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Topic: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?

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HK_Vol

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Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« on: April 10, 2019, 03:24:14 AM »
Wow....

https://www.theamericanconservative.com/dreher/harvard-glass-menagerie/

SNIP:
On our way to the restaurant, I had mentioned to my foreign friend something I’ve heard from several of you readers of this blog who are conservative academics: that as long as old-school liberals remain in charge of faculties and academic institutions, there will be a place for right-of-center scholars. But when the Jacobin-like younger generation moves into leadership, that will be the end. He agreed, and brought up several examples from academia and academia-adjacent institutions (e.g., publishing). He told me one story about a left-liberal scholar he knows who has been turned into a non-person for questioning out loud some of aspects of au courant progressive dogma. I’m not easy to shock about things like this, but this particular story — my foreign friend named names — was for me a sign of how advanced the ideological militancy has become.

It recalled in fact an e-mail conversation I had last week with a liberal journalist friend who hates to see this closing of the left’s mind. My journalist pal said that he’s seeing on the left a moralistic refusal even to consider ideas, people, and data that contradict these leftists’ moral code. Understand: it’s not that this new breed of progressives disagrees (though they do); it’s that they believe, and believe strongly, that even to confront information that contradicts what they prefer to believe is intolerable.

Said my friend: “No wonder these people are always shocked by the latest developments in politics. They refuse to see the world as it is.”

While I was out and about in Boston this weekend, I met and spoke with a professor, who holds fairly despairing opinions about the academy. I brought up the situation at Villanova, where the president and provost responded to two professors’ criticism of politicized student evaluations by saying, in part, that “Diversity and inclusion are not accessories in higher education today, they are at its core.” My interlocutor told me that at his university, white professors are genuinely afraid to give students of color bad grades. They are terrified of being accused of racism, and being forced to defend themselves in a university hearing. It’s a big problem of academic integrity, he said, but the diversity deans, and the “diversity and inclusion” mentality, are all-powerful. It’s not just at his college, the professor said; it’s spreading like wildfire throughout academia.



HK_Vol

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #1 on: April 10, 2019, 03:28:27 AM »
https://meanjin.com.au/essays/in-defence-of-the-bad-white-working-class/

In Defence of the Bad, White Working Class
by Shannon Burns

SNIP:
The habits of progressive social and political discourse almost seem calculated to alienate and aggravate lower class whites. I confess that if a well-dressed, university-educated middle-class person of any gender or ethnicity so much as hinted at my ‘white privilege’ while I was a lumpen child, or my ‘male privilege’ while I was an unskilled labourer who couldn’t afford basic necessities, or my ‘hetero-privilege’ while I was a homeless solitary, I’d have taken special pleasure in voting for their nightmare. And I would have been right to do so.

As an aspirational teenage lumpen, I learned to embrace a working-class ethos. It was a simple, experiential lesson: whenever I allowed myself to feel like a victim, I fell into paralysis and deep poverty; whenever I took pride in my capacity to work and endure, things got slightly better. One world view worked; the other didn’t.

Even if I was wronged or oppressed or marginalised, claiming victim status seemed absurd (since I often came across people who were more unfortunate than me), limiting (since there were other, enriching aspects of life to focus on), humiliating (because in the working-class world self-pity is reviled), and self-defeating (because if you allow yourself to think and behave like a victim, you quickly fall into lumpen despair).

At university, I discovered that this ethos didn’t apply. A season of despair would not send middle-class teens spiralling into a life of drug-addled indigence; they could simply brush themselves off and enrol again next year. Strong, class-enforced safety nets meant that self-pity could be accommodated, and victimhood could even form part of a functional identity.

Indeed, the willingness to expose your wounds is another sign of privilege. Those for whom injury has a use-value will display their injuries; those for whom woundedness is a survival risk, won’t. As a consequence, middle-class grievances now drown out lower class pain. This is why the wounded lower classes come to embrace conservative discourses that ridicule middle-class anguish. Those who cannot afford to see themselves as disadvantaged are instinctively repulsed by those who harp on about disadvantage.


HK_Vol

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #2 on: April 10, 2019, 03:30:16 AM »
More:


Consider who determines the standards of so-called politically correct speech. Are they primarily negotiated across classes and social groups, or are they determined from above? If the latter is the case, then it would be senseless to deny that political correctness, as it stands, is a form and expression of elitism. When rules of expression are forced on people who have their own peculiar relationship to speech, and who can reasonably be expected to struggle with the constraints, it is not a fair imposition. Political correctness is hardly the evil that conservative commentators make it out to be, but as a moral burden it is clearly weighted against the lower classes, who are smart enough to recognise when they are being set up to fail.

HK_Vol

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #3 on: April 10, 2019, 04:07:57 AM »
https://pjmedia.com/instapundit/327034/#respond

A Smith •
"No wonder these people are always shocked by the latest developments in politics."

And how do these people respond? Not with introspection about their flawed worldview, but to conclude "wow, there sure are a lot of racists out there."


PubliusII • 
After the events of spring 1933, the Germans had a word for such political maneuvers: Gleichschaltung, meaning coordination. Everything will be coordinated, mein Herr, with the ruling class view.

Two thoughts occur to me. First, a well-informed German told me that the academics were among the earliest to climb on board the national-socialist movement. Second, a few decades from now the universities in this country and elsewhere will look back on this era with a shudder.


SmartProf • 
Dreher laments that leftists shun actual debate on ideas, in favor of name-calling ("racist!").
He misses the point--why should a leftists go to all the effort of intellectually proving their point, when all they have to do is mindlessly yell "racist!" at anyone who disagrees with them?
The former takes time and effort... the latter, neither. They'll opt for the latter.



herealobladioblada • 
I'm in my 60s and long out of college. I used to be able to disagree with prog friends and we were able to have polite debates about current topics. That shifted somewhere around 2010. At that point, there was no longer discussion and any one who disagreed with them became racist, stupid, and a hater.

