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Topic: NFL

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harvestalvol

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Re: NFL
« Reply #28 on: August 11, 2018, 11:32:34 PM »

harvestalvol

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Re: NFL
« Reply #29 on: August 11, 2018, 11:34:34 PM »

harvestalvol

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Re: NFL
« Reply #30 on: August 11, 2018, 11:36:44 PM »

harvestalvol

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Re: NFL
« Reply #31 on: August 11, 2018, 11:52:10 PM »
http://thefederalist.com/2017/08/03/confederacy-still-lingers-within-progressivism-birthed/
After all, modern-day progressivism is one of the Confederacy’s most enduring legacies in America today. Whether they realize it or not, progressives themselves are among the inheritors of the political ideology that led to the Civil War.
Civil War historian Allen C. Guelzo wrote this week that the real-life Confederacy wasn’t the caricature of a rural backwater so often in popular depictions of the Civil War but an economically vibrant, industrializing region that had more in common with the modern-day administrative state than most Americans realize. But Guelzo only hints at the deeper links between Confederate governance and present-day progressivism:
The Confederate government centralized political authority in ways that made a hash of states’ rights, nationalized industries in ways historians have compared to ‘state socialism,’ and imposed the first compulsory national draft in American history. 

If that sounds crazy to you, it’s because the dominant narratives about the Civil War and the South are by now so familiar, even if they’re largely wrong. Adding to the confusion is the mainstream media’s penchant for portraying Republican voters in the South as a bunch of Confederate flag-waving racists, while casting progressive Democrats as defenders of equality and sincere advocates for social justice.
John C. Calhoun Sowed Modern Progressivism
The truth is more complicated — and more uncomfortable for progressives, should they choose to face it.

ATexasVol

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Re: NFL
« Reply #32 on: August 12, 2018, 12:19:31 AM »

fuzzynavol

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Re: NFL
« Reply #33 on: August 12, 2018, 07:54:48 AM »
No one here has made a good-faith effort to address anything I, or the protesters, have to say.  Just a constant regurgitation of tired, rightwing talking points.  It's apparent you think blacks should know and stay in their place, and that you don't like to be reminded that you subscribe to a political ideology surreptitiously determined to preserve a racially hierarchical caste system.  

gymvol

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Re: NFL
« Reply #34 on: August 12, 2018, 08:40:42 AM »
No one here has made a good-faith effort to address anything I, or the protesters, have to say.  Just a constant regurgitation of tired, rightwing talking points.  It's apparent you think blacks should know and stay in their place, and that you don't like to be reminded that you subscribe to a political ideology surreptitiously determined to preserve a racially hierarchical caste system.  

We address the left wing democrat drivel that you post from what you've read somewhere because you can't think for yourself.

Yours is the party of institutional slavery keeping people dependent on government handouts for their support.

Your's is the party who keeps promising to help those same people then turn your back on them after each election keeping them in poverty.

Yours is the party of the KKK and slavery not ours but you're to damned stupid to admit it.

But since you brought it up why don't you tell us where you think a black persons place is?

One place we can tell you it isn''t that's on their knees during the National Anthem which your party also supports.
If everyone is thinking alike then somebody isn't thinking.

George S. Patton

fuzzynavol

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Re: NFL
« Reply #35 on: August 12, 2018, 09:02:25 AM »
Sorry, but there's so much wrong here that I'm going to have to address it within the quote box.

Yours is the party of the KKK and slavery not ours but you're to damned stupid to admit it.

I've never once denied that the pre-civil war party of the South, all the way through the civil rights movement of the 1060's, was the Democrats.  You seem to be a big fan and very sympathetic toward those Democrats, having adamantly defended them in this very thread.  Don't tell us you've already forgotten what you said:

"It certainly wasn't making war on American citizens by burning, looting, raping and murdering which was done under the Union flag by northern troops...

It was Lincoln who ordered Sherman to destroy everything from Chattanooga to Charleston, he ordered Sheridan to destroy and burn everything in the Shenandoah Valley, he ordered all of his generals to destory the South and everything in it so they could no longer make war.

So don't come here trying to tell us about callous offenses commited under the Confederate flag..."

Of course, that entire misplaced diatribe was because you somehow misunderstood that I was talking about modern day offenses with the Confederate flag - a point that would have been obvious to anyone with an average IQ.  

But since you brought it up why don't you tell us where you think a black persons place is?

