11/no-republicans-need-apply-sign-academia/


SNIP:
For at least a few hours, Mark Kennedy looked like a shoe-in for the job of president at the University of Colorado. After a lengthy search, the regents unanimously selected the outgoing University of North Dakota president as their only finalist for the position. At that point, however, someone must have done a Google search and discovered Kennedy’s disreputable past as … a Republican Congressman from Minnesota.

If the University of Colorado rejects Kennedy at this point for those reasons, they may as well hang a sign outside the campus that reads, “No Republicans Need Apply,” either for jobs or for admission. It would only reinforce the perception that this sign exists all through Academia, especially after Smith has publicly and explicitly made Kennedy’s political beliefs a hiring issue.

 

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