It was useless to even attempt conversation, because it was obvious that their values and worldview had become radically different from previous cultural norms and we had no common understanding of the issues. Rather than discussing/tolerating other views and presenting evidence and data for their opinions, they quickly devolved to anger and insults.

Needless to say, it was necessary to detach from several former friends. A few others have come to detente with me, we have an unspoken agreement not to discuss politics.


bsand  • 
I went from a moderate conservative to a flaming white supremacist without changing a single opinion. You can see from this situation how witch hunts come about, seemingly normal people become insane. I think the people with standards retired and lefty boomers took over. Whatever respect they showed for tradition and tolerance was an act, and once the grown ups retired, all that was left were old children.


Cincydawg

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #4 on: April 10, 2019, 07:04:48 AM »
I think MOST courses don't have a political slant to them.  Certainly little in math or science is political.  Education?  Probably some.  Business?  Probably not much.  Sociology?  A lot.  History, the same.

The environment was rather liberal when I was in school in the 1970s.  I don't recall any classes that were notably political.

HK_Vol

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #5 on: April 10, 2019, 07:14:46 AM »
Would be interesting to see if any of the views of professors seeps into the classroom.

Meanwhile:

https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2018/5/2/faculty-survey-part-2/

No respondent indicated they believe Trump has done a “very good” job.

Respondents who evaluated Trump’s job performance as “very poor” were distributed roughly evenly across the four divisions of FAS. In all, 89 percent of professors who identified themselves as affiliated with the Arts and Humanities division also selected “very poor,” as did 90 percent of those affiliated with the Social Sciences, 86 percent of those affiliated with the Sciences, and 83 percent of those affiliated with the School of Engineering and Applied Sciences.

Negative views of Trump remained consistent along gender lines. Ninety-three percent of female faculty respondents selected “very poor,” as did 86 percent of male faculty respondents.

These numbers appear to match with how respondents voted in the 2016 presidential election. Of the survey-takers, 73 percent reported for Hillary Clinton, while just 2 percent reported voting for Trump. Only 2 percent indicated they voted for Jill E. Stein ’72-’73.


Opinion on President Trump Job Performance ToDate
Percent (%) of Respondents
Very Good Job .      0%
Good Job .          1.08%
Okay Job .          1.89%
Poor Job .           7.55%
Very Poor Job .  88.41%
No Opinion .        1.08%


Cincydawg

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #6 on: April 10, 2019, 07:20:00 AM »
I don't see how this gets passed along in MOST class subjects, as I noted, to any real degree.

It would in some obviously.  A daughter had one professor at Ohio State who was an open Communist, sociology I think it was.  She thought it was funny.  She was in her ROTC uniform every Thursday, he gave her an A.

Cincydawg

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #7 on: April 10, 2019, 07:59:59 AM »
I would guess for some majors, they are "indoctrination camps", but for most, they are not.  And the folks who take those majors are largely already indoctrinated.

If you major in math or computer science or the sciences, you're too busy for political stuff.

gymvol

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #8 on: April 10, 2019, 08:33:46 AM »
Cincy reminds me of an old cartoon character with his always coming to the defense of the liberal left.



"Do not worry, do not fear, Cincydawg is here."



If everyone is thinking alike then somebody isn't thinking.

George S. Patton

Cincydawg

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #9 on: April 10, 2019, 08:50:13 AM »
Perhaps you can refer to any of my posts here that you think are somehow a "defense of the liberal left" (which is redundant anyway).  I offered some thoughts about the topic.  Perhaps you might explain how political leanings could be a factor in a calculus class.

I never had any idea which of my professors were liberal or conservative, but as I say, that was a long time ago.  

DunkingDan

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #10 on: April 10, 2019, 07:27:10 PM »
Perhaps you can refer to any of my posts here that you think are somehow a "defense of the liberal left" (which is redundant anyway).  I offered some thoughts about the topic.  Perhaps you might explain how political leanings could be a factor in a calculus class.

I never had any idea which of my professors were liberal or conservative, but as I say, that was a long time ago.  
Mine were long time ago as well, but I can tell you who a lot of the left wing and right wing professors I had was.
President Harry S. Truman said: “The fundamental basis of this nation’s laws was given to Moses on the Mount.  The fundamental basis of our Bill of Rights comes from the teachings…  If we don't have the proper fundamental moral background, we will finally wind up with a totalitarian government which does not believe in rights for anybody except the state.”

Cincydawg

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #11 on: April 10, 2019, 08:05:28 PM »
I'm not sure that a raging liberal would teach math or physics any differently than a hard right conservative.  So, I'd agree there is some indoctrination in SOME courses in colleges, in many subjects it simply is not relevant to anything.

My kids seem to come out of it rational and sane and all that.



DunkingDan

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #12 on: April 10, 2019, 08:28:31 PM »
Math and physics are not the only classes students take. 
President Harry S. Truman said: “The fundamental basis of this nation’s laws was given to Moses on the Mount.  The fundamental basis of our Bill of Rights comes from the teachings…  If we don't have the proper fundamental moral background, we will finally wind up with a totalitarian government which does not believe in rights for anybody except the state.”

Cincydawg

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Re: Universities - merely indoctrination camps?
« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2019, 07:50:21 AM »
And obviously that was my point.  Quite a few subjects do not appear - to me - to lend themselves to political bias.  The sciences, math, engineering, business, English, foreign language,  ...

... some do.  So, indoctrination MAY occur in the topics that can be twisted one way or the other by some professor, sociology, history, whatever.  So, one might claim SOME parts of universities are "indoctrination camps".


 

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