Blacks don't have "a place."  It's a shame when their employers feel compelled to curtail their free speech because some of their (conservative snowflake) customers think they should know and accept their place in society.  

One place we can tell you it isn''t that's on their knees during the National Anthem which your party also supports.

Democrats do support free speech.  

Usually.  

ATexasVol

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Re: NFL
« Reply #36 on: August 12, 2018, 11:52:13 AM »
No one here has made a good-faith effort to address anything I, or the protesters, have to say.  Just a constant regurgitation of tired, rightwing talking points.  It's apparent you think blacks should know and stay in their place, and that you don't like to be reminded that you subscribe to a political ideology surreptitiously determined to preserve a racially hierarchical caste system.  

We have already addressed it.   But okay, I will address it again by going back to exactly what Colin Kaepernick said. 
"I am not going to stand up to show pride in a flag for a country that oppresses black people and people of color," Kaepernick told NFL Media in an exclusive interview after the game.
That is a lie.  Black people and people of color are not oppressed in this country.  
"There are bodies in the street and people getting paid leave and getting away with murder."
He is right about 2 of his 3 points:  there are bodies on the street and people are getting away with murder.   But it is black people doing the killing, not the police.  The media and the protesters aren't interested in black-on-black and black-on-white crime.  If they were, people like Kaepernick would be holding townhalls at Chicago schools to drive home the message to young people about staying in school, advancing yourself through job training and education, refraining from having babies until you have graduated high school and are married, and respecting the police.   That would be focusing efforts where they would be most effective.  
This whole thing is like an alcoholic blaming the loss of his job and family on anything and everything except his drinking.  If you can't admit you have a drinking problem, you can't beat alcoholism.  The whole BLM movement is all about denying the real underlying problems and shifting the blame to someone else.  That's my problem with the movement.  

harvestalvol

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Re: NFL
« Reply #37 on: August 12, 2018, 12:15:07 PM »
No one here has made a good-faith effort to address anything I, or the protesters, have to say.  Just a constant regurgitation of tired, rightwing talking points.  It's apparent you think blacks should know and stay in their place, and that you don't like to be reminded that you subscribe to a political ideology surreptitiously determined to preserve a racially hierarchical caste system.  


roadvol

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Translation
« Reply #38 on: August 12, 2018, 12:54:48 PM »
"No one here has made a good-faith effort to address anything I, or the protesters, have to say."

Translation.....
In Fuzz's mind...if you don't agree with him or agree in the manner he wants then it's non responsive.
It's not that you're being non responsive ..you're just not answering with a liberal  narrative.

harvestalvol

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Re: NFL
« Reply #39 on: August 12, 2018, 12:59:31 PM »
"No one here has made a good-faith effort to address anything I, or the protesters, have to say."

Translation.....
In Fuzz's mind...if you don't agree with him or agree in the manner he wants then it's non responsive.
It's not that you're being non responsive ..you're just not answering with a liberal  narrative.

That is an indisputable fact. 

fuzzynavol

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Re: NFL
« Reply #40 on: August 12, 2018, 01:01:14 PM »

The whole BLM movement is all about denying the real underlying problems and shifting the blame to someone else.  That's my problem with the movement.  
We certainly agree more on that point than disagree.  We're not debating the merits of the BLM movement, we're debating whether the merits of some players protesting black inequality during the anthem.  

Where we disagree, is that this is a free speech issue.  I think their employer, the NFL, and NFL fans should allow them the right to be wrong (to whatever extent they are or are not).  You think the NFL should censor their speech, and punish them if they speak out.  Fans should boycott.  

There are only two ways that a society can confront disagreements.  Conversation and violence.  Therefore, it's never a good idea to censor peaceful conversation.  If the protesters are akin to alcoholics, then hear them out and explain to them why they're wrong.  Turning away or trying to censor them is wrong.  Then violence is all you have left.  

As I've said, I think the players should realize their anthem protests are counterproductive, but I support their right to be wrong.  Just as I do yours.  

harvestalvol

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Re: NFL
« Reply #41 on: August 12, 2018, 01:21:52 PM »
The players have every right to protest and the owners have every right to punish or fire them if they do.  They do own the team. I support players’ right to be wrong as well and they will only have themselves to blame when the paycheck is gone. I would like to see the owners do nothing and see the league fold. I stopped watching when Peyton retired. I have no interest in the game. 

 

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