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Topic: This is a bit long, but worth reading, especially for Scotchy

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ATexasVol

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This is a bit long, but worth reading, especially for Scotchy
« on: February 24, 2018, 12:55:46 PM »
This OP is far more reasonable and balanced than the stories you watch on CNN and MSNBC scotch.  Read the whole thing, including the summary at the end.   


Mueller may be seeking to defend at least the investigative decisions made by the FBI and the Justice Department, institutions he served for many years.


Special Counsel Robert Mueller has been a busy fellow for the past week. Rapid fire, his indictment of several Russian nationals for meddling in the 2016 election has been followed by a guilty plea, for lying to investigators, from a lawyer tied to Trump-campaign figures Paul Manafort and Richard Gates; a new indictment against Manafort and Gates that, as anticipated, added tax- and bank-fraud charges (in Virginia) to already existing money-laundering charges (in Washington); and finally, just breaking as this is written, a guilty plea from Gates on charges of defrauding the United States and lying to the FBI.

As President Trump’s champions emphasize, what is most notable about this array of allegations is an omission: Nowhere has the special counsel charged any kind of criminal collusion between the Trump campaign and the Kremlin.

Of course, “collusion with Russia” was the suspicion — or, skeptics would counter, the carefully crafted political narrative — that launched the Mueller investigation. So has the collusion theory been abandoned? Is the fundamental rationale for the Justice Department’s appointment of a special counsel, which has addled the Trump administration for seven months, now a big “Never mind”?

I don’t think so. At least, I don’t think that’s the way Mueller is looking at it.

To be sure, not only is there no “collusion” allegation in the new indictments; the Trump campaign is barely mentioned. It has no ostensible relevance to the charges against Manafort, Gates, and the lawyer, Alex van der Zwaan. To the limited extent that the campaign is mentioned in the indictment against the Russian nationals, any contacts that campaign officials had with Russians are said to have been unwitting. That fact would seem to cut sharply against the notion of collusion, for had there been a collusive Trump–Russia relationship, there would have been no need for Russian operatives to dupe Trump-campaign officials.

Add to the mix the other charges Mueller has filed against Michael Flynn and George Papadopoulos, who have pled guilty. In neither instance did Mueller allege any kind of criminal conspiracy between the Trump campaign and the Putin regime. Both defendants served the campaign, and both had contacts with apparent Putin-regime operatives (the Russian ambassador in Flynn’s case, more-shadowy figures claiming regime ties in Papadopoulos’s). Yet Mueller permitted each defendant to resolve the case by pleading guilty to a single count of making false statements to the FBI — a mere process crime, and one that, by branding them as liars, would undermine their effectiveness as cooperating witnesses if there were any eventual “collusion” case against other campaign figures. Again, this cuts against the idea that Mueller is contemplating a collusion case.

Still, that does not mean he has entirely given up the quest. At the very least, I believe, Mueller intends to demonstrate that FBI and Justice Department suspicions about possible collusion were reasonable, even if there is no criminal case to be made against the president or his campaign. Although it is highly unlikely that Trump will be accused of a collusion crime, Mueller intends to illustrate that he showed appalling judgment in putting his campaign in the hands of Manafort and Gates, who were up to their necks in collusion with agents of Putin’s regime.

scotchvol

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Re: This is a bit long, but worth reading, especially for Scotchy
« Reply #1 on: February 24, 2018, 02:31:34 PM »
If Trump is innocent then he and the Red Hats have nothing to fear. If he or anyone connected to the Trump campaign broke the law, colluded, or commited treason then they should feel the whole weight of justice. 

Let’s see where this ends. 


DunkingDan

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President Harry S. Truman said: “The fundamental basis of this nation’s laws was given to Moses on the Mount.  The fundamental basis of our Bill of Rights comes from the teachings…  If we don't have the proper fundamental moral background, we will finally wind up with a totalitarian government which does not believe in rights for anybody except the state.”

ATexasVol

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Re: This is a bit long, but worth reading, especially for Scotchy
« Reply #3 on: February 24, 2018, 03:09:15 PM »
If Trump is innocent then he and the Red Hats have nothing to fear. If he or anyone connected to the Trump campaign broke the law, colluded, or commited treason then they should feel the whole weight of justice.

Let’s see where this ends.


You forgot to add, let's also see the law applied equally, to Democrats as well as Republicans.  The decision about whether to prosecute should not be based on the political affiliation of the alleged criminal.

VolRage

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Re: This is a bit long, but worth reading, especially for Scotchy
« Reply #4 on: February 24, 2018, 05:36:00 PM »
Scratchy, you mean like Hillary has for selling 20% of America’s uranium to the Russians and getting millions for doing so. You’re nothing but a partisan dumbazz that could care less about real crimes against this nation. As long as Trump is found guilty of 2 scoops of ice cream and serves time you’re happy. Dips#it.

gymvol

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Re: This is a bit long, but worth reading, especially for Scotchy
« Reply #5 on: February 25, 2018, 11:12:39 AM »
Appointing Mueller was outside the law for what is required to appoint a special councel.

First and foremost there has to be evidence a crime was commited which the only thing the DOJ had was a fake dossier they knew was fake.

Wimpy ass Jeff Sessions should be fired and Mueller, Rod Rosenstein, Comey along with all the other Obama hold overs who are behind this conspiracy should be behind bars for their crimes.

If these people aren't held accountable then our government has become nothing more than another shit hole third world ruling class.


§ 600.1 Grounds for appointing a Special Counsel.

The Attorney General, or in cases in which the Attorney General is recused, the Acting Attorney General, will appoint a Special Counsel when he or she determines that criminal investigation of a person or matter is warranted and -
 
(a) That investigation or prosecution of that person or matter by a United States Attorney's Office or litigating Division of the Department of Justice would present a conflict of interest for the Department or other extraordinary circumstances; and

(b) That under the circumstances, it would be in the public interest to appoint an outside Special Counsel to assume responsibility for the matter.

If everyone is thinking alike then somebody isn't thinking.

George S. Patton

 

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